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Re: [SCA-Archery] Poll questions on a guild

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  • imgoingtophobos
    Agreed Carolus.
    Message 1 of 38 , May 26, 2013
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      Agreed Carolus.


      On Sun, May 26, 2013 at 3:16 AM, Carolus <eulenhorst@...> wrote:


      Keeping a kingdom level focus for this has a couple of major drawbacks.  First, it isolates many of those interested in archery from each other due to the boundary nature itself.  Second, the focus of archery in the various kingdoms varies considerably and we need a broad representation for this to work to promote period archery.  Third, it makes it much easier for kingdom politics to intrude and interfere with the intentions of the guild(s).  Finally, it fragments the voice of the guild and makes it easier to marginalize and ignore.  This list has been as successful as it has because of its reach across kingdom lines.
      Carolus

      On 5/25/2013 9:39 PM, Jim Pickette wrote:
       

      I suggest keeping a kingdom focus.

      JoO

      ---- Carolus <eulenhorst@...> wrote:
      > CORRECTION!!!! That should have been DO NOT REQUIRE. As Sir Jon
      > pointed out, guilds are unofficial bodies free to establish their own
      > rules. What Gladius experienced is why I have been active in the SCA
      > only in virtual form for the last several years. Too many people who
      > have their own idea of the rules and try to enforce them on others
      > without actually reading the documents.
      > Carolus
      > On 5/25/2013 6:40 PM, Carolus wrote:
      > >
      > > Actually, the laws of the SCA do require that we admit anyone to a
      > > guild. A guild is an non-regulated body without formal standing just
      > > like a household. Just as I do not need to admit anyone to my
      > > household who asks, a guild may set membership requirements. It
      > > depends on the charter of the guild. Most guilds are formed at
      > > kingdom level and get a charter from the King. However, it is not
      > > necessary to do so. We can operate as a society wide household such
      > > as the Dark Horde, Rolling Thunder, or the Barbarian Freehold
      > > Alliance. We just call ourselves a guild. If this is a society wide
      > > group, who would issue a charter anyway? The BoD doesn't issue
      > > charters, in fact it has nothing to do with the medieval portion of
      > > the game. Since we would span kingdoms, what king would be apply to?
      > > Carolus
      > >
      > > On 5/25/2013 9:02 AM, James Koch wrote:
      > >>
      > >> Taran, Et Al,
      > >> >
      > >> Just remember that the laws of the SCA require you to admit anyone
      > >> who wants to join a guild. You can't limit membership just to people
      > >> using SCA period equipment & etc. However, you can have a rank
      > >> system in the guild. If you want to form something like St Hubert's
      > >> Rangers with minimum standards for admission, it is basically a
      > >> household. In fact forming new chapters of St Hubert's Rangers might
      > >> not be a bad idea. I have actually considered joining that
      > >> organization for some time.
      > >> >
      > >> I have a non-guild idea to encourage people to shoot SCA period
      > >> equipment. I'll start a second discussion.
      > >> >
      > >> Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
      > >> >
      > >> >
      > >>
      > >>> I would like to make sure I am correct in what I have been
      > >>> thinking. By period archery guild, we mean a guild for those either
      > >>> using period bows, arrows, and release aids, and/or making period
      > >>> bows, arrows, and strings, and/or developing competitions for period
      > >>> archer's, and/or teaching the use of period techniques, etc. With
      > >>> period bows and arrows defined the same or similar to the IKAC
      > >>> period handbow and period crossbow divisions
      > >>> (http://www.scores-sca.org/public/scores_rules.php?R=10&Shoot=65 ).
      > >>> This wouldn't be 100% inclusive since it would be base on period
      > >>> rather than modern bows, arrows, competitions, construction, etc
      > >>> but I believe that a guild with a more specific purpose will allow
      > >>> us to accomplish more.
      > >>>
      > >>> Thanks,
      > >>> Taran
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>> On Sat, May 25, 2013 at 7:40 AM, Jonathas <Jonathas@...
      > >>> <mailto:Jonathas@...> > wrote:
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>> Absolutely awesome proposal. All inclusive, yet encourages
      > >>> everyone to get better.
      > >>>
      > >>> Jonathas
      > >>> On May 25, 2013 4:14 AM, "Ronald Klick"
      > >>> <osmond_de_berwic@... <mailto:osmond_de_berwic@...>>
      > >>> wrote:
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>> I myself like to shoot, I also teach a lot of kids and
      > >>> beginner adults, I promote archery with passion in and
      > >>> out of the SCA. I shoot an old Stemmler recurve that I've
      > >>> owned for 40 years now. I dress fairly simple as
      > >>> an Englishman of the 13th Century. I believe that if a
      > >>> society-wide guild is created it should include all of
      > >>> the aspects of archery, not be just geared to shooting, or
      > >>> to persona development of appropriate gear and
      > >>> costuming without firing a shot, or just for crafting, or
      > >>> just for research/teaching/running tourneys.
      > >>>
      > >>> For many of these portions of re-creation and recreation
      > >>> there are already existing guild and orders established.
      > >>> Another guild could be created here that promotes just the
      > >>> Periodness of archery/personas, (a period archery
      > >>> guild) or we could try a different path.
      > >>>
      > >>> I think it should encompass all of these somehow with a
      > >>> guiding format to promote Period Archery, but not
      > >>> to cause it to smother all other aspects of the fun of
      > >>> archery at the expense of periodness. I have an idea of
      > >>> how to accomplish this, subject to modification here it is:
      > >>>
      > >>> An SCA Archery Guild that incorporates all of the aspects of
      > >>> archery. Advancement in the guild to be based
      > >>> on four different areas, combined to determine ranking
      > >>> within the guild. I see four areas, but input from all of
      > >>> you may/will cause this to evolve during development.
      > >>>
      > >>> Shooting Skill
      > >>>
      > >>> Period Gear and Persona Development
      > >>>
      > >>> Craftmanship
      > >>>
      > >>> Teaching, Mentoring, Research, Service to Archery Community
      > >>>
      > >>> My thought was a tiered system within each area, ranking
      > >>> from 1 to 5, with a total that yields a ranking in
      > >>> the guild. More input would be needed to refine this but I
      > >>> will give some rough outlining of my basic idea.
      > >>> Criteria would have to be established for ranking within
      > >>> each area. For example Shooting could be based on
      > >>> a RR ranking to get level 1, some other shoots or GAT
      > >>> etc,... to move up. Crafting could start out with an
      > >>> archer making some of his own arrows, bowstrings etc, for
      > >>> level 1. For Period aspect, could be just to look
      > >>> the part of your persona on a basic level for level 1, with
      > >>> increasing requirements for garb and archery tackle
      > >>> to advance. And the last, teaching and mentoring,
      > >>> researching archery history/crafts personas, service and
      > >>> promotion of archery and its community.
      > >>>
      > >>> Rankings within Guild based on total scores of the 4 aspects:
      > >>>
      > >>> 4 = Apprentice
      > >>> 8 = Journeyman
      > >>> 12 = GuildMaster
      > >>> 16 = Senior Guild Master
      > >>> 20 = Guild Grand Master
      > >>>
      > >>> So to get started in the guild, you'd have to amass 4
      > >>> points. Someone who does not even shoot could be a
      > >>> part of our guild and community, but would have to
      > >>> concentrate on other aspects to join. Then again, an
      > >>> archer whose only interest is shooting would not be able to
      > >>> advance beyond Apprentice without trying
      > >>> to develop in the other aspects. And in order to attain the
      > >>> highest rankings someone will have to develop
      > >>> in all of the aspects and become immersed in archery,
      > >>> shooting skill, Period Persona and gear, crafting, and
      > >>> dedication to heightening Archery in the SCA. Someone who
      > >>> attained the highest ranking would be the
      > >>> ultimate example, ambassador of the Archery Community where
      > >>> ever they went.
      > >>>
      > >>> Numbers can be evaluated and adjusted, but I hope my basic
      > >>> outline makes sense. I now open this to the
      > >>> comments of my fellows of the Archery Community. These are
      > >>> my own opinions, not to be considered
      > >>> the prevailing views of my Barony or Kingdom.
      > >>>
      > >>> YIS
      > >>> Osmond de Berwic
      > >>> Barony of Stonemarche
      > >>> East Kingdom
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>> From: John Edgerton <sirjon1@...
      > >>> <mailto:sirjon1@...>>
      > >>> To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
      > >>> <mailto:SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com>
      > >>> Sent: Friday, May 24, 2013 11:00 PM
      > >>> Subject: [SCA-Archery] Poll questions on a guild
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>> There seem to be some basic differences of opinion on what a
      > >>> SCA wide guild should include. So, I am going to set a poll
      > >>> using the poll function of this group. Before I do I want
      > >>> to run the questions by everyone for comment or possible
      > >>> changes. This is not a poll at this time so do not vote,
      > >>> just send comments if you have any.
      > >>>
      > >>> Jon
      > >>> ************************
      > >>>
      > >>> Society wide guild.
      > >>> What type of guild would you like to see develop ?
      > >>>
      > >>> 1: An Archers guild that is exclusively for archers and
      > >>> focused on shooting and improving scores. The other archery
      > >>> related activities such as bow making, fletching, string
      > >>> making, running competitions, etc. would need to set up
      > >>> their own guild or guilds.
      > >>>
      > >>> 2: An Archery guild that is for all archery related
      > >>> activities such as shooting, bow making, fletching, string
      > >>> making, running competitions, etc.
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >
      > >
      >





    • John Edgerton
      I will leave the poll open till 12:00 PDT tonight to allow any last minute votes. Jon
      Message 38 of 38 , May 28, 2013
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        I will leave the poll open till 12:00 PDT tonight to allow any last minute votes. 

        Jon
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