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Re: Draw Weights?

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  • okami49
    Jim, Is the horse archery competition you are referring to target archery or actually done in combat? It seems very backward that combat can go up to 50# and
    Message 1 of 67 , Dec 28, 2011
      Jim,

      Is the horse archery competition you are referring to target archery or actually done in combat? It seems very backward that combat can go up to 50# and target is limited to 35#. Grounds enough to suggest a change I would think. By itself, I would assume the 35 lb limit would be for the horse's safety but don't really know that for sure. My limited experience shooting from horseback didn't seem to have a draw weight limit (at least not asked).

      Would be pretty easy to compile a quick list and run some simple tests using the winter challenge shoot data (only one I can think of that shows scores and weights). I suspect you would be right, that men on average shoot higher weight bows than women.

      The reasons for that trend are a whole different discussion entirely and probably outside of the scope of what you are asking. If it were me, I would argue the point on the grounds of authentic recreation since a 35 lb bow wouldn't be very useful for a horse archer in either war or hunting.

      As a horsebow shooter I have done a lot of reading on training techniques and shooting styles of steppe cultures. I would love to help you out with this if you need a hand.

      -Eógan
      Archery Captain, Shire of Mynydd Seren
      http://www.wix.com/rangersofmynyddseren/archery

      --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, James Koch <alchem@...> wrote:
      >
      > Gentlemen & Ladies,
      > >
      > Apparently there is horse mounted combat
      > archery. I don't know how they protect the
      > horse's eyes. For horse mounted combat archery,
      > the posted rule states bows are limited to a
      > maximum of 50 pounds draw weight. This strikes
      > me as strange. As stated earlier, I have not yet
      > reached the Society equestrian marshal for clarification.
      > >
      > Jim "Gladius"
      > >
      > >
      > >At 02:44 PM 12/28/2011, you wrote:
      > >
      > >
      > >more curious .... what is the purpose if
      > >limiting the draw weight 35#. will we being
      > >using horseback archery with markland arrows in heavy combat ?
      > >the point being is this. why a 35# limit in
      > >the first place, if the premise for the rule is flawed, change the rule.
      > >
      > >
      > >----------
      > >From: "James Koch" <alchem@...>
      > >To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
      > >Sent: Wednesday, December 28, 2011 2:22:38 PM
      > >Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Draw Weights?
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >Lorelei,
      > > >
      > >We are putting together a horse archery program
      > >here in the Midrealm. There is currently a
      > >simple horse archery shoot, but it is only part
      > >of a larger tournament involving quintain and
      > >that sort of thing. Also, the people who wrote
      > >the rules for the horse archery portion of the
      > >competition included some rules that make the
      > >shoot problematic. To make matters worse, there
      > >are very basic horse archery rules that are
      > >causing some people concern. The one rule
      > >limits bow draw weights to a maximum of 35
      > >pounds. Many of the people here working on
      > >horse archery shoots are men and shoot 40 pound
      > >or higher bows. We can use the lighter bows,
      > >but we do not want to buy a second bow strictly
      > >for horse archery, especially one that is
      > >lighter than what we regularly use for foot
      > >archery. Some of the men, like Merlin who
      > >shoots an 80 pound bow, are concerned that while
      > >bouncing around during a trot, they may
      > >inadvertently overdraw and loose against the riser.
      > > >
      > >If I can show that men on average shoot bows of
      > >a few pounds higher draw weight than the women,
      > >we can get the basic equestrian rules fixed before they become ossified.
      > > >
      > >Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > At 08:42 AM 12/28/2011, you wrote:
      > >
      > >
      > >Curious, why?
      > >
      > >Lorelei
      > >-----Original Message-----
      > >From: James Koch <alchem@...>
      > >To: SCA-Archery <SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com>
      > >Sent: Tue, Dec 27, 2011 7:53 pm
      > >Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Draw Weights?
      > >
      > >
      > >Gentlemen & Ladies,
      > > >
      > >Has anyone compiled statistics for draw weights of hand bows used in
      > >SCA target archery? You know, averages, standard deviation, that
      > >sort of thing. I need to compare the average for male versus female archers.
      > > >
      > >Jim Koch "Gladius"
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >------------------------------------
      > >
      > >--
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      > >to leave this list]
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      > >
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      > >
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      > > (Yahoo! ID required)
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      >
    • Taslen
      ty I just had to ask my daughter the horsey person in the family ________________________________ From: Emil Stecher To:
      Message 67 of 67 , Jan 3, 2012
        ty I just had to ask my daughter the horsey person in the family

        From: Emil Stecher <gwrgi@...>
        To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2011 6:36 AM
        Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Draw Weights?
         
        According to dictionary.com

        1 poll definition

        Pronunciation:  /ˈpōl/
        Function: n
        :  the head or a part of it

        horse: 1  forehead, 2  poll, 3  withers, 4  back, 5  flank, 6  loin, 7  point of hip, 8  tail, 9  hock, 10  cannon, 11  gaskin, 12  thigh, 13  stifle, 14  chestnut, 15  fetlock, 16  pastern, 17  hoof, 18  coronet, 19  knee, 20  forearm, 21  chest, 22  shoulder, 23  neck, 24  cheek
        especially :  the region between the ears of some quadrupeds (as a horse)

        Barak Raz
        (Emil M Stecher)
        (gwrgiATyahooDOTcom)

        --- On Sat, 12/31/11, Taslen <taslen2000@...> wrote:

        From: Taslen <taslen2000@...>
        Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Draw Weights?
        To: "SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com" <SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com>
        Date: Saturday, December 31, 2011, 6:22 AM

        For those of us who don't know what is the "poll"? And it does seem like a unlikely occurance. Als can't the "poll" be protected? Sorry just woke up.
         
        Gaelen
        From: Dan Scheid <damales@...>
        To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Saturday, December 31, 2011 2:05 AM
        Subject: RE: [SCA-Archery] Re: Draw Weights?
         
        (Snip) As I think about the considerations, I am struggling to see how you could realistically shoot your horse in the head. Not impossible, but you would have to have such a unique combination of incredibly rare circumstances all come together in the perfect, one-in-10-billion-or-so situations that I am not sure what we are accomplishing. You have much higher odds of dying in a car crash or plane crash than you do of shooting your horse in the head. And no one thinks we should get quit riding in cars and planes. cheers, Terafan
        Something to remember it takes 5# of force to kill a horse at the poll
        Damales
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