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Re: [SCA-Archery] Can I draw to another spot?

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  • Carolus
    Actually, unless you need arrows longer than 32 cost isn t a factor. Drawing to a location on the face, be it mouth, ear, chin, or whatever, is a matter of
    Message 1 of 12 , Oct 26, 2007
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      Actually, unless you need arrows longer than 32" cost isn't a
      factor. Drawing to a location on the face, be it mouth, ear, chin,
      or whatever, is a matter of dynamics and physiology. Drawing to
      other locations usually requires an entirely different technique to
      avoid injury. There is a reason why the western style we usually use
      has certain conventions. Most of them are for safety and others for
      consistency, thus accuracy. Work with your local marshal/coach to
      find out what is best for you.
      Carolus

      At 01:43 PM 10/26/2007, you wrote:

      >What's the right term for the point to which you draw the string back
      >to? Nock point? Draw point?
      >
      >Anyway, most people draw back to a point on the face, right? Cheek,
      >corner of the mouth, various. But you use the same one every time for
      >consistency's sake.
      >
      >But can you use a different point altoghter, not on your face? Am I
      >remembering correctly, that I think I've seen some archers draw to a
      >point under the bow arm, near the armpit?
      >
      >Is the point of drawing to the face just for consistency's sake, or is
      >it too hard to aim when using a different point?
      >
      >(The reason I ask is that I haven't started yet, but I'm quite tall
      >with long arms, and I'd rather be able to buy slightly shorter arrows,
      >as I think they'll be easier and perhaps even cheaper to get.)
      >
      >Thanks.
      >
      >~Geirr


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    • jameswolfden
      My drawlength is 26.5 to the corner of my mouth. If I anchor under the chin, string touching the nose, my draw is only 25 . Sight picture changes so I
      Message 2 of 12 , Oct 27, 2007
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        My drawlength is 26.5" to the corner of my mouth.

        If I anchor under the chin, string touching the nose, my draw is only 25". Sight picture
        changes so I actually have aim lower.

        So there are alternatives that you can use but you need to be consistent.

        I have never drawn to the chest but I just tried it as an experiment and was quite surprized
        that anchoring to my sternum, my draw increased to 29". Not quite the results I was
        expecting.

        In Toxophilus, Ascham talks about a favoured 'silver spoon' style of arrowhead.

        "They made a certain kind of heads which men call high rigged, creased, or shouldered
        heads, or silver spoon heads for a certain likeness that such head have with the knob end
        of some silver spoons.

        These heads be good to both keep a length withal and also to percha a wind withal, to
        keep a length withal because a man may certainly pull it to the shoulder every shot and no
        further."

        This suggest to me that arrow head itself was used as the anchor point to ensure
        consistency. Sort of a medieval clicker.

        In Service,
        James
      • G P
        ... That s good to hear--using that chest-to-clapped-hands thing, I come out to exactly 32 . ~Geirr
        Message 3 of 12 , Oct 27, 2007
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          On 10/26/07, Carolus <eulenhorst@...> wrote:
          > Actually, unless you need arrows longer than 32" cost isn't a
          > factor.
          > Carolus


          That's good to hear--using that chest-to-clapped-hands thing, I come
          out to exactly 32".

          ~Geirr
        • Carolus
          With that in mind, make your first few sets of arrows with add on nocks instead of self nocks, the added length of the nock plus the point will give you some
          Message 4 of 12 , Oct 27, 2007
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            With that in mind, make your first few sets of arrows with add on
            nocks instead of self nocks, the added length of the nock plus the
            point will give you some safety margin until you determine the true
            length you need.
            Carolus

            At 06:37 AM 10/27/2007, you wrote:

            >On 10/26/07, Carolus
            ><<mailto:eulenhorst%40rosesandivy.net>eulenhorst@...> wrote:
            > > Actually, unless you need arrows longer than 32" cost isn't a
            > > factor.
            > > Carolus
            >
            >That's good to hear--using that chest-to-clapped-hands thing, I come
            >out to exactly 32".
            >
            >~Geirr


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          • Richard Yeager
            I know this has caused some arguments on here in the past but I will weigh in anyway. If your draw-length is 32 make absolutely certain that the bow you get
            Message 5 of 12 , Oct 28, 2007
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              I know this has caused some arguments on here in the past but I will weigh in anyway. If your draw-length is 32" make absolutely certain that the bow you get (whether you build or buy) is tillered to draw that far. Fiberglass backed bows are more forgiving, but even those will have problems if they were tillered to 28". The concern about having arrows too short (and putting one through your hand) is a real concern. So is the damage that you can do to a bow by overdrawing. Most of the wooden longbows you will commonly find are tillered to 28'. A four inch overdraw can be incredibly ugly to the person holding what is left of the bow and anyone within range of what comes apart.

              Cuan mac Niall

              G P <gonfannon@...> wrote: On 10/26/07, Carolus <eulenhorst@...> wrote:
              > Actually, unless you need arrows longer than 32" cost isn't a
              > factor.
              > Carolus

              That's good to hear--using that chest-to-clapped-hands thing, I come
              out to exactly 32".

              ~Geirr




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            • Lord Godwin FitzGilbert de Strigoil
              You can also make/get footed shafts. This would allow you to have arrows longer than 32 . Godwin
              Message 6 of 12 , Oct 29, 2007
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                You can also make/get 'footed' shafts. This would allow you to have arrows longer
                than 32".


                Godwin



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              • Luigi Kapaj
                ... Yes. You absolutely can draw to a different point. In fact, drawing to the mouth was not the most widely used traditional archery style. Native Americans
                Message 7 of 12 , Oct 29, 2007
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                  > Anyway, most people draw back to a point on the face, right? Cheek,
                  > corner of the mouth, various. But you use the same one every time for
                  > consistency's sake.
                  >
                  > But can you use a different point altoghter, not on your face? Am I
                  > remembering correctly, that I think I've seen some archers draw to a
                  > point under the bow arm, near the armpit?
                  >
                  > Is the point of drawing to the face just for consistency's sake, or is
                  > it too hard to aim when using a different point?

                  Yes. You absolutely can draw to a different point. In fact, drawing to the
                  mouth was not the most widely used traditional archery style. Native
                  Americans (Plains Indians, I think) would draw with 3 fingers to the
                  stomach. Mongol, Chinese, Turkic, Indian, and many other archers would draw
                  with the thumb to the collar bone or chest area. 36" arrows are not uncommon
                  for such styles.

                  Careful with drawing high and past the cheek, I've heard English and
                  Japanese longbowmen were known to lose ears. All other style of longer draw,
                  draw lower and don't have to worry about a string getting behind the ear.

                  It is important to note that anything a typical SCAdian archer will tell you
                  about consistency is equally important in such other styles of archery. You
                  may not be using a particular tooth as an anchor point, but you still need
                  to learn a consistent draw no matter what point you draw to. You can use a
                  location on you garb, or other body part such as collar bone as a reference
                  instead of a tooth, but ultimately this is just a learning tool and you want
                  this technique to become muscle memory.

                  Such muscle memory is even more important if you practice mounted archery.
                  In mounted archery, you neither pause at full draw, nor use any form of
                  anchor point. However, you are still aiming and drawing consistantly, just
                  doing it without a pause in the middle.

                  Most Asiatic bows, Composite bows, Yumi bows, and even the replicas like
                  Horsebows, are designed to accomidate longer draws.


                  Gulugjab
                  http://www.NYCMongol.com
                • arturdubh
                  I realize that I am a bit late in adding to this particular topic, but for the sake of the safety of every archer.... I have seen what can happen when a bow is
                  Message 8 of 12 , Dec 9, 2007
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                    I realize that I am a bit late in adding to this particular topic,
                    but for the sake of the safety of every archer....

                    I have seen what can happen when a bow is over-drawn, due to a too-
                    short arrow -- I was not there to see it happen, but I did see the
                    result; picture a modern recurve bow, with a hole through the handle
                    portion, put there by the arrow as it left the string. Not merely a
                    hole **in** the bow, but completely *****through***** it.

                    Now consider what that would do to your hand or arm -- or the archer
                    next to you.

                    --Artúr


                    --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, Richard Yeager <chuymonstre@...>
                    wrote:
                    >
                    > I know this has caused some arguments on here in the past but I
                    will weigh in anyway. If your draw-length is 32" make absolutely
                    certain that the bow you get (whether you build or buy) is tillered
                    to draw that far. Fiberglass backed bows are more forgiving, but
                    even those will have problems if they were tillered to 28". The
                    concern about having arrows too short (and putting one through your
                    hand) is a real concern. So is the damage that you can do to a bow
                    by overdrawing. Most of the wooden longbows you will commonly find
                    are tillered to 28'. A four inch overdraw can be incredibly ugly to
                    the person holding what is left of the bow and anyone within range of
                    what comes apart.
                    >
                    > Cuan mac Niall
                    >
                    > G P <gonfannon@...> wrote: On
                    10/26/07, Carolus <eulenhorst@...> wrote:
                    > > Actually, unless you need arrows longer than 32" cost isn't a
                    > > factor.
                    > > Carolus
                    >
                    > That's good to hear--using that chest-to-clapped-hands thing, I
                    come
                    > out to exactly 32".
                    >
                    > ~Geirr
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
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