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Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Some numbers from the SCA census.

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  • John Edgerton
    So it seems. :-) Jon
    Message 1 of 24 , Aug 16, 2011
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      So it seems. :-)

      Jon
      On Aug 16, 2011, at 9:35 PM, Damales wrote:

       

      <sirjon1@...> wrote:
      >
      > Correction. Regarding the 13 people that received peerage for other martial activities... it should be .6% not .006%
      /
      /
      so does this make me part of the TOP .6% ?
      Smile
      Damales O.L. (Horsemanship).


    • James Koch
      Gentlemen & Ladies, ... Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
      Message 2 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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        Gentlemen & Ladies,
        >
        Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
        archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
        arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
        across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
        be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
        >
        We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
        was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
        in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
        and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
        to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
        and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
        >
        What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
        >
        Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
      • Ld.blackmoon
        greetings while I personally like the crossed arrows designs I have seen, when I proposed using them as a site token or marshal emblem for an archery only
        Message 3 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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          greetings
           
          while I personally like the crossed arrows designs I have seen, when I proposed using them as a site token or marshal emblem for an archery only event ,
          you would have sworn I was Hitler reborn and as un American as anyone could possibly get because I dare suggest using something some people perceived as being reserved only for members of the us special forces. and thereby disrespecting the us military .......
           
          so , don't be surprised if you get some negative feedback : (
           
          Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
          Arthur
           
           
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 1:22 PM
          Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

           

          Gentlemen & Ladies,
          >
          Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
          archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
          arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
          across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
          be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
          >
          We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
          was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
          in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
          and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
          to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
          and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
          >
          What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
          >
          Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"


          No virus found in this message.
          Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
          Version: 10.0.1392 / Virus Database: 1520/3835 - Release Date: 08/15/11

        • loreleiElkins@aol.com
          I loved the crossed arrows. That has my vote. It is what we use unofficially on marshals tabards and favors. Lorelei Greenleafe, Atlantia ... From: James
          Message 4 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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            I loved the crossed arrows.  That has my vote.  It is what we use unofficially on marshals tabards and favors. 

            Lorelei Greenleafe, Atlantia

            -----Original Message-----
            From: James Koch <alchem@...>
            To: SCA-Archery <SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com>
            Sent: Wed, Aug 17, 2011 10:21 am
            Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

            Gentlemen & Ladies,
            
            >
            Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
            >
            We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
            >
            What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
            >
            Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist" ------------------------------------ -- [Email to SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com to leave this list] Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-Archery/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-Archery/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: SCA-Archery-digest@yahoogroups.com SCA-Archery-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          • Dearg Ailfredsson
            I vote for the crossed arrows.   Dearg. ... Lord Úlfr Rauðskeggr (Dearg) AOA CSO (Yule-fur Rowth-skegg-er) Wolf Red beard 11th century Gall Gaidhel [gall
            Message 5 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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              I vote for the crossed arrows.
               
              Dearg.
              >>------>

              Lord Úlfr Rauðskeggr (Dearg) AOA CSO
              (Yule-fur Rowth-skegg-er) "Wolf Red beard"
              11th century Gall Gaidhel [gall guy-yell]
              a.k.a. "Irish Northman"
              Leather Craftsman, Archer, Huntsman and Target Archery M.I.T.
              The Barony of Fenix
              Paid SCA member since 2003


              When you stop challenging yourself, that's as good as you'll ever be.

              From: "loreleiElkins@..." <loreleiElkins@...>
              To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 4:19 PM
              Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

               
              I loved the crossed arrows.  That has my vote.  It is what we use unofficially on marshals tabards and favors. 

              Lorelei Greenleafe, Atlantia

              -----Original Message-----
              From: James Koch <alchem@...>
              To: SCA-Archery <SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Wed, Aug 17, 2011 10:21 am
              Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

              Gentlemen & Ladies,
              
              >
              Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
              >
              We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
              >
              What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
              >
              Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist" ------------------------------------ -- [Email to SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com to leave this list] Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-Archery/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-Archery/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: SCA-Archery-digest@yahoogroups.com SCA-Archery-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


            • James Koch
              Arthur, ... If the field color around the arrows is bright red would that make the design different enough from the special forces symbol? What about adding
              Message 6 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                Arthur,
                >
                If the field color around the arrows is bright red would that make the design different enough from the special forces symbol?  What about adding the letters SCA or some other symbol or sign?
                >
                I suppose whatever design is eventually chosen, it will conflict with some other groups charge.
                >
                Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
                >
                >
                >At 03:47 PM 8/17/2011, you wrote:
                 

                greetings
                 
                while I personally like the crossed arrows designs I have seen, when I proposed using them as a site token or marshal emblem for an archery only event ,
                you would have sworn I was Hitler reborn and as un American as anyone could possibly get because I dare suggest using something some people perceived as being reserved only for members of the us special forces. and thereby disrespecting the us military .......
                 
                so , don't be surprised if you get some negative feedback : (
                 
                Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
                Arthur
                 
                 
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: James Koch
                To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 1:22 PM
                Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

                 

                Gentlemen & Ladies,
                >
                Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
                archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
                arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
                across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
                be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
                >
                We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
                was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
                in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
                and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
                to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
                and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
                >
                What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
                >
                Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"


                No virus found in this message.
                Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                Version: 10.0.1392 / Virus Database: 1520/3835 - Release Date: 08/15/11

              • John Edgerton
                Agree.... Crossed arrows. Jon
                Message 7 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                  Agree.... Crossed arrows.

                  Jon
                  On Aug 17, 2011, at 11:22 AM, James Koch wrote:

                   

                  Gentlemen & Ladies,
                  >
                  Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
                  archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
                  arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
                  across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
                  be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
                  >
                  We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
                  was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
                  in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
                  and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
                  to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
                  and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
                  >
                  What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
                  >
                  Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"


                • James Koch
                  Gentlemen & Ladies, ... What about the background enamel color? Is red acceptable? The silver arrows will show up great on a bright red background. The red
                  Message 8 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                    Gentlemen & Ladies,
                    >
                    What about the background enamel color?  Is red acceptable?  The silver arrows will show up great on a bright red background.  The red will also be visible from a distance.  Other options are black, green, yellow, or orange.  Blue and purple are taken and white doesn't provide good contrast for the silver arrows.   
                    >
                    Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
                    >
                    >
                    >  At 04:44 PM 8/17/2011, you wrote:
                     


                    Agree.... Crossed arrows.

                    Jon
                    On Aug 17, 2011, at 11:22 AM, James Koch wrote:

                     

                    Gentlemen & Ladies,
                    >
                    Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
                    archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
                    arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
                    across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
                    be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
                    >
                    We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
                    was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
                    in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
                    and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
                    to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
                    and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
                    >
                    What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
                    >
                    Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"

                  • sabre0link
                    It s probably a good thing the email I was typing out was eaten by the net... Heavy uses crossed swords, Equestrian uses crossed lances with a horse head
                    Message 9 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                      It's probably a good thing the email I was typing out was eaten by the 'net...

                      Heavy uses crossed swords, Equestrian uses crossed lances with a horse head facing out above, and I swear I had seen a Rapier/Light one that had crossed rapiers. 

                      Crossed arrows is the best choice, following what is used in the other areas.

                      What about a sheaf of arrows (a bundle of three arrows), points up? http://www.aeheralds.net/Links/AE_Traceable_Art/IndivPDFs/Arrow_sheaf_of.pdf

                      Or, add a roundel above the crossed arrows? (to be a target)...

                      Just options to make it different from the Army Special Forces logo...

                      Adelaide
                      Meridies
                    • Dearg Ailfredsson
                      Green!!!   Dearg. ... Lord Úlfr Rauðskeggr (Dearg) AOA CSO (Yule-fur Rowth-skegg-er) Wolf Red beard 11th century Gall Gaidhel [gall guy-yell] a.k.a.
                      Message 10 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                        Green!!!
                         
                        Dearg.
                        >>------>

                        Lord Úlfr Rauðskeggr (Dearg) AOA CSO
                        (Yule-fur Rowth-skegg-er) "Wolf Red beard"
                        11th century Gall Gaidhel [gall guy-yell]
                        a.k.a. "Irish Northman"
                        Leather Craftsman, Archer, Huntsman and Target Archery M.I.T.
                        The Barony of Fenix
                        Paid SCA member since 2003


                        When you stop challenging yourself, that's as good as you'll ever be.

                        From: James Koch <alchem@...>
                        To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 5:09 PM
                        Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

                         
                        Gentlemen & Ladies,
                        >
                        What about the background enamel color?  Is red acceptable?  The silver arrows will show up great on a bright red background.  The red will also be visible from a distance.  Other options are black, green, yellow, or orange.  Blue and purple are taken and white doesn't provide good contrast for the silver arrows.   
                        >
                        Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
                        >
                        >
                        >  At 04:44 PM 8/17/2011, you wrote:
                         


                        Agree.... Crossed arrows.

                        Jon
                        On Aug 17, 2011, at 11:22 AM, James Koch wrote:

                         

                        Gentlemen & Ladies,
                        >
                        Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
                        archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
                        arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
                        across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
                        be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
                        >
                        We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
                        was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
                        in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
                        and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
                        to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
                        and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
                        >
                        What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
                        >
                        Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"



                      • John Edgerton
                        Kind of a toss up, but I would go with red. Jon
                        Message 11 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                          Kind of a toss up, but I would go with red.

                          Jon

                          On Aug 17, 2011, at 2:09 PM, James Koch wrote:

                           

                          Gentlemen & Ladies,
                          >
                          What about the background enamel color?  Is red acceptable?  The silver arrows will show up great on a bright red background.  The red will also be visible from a distance.  Other options are black, green, yellow, or orange.  Blue and purple are taken and white doesn't provide good contrast for the silver arrows.   
                          >
                          Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
                          >
                          >
                          >  At 04:44 PM 8/17/2011, you wrote:


                        • Ld.blackmoon
                          greetings like i said , i like them in several forms, but i caught a lot of flak because of some people that had never been in the military saying it was used
                          Message 12 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                            greetings
                             
                            like i said , i like them in several forms, but i caught a lot of flak because of some people that had never been in the military saying it was used as part of  one the special forces emblems, and therefore i had no right to use anything that remotely resembled it : (
                             
                            Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
                            Arthur
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 3:39 PM
                            Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

                             

                            Arthur,
                            >
                            If the field color around the arrows is bright red would that make the design different enough from the special forces symbol?  What about adding the letters SCA or some other symbol or sign?
                            >
                            I suppose whatever design is eventually chosen, it will conflict with some other groups charge.
                            >
                            Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
                            >
                            >
                            >At 03:47 PM 8/17/2011, you wrote:



                            greetings
                             
                            while I personally like the crossed arrows designs I have seen, when I proposed using them as a site token or marshal emblem for an archery only event ,
                            you would have sworn I was Hitler reborn and as un American as anyone could possibly get because I dare suggest using something some people perceived as being reserved only for members of the us special forces. and thereby disrespecting the us military .......
                             
                            so , don't be surprised if you get some negative feedback : (
                             
                            Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
                            Arthur
                             
                             
                            ----- Original Message -----
                            From: James Koch
                            To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                            Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 1:22 PM
                            Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings



                            Gentlemen & Ladies,
                            >
                            Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
                            archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
                            arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
                            across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
                            be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
                            >
                            We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
                            was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
                            in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
                            and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
                            to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
                            and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
                            >
                            What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
                            >
                            Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"


                            No virus found in this message.
                            Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                            Version: 10.0.1392 / Virus Database: 1520/3835 - Release Date: 08/15/11


                            No virus found in this message.
                            Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                            Version: 10.0.1392 / Virus Database: 1520/3835 - Release Date: 08/15/11

                          • Ld.blackmoon
                            greetings red is ok , i personaly prefer black, ; ) but i m known for being opinionated ; ) Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun . Arthur ... From: James Koch To:
                            Message 13 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                              greetings
                               
                              red is ok ,
                              i personaly prefer black, ; )  but i'm known for being opinionated ; )
                              Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
                              Arthur
                              ----- Original Message -----
                              Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 4:09 PM
                              Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

                               

                              Gentlemen & Ladies,
                              >
                              What about the background enamel color?  Is red acceptable?  The silver arrows will show up great on a bright red background.  The red will also be visible from a distance.  Other options are black, green, yellow, or orange.  Blue and purple are taken and white doesn't provide good contrast for the silver arrows.   
                              >
                              Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
                              >
                              >
                              >  At 04:44 PM 8/17/2011, you wrote:




                              Agree.... Crossed arrows.

                              Jon
                              On Aug 17, 2011, at 11:22 AM, James Koch wrote:



                              Gentlemen & Ladies,
                              >
                              Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
                              archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
                              arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
                              across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
                              be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
                              >
                              We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
                              was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
                              in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
                              and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
                              to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
                              and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
                              >
                              What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
                              >
                              Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"


                              No virus found in this message.
                              Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
                              Version: 10.0.1392 / Virus Database: 1520/3835 - Release Date: 08/15/11

                            • Joe Klovance
                              This just shows how uninformed many people are. The badge of the US Special Forces is this; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Us-special_forces.svg The badge
                              Message 14 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                                This just shows how uninformed many people are. The badge of the US Special Forces is this; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Us-special_forces.svg
                                The badge of the 1st Special Forces Regiment is as follows; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SpecialForces_Badge.svg
                                The badge is much more complex than crossed arrows. It is very difficult to confuse a plain crossed arrows with that badge.

                                The crossed arrows is also already used in conjunction with SCA archer. The badge for the An Tir Royal Archer is as follows; http://antir.sca.org/Offices/OfficeBadges/archer.gif

                                Gryffyd ap Llylewyn
                              • loreleiElkins@aol.com
                                ooOOOoo.....Lorelei GREENleafe approves. ... From: Dearg Ailfredsson To: SCA-Archery Sent: Wed, Aug
                                Message 15 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                                  ooOOOoo.....Lorelei GREENleafe approves.



                                  -----Original Message-----
                                  From: Dearg Ailfredsson <thefenixhuntsman@...>
                                  To: SCA-Archery <SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com>
                                  Sent: Wed, Aug 17, 2011 1:17 pm
                                  Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings



                                  Green!!!
                                   
                                  Dearg.
                                  >>------>

                                  Lord Úlfr Rauðskeggr (Dearg) AOA CSO
                                  (Yule-fur Rowth-skegg-er) "Wolf Red beard"
                                  11th century Gall Gaidhel [gall guy-yell]
                                  a.k.a. "Irish Northman"
                                  Leather Craftsman, Archer, Huntsman and Target Archery M.I.T.
                                  The Barony of Fenix
                                  Paid SCA member since 2003


                                  When you stop challenging yourself, that's as good as you'll ever be.

                                  From: James Koch <alchem@...>
                                  To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                                  Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 5:09 PM
                                  Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

                                   
                                  Gentlemen & Ladies,
                                  >
                                  What about the background enamel color?  Is red acceptable?  The silver arrows will show up great on a bright red background.  The red will also be visible from a distance.  Other options are black, green, yellow, or orange.  Blue and purple are taken and white doesn't provide good contrast for the silver arrows.   
                                  >
                                  Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >  At 04:44 PM 8/17/2011, you wrote:
                                   


                                  Agree.... Crossed arrows.

                                  Jon
                                  On Aug 17, 2011, at 11:22 AM, James Koch wrote:

                                   

                                  Gentlemen & Ladies,
                                  >
                                  Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
                                  archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
                                  arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
                                  across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
                                  be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
                                  >
                                  We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
                                  was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
                                  in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
                                  and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
                                  to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
                                  and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
                                  >
                                  What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
                                  >
                                  Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"





                                • Taslen
                                  Aye I agree with what about having   Archery Marshal Gaelen OGrady Sent from Yahoo! Mail on Android Aye I agree with what about having Archery Marshal
                                  Message 16 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                                    Aye I agree with what about having " Archery Marshal"

                                    Gaelen OGrady

                                    Sent from Yahoo! Mail on Android



                                    From: Ld.blackmoon <ld.blackmoon@...>;
                                    To: <SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com>;
                                    Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings
                                    Sent: Wed, Aug 17, 2011 9:57:03 PM

                                     

                                    greetings
                                     
                                    like i said , i like them in several forms, but i caught a lot of flak because of some people that had never been in the military saying it was used as part of  one the special forces emblems, and therefore i had no right to use anything that remotely resembled it : (
                                     
                                    Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
                                    Arthur
                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 3:39 PM
                                    Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

                                     

                                    Arthur,
                                    >
                                    If the field color around the arrows is bright red would that make the design different enough from the special forces symbol?  What about adding the letters SCA or some other symbol or sign?
                                    >
                                    I suppose whatever design is eventually chosen, it will conflict with some other groups charge.
                                    >
                                    Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >At 03:47 PM 8/17/2011, you wrote:



                                    greetings
                                     
                                    while I personally like the crossed arrows designs I have seen, when I proposed using them as a site token or marshal emblem for an archery only event ,
                                    you would have sworn I was Hitler reborn and as un American as anyone could possibly get because I dare suggest using something some people perceived as being reserved only for members of the us special forces. and thereby disrespecting the us military .......
                                     
                                    so , don't be surprised if you get some negative feedback : (
                                     
                                    Be Safe , Be Happy, Have Fun .
                                    Arthur
                                     
                                     
                                    ----- Original Message -----
                                    From: James Koch
                                    To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                                    Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 1:22 PM
                                    Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings



                                    Gentlemen & Ladies,
                                    >
                                    Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
                                    archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
                                    arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
                                    across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
                                    be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
                                    >
                                    We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
                                    was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
                                    in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
                                    and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
                                    to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
                                    and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
                                    >
                                    What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
                                    >
                                    Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"


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                                  • Paul Wilburn
                                    Actually Gyffyd, plain gold crossed arrows ARE the branch insignia of Special Forces personnel, worn on their collars:
                                    Message 17 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                                      Actually Gyffyd, plain gold crossed arrows ARE the ‘branch insignia’ of Special Forces personnel, worn on their collars: http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/armybranches/blsf.htm   It seems you were right about uninformed people ; )

                                       

                                       

                                       

                                       

                                       

                                      That being pointed out, I don’t think any reasonable person would be offended that an archery marshal emblem resembles one of the Special Forces emblems.  In fact, there is probably some knight rolling over in his tomb, cursing out the Special Forces for stealing his heraldic charge : )

                                       

                                      Hawken

                                       

                                       

                                       

                                       


                                      From: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com [mailto: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Joe Klovance
                                      Sent: Wednesday, August 17, 2011 6:11 PM
                                      To: sca-archery@yahoogroups.com
                                      Subject: RE: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

                                       

                                       

                                      This just shows how uninformed many people are. The badge of the US Special Forces is this; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Us-special_forces.svg
                                      The badge of the 1st Special Forces Regiment is as follows; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:SpecialForces_Badge.svg
                                      The badge is much more complex than crossed arrows. It is very difficult to confuse a plain crossed arrows with that badge.

                                      The crossed arrows is also already used in conjunction with SCA archer. The badge for the An Tir Royal Archer is as follows; http://antir.sca.org/Offices/OfficeBadges/archer.gif

                                      Gryffyd ap Llylewyn

                                    • Robert Maddison
                                      Crossed arrows on red works for me Gandalfr( used to be Llywyllyn)
                                      Message 18 of 24 , Aug 17, 2011
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                                        Crossed arrows on red works for me
                                        Gandalfr( used to be Llywyllyn)

                                        On Wed, Aug 17, 2011 at 2:22 PM, James Koch <alchem@...> wrote:
                                         

                                        Gentlemen & Ladies,
                                        >
                                        Now that Pennsic is past, I can devote some time to designing the
                                        archery marshal rings. Some kingdoms have their own archery marshal
                                        arms, but it is my hope to come up with a design which is acceptable
                                        across the SCA. This will keep the cost of the rings down since I'll
                                        be able to make just one pattern and wax mold.
                                        >
                                        We are already making the rings with the single pheon. My thought
                                        was to make a ring with two crossed arrows for the marshals. This is
                                        in keeping with the crossed swords of the armored combatant marshals
                                        and the crossed rapiers of the fencing marshals. Another option is
                                        to simply enamel the single pheon ring with a red shield background
                                        and a colored pheon to indicate a marshal.
                                        >
                                        What are other people's thoughts and preferences?
                                        >
                                        Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"


                                      • James Koch
                                        ... Oblio, ... That is actually a good idea. Here are a couple examples. http://www.alcheminc.com/archrings.html You have to scroll to the bottom of the
                                        Message 19 of 24 , Aug 18, 2011
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                                          >
                                          >
                                          >Hello, from the Wild West (Western Australia).
                                          >
                                          >Suggestion: if you have (upload) access to a web site, why do you not
                                          >put up proposed images, and post a link to the proposed images, so
                                          >that people can see the prospective images?
                                          >
                                          >I think it would make the visualisation, a bit easier.
                                          >
                                          >--
                                          >Oblio the Heretic, of Abertwidr
                                          >Per fructu, non folii
                                          > ................................

                                          Oblio,
                                          >
                                          That is actually a good idea. Here are a couple
                                          examples. http://www.alcheminc.com/archrings.html You have to
                                          scroll to the bottom of the page to see them. The one on the left is
                                          a possible archery marshals ring. On the right is a ring for an
                                          archery marshal who is also a member of the Order of Saggitarius. Of
                                          course the lettering on an actual rung would be less modern.
                                          >
                                          Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
                                        • Taslen
                                          I like it but I still want it in a pendant From: James Koch To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2011 5:07 PM Subject:
                                          Message 20 of 24 , Aug 18, 2011
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                                            I like it but I still want it in a pendant

                                            From: James Koch <alchem@...>
                                            To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                                            Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2011 5:07 PM
                                            Subject: RE: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

                                             

                                            >
                                            >
                                            >Hello, from the Wild West (Western Australia).
                                            >
                                            >Suggestion: if you have (upload) access to a web site, why do you not
                                            >put up proposed images, and post a link to the proposed images, so
                                            >that people can see the prospective images?
                                            >
                                            >I think it would make the visualisation, a bit easier.
                                            >
                                            >--
                                            >Oblio the Heretic, of Abertwidr
                                            >Per fructu, non folii
                                            > ................................

                                            Oblio,
                                            >
                                            That is actually a good idea. Here are a couple
                                            examples. http://www.alcheminc.com/archrings.html You have to
                                            scroll to the bottom of the page to see them. The one on the left is
                                            a possible archery marshals ring. On the right is a ring for an
                                            archery marshal who is also a member of the Order of Saggitarius. Of
                                            course the lettering on an actual rung would be less modern.
                                            >
                                            Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"



                                          • James Koch
                                            We can do pendants. In fact those would be cheaper since they don t have to be silver or gold since they won t be worn against the skin. ... Jim Koch Gladius
                                            Message 21 of 24 , Aug 18, 2011
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                                              We can do pendants.  In fact those would be cheaper since they don't have to be silver or gold since they won't be worn against the skin.
                                              >
                                              Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > At 08:53 PM 8/18/2011, you wrote:
                                               

                                              I like it but I still want it in a pendant

                                              From: James Koch <alchem@...>
                                              To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
                                              Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2011 5:07 PM
                                              Subject: RE: [SCA-Archery] Re: Design For Archery Marshal Rings

                                               

                                              >
                                              >
                                              >Hello, from the Wild West (Western Australia).
                                              >
                                              >Suggestion: if you have (upload) access to a web site, why do you not
                                              >put up proposed images, and post a link to the proposed images, so
                                              >that people can see the prospective images?
                                              >
                                              >I think it would make the visualisation, a bit easier.
                                              >
                                              >--
                                              >Oblio the Heretic, of Abertwidr
                                              >Per fructu, non folii
                                              > ................................

                                              Oblio,
                                              >
                                              That is actually a good idea. Here are a couple
                                              examples. http://www.alcheminc.com/archrings.html You have to
                                              scroll to the bottom of the page to see them. The one on the left is
                                              a possible archery marshals ring. On the right is a ring for an
                                              archery marshal who is also a member of the Order of Saggitarius. Of
                                              course the lettering on an actual rung would be less modern.
                                              >
                                              Jim Koch "Gladius The Alchemist"



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