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Re: Crossbow strings

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  • Dana DeGroat
    Any line only develops its full strength in a straight line pull with no bends or knots. A bend in a line as in around a bow nock reduces strength by about
    Message 1 of 16 , Feb 2, 2007
      Any line only develops its full strength in a straight line pull with
      no bends or knots. A bend in a line as in around a bow nock reduces
      strength by about 20%. Knotting a line reduces strength by 20% to 50%
      depending on the knot used. In a total system of bends and knots as
      long as the right knots are used the overall strength of the line
      remains the same regardless of the number of knots or bends. If weaker
      knots are used then the total strength of the line will need to be
      increased approximately.

      Kind of a long winded way of saying that as long as it's done right
      mixing colors won't effect the strength of the line.

      Note. I spent 25 years as a captain of ocean going tugs mostly on trans
      Pacific routes so have some knowledge of line under load, given that
      your mileage may vary:) As they say different ships different long
      splices.

      In Service
      Dana the Unredy
    • latorrej@aol.com
      In a message dated 2/2/2007 7:22:05 AM Pacific Standard Time, SiegfriedFaust@gmail.com writes: Now, that said, I could see the possibility of using two colors,
      Message 2 of 16 , Feb 2, 2007
        In a message dated 2/2/2007 7:22:05 AM Pacific Standard Time,
        SiegfriedFaust@... writes:
        Now, that said, I could see the possibility of using two colors,
        basically making 2 endless loops on top of each other, and binding
        them together. But I would use a 'few more strands' than I would
        otherwise, to make up for the 'cut' in the string that you are making.
        I've used that method for a longbow string (to use up two different color
        leftovers!). The only problem was that, in serving the end loops, I wasn't
        careful to keep the colors separated. So, instead of a sting that appears to be
        two separate strands twisted together as in a flemish, the colors are
        distributed rather randomly. Doesn't look too bad, though, and works fine.

        Joseph de la Tour, West Kingdom


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Scott Jaqua
        You are in essence making two continuous loop strings. You may need an extra loop of both colors to make up for the break. That being said a few cautions. One,
        Message 3 of 16 , Feb 2, 2007
          You are in essence making two continuous loop strings. You may need an
          extra loop of both colors to make up for the break. That being said a
          few cautions.

          One, don't knot your colors together. First wrap one color and anchor it
          on your jig and then do the other. Pull the ends of each color under
          the serving like usual. This might work better if you end the two colors
          on opposite ends of your jig.

          Two, make sure your two strands are equal in all ways. Diameter,
          strength, amount of wax, etc. If the strings are at all uneven, then
          they will stretch at different rates. This could put all the load on
          only one half of your string. The half that stretched out further or faster.

          And last, speaking of stretch, make sure you really pre-stretch your
          string before shooting it. Static force is much more forgiving then the
          force at release. String you crossbow for several days first. That will
          start the stretch. Then span the bow for several hours at a time. Last
          do a series of spanning a relaxing the bow. All this before your first
          shot. This will give as much stretch as possible and allow you see
          problems relating to how the string stretchs in early on.

          Njall
        • Rj Bachner
          What is wrong with a flemish crossbow string? You can mix colors as you wish and the braiding will even out the unequal bundle tension worries. Ragi ... From:
          Message 4 of 16 , Feb 2, 2007
            What is wrong with a flemish crossbow string? You can mix colors as you wish
            and the braiding will even out the unequal bundle tension worries.

            Ragi

            -----Original Message-----
            From: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com] On
            Behalf Of Scott Jaqua
            Sent: Friday, February 02, 2007 5:15 PM
            To: SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Crossbow strings

            You are in essence making two continuous loop strings. You may need an
            extra loop of both colors to make up for the break. That being said a
            few cautions.

            One, don't knot your colors together. First wrap one color and anchor it
            on your jig and then do the other. Pull the ends of each color under
            the serving like usual. This might work better if you end the two colors
            on opposite ends of your jig.

            Two, make sure your two strands are equal in all ways. Diameter,
            strength, amount of wax, etc. If the strings are at all uneven, then
            they will stretch at different rates. This could put all the load on
            only one half of your string. The half that stretched out further or faster.

            And last, speaking of stretch, make sure you really pre-stretch your
            string before shooting it. Static force is much more forgiving then the
            force at release. String you crossbow for several days first. That will
            start the stretch. Then span the bow for several hours at a time. Last
            do a series of spanning a relaxing the bow. All this before your first
            shot. This will give as much stretch as possible and allow you see
            problems relating to how the string stretchs in early on.

            Njall


            --
            [Email to SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com to leave this list]

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          • Scott Jaqua
            ... you wish ... Nothing that I can think of. However it is outside my experience. I don t believe I have ever seen a flemish twist crossbow string. So I don t
            Message 5 of 16 , Feb 2, 2007
              Rj Bachner wrote:

              > What is wrong with a flemish crossbow string? You can mix colors as
              you wish
              > and the braiding will even out the unequal bundle tension worries.

              Nothing that I can think of. However it is outside my experience. I
              don't believe I have ever seen a flemish twist crossbow string. So I
              don't know how it would work with the dynamic of a crossbow.

              Njall
            • i_griffen
              Many years ago I made a Flemish Crossbow string. For the life of me I am not able to remember the inches added to the prod length I think it was 6 . Iain
              Message 6 of 16 , Feb 2, 2007
                Many years ago I made a Flemish Crossbow string. For the life of me I
                am not able to remember the inches added to the prod length I think it
                was 6".


                Iain Griffen

                --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, "Rj Bachner" <ragiwarmbear@...>
                wrote:
                >
                > What is wrong with a flemish crossbow string? You can mix colors as
                you wish
                > and the braiding will even out the unequal bundle tension worries.
                >
                > Ragi
              • i_griffen
                When I laied up the string I layed both colors at the same time using equal tension.I started the loop on one end of the jig and finished ith on the other end.
                Message 7 of 16 , Feb 2, 2007
                  When I laied up the string I layed both colors at the same time using
                  equal tension.I started the loop on one end of the jig and finished
                  ith on the other end. when I seerved the string the starting and
                  ending were served into the eyes for the string.


                  I will let you know if I had any problems after Estrella War


                  Iain Griffen

                  --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, Siegfried <SiegfriedFaust@...>
                  wrote:
                  >
                  > Unless you have some fancy multicolored Dacron ... then by
                  definition
                  > a multi-colored continuous loop string, doesn't exist.
                  >
                  > Since a continuous loop string derives much of it's strength by the
                  > fact that it's one, bit, long, loop of string.
                  >
                  > No breaks.
                  >
                  > Now, that said, I could see the possibility of using two colors,
                  > basically making 2 endless loops on top of each other, and binding
                  > them together. But I would use a 'few more strands' than I would
                  > otherwise, to make up for the 'cut' in the string that you are
                  making.
                  >
                  > Though, at the same time, if you are wanting a multicolored look ...
                  > why not just make a flemish string?
                  >
                  > Siegfried
                  >
                  > On 2/1/07, Ian Griffen <i_griffen@...> wrote:
                  > > Has anyone had problems using a multi-corlored continuious loop
                  crossbow string?
                  > >
                  > > Iain Griffen
                  >
                  >
                  > --
                  >
                  ______________________________________________________________________
                  ___
                  > THL Siegfried Sebastian Faust - http://crossbows.biz/
                  > Barony of Highland Foorde - Baronial Archery Marshal
                  > Kingdom of Atlantia - Deputy Kingdom Earl Marshal for Target
                  Archery
                  > http://eliw.com/ - http://archery.atlantia.sca.org/
                  >
                • Frederick Fenters
                  I have made strings with 2 sets of loops. I usually make them in contrasting colors. If done correctly, no problems. Sigfried is right, you make the string
                  Message 8 of 16 , Feb 2, 2007
                    I have made strings with 2 sets of loops. I usually make them in
                    contrasting colors. If done correctly, no problems. Sigfried is right, you
                    make the string with an extra strand or two.



                    Padraig



                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • i_griffen
                    ... What kind of dynamics are you thinking about? I m not sure how much but, the Flemish Twist is slightly heaver than the Continious loop. Iain Griffen
                    Message 9 of 16 , Feb 2, 2007
                      >
                      > Nothing that I can think of. However it is outside my experience. I
                      > don't believe I have ever seen a flemish twist crossbow string. So I
                      > don't know how it would work with the dynamic of a crossbow.
                      >
                      > Njall
                      >
                      What kind of dynamics are you thinking about? I'm not sure how much
                      but, the Flemish Twist is slightly heaver than the Continious loop.

                      Iain Griffen
                    • Dayrl Merrill
                      I have made several 2 color continous loop crossbow strings, Actually as described 2 continous loops served together. How many extra strands if any would
                      Message 10 of 16 , Feb 3, 2007
                        I have made several 2 color continous loop crossbow strings, Actually as
                        described 2 continous loops served together. How many extra strands if any
                        would depend on the poundage of the crossbow.

                        Rask

                        At 05:48 PM 2/2/07, you wrote:

                        >Rj Bachner wrote:
                        >
                        > > What is wrong with a flemish crossbow string? You can mix colors as
                        >you wish
                        > > and the braiding will even out the unequal bundle tension worries.
                        >
                        >Nothing that I can think of. However it is outside my experience. I
                        >don't believe I have ever seen a flemish twist crossbow string. So I
                        >don't know how it would work with the dynamic of a crossbow.
                        >
                        >Njall
                        >


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • John Atkins
                        I have made Flemish crosbow strings and they work just dandy. Of course, like all Flemish strings they stretch at first and need to be twisted to compensate,
                        Message 11 of 16 , Feb 4, 2007
                          I have made Flemish crosbow strings and they work just dandy. Of
                          course, like all Flemish strings they stretch at first and need to be
                          twisted to compensate, but once stretched out they work just as well as
                          a continuous loop (made those too). The conpensation for the crossbow
                          versus a hand bow is that I served the end loops. I believe there is a
                          great deal more stress on the end loops of a crossbow string than a hand
                          bow string, thus the serving. I also double served the center/contact
                          area as this tends to take a great deal of stress both from contact with
                          the bolt end and the prod/guide rail. And, yes, they were pretty
                          because they were two toned. Look good, shoot good.

                          cog


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Scott B. Jaqua
                          Crossbow strings do take a lot of abuse at the loops. In part because this is where the shock is greatest at the end of the power stroke. But also in part
                          Message 12 of 16 , Feb 4, 2007
                            Crossbow strings do take a lot of abuse at the loops. In part because
                            this is where the shock is greatest at the end of the power stroke. But
                            also in part because the string is bent around a very small radius.
                            Another small radius is the sharp bend at the release nut when spanned.
                            So these are the two places I have seen crossbow strings fail.

                            Njall

                            --
                            Scott B. Jaqua
                            Hagerson Forge, Custom Blades from Historic Patterns
                            http://sjaqua.tripod.com
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