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Re: Who shoots "one eye shut?" Both eyes?

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  • trekster242
    I think the main reason to shoot (either archery, firearms or otherwise) with one eye open, scoped, sighted, or point and shoot, is so that you re aware of
    Message 1 of 28 , May 12, 2013
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      I think the main reason to shoot (either archery, firearms or otherwise) with one eye open, scoped, sighted, or point and shoot, is so that you're aware of everything else going on around you. This of course would have been important not only to modern soldiers using rifles but also to the medieval archer or yeoman, who would find himself assaulted with various projectiles (slung stones, crossbow bolts or arrows, etc) and of course since the distances that a bow is effective at are much less than a modern firearm, he'd also need to be aware of foot soldiers sneaking up in his peripheral vision.


      My guess is that even back in the day, soldiers were taught to shoot with both eyes open. Haha.

      The only benefit of shooting with one eye shut (increased concentration and narrowing of vision) is also a detriment in time of war.

      PMZ
      --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, "aelric_southlake" <magnetcoil@...> wrote:
      >
      > Greetings, strange question (?) here...
      >
      > Was talking to a guy who once shot traditional at a national level, and he mentioned that he shoots with one eye shut. It dawned on me that I had never tried that, nor had even THOUGHT about it - which is weird because I shoot rifles with one eye shut.
      >
      > I am completely self taught as far as archery goes (need some real lessons), and was wondering if it isn't just common sense, or something, to shoot with one eye, or if that's some kind of "higher level" technique.
      >
      > I tried it earlier today with unpleasant results, ha ha ha. I think, now that I've been doing it "my" way, it'd be a hard adjustment.
      >
      > How do you all out there shoot - one eye or two? Anyone have the skinny on the rhymes or reasons for either way? Does it matter?
      >
      > As always, thanks for any replies,
      > Aelric, West K.
      >
    • killergi_2006
      I shoot with one eye. I am left handed, but shoot right handed as my right eye is dominent. One eye shooting provides accuracy. Sent from my Verizon Wireless
      Message 2 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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        I shoot with one eye. I am left handed, but shoot right handed as my right eye is dominent. One eye shooting provides accuracy.
        Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

        From: "aelric_southlake" <magnetcoil@...>
        Sender: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Mon, 13 May 2013 02:00:22 -0000
        To: <SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com>
        ReplyTo: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [SCA-Archery] Who shoots "one eye shut?" Both eyes?

         

        Greetings, strange question (?) here...

        Was talking to a guy who once shot traditional at a national level, and he mentioned that he shoots with one eye shut. It dawned on me that I had never tried that, nor had even THOUGHT about it - which is weird because I shoot rifles with one eye shut.

        I am completely self taught as far as archery goes (need some real lessons), and was wondering if it isn't just common sense, or something, to shoot with one eye, or if that's some kind of "higher level" technique.

        I tried it earlier today with unpleasant results, ha ha ha. I think, now that I've been doing it "my" way, it'd be a hard adjustment.

        How do you all out there shoot - one eye or two? Anyone have the skinny on the rhymes or reasons for either way? Does it matter?

        As always, thanks for any replies,
        Aelric, West K.

      • Kat Pogatshnik
        I shoot with one eye shut now. I use to shoot with both eyes but had no accuracy or aiming point. Pretty much I was just instinct shooting. I have now
        Message 3 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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          I shoot with one eye shut now.  I use to shoot with both eyes but had no accuracy or aiming point.  Pretty much I was just instinct shooting.  I have now taught myself to shoot with my right eye closed (right handed) and it has helped my shooting a lot.  For me, I can find my aiming point a lot quicker and easier with one eye closed.

           ~Alessandra de Piro
        • Caterina Fortuna
          I m naturally right handed. I started shooting right handed. At the time, I only had contacts. We believed that I was right eye dominant. When I decided I
          Message 4 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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            I'm naturally right handed. I started shooting right handed. At the time, I only had contacts. We believed that I was right eye dominant.

            When I decided I really wanted to improve, I discovered that when I changed to glasses, primarily, my eye dominance changed. I believe its due to the correction of the minor amount of astigmatism in my eyes. the target is much clearer to my left eye with glasses on.
            However, I can not shoot left handed. So I spent months practicing my form including closing my left eye. I find that now I can shoot without closing my eye, but I shoot better when I close it. Which makes my aim much better when shooting at a wand target.

            I'm hoping to incorporate some instinctive shooting into my style this year.

            Does anyone else notice this with astigmatism?
            Cat

          • Ken Dolphin
            I shoot with one eye closed because my eye dominance shifts back and forth. remembering back to military shooting, I also closed one eye when shooting a rifle.
            Message 5 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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              I shoot with one eye closed because my eye dominance shifts back and forth. remembering back to military shooting, I also closed one eye when shooting a rifle. Two years ago, I got to help a young lady who had been coached by several others and still had problems hitting the target face. Tried several things before watching her eyes. Subsequently got her to close one and she immediatly started hitting the target.
               
              Kenneth of Shaftesbury
              An Tir
               
              ----- Original Message -----
              Sent: Sunday, May 12, 2013 7:00 PM
              Subject: [SCA-Archery] Who shoots "one eye shut?" Both eyes?

               

              Greetings, strange question (?) here...

              Was talking to a guy who once shot traditional at a national level, and he mentioned that he shoots with one eye shut. It dawned on me that I had never tried that, nor had even THOUGHT about it - which is weird because I shoot rifles with one eye shut.

              I am completely self taught as far as archery goes (need some real lessons), and was wondering if it isn't just common sense, or something, to shoot with one eye, or if that's some kind of "higher level" technique.

              I tried it earlier today with unpleasant results, ha ha ha. I think, now that I've been doing it "my" way, it'd be a hard adjustment.

              How do you all out there shoot - one eye or two? Anyone have the skinny on the rhymes or reasons for either way? Does it matter?

              As always, thanks for any replies,
              Aelric, West K.

            • JonThomme De Claydon
              Ken, Funnier yet, had an archer closing the wrong eye! I was not her coach but happened to hand her a cross bow to try and noticed the error and corrected her.
              Message 6 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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                Ken, Funnier yet, had an archer closing the wrong eye! I was not her coach but happened to hand her a cross bow to try and noticed the error and corrected her. It changed her shooting game quite a bit!


                In service to the dream

                Baron Jon Thomme

                Gold is for the mistress
                Silver for the maid
                Copper for the craftsman cunning in his trade.
                "Good" said the Baron sitting in his hall,
                But iron, cold iron is master of them all.
                R. Kipling
              • Rusty McMillan
                I am left eye dominant, but that is due in part to double vision caused by the tendancy of my right eye to drift in and down. As a result I close the left eye
                Message 7 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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                  I am left eye dominant, but that is due in part to double vision caused by the tendancy of my right eye to drift in and down. As a result I close the left eye while I shoot right handed. I am hoping to have the wandering eye surgically improved, and then maybe I'll open both eyes for better depth perception.

                  Randal

                  --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, "aelric_southlake" <magnetcoil@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Greetings, strange question (?) here...
                  >
                  > Was talking to a guy who once shot traditional at a national level, and he mentioned that he shoots with one eye shut. It dawned on me that I had never tried that, nor had even THOUGHT about it - which is weird because I shoot rifles with one eye shut.
                  >
                  > I am completely self taught as far as archery goes (need some real lessons), and was wondering if it isn't just common sense, or something, to shoot with one eye, or if that's some kind of "higher level" technique.
                  >
                  > I tried it earlier today with unpleasant results, ha ha ha. I think, now that I've been doing it "my" way, it'd be a hard adjustment.
                  >
                  > How do you all out there shoot - one eye or two? Anyone have the skinny on the rhymes or reasons for either way? Does it matter?
                  >
                  > As always, thanks for any replies,
                  > Aelric, West K.
                  >
                • John Edgerton
                  I am right handed and right eye dominant. However, I shoot left handed due a damaged right eye. I have learned to shoot with both eyes open. Jon, West
                  Message 8 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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                    I am right handed and right eye dominant. However, I shoot left handed due a damaged right eye. I have learned to shoot with both eyes open. 

                    Jon, West



                    --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, "aelric_southlake" <magnetcoil@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Greetings, strange question (?) here...
                    >
                    > Was talking to a guy who once shot traditional at a national level, and he mentioned that he shoots with one eye shut. It dawned on me that I had never tried that, nor had even THOUGHT about it - which is weird because I shoot rifles with one eye shut.
                    >
                    > I am completely self taught as far as archery goes (need some real lessons), and was wondering if it isn't just common sense, or something, to shoot with one eye, or if that's some kind of "higher level" technique.
                    >
                    > I tried it earlier today with unpleasant results, ha ha ha. I think, now that I've been doing it "my" way, it'd be a hard adjustment.
                    >
                    > How do you all out there shoot - one eye or two? Anyone have the skinny on the rhymes or reasons for either way? Does it matter?
                    >
                    > As always, thanks for any replies,
                    > Aelric, West K.
                    >

                  • Taslen
                    Cleve, Can you write up something for the current practice schedule so I can get it into the QandQ? Gaelen ________________________________
                    Message 9 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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                      Cleve,

                      Can you write up something for the current practice schedule so I can get it into the QandQ?

                      Gaelen



                    • edmund_penyngton
                      I have been taught to shoot with both eyes open since the first time I picked up a bow as a little boy. I am naturally left handed, and right-eye dominant, so
                      Message 10 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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                        I have been taught to shoot with both eyes open since the first time I picked up a bow as a little boy.

                        I am naturally left handed, and right-eye dominant, so I shoot a right handed bow. I shoot strictly "instinctive" (for lack of a better term), not gap shooting or some other "aiming" method. I try to follow Byron Ferguson's method he calls "Become the Arrow." This involves focusing entirely on the target itself, rather than the tip of the arrow in relation to the target.

                        As such, both eyes open is *absolutely* critical in this method. When you close one eye your depth perception is somewhat altered, which would make a huge difference. I would imagine, with sufficient practice, it would be possible to overcome this, but considering how long I've shot with both eyes open... I doubt I'll be switching any time soon.

                        In fact, the only time I recall shooting a bow "one eye closed" was during my "confused teenage years" when I shot one of those modern contraptions that pass for bows these days... You know, the ones with "training wheels"? ^^

                        --Edmund of Penyngton

                        Live Weapons Marshal

                        Kingdom of Gleann Abhann
                        Shire of Coill Fhionnabhann

                        --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, "aelric_southlake" <magnetcoil@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Greetings, strange question (?) here...
                        >
                        > Was talking to a guy who once shot traditional at a national level, and he mentioned that he shoots with one eye shut. It dawned on me that I had never tried that, nor had even THOUGHT about it - which is weird because I shoot rifles with one eye shut.
                        >
                        > I am completely self taught as far as archery goes (need some real lessons), and was wondering if it isn't just common sense, or something, to shoot with one eye, or if that's some kind of "higher level" technique.
                        >
                        > I tried it earlier today with unpleasant results, ha ha ha. I think, now that I've been doing it "my" way, it'd be a hard adjustment.
                        >
                        > How do you all out there shoot - one eye or two? Anyone have the skinny on the rhymes or reasons for either way? Does it matter?
                        >
                        > As always, thanks for any replies,
                        > Aelric, West K.
                        >
                      • Oscar Van Loveren 000724 recon
                        I would like to add something to this discussion. I too have read Byron s book and agree that with a LOT, and I mean a LOT of practice one can learn to be the
                        Message 11 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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                          I would like to add something to this discussion. I too
                          have read Byron's book and agree that with a LOT, and I
                          mean a LOT of practice one can learn to "be the arrow" and
                          hit anything that moves without knowing the distance and
                          without thinking about it.

                          It is how most, if not all of our Grand Masters shoot.

                          That said, not many have the time dedicated to learning to
                          shoot like that. Gap shooting gives better results
                          initially and quicker. I will accept the argument that you
                          will never become someone who can shoot at anything
                          anytime, but face it, most of our targets are at
                          20-30-40-50-60 feet......

                          So, if you have limited time, and want to become a
                          reasonable shooter faster, and realize that you will never
                          shoot 110+......

                          Food for thought.


                          > I have been taught to shoot with both eyes open since the
                          > first time I picked up a bow as a little boy.
                          >
                          > I am naturally left handed, and right-eye dominant, so I
                          > shoot a right handed bow. I shoot strictly "instinctive"
                          > (for lack of a better term), not gap shooting or some
                          > other "aiming" method. I try to follow Byron Ferguson's
                          > method he calls "Become the Arrow." This involves
                          > focusing entirely on the target itself, rather than the
                          > tip of the arrow in relation to the target.
                          >
                          > As such, both eyes open is *absolutely* critical in this
                          > method. When you close one eye your depth perception is
                          > somewhat altered, which would make a huge difference. I
                          > would imagine, with sufficient practice, it would be
                          > possible to overcome this, but considering how long I've
                          > shot with both eyes open... I doubt I'll be switching any
                          > time soon.
                          >
                          > In fact, the only time I recall shooting a bow "one eye
                          > closed" was during my "confused teenage years" when I
                          > shot one of those modern contraptions that pass for bows
                          > these days... You know, the ones with "training wheels"?
                          > ^^
                          >
                          > --Edmund of Penyngton
                          >
                          > Live Weapons Marshal
                          >
                          > Kingdom of Gleann Abhann
                          > Shire of Coill Fhionnabhann
                          >
                          > --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, "aelric_southlake"
                          > <magnetcoil@...> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Greetings, strange question (?) here...
                          > >
                          > > Was talking to a guy who once shot traditional at a
                          > national level, and he mentioned that he shoots with one
                          > eye shut. It dawned on me that I had never tried that,
                          > nor had even THOUGHT about it - which is weird because I
                          > shoot rifles with one eye shut.
                          > >
                          > > I am completely self taught as far as archery goes
                          > (need some real lessons), and was wondering if it isn't
                          > just common sense, or something, to shoot with one eye,
                          > or if that's some kind of "higher level" technique.
                          > >
                          > > I tried it earlier today with unpleasant results, ha ha
                          > ha. I think, now that I've been doing it "my" way, it'd
                          > be a hard adjustment.
                          > >
                          > > How do you all out there shoot - one eye or two?
                          > Anyone have the skinny on the rhymes or reasons for
                          > either way? Does it matter?
                          > >
                          > > As always, thanks for any replies,
                          > > Aelric, West K.
                          > >
                          >
                          >

                          ---------------------------------------------------------------------
                          Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider.
                          http://www.nni.com/
                        • Cleve Johnson
                          Barony of Sternfeld (Constellation Region, Middle Kingdom) has practice Wednesday eveninging 7:00 to 9:00 PM at Yurts of America, 4375 Sellers Street,
                          Message 12 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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                            Barony of Sternfeld (Constellation Region, Middle Kingdom) has practice Wednesday eveninging 7:00 to 9:00 PM at Yurts of America, 4375 Sellers Street, Indianapolis, IN 46226.  Outdoor practices will be announced on the Sternfeld Facebook page and on the Yahoo group page.  Come have some fun!


                            On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 6:10 PM, Taslen <taslen2000@...> wrote:
                             

                            Cleve,

                            Can you write up something for the current practice schedule so I can get it into the QandQ?

                            Gaelen






                            --
                            Lord Eadric of Grenefelda
                            Barony of Sternfeld Archery Captain
                            Order of the Dragon's Barb, AoA
                            Order of the Golden Tower, Orion's Belt, Award of the Nova, Yeoman
                             Pandus planto populus mico.
                            (Archers make people quiver.)
                             
                          • edmund_penyngton
                            It was not my intention to sound as if I was belittling Gap Shooting or similar methods, by no means. I ve used them before, and they do work wonderfully for
                            Message 13 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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                              It was not my intention to sound as if I was belittling Gap Shooting or similar methods, by no means. I've used them before, and they do work wonderfully for what they are intended to do. Gap Shooting is by and far the method I suggest for beginners in barebow shooting. I was simply offering my reasons for using both eyes.

                              Also, while I subscribe to Mister Ferguson's method and strive to follow it, I in no way claim to be a "Master" of said technique. There are days I'd consider myself a novice at best. *Decades* of consistent practice would be needed to reach Byron's level, which is no doubt the reason he is considered the greatest longbow archer alive.

                              While I admit that I consider Byron Ferguson an inspiration and role model for my archery studies, I hold *no* delusions of matching his skill in my lifetime. My personal aspirations in the medium term are become proficient enough to reach the skill level needed to hit my mark without giving so much as a thought to the distance. And in the long term, I intend to one day post scores in the 100+ range you spoke of...

                              This little exchange reminds me of the words of Rodger Aschram in Toxophilous: "In all deeds there are two points to be marked, possibility and excellency, but chiefly a wise man must follow and lay hand on possibility, for fear he lose both."

                              --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, "Oscar Van Loveren 000724 recon" <oscar@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > I would like to add something to this discussion. I too
                              > have read Byron's book and agree that with a LOT, and I
                              > mean a LOT of practice one can learn to "be the arrow" and
                              > hit anything that moves without knowing the distance and
                              > without thinking about it.
                              >
                              > It is how most, if not all of our Grand Masters shoot.
                              >
                              > That said, not many have the time dedicated to learning to
                              > shoot like that. Gap shooting gives better results
                              > initially and quicker. I will accept the argument that you
                              > will never become someone who can shoot at anything
                              > anytime, but face it, most of our targets are at
                              > 20-30-40-50-60 feet......
                              >
                              > So, if you have limited time, and want to become a
                              > reasonable shooter faster, and realize that you will never
                              > shoot 110+......
                              >
                              > Food for thought.
                              >
                              >
                              > > I have been taught to shoot with both eyes open since the
                              > > first time I picked up a bow as a little boy.
                              > >
                              > > I am naturally left handed, and right-eye dominant, so I
                              > > shoot a right handed bow. I shoot strictly "instinctive"
                              > > (for lack of a better term), not gap shooting or some
                              > > other "aiming" method. I try to follow Byron Ferguson's
                              > > method he calls "Become the Arrow." This involves
                              > > focusing entirely on the target itself, rather than the
                              > > tip of the arrow in relation to the target.
                              > >
                              > > As such, both eyes open is *absolutely* critical in this
                              > > method. When you close one eye your depth perception is
                              > > somewhat altered, which would make a huge difference. I
                              > > would imagine, with sufficient practice, it would be
                              > > possible to overcome this, but considering how long I've
                              > > shot with both eyes open... I doubt I'll be switching any
                              > > time soon.
                              > >
                              > > In fact, the only time I recall shooting a bow "one eye
                              > > closed" was during my "confused teenage years" when I
                              > > shot one of those modern contraptions that pass for bows
                              > > these days... You know, the ones with "training wheels"?
                              > > ^^
                              > >
                              > > --Edmund of Penyngton
                              > >
                              > > Live Weapons Marshal
                              > >
                              > > Kingdom of Gleann Abhann
                              > > Shire of Coill Fhionnabhann
                              > >
                              > > --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, "aelric_southlake"
                              > > <magnetcoil@> wrote:
                              > > >
                              > > > Greetings, strange question (?) here...
                              > > >
                              > > > Was talking to a guy who once shot traditional at a
                              > > national level, and he mentioned that he shoots with one
                              > > eye shut. It dawned on me that I had never tried that,
                              > > nor had even THOUGHT about it - which is weird because I
                              > > shoot rifles with one eye shut.
                              > > >
                              > > > I am completely self taught as far as archery goes
                              > > (need some real lessons), and was wondering if it isn't
                              > > just common sense, or something, to shoot with one eye,
                              > > or if that's some kind of "higher level" technique.
                              > > >
                              > > > I tried it earlier today with unpleasant results, ha ha
                              > > ha. I think, now that I've been doing it "my" way, it'd
                              > > be a hard adjustment.
                              > > >
                              > > > How do you all out there shoot - one eye or two?
                              > > Anyone have the skinny on the rhymes or reasons for
                              > > either way? Does it matter?
                              > > >
                              > > > As always, thanks for any replies,
                              > > > Aelric, West K.
                              > > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                              > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
                              > Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider.
                              > http://www.nni.com/
                              >
                            • aelric_southlake
                              Wow... Cool. THANK YOU, ALL OF YOU, who took the time to weigh in. Phew! I m glad to hear I don t have to stop shooting with both eyes open. Sounds like
                              Message 14 of 28 , May 13, 2013
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                                Wow... Cool. THANK YOU, ALL OF YOU, who took the time to weigh in.

                                Phew! I'm glad to hear I don't have to stop shooting with both eyes open. Sounds like there are good reasons and rationales for both.

                                Edmund, you struck a chord twice when you (1) mentioned Byron Ferguson (I've watched some of his stuff, in awe, on Youtube, and have heard of the "Become the Arrow" thing - so I'm happy to hear HE shoots 2 eyes), and (2) when you described compound bows as having "training wheels." ha ha ha

                                I thought I was being whitty & original when I once referred to compounds as having "training wheels." Was happy and laughed out loud when I saw that. {Note: I own one, and see the reasons and benefits of compounds - I've just chosen not to go down that road anymore}

                                I shoot lefty, do everything left-handed, and am pretty sure I am left eye dominant - my left eye is MUCH stronger than my right eye. But now I'm wondering if that necessarily means it is the dominant eye. Oh well, even if it isn't, and that it might keep me from ever being any good, there is NO WAY I could switch hands at this point... I am TOO old, and TOO set in my ways, ha ha ha

                                BUT all of this has been VERY interesting.

                                Thanks,
                                Aelric, West K.
                              • The Greys
                                I think Stan Lee did a thing on his Real Life Super Heroes show about people with extraordinary eyesight. The program said that pilots and some other folks
                                Message 15 of 28 , May 14, 2013
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                                  I think Stan Lee did a thing on his Real Life Super Heroes show about people with extraordinary eyesight. The program said that pilots and some other folks simply see much better than the average person because they have more rods and cones. Byron Ferguson was one of those people in the show. There is a YouTube of Byron shooting out the flame of a candle. On his first shot he accomplishes the task but then says "Well I missed with that one. It was the fletches that hit the flame." It takes pretty good eyes to actually see that! In this thread some have discussed wearing glasses and having damaged eyes. Perhaps one major factor in shooting extraordinarily well is having extraordinary vision. I know for myself when folks say "Aim for the little X in the middle of the target" at 40 yards I respond with "There's a target at 40 yards?" :-) .

                                  You just can't hit what you can't see.

                                  cog
                                • Doug Copley
                                  Just FYI - Samuel ap Dewi (Ansteorra) shoots GAP and shoots 120+ Vincenti On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Oscar Van Loveren 000724 recon
                                  Message 16 of 28 , May 14, 2013
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                                    Just FYI - Samuel ap Dewi (Ansteorra) shoots GAP and shoots 120+

                                    Vincenti


                                    On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Oscar Van Loveren 000724 recon <oscar@...> wrote:
                                    I would like to add something to this discussion. I too
                                    have read Byron's book and agree that with a LOT, and I
                                    mean a LOT of practice one can learn to "be the arrow" and
                                    hit anything that moves without knowing the distance and
                                    without thinking about it.

                                    It is how most, if not all of our Grand Masters shoot.

                                    That said, not many have the time dedicated to learning to
                                    shoot like that. Gap shooting gives better results
                                    initially and quicker. I will accept the argument that you
                                    will never become someone who can shoot at anything
                                    anytime, but face it, most of our targets are at
                                    20-30-40-50-60 feet......

                                    So, if you have limited time, and want to become a
                                    reasonable shooter faster, and realize that you will never
                                    shoot 110+......

                                    Food for thought.


                                    > I have been taught to shoot with both eyes open since the
                                    > first time I picked up a bow as a little boy.
                                    >
                                    > I am naturally left handed, and right-eye dominant, so I
                                    > shoot a right handed bow.  I shoot strictly "instinctive"
                                    > (for lack of a better term), not gap shooting or some
                                    > other "aiming" method.  I try to follow Byron Ferguson's
                                    > method he calls "Become the Arrow."  This involves
                                    > focusing entirely on the target itself, rather than the
                                    > tip of the arrow in relation to the target.
                                    >
                                    > As such, both eyes open is *absolutely* critical in this
                                    > method.  When you close one eye your depth perception is
                                    > somewhat altered, which would make a huge difference.  I
                                    > would imagine, with sufficient practice, it would be
                                    > possible to overcome this, but considering how long I've
                                    > shot with both eyes open... I doubt I'll be switching any
                                    > time soon.
                                    >
                                    > In fact, the only time I recall shooting a bow "one eye
                                    > closed" was during my "confused teenage years" when I
                                    > shot one of those modern contraptions that pass for bows
                                    > these days... You know, the ones with "training wheels"?
                                    >  ^^
                                    >
                                    > --Edmund of Penyngton
                                    >
                                    > Live Weapons Marshal
                                    >
                                    > Kingdom of Gleann Abhann
                                    > Shire of Coill Fhionnabhann
                                    >
                                    > --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, "aelric_southlake"
                                    > <magnetcoil@...> wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > > Greetings,  strange question (?) here...
                                    > >
                                    > > Was talking to a guy who once shot traditional at a
                                    > national level, and he mentioned that he shoots with one
                                    > eye shut.  It dawned on me that I had never tried that,
                                    > nor had even THOUGHT about it - which is weird because I
                                    > shoot rifles with one eye shut.
                                    > >
                                    > > I am completely self taught as far as archery goes
                                    > (need some real lessons), and was wondering if it isn't
                                    > just common sense, or something, to shoot with one eye,
                                    > or if that's some kind of "higher level" technique.
                                    > >
                                    > > I tried it earlier today with unpleasant results, ha ha
                                    > ha.  I think, now that I've been doing it "my" way, it'd
                                    > be a hard adjustment.
                                    > >
                                    > > How do you all out there shoot - one eye or two?
                                    >  Anyone have the skinny on the rhymes or reasons for
                                    > either way?  Does it matter?
                                    > >
                                    > > As always, thanks for any replies,
                                    > > Aelric, West K.
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    >

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                                  • Taslen
                                    Cleve, Got it! Gaelen ________________________________ From: Cleve Johnson To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, May 13,
                                    Message 17 of 28 , May 14, 2013
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                                      Cleve,

                                      Got it!

                                      Gaelen


                                      From: Cleve Johnson <eadric.of.grenfeld@...>
                                      To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                                      Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 8:18 PM
                                      Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Archery Practice

                                       
                                      Barony of Sternfeld (Constellation Region, Middle Kingdom) has practice Wednesday eveninging 7:00 to 9:00 PM at Yurts of America, 4375 Sellers Street, Indianapolis, IN 46226.  Outdoor practices will be announced on the Sternfeld Facebook page and on the Yahoo group page.  Come have some fun!


                                      On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 6:10 PM, Taslen <taslen2000@...> wrote:
                                       
                                      Cleve,

                                      Can you write up something for the current practice schedule so I can get it into the QandQ?

                                      Gaelen






                                      --
                                      Lord Eadric of Grenefelda
                                      Barony of Sternfeld Archery Captain
                                      Order of the Dragon's Barb, AoA
                                      Order of the Golden Tower, Orion's Belt, Award of the Nova, Yeoman
                                       Pandus planto populus mico.
                                      (Archers make people quiver.)
                                       


                                    • Jonathas
                                      Just a side note for kingdoms using the Scores Site. Any Marshal with an account can enter and edit information about their local practices, the forms can be
                                      Message 18 of 28 , May 14, 2013
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                                        Just a side note for kingdoms using the Scores Site.  Any Marshal with an account can enter and edit information about their local practices, the forms can be found under the Marshal Tools => Practices menu.  This information is then displayed to the public under the menu General Info => Local Practices.  Marshals can update their practices any time they wish, so you could use it to display cancelled dates as well.

                                        Jonathas
                                        Scores Site DBA


                                        On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 11:06 AM, Taslen <taslen2000@...> wrote:
                                         

                                        Cleve,

                                        Got it!

                                        Gaelen


                                        From: Cleve Johnson <eadric.of.grenfeld@...>
                                        To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                                        Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 8:18 PM
                                        Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Archery Practice

                                         
                                        Barony of Sternfeld (Constellation Region, Middle Kingdom) has practice Wednesday eveninging 7:00 to 9:00 PM at Yurts of America, 4375 Sellers Street, Indianapolis, IN 46226.  Outdoor practices will be announced on the Sternfeld Facebook page and on the Yahoo group page.  Come have some fun!


                                        On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 6:10 PM, Taslen <taslen2000@...> wrote:
                                         
                                        Cleve,

                                        Can you write up something for the current practice schedule so I can get it into the QandQ?

                                        Gaelen






                                        --
                                        Lord Eadric of Grenefelda
                                        Barony of Sternfeld Archery Captain
                                        Order of the Dragon's Barb, AoA
                                        Order of the Golden Tower, Orion's Belt, Award of the Nova, Yeoman
                                         Pandus planto populus mico.
                                        (Archers make people quiver.)
                                         



                                      • Taslen
                                        Jonathas, If you want i can upload what I put together once it s ready we need practices society wide! Gaelen ________________________________ From: Jonathas
                                        Message 19 of 28 , May 14, 2013
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                                          Jonathas,

                                          If you want i can upload what I put together once it's ready we need practices society wide!

                                          Gaelen



                                          From: Jonathas <Jonathas@...>
                                          To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                                          Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 11:27 AM
                                          Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Archery Practice

                                           
                                          Just a side note for kingdoms using the Scores Site.  Any Marshal with an account can enter and edit information about their local practices, the forms can be found under the Marshal Tools => Practices menu.  This information is then displayed to the public under the menu General Info => Local Practices.  Marshals can update their practices any time they wish, so you could use it to display cancelled dates as well.

                                          Jonathas
                                          Scores Site DBA


                                          On Tue, May 14, 2013 at 11:06 AM, Taslen <taslen2000@...> wrote:
                                           
                                          Cleve,

                                          Got it!

                                          Gaelen


                                          From: Cleve Johnson <eadric.of.grenfeld@...>
                                          To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                                          Sent: Monday, May 13, 2013 8:18 PM
                                          Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Archery Practice

                                           
                                          Barony of Sternfeld (Constellation Region, Middle Kingdom) has practice Wednesday eveninging 7:00 to 9:00 PM at Yurts of America, 4375 Sellers Street, Indianapolis, IN 46226.  Outdoor practices will be announced on the Sternfeld Facebook page and on the Yahoo group page.  Come have some fun!


                                          On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 6:10 PM, Taslen <taslen2000@...> wrote:
                                           
                                          Cleve,

                                          Can you write up something for the current practice schedule so I can get it into the QandQ?

                                          Gaelen






                                          --
                                          Lord Eadric of Grenefelda
                                          Barony of Sternfeld Archery Captain
                                          Order of the Dragon's Barb, AoA
                                          Order of the Golden Tower, Orion's Belt, Award of the Nova, Yeoman
                                           Pandus planto populus mico.
                                          (Archers make people quiver.)
                                           





                                        • ladyjohannatrewpeny
                                          I have the left eye dominance and astigmatism also. I have not succeeded at left handed shooting, so far, so I am still a right handed shooter. I had several
                                          Message 20 of 28 , May 15, 2013
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                                            I have the left eye dominance and astigmatism also. I have not succeeded at left handed shooting, so far, so I am still a right handed shooter. I had several bits of information that were helpful to me given from various sources which have improved my instinctive shooting.
                                            1) Don't keep your dominant eye closed because it can mess up your dominance and also you won't have a depth/distance guage.
                                            2) Start with new targets/distances by putting the point of the arrow on the target's center.
                                            Which target? Yes, I see two even at 20yds.
                                            I have found that if I close my left eye as I draw and force my right eye to KNOW which is the 'Real Center' and then open both eyes before firing I am usually more 'on target'. On a good day I can be Great.... but conversely on a bad day a newbie can outshoot me. For me it's about how tired/overwhelmed my brain is and if it can handle the mental exercise finding the right circle. I've also found I can shoot at almost ANY target that Isn't a circle with more accuracy. Bah Royal Rounds and IKACs.

                                            On the 'what did they do about closing eyes back in the Historical Period we're working on...... check out this snippet of one of my favorite Historicals. (Toxophilus found in Archery Library - links posted by SirJon here previously)

                                            From Roger Ascham's 'Toxophilus' 1545
                                            "Some shooteth his head forward, as though he would bite the mark ; another stareth with his eyes, as though they should fly out; another winketh with one eye and looketh with the other; some make a face with writhing their mouth and countenance so, as though they were doing you wot what; another bleareth out his tongue ; another biteth his lips; another holdeth his neck awry......(after a few dozen other characteristics, which are well noted, so read them for a laugh and an education on what to avoid)
                                            .......Now imagine an archer that is clean without all these faults, and I am sure every man would be delighted to see him shoot."

                                            Have fun becoming the Delight of the Archery Range!
                                            Sweeps a curtsy,
                                            Lady Johanna

                                            PS> We have done some both eyes shut, with spotters... it's very fun!
                                          • Oscar Van Loveren 000724 recon
                                            As a professional pilot of 26 years I have to call urban legend on that part. Yes, there are people with exceptional eyesight. Pilots are 20/20 correctable. No
                                            Message 21 of 28 , May 17, 2013
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                                              As a professional pilot of 26 years I have to call urban
                                              legend on that part. Yes, there are people with exceptional
                                              eyesight. Pilots are 20/20 correctable. No more, no less.

                                              Goerijs.


                                              > I think Stan Lee did a thing on his Real Life Super
                                              > Heroes show about people with extraordinary eyesight.
                                              > The program said that pilots and some other folks simply
                                              > see much better than the average person because they have
                                              > more rods and cones. Byron Ferguson was one of those
                                              > people in the show. There is a YouTube of Byron shooting
                                              > out the flame of a candle. On his first shot he
                                              > accomplishes the task but then says "Well I missed with
                                              > that one. It was the fletches that hit the flame." It
                                              > takes pretty good eyes to actually see that! In this
                                              > thread some have discussed wearing glasses and having
                                              > damaged eyes. Perhaps one major factor in shooting
                                              > extraordinarily well is having extraordinary vision. I
                                              > know for myself when folks say "Aim for the little X in
                                              > the middle of the target" at 40 yards I respond with
                                              > "There's a target at 40 yards?" :-) .
                                              >
                                              > You just can't hit what you can't see.
                                              >
                                              > cog
                                              >

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                                            • Oscar Van Loveren 000724 recon
                                              OK, I m sold. Goerijs. ... Web mail provided by NuNet, Inc. The Premier National provider. http://www.nni.com/
                                              Message 22 of 28 , May 17, 2013
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                                                OK, I'm sold.

                                                Goerijs.


                                                > Just FYI - Samuel ap Dewi (Ansteorra) shoots GAP and
                                                > shoots 120+
                                                >
                                                > Vincenti
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > On Mon, May 13, 2013 at 6:12 PM, Oscar Van Loveren 000724
                                                > recon <
                                                > oscar@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                > > I would like to add something to this discussion. I too
                                                > > have read Byron's book and agree that with a LOT, and I
                                                > > mean a LOT of practice one can learn to "be the arrow"
                                                > and
                                                > > hit anything that moves without knowing the distance
                                                > and
                                                > > without thinking about it.
                                                > >
                                                > > It is how most, if not all of our Grand Masters shoot.
                                                > >
                                                > > That said, not many have the time dedicated to learning
                                                > to
                                                > > shoot like that. Gap shooting gives better results
                                                > > initially and quicker. I will accept the argument that
                                                > you
                                                > > will never become someone who can shoot at anything
                                                > > anytime, but face it, most of our targets are at
                                                > > 20-30-40-50-60 feet......
                                                > >
                                                > > So, if you have limited time, and want to become a
                                                > > reasonable shooter faster, and realize that you will
                                                > never
                                                > > shoot 110+......
                                                > >
                                                > > Food for thought.
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > > > I have been taught to shoot with both eyes open since
                                                > the
                                                > > > first time I picked up a bow as a little boy.
                                                > > >
                                                > > > I am naturally left handed, and right-eye dominant,
                                                > so I
                                                > > > shoot a right handed bow. I shoot strictly
                                                > "instinctive"
                                                > > > (for lack of a better term), not gap shooting or some
                                                > > > other "aiming" method. I try to follow Byron
                                                > Ferguson's
                                                > > > method he calls "Become the Arrow." This involves
                                                > > > focusing entirely on the target itself, rather than
                                                > the
                                                > > > tip of the arrow in relation to the target.
                                                > > >
                                                > > > As such, both eyes open is *absolutely* critical in
                                                > this
                                                > > > method. When you close one eye your depth perception
                                                > is
                                                > > > somewhat altered, which would make a huge difference.
                                                > I
                                                > > > would imagine, with sufficient practice, it would be
                                                > > > possible to overcome this, but considering how long
                                                > I've
                                                > > > shot with both eyes open... I doubt I'll be switching
                                                > any
                                                > > > time soon.
                                                > > >
                                                > > > In fact, the only time I recall shooting a bow "one
                                                > eye
                                                > > > closed" was during my "confused teenage years" when I
                                                > > > shot one of those modern contraptions that pass for
                                                > bows
                                                > > > these days... You know, the ones with "training
                                                > wheels"?
                                                > > > ^^
                                                > > >
                                                > > > --Edmund of Penyngton
                                                > > >
                                                > > > Live Weapons Marshal
                                                > > >
                                                > > > Kingdom of Gleann Abhann
                                                > > > Shire of Coill Fhionnabhann
                                                > > >
                                                > > > --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com,
                                                > "aelric_southlake"
                                                > > > <magnetcoil@...> wrote:
                                                > > > >
                                                > > > > Greetings, strange question (?) here...
                                                > > > >
                                                > > > > Was talking to a guy who once shot traditional at a
                                                > > > national level, and he mentioned that he shoots with
                                                > one
                                                > > > eye shut. It dawned on me that I had never tried
                                                > that,
                                                > > > nor had even THOUGHT about it - which is weird
                                                > because I
                                                > > > shoot rifles with one eye shut.
                                                > > > >
                                                > > > > I am completely self taught as far as archery goes
                                                > > > (need some real lessons), and was wondering if it
                                                > isn't
                                                > > > just common sense, or something, to shoot with one
                                                > eye,
                                                > > > or if that's some kind of "higher level" technique.
                                                > > > >
                                                > > > > I tried it earlier today with unpleasant results,
                                                > ha ha
                                                > > > ha. I think, now that I've been doing it "my" way,
                                                > it'd
                                                > > > be a hard adjustment.
                                                > > > >
                                                > > > > How do you all out there shoot - one eye or two?
                                                > > > Anyone have the skinny on the rhymes or reasons for
                                                > > > either way? Does it matter?
                                                > > > >
                                                > > > > As always, thanks for any replies,
                                                > > > > Aelric, West K.
                                                > > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                >
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                                                > >
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