Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Why are the ranks different?

Expand Messages
  • Barnabas Remington
    Hello All, This might be a stupid question, but why are the archery ranks and the scores to attain them different for each kingdom? Why isn t there a standard
    Message 1 of 9 , Nov 24, 2004
    • 0 Attachment
      Hello All,

      This might be a stupid question, but why are the archery ranks and
      the scores to attain them different for each kingdom? Why isn't
      there a standard ranking system for archery across the SCA? Not that
      the differences are a big deal, just an idle curiosity on my part...

      [I just switched over to the SCA about 4 months ago (and have only
      been shooting archery for that long as well), so this might have been
      discussed recently...if so, please forgive my reposting.]

      Evan Hawkins
      SunDragon
    • Harry Bilings
      Because they (archery rank) are set by the different Kingdoms not the SCA. plachoya humble archer Ravens Fort Ansteorra Hello All, This might be a stupid
      Message 2 of 9 , Nov 24, 2004
      • 0 Attachment
        Because they (archery rank) are set by the different Kingdoms not the SCA.
        plachoya
        humble archer
        Ravens Fort Ansteorra

        Hello All,

        This might be a stupid question, but why are the archery ranks and
        the scores to attain them different for each kingdom? Why isn't
        there a standard ranking system for archery across the SCA? Not that
        the differences are a big deal, just an idle curiosity on my part...

        [I just switched over to the SCA about 4 months ago (and have only
        been shooting archery for that long as well), so this might have been
        discussed recently...if so, please forgive my reposting.]

        Evan Hawkins
        SunDragon


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Eadric Anstapa
        ... They are different simply because they are. It is part of the cultural differences that make the various kingdoms unique. At the Society level we tend to
        Message 3 of 9 , Nov 24, 2004
        • 0 Attachment
          Barnabas Remington wrote:

          >Hello All,
          >
          >This might be a stupid question, but why are the archery ranks and
          >the scores to attain them different for each kingdom? Why isn't
          >there a standard ranking system for archery across the SCA? Not that
          >the differences are a big deal, just an idle curiosity on my part...
          >
          >[I just switched over to the SCA about 4 months ago (and have only
          >been shooting archery for that long as well), so this might have been
          >discussed recently...if so, please forgive my reposting.]
          >
          >Evan Hawkins
          >SunDragon
          >
          >
          >
          They are different simply because they are. It is part of the cultural
          differences that make the various kingdoms unique. At the Society level
          we tend to try not to legislate such cultural aspects of the "game".

          That that awards are very different from kingdom to kingdom. Peerages
          are the same throughout the known world as are for the most part the
          Noble ranks and Awards of Arms but beyond that the awards are different
          sometimes very different from kingdom to kingdom. Beyond just different
          names for awards some kingdoms have Grant level awards while others do
          not, some kingdoms have polling orders other than the peerages while
          others do not, in one kingdom the Order of the White Scarf might be a
          Grant level polling order in the next kingdom it might be an AoA level
          award.

          It's those neat little cultural differences that had extra spice to to
          the SCA. Otherwise, whats the point in having different kingdoms? We
          could all simply be "SCA Inc." with exactly the same everything.

          Regards,
          --
          HL Eadric Anstapa
          /eadric@.../ <mailto:eadric@...>



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Siegfried
          I will also add that they tend to be similar , yet kingdoms still like to make them different, unique. However, most all the kingdoms for the ranks/scores end
          Message 4 of 9 , Nov 24, 2004
          • 0 Attachment
            I will also add that they tend to be 'similar', yet kingdoms still
            like to make them different, unique.

            However, most all the kingdoms for the ranks/scores end up using the
            same shoot, the Royal Round, so at least the scores are consistant if
            the ranks are not. (Though that isn't necissarily the case, as some
            Kingdoms shoot the RR differently, many, such as Atlantia, require
            that all 4 ends of the shoot be done consequtively - However I know at
            least one Kingdom allows for 'ranging ends' to be shot in between the
            scoring ends (ie, shoot 6 at 20 for practice, shoot 6 at 20 for score,
            shoot 6 at 30 for practice, shoot 6 at 30 for score, etc).

            However, back on point, most are quite similar, with the ranks being
            about 20 points apart, the highest rank being around 100 or 105.

            Mostly it seems that Kingdoms either adopted the Middle's 105 based
            ranking system and modified it, or adopted the East's 100 based
            ranking.

            Atlantia, for example, did alot of copying from the East (especially
            since we used to be their principality), and we have a 40/60/80/100
            based ranking, with even the 0, 40, and 60 ranks using the same name
            as the East, but the 80 and 100 changing, to show we are different
            (Bowman Elite and Grand Bowman Elite, versus Master Bowman and
            Grandmaster Bowman) ...

            Atlantia ... The Elite ;)

            Siegfried


            > >This might be a stupid question, but why are the archery ranks and
            > >the scores to attain them different for each kingdom? Why isn't

            --
            ___________________________________________________________________________
            THL Siegfried Sebastian Faust http://crossbows.biz/
            Barony of Highland Foorde Baronial Web Minister & Archery Marshal
            Kingdom of Atlantia Deputy Kingdom Earl Marshal for Target Archery
            http://highland-foorde.atlantia.sca.org/ http://archery.atlantia.sca.org/
          • Lord Cain Saethydd
            Well here in Atenveldt (and Sundragon area), we do allow a practice round at each range, but not before each end of six. Meaning, practice at 40, then three
            Message 5 of 9 , Nov 24, 2004
            • 0 Attachment
              Well here in Atenveldt (and Sundragon area), we do allow a practice
              round at each range, but not before each end of six. Meaning,
              practice at 40, then three royals at 40, then practice at thirty,
              etc. We tend to shoot at the farthest range first. I know this
              varies from kingdom to kingdom.

              Our top two ranks are Bowmaster Elite 100 to 108? or 109, cannot
              recall, and Bowmaster Par Excellance, which is 109/110 and above.

              We require that all three royal rounds be shot within the same
              month.

              Atenveldt also includes a rank of Novice. This is awarded to any
              archer who finishes the three royal round 'set' that we normaly
              shoot. They need not ever hit the target, so long as they shoot all
              the arrows. For some, this a worthy goal, as disabilities and such
              may very well interfere.

              Cain

              --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, Siegfried <SiegfriedFaust@g...>
              wrote:
              > I will also add that they tend to be 'similar', yet kingdoms still
              > like to make them different, unique.
              >
              > However, most all the kingdoms for the ranks/scores end up using
              the
              > same shoot, the Royal Round, so at least the scores are consistant
              if
              > the ranks are not. (Though that isn't necissarily the case, as
              some
              > Kingdoms shoot the RR differently, many, such as Atlantia, require
              > that all 4 ends of the shoot be done consequtively - However I
              know at
              > least one Kingdom allows for 'ranging ends' to be shot in between
              the
              > scoring ends (ie, shoot 6 at 20 for practice, shoot 6 at 20 for
              score,
              > shoot 6 at 30 for practice, shoot 6 at 30 for score, etc).
              >
              > However, back on point, most are quite similar, with the ranks
              being
              > about 20 points apart, the highest rank being around 100 or 105.
              >
              > Mostly it seems that Kingdoms either adopted the Middle's 105 based
              > ranking system and modified it, or adopted the East's 100 based
              > ranking.
              >
              > Atlantia, for example, did alot of copying from the East
              (especially
              > since we used to be their principality), and we have a 40/60/80/100
              > based ranking, with even the 0, 40, and 60 ranks using the same
              name
              > as the East, but the 80 and 100 changing, to show we are different
              > (Bowman Elite and Grand Bowman Elite, versus Master Bowman and
              > Grandmaster Bowman) ...
              >
              > Atlantia ... The Elite ;)
              >
              > Siegfried
              >
              >
              > > >This might be a stupid question, but why are the archery ranks
              and
              > > >the scores to attain them different for each kingdom? Why isn't
              >
              > --
              >
              _____________________________________________________________________
              ______
              > THL Siegfried Sebastian Faust
              http://crossbows.biz/
              > Barony of Highland Foorde Baronial Web Minister &
              Archery Marshal
              > Kingdom of Atlantia Deputy Kingdom Earl Marshal for
              Target Archery
              > http://highland-foorde.atlantia.sca.org/
              http://archery.atlantia.sca.org/
            • John edgerton
              On Wednesday, November 24, 2004, at 07:02 PM, Siegfried wrote: Misc deleted ... And these are all descended from the West s 40/60/80 ranking system for the RR
              Message 6 of 9 , Nov 24, 2004
              • 0 Attachment
                On Wednesday, November 24, 2004, at 07:02 PM, Siegfried wrote:

                Misc deleted

                >
                >
                > Mostly it seems that Kingdoms either adopted the Middle's 105 based
                > ranking system and modified it, or adopted the East's 100 based
                > ranking.

                And these are all descended from the West's 40/60/80 ranking system for
                the RR
                of about 30 years ago. :-) When I started the IKAC ( which was based
                upon the RR)
                I often sent information to archers from various kingdoms, on how we
                were doing
                target archery in the West and that included the RR ranking system that
                I had set
                up earlier for the West.

                Jon

                >
                > Atlantia, for example, did alot of copying from the East (especially
                > since we used to be their principality), and we have a 40/60/80/100
                > based ranking, with even the 0, 40, and 60 ranks using the same name
                > as the East, but the 80 and 100 changing, to show we are different
                > (Bowman Elite and Grand Bowman Elite, versus Master Bowman and
                > Grandmaster Bowman) ...
                >
                > Atlantia ... The Elite ;)
                >
                > Siegfried
              • Ben
                Revisiting a part of the replies to this post, I had a question regarding the ranks in each kingdom. Granted, this may seem VERY simple and ignorant of me,
                Message 7 of 9 , Jan 15, 2005
                • 0 Attachment
                  Revisiting a part of the replies to this post, I had a question
                  regarding the ranks in each kingdom. Granted, this may seem VERY
                  simple and ignorant of me, like someone who was raised by wolves
                  asking you what the shiny things beside the round things on the
                  raised piece of wood that everyone seems to throw their food onto are
                  for. In essence, how are the ranks awarded? Is this something the
                  crown awards, like AoAs & such, or is there another process for this?

                  Please pardon my ignorance,
                  Strongbow
                  (called "Throws Pointy Sticks REALLY Fast" by my brothers & sisters
                  in the wolf pack that raised me)
                • Bruce R. Gordon
                  Greetings It depends on the Kingdom to a certain extent, I think - some are a bit more formal than others. But, no, Royal Round rankings aren t awards as
                  Message 8 of 9 , Jan 15, 2005
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Greetings
                    It depends on the Kingdom to a certain extent, I think - some are
                    a bit more formal than others. But, no, Royal Round rankings
                    aren't "awards" as such, and the RR's and IKAC's aren't (still less my
                    Winter Challenge) officially sanctioned across the Knowne Worlde. Most
                    Kingdoms nowadays have a scorekeeper or some equivalent thereof that
                    keeps track of those records in Kingdoms that pay attention to that
                    sort of thing. In my own Kingdom, the Middle, we have such a deputy,
                    whose website is at http://www.castlewalls.com/archery/default.html .
                    We also have me for the Winter Challenge (which is SCA-wide), since
                    it's my local group that sponsors it. The Challenge website is at
                    http://web.raex.com/~obsidian/wint.html . Typically, when someone
                    reaches a given rank, or tops their previous best, or whatever, they
                    (or often the Marshal-in-Charge at the practice or event) will submit
                    the new score to whomever is keeping records of such things, and
                    thereafter they will assume whatever badge or rank they are entitled
                    to. Some Kingdoms may note the advance in Court, particularly for the
                    top level of Master (or local equivalent), but for the most part it's
                    fairly informal.

                    Nigel FitzMaurice, Midrealm AG (Known as "Gazes long at bright crystal
                    while tapping at pebbles and swearing a lot" by my local wolf pack)

                    >
                    >
                    > Revisiting a part of the replies to this post, I had a question
                    > regarding the ranks in each kingdom. Granted, this may seem VERY
                    > simple and ignorant of me, like someone who was raised by wolves
                    > asking you what the shiny things beside the round things on the
                    > raised piece of wood that everyone seems to throw their food onto are
                    > for. In essence, how are the ranks awarded? Is this something the
                    > crown awards, like AoAs & such, or is there another process for this?
                    >
                    > Please pardon my ignorance,
                    > Strongbow
                    > (called "Throws Pointy Sticks REALLY Fast" by my brothers & sisters
                    > in the wolf pack that raised me)
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ---8<---------------------------------------------
                    > Brought to you YahooGroups Ad Free in 2003 by Medieval Mart
                    > Get Medieval at Mad Macsen's http://www.medievalmart.com/
                    >
                    > [Email to SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com to leave this list]
                    >
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >

                    --
                    Three things never heard from the mouth of a Celt:
                    "Do these colors match?"
                    "Is this too much jewelry?"
                    "Is that my drink?"

                    http://web.raex.com/~obsidian/index.html
                  • James W. Pratt, Jr.
                    Greetings Strongbow I can answere from the Middle Kingdom. We use what we call the Royal Round: 6 arrows at 20,30,40yards and a 30 secound speed round at 20.
                    Message 9 of 9 , Jan 15, 2005
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Greetings Strongbow

                      I can answere from the Middle Kingdom. We use what we call the Royal Round:
                      6 arrows at 20,30,40yards and a 30 secound speed round at 20. Shot at a FITA
                      60 cm targets using 5,4,3,2,1 scoring for the colors. The Scores are
                      reported to the keeper of the Ranking system( Our lovely Countess Aibhilin)
                      After you turn in three scores you get and average and are ranked. See:
                      http://www.castlewalls.com/archery/default.html

                      Other kingdoms use other systems, Like the Falcon Round of Calontir.

                      Our system is easy to set up, quick to shoot, and standardized so you can
                      compare yourself with anyone from northern Michigan to southern Kentucky.
                      It is not perfect and does not test all archery skills. Only meat in the
                      pot and comming home alive are the true tests of an archer.

                      James Cunningham

                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: "Ben" <unclestrongbow@...>
                      To: <SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com>
                      Sent: Saturday, January 15, 2005 5:03 AM
                      Subject: [SCA-Archery] Re: Why are the ranks different?


                      >
                      >
                      > Revisiting a part of the replies to this post, I had a question
                      > regarding the ranks in each kingdom. Granted, this may seem VERY
                      > simple and ignorant of me, like someone who was raised by wolves
                      > asking you what the shiny things beside the round things on the
                      > raised piece of wood that everyone seems to throw their food onto are
                      > for. In essence, how are the ranks awarded? Is this something the
                      > crown awards, like AoAs & such, or is there another process for this?
                      >
                      > Please pardon my ignorance,
                      > Strongbow
                      > (called "Throws Pointy Sticks REALLY Fast" by my brothers & sisters
                      > in the wolf pack that raised me)
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ---8<---------------------------------------------
                      > Brought to you YahooGroups Ad Free in 2003 by Medieval Mart
                      > Get Medieval at Mad Macsen's http://www.medievalmart.com/
                      >
                      > [Email to SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com to leave this list]
                      >
                      > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                    Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.