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k.i.s.s / less fighting ? ( sorry it's long ) was Re: [SCA-Archery] What is Period Archery.

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  • Ld.blackmoon
    greetings just a thought after several hundreds of posts on this ... if it isn t simple it won t be done, if it isn t done why bother in the first place ? I
    Message 1 of 5 , Oct 30, 2013
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      greetings
       
      just a thought after several hundreds of posts on this ...
       
      if it isn't simple it won't be done, if it isn't done why bother in the first place ?
       
      I make period style bows, and I wouldn't do half of the things mentioned in just the hit and miss sampling I did in this subject : ( 
      ( sorry , I'm going to school full time, and don't have the time to read every post )
      if I have to make " special arrangements" to " shoot period " I may as well just go back to my recurve and shoot for fun again... it will be a whole lot less hassle : (
       
      do we find ways to make shooting " period style "equipment fun and easy ?
      or do we try to regulate and legislate " period " archery back into the dark ages  ?
       
      do we try to make archery and especially " period style " archery welcoming, fun and easy to participate in ?
      or do we try to make it a private, specialty ,champions, club,
       
      just some of the choices people will need to make......
      are we really as bad as the government , at communication and compromise , when it comes to something for which we proclaim our " love "  ??
       
      will we need to register , so that we can be told which " party " to vote for ??
       
      I hope not.
      I used to believe in an honorable society, it pushed me to event after event, but in over 30 years in the sca, I have unfortunately found few examples of it here ( in the sca ).
      is the sca mirroring the government, and trying to destroy itself from the inside ?
       
      I have watched the ebb and flow of the " period police " movements.
      I have watched people go from carpet armor, to plate mail, to plastic barrel armor, to covered plastic armor.
      I have watched people give nubies a hard time because the polyester wrapped around their tennis shoes , wasn't period. I have watched as one person after another complained about something , that wasn't " period enough "  to suit them, but rarely did I ever here or see those same people offer to help the person they were complaining about , get the more " period " things they had just complained about.
       
      is there a way to make the majority happy, without chasing off the new , the borderline,and even the old time archers ??
      is there a way to follow the k.I.s.s. principle , and keep it simple ?? easy ? fun ?
       
      I hope so :  /
       
      can we compromise instead of compete ?
      can we discuss instead of argue ?
       
      Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
      Arthur
       
       
       
    • Kevin Smith
      I think in your sampling you missed a lot. These proposals only involve getting bows that can be documented as period style through research certified if they
      Message 2 of 5 , Oct 30, 2013
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        I think in your sampling you missed a lot. These proposals only involve getting bows that can be documented as period style through research certified if they are not the "always recognized" period styles. Saracen, Hun, and ELB's everyone recognizes....side knocked Viking oval cross sectioned bows maybe not so much....
        So we are taking about keeping it simple.

        On Oct 30, 2013, at 10:38 PM, "Ld.blackmoon" <ld.blackmoon@...> wrote:

         

        greetings
         
        just a thought after several hundreds of posts on this ...
         
        if it isn't simple it won't be done, if it isn't done why bother in the first place ?
         
        I make period style bows, and I wouldn't do half of the things mentioned in just the hit and miss sampling I did in this subject : ( 
        ( sorry , I'm going to school full time, and don't have the time to read every post )
        if I have to make " special arrangements" to " shoot period " I may as well just go back to my recurve and shoot for fun again... it will be a whole lot less hassle : (
         
        do we find ways to make shooting " period style "equipment fun and easy ?
        or do we try to regulate and legislate " period " archery back into the dark ages  ?
         
        do we try to make archery and especially " period style " archery welcoming, fun and easy to participate in ?
        or do we try to make it a private, specialty ,champions, club,
         
        just some of the choices people will need to make......
        are we really as bad as the government , at communication and compromise , when it comes to something for which we proclaim our " love "  ??
         
        will we need to register , so that we can be told which " party " to vote for ??
         
        I hope not.
        I used to believe in an honorable society, it pushed me to event after event, but in over 30 years in the sca, I have unfortunately found few examples of it here ( in the sca ).
        is the sca mirroring the government, and trying to destroy itself from the inside ?
         
        I have watched the ebb and flow of the " period police " movements.
        I have watched people go from carpet armor, to plate mail, to plastic barrel armor, to covered plastic armor.
        I have watched people give nubies a hard time because the polyester wrapped around their tennis shoes , wasn't period. I have watched as one person after another complained about something , that wasn't " period enough "  to suit them, but rarely did I ever here or see those same people offer to help the person they were complaining about , get the more " period " things they had just complained about.
         
        is there a way to make the majority happy, without chasing off the new , the borderline,and even the old time archers ??
        is there a way to follow the k.I.s.s. principle , and keep it simple ?? easy ? fun ?
         
        I hope so :  /
         
        can we compromise instead of compete ?
        can we discuss instead of argue ?
         
        Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
        Arthur
         
         
         

      • Pat
        I HAVE read the majority, and feel the same. I was nearly driven away from archery by someone that was so adamant about what archery should be. He couldn t
        Message 3 of 5 , Oct 31, 2013
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          I HAVE read the majority, and feel the same. I was nearly driven away from archery by someone that was so adamant about what archery should be. He couldn't comprehend why some just came out to shoot and socialize, with no desire either to get or to be driven to higher SCA ranking. This discussion does not seem to have a true focus. Period archery covers a lot of territory, and it is quite possible that there is so much overlapping information that we could be losing focus. You also need to reassure those, like me, that may not have a drive to be that period that we are important to the SCA archery program. That your guild will have room for the likes of us. That everyone can contribute to the growth and development of archery within the SCA.

          Moire

          P.S. The Guild committee needs to keep us updated on progress. Or lack thereof. If you have a mission statement, tell us what it is. Show us the status, we may be able to contribute thoughts that may assist you in going forward.


          --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, Kevin Smith <kevinsmith5@...> wrote:
          >
          > I think in your sampling you missed a lot. These proposals only involve getting bows that can be documented as period style through research certified if they are not the "always recognized" period styles. Saracen, Hun, and ELB's everyone recognizes....side knocked Viking oval cross sectioned bows maybe not so much....
          > So we are taking about keeping it simple.
          >
          > > On Oct 30, 2013, at 10:38 PM, "Ld.blackmoon" <ld.blackmoon@...> wrote:
          > >
          > > greetings
          > >
          > > just a thought after several hundreds of posts on this ...
          > >
          > > if it isn't simple it won't be done, if it isn't done why bother in the first place ?
          > >
          > > I make period style bows, and I wouldn't do half of the things mentioned in just the hit and miss sampling I did in this subject : (
          > > ( sorry , I'm going to school full time, and don't have the time to read every post )
          > > if I have to make " special arrangements" to " shoot period " I may as well just go back to my recurve and shoot for fun again... it will be a whole lot less hassle : (
          > >
          > > do we find ways to make shooting " period style "equipment fun and easy ?
          > > or do we try to regulate and legislate " period " archery back into the dark ages ?
          > >
          > > do we try to make archery and especially " period style " archery welcoming, fun and easy to participate in ?
          > > or do we try to make it a private, specialty ,champions, club,
          > >
          > > just some of the choices people will need to make......
          > > are we really as bad as the government , at communication and compromise , when it comes to something for which we proclaim our " love " ??
          > >
          > > will we need to register , so that we can be told which " party " to vote for ??
          > >
          > > I hope not.
          > > I used to believe in an honorable society, it pushed me to event after event, but in over 30 years in the sca, I have unfortunately found few examples of it here ( in the sca ).
          > > is the sca mirroring the government, and trying to destroy itself from the inside ?
          > >
          > > I have watched the ebb and flow of the " period police " movements.
          > > I have watched people go from carpet armor, to plate mail, to plastic barrel armor, to covered plastic armor.
          > > I have watched people give nubies a hard time because the polyester wrapped around their tennis shoes , wasn't period. I have watched as one person after another complained about something , that wasn't " period enough " to suit them, but rarely did I ever here or see those same people offer to help the person they were complaining about , get the more " period " things they had just complained about.
          > >
          > > is there a way to make the majority happy, without chasing off the new , the borderline,and even the old time archers ??
          > > is there a way to follow the k.I.s.s. principle , and keep it simple ?? easy ? fun ?
          > >
          > > I hope so : /
          > >
          > > can we compromise instead of compete ?
          > > can we discuss instead of argue ?
          > >
          > > Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
          > > Arthur
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
        • Kevin Smith
          I am having a re hard time figuring out why so many people are taking the view that ENCOURAGING more people to shoot period style somehow requires that we
          Message 4 of 5 , Oct 31, 2013
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            I am having a re hard time figuring out why so many people are taking the view that ENCOURAGING more people to shoot period style somehow requires that we DISCOURAGE open archery. I just don't see how this concern keeps coming up. When we talk about a bow NOT being classified as a period bow we aren't saying "you can't shoot that" we're saying "you're scores will be in the open class not the period class". All we're trying to discuss is what bows and equipment would be classified as period, this isn't a threat to anything anyone is already doing.

            On Oct 31, 2013, at 11:54 AM, Pat <pat_auten@...> wrote:

             

            I HAVE read the majority, and feel the same. I was nearly driven away from archery by someone that was so adamant about what archery should be. He couldn't comprehend why some just came out to shoot and socialize, with no desire either to get or to be driven to higher SCA ranking. This discussion does not seem to have a true focus. Period archery covers a lot of territory, and it is quite possible that there is so much overlapping information that we could be losing focus. You also need to reassure those, like me, that may not have a drive to be that period that we are important to the SCA archery program. That your guild will have room for the likes of us. That everyone can contribute to the growth and development of archery within the SCA.

            Moire

            P.S. The Guild committee needs to keep us updated on progress. Or lack thereof. If you have a mission statement, tell us what it is. Show us the status, we may be able to contribute thoughts that may assist you in going forward.

            --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, Kevin Smith <kevinsmith5@...> wrote:
            >
            > I think in your sampling you missed a lot. These proposals only involve getting bows that can be documented as period style through research certified if they are not the "always recognized" period styles. Saracen, Hun, and ELB's everyone recognizes....side knocked Viking oval cross sectioned bows maybe not so much....
            > So we are taking about keeping it simple.
            >
            > > On Oct 30, 2013, at 10:38 PM, "Ld.blackmoon" <ld.blackmoon@...> wrote:
            > >
            > > greetings
            > >
            > > just a thought after several hundreds of posts on this ...
            > >
            > > if it isn't simple it won't be done, if it isn't done why bother in the first place ?
            > >
            > > I make period style bows, and I wouldn't do half of the things mentioned in just the hit and miss sampling I did in this subject : (
            > > ( sorry , I'm going to school full time, and don't have the time to read every post )
            > > if I have to make " special arrangements" to " shoot period " I may as well just go back to my recurve and shoot for fun again... it will be a whole lot less hassle : (
            > >
            > > do we find ways to make shooting " period style "equipment fun and easy ?
            > > or do we try to regulate and legislate " period " archery back into the dark ages ?
            > >
            > > do we try to make archery and especially " period style " archery welcoming, fun and easy to participate in ?
            > > or do we try to make it a private, specialty ,champions, club,
            > >
            > > just some of the choices people will need to make......
            > > are we really as bad as the government , at communication and compromise , when it comes to something for which we proclaim our " love " ??
            > >
            > > will we need to register , so that we can be told which " party " to vote for ??
            > >
            > > I hope not.
            > > I used to believe in an honorable society, it pushed me to event after event, but in over 30 years in the sca, I have unfortunately found few examples of it here ( in the sca ).
            > > is the sca mirroring the government, and trying to destroy itself from the inside ?
            > >
            > > I have watched the ebb and flow of the " period police " movements.
            > > I have watched people go from carpet armor, to plate mail, to plastic barrel armor, to covered plastic armor.
            > > I have watched people give nubies a hard time because the polyester wrapped around their tennis shoes , wasn't period. I have watched as one person after another complained about something , that wasn't " period enough " to suit them, but rarely did I ever here or see those same people offer to help the person they were complaining about , get the more " period " things they had just complained about.
            > >
            > > is there a way to make the majority happy, without chasing off the new , the borderline,and even the old time archers ??
            > > is there a way to follow the k.I.s.s. principle , and keep it simple ?? easy ? fun ?
            > >
            > > I hope so : /
            > >
            > > can we compromise instead of compete ?
            > > can we discuss instead of argue ?
            > >
            > > Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
            > > Arthur
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >

          • James Koch
            Kevin, ... We had the same resistance when we were discussing the idea of a missile weapon peerage. There are no doubt multiple reasons people are against
            Message 5 of 5 , Oct 31, 2013
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              Kevin,
              >
              We had the same resistance when we were discussing the idea of a missile weapon peerage.  There are no doubt multiple reasons people are against change.  There are the people who don't want to see other people showing up at shoots with ever more authentic kit because it will make them look bad.  There are the slippery slope people who actually believe that once more authentic kit is common, there will be a push to phase out recurves and modern materials.  There are also the LARPers and also people who don't want any more complexity introduced to archery because they don't want to have to wade through any more rules.    

              I am having a re hard time figuring out why so many people are taking the view that ENCOURAGING more people to shoot period style somehow requires that we DISCOURAGE open archery. I just don't see how this concern keeps coming up. When we talk about a bow NOT being classified as a period bow we aren't saying "you can't shoot that" we're saying "you're scores will be in the open class not the period class". All we're trying to discuss is what bows and equipment would be classified as period, this isn't a threat to anything anyone is already doing.
              On Oct 31, 2013, at 11:54 AM, Pat <pat_auten@...> wrote:

              Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
              >

               

              I HAVE read the majority, and feel the same. I was nearly driven away from archery by someone that was so adamant about what archery should be. He couldn't comprehend why some just came out to shoot and socialize, with no desire either to get or to be driven to higher SCA ranking. This discussion does not seem to have a true focus. Period archery covers a lot of territory, and it is quite possible that there is so much overlapping information that we could be losing focus. You also need to reassure those, like me, that may not have a drive to be that period that we are important to the SCA archery program. That your guild will have room for the likes of us. That everyone can contribute to the growth and development of archery within the SCA.

              Moire

              P.S. The Guild committee needs to keep us updated on progress. Or lack thereof. If you have a mission statement, tell us what it is. Show us the status, we may be able to contribute thoughts that may assist you in going forward.

              --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, Kevin Smith <kevinsmith5@...> wrote:
              >
              > I think in your sampling you missed a lot. These proposals only involve getting bows that can be documented as period style through research certified if they are not the "always recognized" period styles. Saracen, Hun, and ELB's everyone recognizes....side knocked Viking oval cross sectioned bows maybe not so much....
              > So we are taking about keeping it simple.
              >
              > > On Oct 30, 2013, at 10:38 PM, "Ld.blackmoon" <ld.blackmoon@...> wrote:
              > >
              > > greetings
              > >
              > > just a thought after several hundreds of posts on this ...
              > >
              > > if it isn't simple it won't be done, if it isn't done why bother in the first place ?
              > >
              > > I make period style bows, and I wouldn't do half of the things mentioned in just the hit and miss sampling I did in this subject : (
              > > ( sorry , I'm going to school full time, and don't have the time to read every post )
              > > if I have to make " special arrangements" to " shoot period " I may as well just go back to my recurve and shoot for fun again... it will be a whole lot less hassle : (
              > >
              > > do we find ways to make shooting " period style "equipment fun and easy ?
              > > or do we try to regulate and legislate " period " archery back into the dark ages ?
              > >
              > > do we try to make archery and especially " period style " archery welcoming, fun and easy to participate in ?
              > > or do we try to make it a private, specialty ,champions, club,
              > >
              > > just some of the choices people will need to make......
              > > are we really as bad as the government , at communication and compromise , when it comes to something for which we proclaim our " love " ??
              > >
              > > will we need to register , so that we can be told which " party " to vote for ??
              > >
              > > I hope not.
              > > I used to believe in an honorable society, it pushed me to event after event, but in over 30 years in the sca, I have unfortunately found few examples of it here ( in the sca ).
              > > is the sca mirroring the government, and trying to destroy itself from the inside ?
              > >
              > > I have watched the ebb and flow of the " period police " movements.
              > > I have watched people go from carpet armor, to plate mail, to plastic barrel armor, to covered plastic armor.
              > > I have watched people give nubies a hard time because the polyester wrapped around their tennis shoes , wasn't period. I have watched as one person after another complained about something , that wasn't " period enough " to suit them, but rarely did I ever here or see those same people offer to help the person they were complaining about , get the more " period " things they had just complained about.
              > >
              > > is there a way to make the majority happy, without chasing off the new , the borderline,and even the old time archers ??
              > > is there a way to follow the k.I.s.s. principle , and keep it simple ?? easy ? fun ?
              > >
              > > I hope so : /
              > >
              > > can we compromise instead of compete ?
              > > can we discuss instead of argue ?
              > >
              > > Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
              > > Arthur
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
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