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Re: Quiver Shivers

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  • Kinjal of Moravia
    ... three ... if ... ................................................. I would append, in more Eastern practice where the Scythian style quiver was used, both
    Message 1 of 17 , May 7 7:08 AM
      >
      > my shoddy research in all provinces suggest that they carried
      three
      > arrows in bow hand and perhaps no quiver at all! Interestingly,
      if
      > you draw with arrows in hand you get a different 'sight picture',
      > and can use the arrows as range points -- just a thought. My
      > earliest suggestion of a quiver was a way for Charlamagne to
      > guarantee that each soldier had a proper quota of arrows, not a
      > shooting requirement.
      >
      > kinjal

      .................................................

      I would append, in more Eastern practice where the Scythian style
      quiver was used, both the strung bow and arrows are carried in a
      belt quiver and there is no rattle because of the tension. With my
      creative attempt I can't draw the bow without dropping arrows on the
      ground, though -- perhaps gut size has something to do with it! In
      the previously noted 'hidden' draw style of the cloaked Greecian
      guards there is no mention of how arrows were stored/kept --
      just 'ten arrows loose without a sound or maiden disturbed'. I
      can't even sneek out of the house for practice!

      kinjal
    • Tessa the Huntress
      There are personas that used quivers. It wasn; t uncommon for some just to tuck 6 or so arrows/bolts in their belt though. If you look at the battle of
      Message 2 of 17 , May 7 7:08 AM
        There are personas that used quivers. It wasn;'t uncommon for some just to
        tuck 6 or so arrows/bolts in their belt though. If you look at the battle
        of hastings (the tapestry), you will see several archers wearing quivers.

        It's my understanding that some used "spacers" which kept the arrows
        separate and kept them from making noise and clacking together.

        I do know there are a number of scrolls that have pictures of Scottish
        people "hunting" with bows/crossbows.. so they might be helpful. I believe
        Master Charles is on this list.. and he has an awesome book full of
        scrolls/illuminations of people hunting in period. I believe some are from
        your time period & area, hopefully he will give more details.. :)

        He does an awesome job doing research and he has an interest in crossbows
        and Irish, but he may have good knowledge of Scottish people as well.

        Good luck on your quest.

        Tessa the Huntress


        >
        > Any decent quivers out there that take care of this while
        remaining in
        > period? My persona is 16th century Scottish, so what would he
        have used?
        >
        > Just curious.
        >
        > Alisdar Mac Giolle Chroiste
      • Carolus Eulenhorst
        Period archers only carried a few arrows, often tucked in a belt. No quiver to worry about when hunting. Carolus On Mon, 3 May 2004 08:10:52 -0400 Nathaniel
        Message 3 of 17 , May 7 7:12 AM
          Period archers only carried a few arrows, often tucked in a belt. No
          quiver to worry about when hunting.
          Carolus
          On Mon, 3 May 2004 08:10:52 -0400 "Nathaniel S. Prentice"
          <nateprentice@...> writes:
          > Hi.
          >
          > I'm interested in taking up the bow in the SCA (I got a PSE
          > Impala--takedown
          > recurve recently). I'm interested in getting a quiver as well, but
          > I'm
          > worried about the rattling that the arrows will make in the back of
          > a quiver
          > while I move around doing bowhunting.
          >
          > I'm sure that archers in period had the same concerns--what did they
          > do to
          > keep the arrows accessible and yet minimize visible movement and
          > audible
          > noise?
          >
          > Any decent quivers out there that take care of this while remaining
          > in
          > period? My persona is 16th century Scottish, so what would he have
          > used?
          >
          > Just curious.
          >
          > Alisdar Mac Giolle Chroiste
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > ---8<---------------------------------------------
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          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >

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        • kilmye@aol.com
          I ve seen modern quivers with spacers, and spacers sold seperately. I suppose if one didn t mind using some plastic, one could make a period style quiver, and
          Message 4 of 17 , May 7 7:19 AM
            I've seen modern quivers with spacers, and spacers sold seperately. I suppose
            if one didn't mind using some plastic, one could make a period style quiver,
            and use modern inserts inside, where they couldn't be seen. I think it might
            be more fun to learn about how it was done in period, but modern ones would
            work, and could be hidden.

            Kiley


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • LD.BLACKMOON
            GREETINGS MY EARLIEST DOCUMENTATION SHOWS NO QUIVER AT ALL. JUST A CLOTH SHEAF TUCKED UNDER THE ARCHERS BELT BEHIND HIS BACK. THIS WAS DURING THE AGINCOURT
            Message 5 of 17 , May 7 8:52 AM
              GREETINGS

              MY EARLIEST DOCUMENTATION SHOWS NO QUIVER AT ALL. JUST A CLOTH " SHEAF "
              TUCKED UNDER THE ARCHERS BELT BEHIND HIS BACK. THIS WAS DURING THE AGINCOURT
              ERA.
              FOR HUNTING , I HAVE FOUND THAT SHEEPSKIN IN THE BOTTOM AND AROUND THE TOP
              OF A LEATHER QUIVER DOES WONDERS FOR KEEPING THE ARROWS QUIET,
              BUT JUST CARRYING A FEW IN THE BELT WORKS BEST OF ALL .

              BE SAFE, BE HAPPY, HAVE FUN
              ARTHUR BLACKMOON
            • jay
              Greetings all, I ve used the belt method for a few years now (excepting my current gaffiation ;) and I ve been relatively successful with it. A wider (2+
              Message 6 of 17 , May 7 9:12 AM
                Greetings all,

                I've used the "belt method" for a few years now (excepting my current
                gaffiation ;) and I've been
                relatively successful with it. A wider (2+ inches) belt seems to work
                better than the narrower ones.

                Regarding spacers, wasn't there something in the Mary Rose findings that
                seemed to be a quiver spacer? That is, a leather disk with a dozen or so
                holes punched in it? It would work well enough for
                bodkin-type heads, but not for broadheads.

                Calum

                At 5/7/04 07:12 AM, you wrote:
                >Period archers only carried a few arrows, often tucked in a belt. No
                >quiver to worry about when hunting.
                >Carolus
              • Tighearn Mac Con mac Conaill
                Ohh that just hurts. I have seen Sir Rand the tracker keep 3 arrows in his bow hand during the speed round and just don t know how he does it! Maybe my hands
                Message 7 of 17 , May 7 11:14 AM
                  Ohh that just hurts. I have seen Sir Rand the tracker keep 3 arrows in his bow hand during the speed round and just don't know how he does it! Maybe my hands are just too small.

                  I have read about spacers that werer used by archers in the 100 years war. They were used to keep the flechings from getting messed up but it should also keep the arrows quit.

                  Kinjal of Moravia <gusarimagic@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Any decent quivers out there that take care of this while
                  remaining in
                  > period? My persona is 16th century Scottish, so what would he
                  have used?
                  >
                  > Just curious.
                  >
                  > Alisdar Mac Giolle Chroiste

                  ...................................................

                  my shoddy research in all provinces suggest that they carried three
                  arrows in bow hand and perhaps no quiver at all! Interestingly, if
                  you draw with arrows in hand you get a different 'sight picture',
                  and can use the arrows as range points -- just a thought. My
                  earliest suggestion of a quiver was a way for Charlamagne to
                  guarantee that each soldier had a proper quota of arrows, not a
                  shooting requirement.

                  kinjal



                  ---8<---------------------------------------------
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                  Yours in Service;

                  Tighearn (Lord) Mac Con mac Conaill of Clan MacDonald
                  Quartermaster of the Barony of Dragonsspine
                  Forester Archer of the Kingdom of the Outlands

                  When you shoot with a gun, one miss is just as vexatious as another. It is a miss -- maybe an inch, maybe an ell, who knows? -- and you gain nothing from it. Your bird is missed, that is all. But with the bow it is the reverse. Will's miss was almost as pleasurable as a hit -- the bird had such a hair breath escape the shot was so well sent..
                  -- Maurice Thompson













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                • Tighearn Mac Con mac Conaill
                  Ahhhhh the archer bag that I have read about. At times I wonder if quivers are period at all for a 1340 Scot. Matters not I love my hip quiver but I would
                  Message 8 of 17 , May 7 11:17 AM
                    Ahhhhh the archer bag that I have read about. At times I wonder if quivers are period at all for a 1340 Scot. Matters not I love my hip quiver but I would like to make a bag like the one described.

                    "LD.BLACKMOON" <LD.BLACKMOON@...> wrote:GREETINGS

                    MY EARLIEST DOCUMENTATION SHOWS NO QUIVER AT ALL. JUST A CLOTH " SHEAF "
                    TUCKED UNDER THE ARCHERS BELT BEHIND HIS BACK. THIS WAS DURING THE AGINCOURT
                    ERA.
                    FOR HUNTING , I HAVE FOUND THAT SHEEPSKIN IN THE BOTTOM AND AROUND THE TOP
                    OF A LEATHER QUIVER DOES WONDERS FOR KEEPING THE ARROWS QUIET,
                    BUT JUST CARRYING A FEW IN THE BELT WORKS BEST OF ALL .

                    BE SAFE, BE HAPPY, HAVE FUN
                    ARTHUR BLACKMOON



                    ---8<---------------------------------------------
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                    Yours in Service;

                    Tighearn (Lord) Mac Con mac Conaill of Clan MacDonald
                    Quartermaster of the Barony of Dragonsspine
                    Forester Archer of the Kingdom of the Outlands

                    When you shoot with a gun, one miss is just as vexatious as another. It is a miss -- maybe an inch, maybe an ell, who knows? -- and you gain nothing from it. Your bird is missed, that is all. But with the bow it is the reverse. Will's miss was almost as pleasurable as a hit -- the bird had such a hair breath escape the shot was so well sent..
                    -- Maurice Thompson













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                  • Bruce R. Gordon
                    Greetings I ve seen equestrian archery demos in which that gripping of arrows in one s bowhand is used - I was fascinated by the idea, but don t know if I have
                    Message 9 of 17 , May 7 11:34 AM
                      Greetings
                      I've seen equestrian archery demos in which that gripping of
                      arrows in one's bowhand is used - I was fascinated by the idea, but
                      don't know if I have the nerve to try it unmounted - I suspect I'd end
                      up by dropping everything, at least initially.
                      In regards the original topic of this thread, to quiver or not to
                      quiver (and if you do, is it belt or back) is one of those perennial
                      controversies that regularly gets aired here, and on other lists. It
                      seems clear that some quivers or quiver-like containers were used in
                      period at various times and places - you see illustrations of them in
                      many sources: Bayeux Tapestry for the 11th-12th cent. and the Catherine
                      of Cleves book of hours for the 15th cent. come to mind immediately.
                      And it also seems clear that great many archers had only a handful of
                      arrows (or only used a few arrows at a time) and simply stuck 'em in
                      their belts or sashes. I suspect, but cannot as yet prove, that quivers
                      were more common among later-period professional military archers who
                      were issued a sheaf at a time (24 arrows), and that non-military types
                      (hunter-poachers, foresters, etc. probably took only 2 to 5 arrows with
                      them went they went out to hunt or practice, and did without special
                      bags or sacks, mostly. Probably a matter of cost, availability, and
                      personal taste as much as anything. And I'll betcha there were plenty
                      of counter-examples as well - military archers who scooped up their
                      sheaf, walked up to the line, and stuck 'em in the ground next to them
                      for easy reach (anyone have documentation on metal ground-quivers?) and
                      hunters with artfully tooled fancy quivers like in Catherine of Cleves.

                      Nigel

                      > Ohh that just hurts. I have seen Sir Rand the tracker keep 3 arrows
                      in his bow hand during the speed round and just don't know how he does
                      it! Maybe my hands are just too small.
                      >
                      > I have read about spacers that werer used by archers in the 100 years
                      war. They were used to keep the flechings from getting messed up but
                      it should also keep the arrows quit.
                      >
                      > Kinjal of Moravia <gusarimagic@...> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Any decent quivers out there that take care of this while
                      > remaining in
                      > > period? My persona is 16th century Scottish, so what would he
                      > have used?
                      > >
                      > > Just curious.
                      > >
                      > > Alisdar Mac Giolle Chroiste
                      >
                      > ...................................................
                      >
                      > my shoddy research in all provinces suggest that they carried three
                      > arrows in bow hand and perhaps no quiver at all! Interestingly, if
                      > you draw with arrows in hand you get a different 'sight picture',
                      > and can use the arrows as range points -- just a thought. My
                      > earliest suggestion of a quiver was a way for Charlamagne to
                      > guarantee that each soldier had a proper quota of arrows, not a
                      > shooting requirement.
                      >
                      > kinjal
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ---8<---------------------------------------------
                      > Brought to you YahooGroups Ad Free in 2003 by Medieval Mart
                      > Get Medieval at Mad Macsen's http://www.medievalmart.com/
                      >
                      > [Email to SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com to leave this list]
                      >
                      > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Yours in Service;
                      >
                      > Tighearn (Lord) Mac Con mac Conaill of Clan MacDonald
                      > Quartermaster of the Barony of Dragonsspine
                      > Forester Archer of the Kingdom of the Outlands
                      >
                      > When you shoot with a gun, one miss is just as vexatious as another.
                      It is a miss -- maybe an inch, maybe an ell, who knows? -- and you gain
                      nothing from it. Your bird is missed, that is all. But with the bow it
                      is the reverse. Will's miss was almost as pleasurable as a hit -- the
                      bird had such a hair breath escape the shot was so well sent..
                      > -- Maurice Thompson
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ---------------------------------
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                      > Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      >
                      >
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                      --
                      Ex Tenebra, Lux

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                    • hawkwoode@att.net
                      I have an arrow bag that I purchased from Historic Enterprises, along with a bow case. Visit the website at www.historicenterprises.com to see a picture of
                      Message 10 of 17 , May 7 11:36 AM
                        I have an arrow bag that I purchased from Historic Enterprises, along with a bow case. Visit the website at www.historicenterprises.com to see a picture of the bag. Click on the arms and armor listing to see the line of archery equipment, which includes self-nock arrows and bodkin points of various types.

                        Elizabeth Hawkwood




                        --
                        Nothing's Forgotten - Nothing is
                        Ever Forgotten


                        > Ohh that just hurts. I have seen Sir Rand the tracker keep 3 arrows in his bow
                        > hand during the speed round and just don't know how he does it! Maybe my hands
                        > are just too small.
                        >
                        > I have read about spacers that werer used by archers in the 100 years war. They
                        > were used to keep the flechings from getting messed up but it should also keep
                        > the arrows quit.
                        >
                        > Kinjal of Moravia <gusarimagic@...> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > Any decent quivers out there that take care of this while
                        > remaining in
                        > > period? My persona is 16th century Scottish, so what would he
                        > have used?
                        > >
                        > > Just curious.
                        > >
                        > > Alisdar Mac Giolle Chroiste
                        >
                        > ...................................................
                        >
                        > my shoddy research in all provinces suggest that they carried three
                        > arrows in bow hand and perhaps no quiver at all! Interestingly, if
                        > you draw with arrows in hand you get a different 'sight picture',
                        > and can use the arrows as range points -- just a thought. My
                        > earliest suggestion of a quiver was a way for Charlamagne to
                        > guarantee that each soldier had a proper quota of arrows, not a
                        > shooting requirement.
                        >
                        > kinjal
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ---8<---------------------------------------------
                        > Brought to you YahooGroups Ad Free in 2003 by Medieval Mart
                        > Get Medieval at Mad Macsen's http://www.medievalmart.com/
                        >
                        > [Email to SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com to leave this list]
                        >
                        > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Yours in Service;
                        >
                        > Tighearn (Lord) Mac Con mac Conaill of Clan MacDonald
                        > Quartermaster of the Barony of Dragonsspine
                        > Forester Archer of the Kingdom of the Outlands
                        >
                        > When you shoot with a gun, one miss is just as vexatious as another. It is a
                        > miss -- maybe an inch, maybe an ell, who knows? -- and you gain nothing from it.
                        > Your bird is missed, that is all. But with the bow it is the reverse. Will's
                        > miss was almost as pleasurable as a hit -- the bird had such a hair breath
                        > escape the shot was so well sent..
                        > -- Maurice Thompson
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ---------------------------------
                        > Do you Yahoo!?
                        > Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                        >
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                        > Get Medieval at Mad Macsen's http://www.medievalmart.com/
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                      • Tighearn Mac Con mac Conaill
                        WOW! Now that is period. I will have to get one. Nice to see one done so well and for a very fair price. hawkwoode@att.net wrote:I have an arrow bag that I
                        Message 11 of 17 , May 7 11:48 AM
                          WOW! Now that is period. I will have to get one. Nice to see one done so well and for a very fair price.

                          hawkwoode@... wrote:I have an arrow bag that I purchased from Historic Enterprises, along with a bow case. Visit the website at www.historicenterprises.com to see a picture of the bag. Click on the arms and armor listing to see the line of archery equipment, which includes self-nock arrows and bodkin points of various types.

                          Elizabeth Hawkwood




                          --
                          Nothing's Forgotten - Nothing is
                          Ever Forgotten


                          > Ohh that just hurts. I have seen Sir Rand the tracker keep 3 arrows in his bow
                          > hand during the speed round and just don't know how he does it! Maybe my hands
                          > are just too small.
                          >
                          > I have read about spacers that werer used by archers in the 100 years war. They
                          > were used to keep the flechings from getting messed up but it should also keep
                          > the arrows quit.
                          >
                          > Kinjal of Moravia wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Any decent quivers out there that take care of this while
                          > remaining in
                          > > period? My persona is 16th century Scottish, so what would he
                          > have used?
                          > >
                          > > Just curious.
                          > >
                          > > Alisdar Mac Giolle Chroiste
                          >
                          > ...................................................
                          >
                          > my shoddy research in all provinces suggest that they carried three
                          > arrows in bow hand and perhaps no quiver at all! Interestingly, if
                          > you draw with arrows in hand you get a different 'sight picture',
                          > and can use the arrows as range points -- just a thought. My
                          > earliest suggestion of a quiver was a way for Charlamagne to
                          > guarantee that each soldier had a proper quota of arrows, not a
                          > shooting requirement.
                          >
                          > kinjal
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > ---8<---------------------------------------------
                          > Brought to you YahooGroups Ad Free in 2003 by Medieval Mart
                          > Get Medieval at Mad Macsen's http://www.medievalmart.com/
                          >
                          > [Email to SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com to leave this list]
                          >
                          > Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Yours in Service;
                          >
                          > Tighearn (Lord) Mac Con mac Conaill of Clan MacDonald
                          > Quartermaster of the Barony of Dragonsspine
                          > Forester Archer of the Kingdom of the Outlands
                          >
                          > When you shoot with a gun, one miss is just as vexatious as another. It is a
                          > miss -- maybe an inch, maybe an ell, who knows? -- and you gain nothing from it.
                          > Your bird is missed, that is all. But with the bow it is the reverse. Will's
                          > miss was almost as pleasurable as a hit -- the bird had such a hair breath
                          > escape the shot was so well sent..
                          > -- Maurice Thompson
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > ---------------------------------
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                          > Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          >
                          >
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                          Yours in Service;

                          Tighearn (Lord) Mac Con mac Conaill of Clan MacDonald
                          Quartermaster of the Barony of Dragonsspine
                          Forester Archer of the Kingdom of the Outlands

                          When you shoot with a gun, one miss is just as vexatious as another. It is a miss -- maybe an inch, maybe an ell, who knows? -- and you gain nothing from it. Your bird is missed, that is all. But with the bow it is the reverse. Will's miss was almost as pleasurable as a hit -- the bird had such a hair breath escape the shot was so well sent..
                          -- Maurice Thompson













                          ---------------------------------
                          Do you Yahoo!?
                          Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs

                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Nathaniel S. Prentice
                          Hiya. Thanks for the response to my email. I put a bunch of snippets together. The way to read this is the response I am referring to can be found
                          Message 12 of 17 , May 8 12:55 PM
                            Hiya. Thanks for the response to my email. I put a bunch of snippets
                            together. The way to read this is the response I am referring to can be
                            found underneath my response.

                            ------------------------------

                            Now this is a truly interesting idea. I wonder if this would be allowed in
                            a tournament...

                            my shoddy research in all provinces suggest that they carried three
                            arrows in bow hand and perhaps no quiver at all! Interestingly, if
                            you draw with arrows in hand you get a different 'sight picture',
                            and can use the arrows as range points -- just a thought. My
                            earliest suggestion of a quiver was a way for Charlamagne to
                            guarantee that each soldier had a proper quota of arrows, not a
                            shooting requirement.

                            kinjal

                            Actually, my character is late 1500's Scot. I would be afraid to hunt with
                            a purely cloth quiver--what if I fell and the arrows went into my gut? I
                            can see how using a sheepskin liner would work for the arrows on the
                            outside, but what about the jostling between the ones on the inside?
                            Ahhhhh the archer bag that I have read about. At times I wonder if quivers
                            are period at all for a 1340 Scot. Matters not I love my hip quiver but I
                            would like to make a bag like the one described.

                            "LD.BLACKMOON" <LD.BLACKMOON@...> wrote:GREETINGS

                            MY EARLIEST DOCUMENTATION SHOWS NO QUIVER AT ALL. JUST A CLOTH " SHEAF "
                            TUCKED UNDER THE ARCHERS BELT BEHIND HIS BACK. THIS WAS DURING THE AGINCOURT
                            ERA.
                            FOR HUNTING , I HAVE FOUND THAT SHEEPSKIN IN THE BOTTOM AND AROUND THE TOP
                            OF A LEATHER QUIVER DOES WONDERS FOR KEEPING THE ARROWS QUIET,
                            BUT JUST CARRYING A FEW IN THE BELT WORKS BEST OF ALL .

                            BE SAFE, BE HAPPY, HAVE FUN
                            ARTHUR BLACKMOON


                            I like the arrow bag that you found. It sounds like it fits the description
                            of what some people on the Net have mentioned about the Mary Rose archers.
                            Being a newbie who is just coming off of his training wheels (i.e. compound
                            bow), what exactly is a "spacer"? I think I could probably make one of my
                            own versions of that. Linen scares me, though, for reasons I already
                            stated.

                            Message: 5
                            Date: Fri, 07 May 2004 18:36:33 +0000
                            From: hawkwoode@...
                            Subject: Re: Re: Quiver Shivers

                            I have an arrow bag that I purchased from Historic Enterprises, along with a
                            bow case. Visit the website at www.historicenterprises.com to see a picture
                            of the bag. Click on the arms and armor listing to see the line of archery
                            equipment, which includes self-nock arrows and bodkin points of various
                            types.

                            Elizabeth Hawkwood

                            :(

                            With a quiver, noise is always something to overcome.
                            ..................................................
                            Ian Gourdon of Glen Awe - OP, Midrealm Forester
                            "Take thou no scorn to wear the horn; It was a crest ere thou wast born"
                            - As You Like It Act 4, Scene II

                            Thanks for the input, guys. I was actually thinking that it would be OK to
                            break a few rules--I'd be willing to bet the Scots didn't have many bows at
                            all, or if they did, they were too prrrroud to use them, in any case.

                            I like the idea of the linen quiver. I wonder if anyone out there might
                            have a schematic...



                            Alisdar Mac Giolle Chroiste

                            Archer-in-training, Barony of Bhakail



                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Carolus Eulenhorst
                            Actually, the bags and spacers referred to on this list were storage bags used to ship arrows. The points were gathered in the narrow end of the bag and the
                            Message 13 of 17 , May 9 10:30 AM
                              Actually, the bags and spacers referred to on this list were storage bags
                              used to ship arrows. The points were gathered in the narrow end of the
                              bag and the nocks placed in the holes of the spacers to prevent crushing
                              the fletchings. When the wide end of the bag was opened, a leather disc
                              with 24 protruding nocks was all that was seen. Then entire sheaf of
                              arrows had to be removed and then the arrows could be removed from the
                              spacer. Contemporary account state that the arrows were issued to the
                              archers who then carried them loose to their position on the line and
                              stuck them in the ground before them.

                              All of which is fine for the military archer. However, our target
                              archery is much more akin to hunting, roving, or the noble target
                              shooting of period. As to practices of the period in this regard nothing
                              has been said. Frankly I have not looked into it either.
                              Carolus

                              On Fri, 07 May 2004 09:12:12 -0700 jay <ravnville@...> writes:
                              > Greetings all,
                              >
                              > I've used the "belt method" for a few years now (excepting my
                              > current
                              > gaffiation ;) and I've been
                              > relatively successful with it. A wider (2+ inches) belt seems to
                              > work
                              > better than the narrower ones.
                              >
                              > Regarding spacers, wasn't there something in the Mary Rose findings
                              > that
                              > seemed to be a quiver spacer? That is, a leather disk with a dozen
                              > or so
                              > holes punched in it? It would work well enough for
                              > bodkin-type heads, but not for broadheads.
                              >
                              > Calum
                              >
                              > At 5/7/04 07:12 AM, you wrote:
                              > >Period archers only carried a few arrows, often tucked in a belt.
                              > No
                              > >quiver to worry about when hunting.
                              > >Carolus
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
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                            • David Thompson-Hall
                              ... Definitely an awesome sight - does anyone know what they sell their bodkins for, when they re in stock? Also, I am very curious about the book they cited
                              Message 14 of 17 , May 9 7:24 PM
                                At 6:36 PM +0000 5/7/04, hawkwoode@... wrote:
                                >I have an arrow bag that I purchased from Historic Enterprises,
                                >along with a bow case. Visit the website at
                                >www.historicenterprises.com to see a picture of the bag. Click on
                                >the arms and armor listing to see the line of archery equipment,
                                >which includes self-nock arrows and bodkin points of various types.

                                Definitely an awesome sight - does anyone know what they sell their
                                bodkins for, when they're in stock?

                                Also, I am very curious about the book they cited on the web page as
                                their source for the arrow bag and other stuff - "The Medieval
                                Soldier" by Embleton & Howe. If anyone has read this book, can you
                                tell me more about it? What other reconstructions does it have?


                                Jack
                                always glad to find more sources for cool and period stuff


                                --
                                >>>>>>>>>>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
                                THL John Bartholomew of Flanders, AoA, CDB, CGC, OSN, Watchman jbf@...
                                Barony of Jararvellir, Northshield, Midrealm www.pobox.com/~jbf
                              • Godwin fitzGilbert de Striguil
                                Not only were the arrows delivered in the sheaf bags, but 1/3 to 1/4 of of each sheaf were flight arrows, the rest being the larger and heavier shafts used in
                                Message 15 of 17 , May 10 5:54 AM
                                  Not only were the arrows delivered in the sheaf bags, but 1/3 to 1/4 of
                                  of each sheaf were flight arrows, the rest being the larger and heavier
                                  shafts used in 'closer' ranges.

                                  The arrows "in use" were tucked into the belt, whilst the arrows of
                                  "next use" were stuck in the ground.

                                  As far as naming ash for arrow woods, Ascham lists it as a favorite
                                  amongst others, in Toxophilus. Most of the arrows on the Mary Rose were
                                  breasted poplar shafts.

                                  Godwin
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