Re: [SCA-Archery] When did recurves appear in Britain?
- Just a couple of points on this thread:
1) The Romans scattered auxilliai (sic) around western Europe, many of
which where armed with composite recurves.
Later, tribes of Federote were also scattered around. Some. notably the
Alans, were similarly armed. In fact, by the 8th century, the Alans went
from bow-armed catafracti and horse archers to spear armed shock cavalry,
with a formatable reputation. The prevaling weather is cited as the cause.
As has been noted by others on this thread, the damp weather of northwestern
Europe is not condusive to the development of composite bows. Certainly the
Europeans knew how to make them, at least by the later 12th and 13th
centuries. But their use seems to have been restricted to crossbow. I
suspect the nature of their construction made it easier to waterproof them.
Similar meathods were used the later steel crossbow prods.
2) Concerning the French archers in the latter part of the 15th century,
they in fact had a terrible reputation. One source states they were only
good for stealing chickens. Sometime in the early 16th cenury, the French
king Either Charles or Francis, I can't remember which, scrapped the idea,
and gathered whatever "Francs Archers" were left, and started a training
camp to turn them into pikemen. In both the Bourdeaux campaign in general,
and the battle of Castillon in particular, the real winner for the French
was the field artillery, recently developed by a pair of brothers, and made
with royal funding. Also the French finding ways of defeating the English
without charging straight into the rain of arrows. (only took the a century
or so, but they eventually learned).
The French did field competent companies of crossbowmen, mostly
recruited in Gascony, by independent contract. These saw use in the early
part of the Italian Wars, and eventually converted into Arqubus companies to
suppliment the ex-Francs Archer pikemen.
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce R. Gordon <obsidian@...>
> Similar circumstances in Russia and especially in Scandinavia.
> France is a special case - you are correct in saying that they
> developed their own archery corps late, but it was, in fact, used to
> good effect: see the Bourdeaux campaign of 1450 and the Battle of
> Castillon in 1452, for instance.
- --- In SCA-Archery@yahoogroups.com, mwertz@f... wrote:
> > Hold on. I thought yumi's were very non-sym in design? Longerupper
> limb,shorter lower limb. English longbow is more sym in design. Thatoranges......
> would make the yumi specific to horse archery. Apples and
> Wonder what the production man hours were for one englishlongbow/one
> mongol composite bow/one yumi.(low end munitions grade).effective
> In Sane,
> > Wow! Someone needs to tell the Japanese that longbows aren't
> > from horseback. Have you ever seen the length of those Yumibows? Check
> > it out on The Last Samurai.Oudoceus--- On Tue 01/27, < mwertz@f...Chidiock,
> > > wrote:From: [mailto: mwertz@f...]To:
> > SCA-Archery@y...: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 16:15:39 -0500
> > (EST)Subject: Re: [SCA-Archery] Re: When did recurves appear in
> > Britain?Did not the French get their butts kicked because genoese
> > crossbowmen cutand ran due to "wet strings"? Operator error.>
> > when you wrote: "For military purposes, such> a bow would beinferior
> > to a good longbow," you seem> to forget that the recurve (orcrossbow
> > for that> matter) is a lot better for mounted archery. Longbow> isare
> > great when massed on the defensive in a major> battle. But there
> > real limitations in other> military situations....>> I amover
> > reminded when a Welsh Lady friend of mine came> back from a trip
> > there with the comment "you can> not shoot a longbow fromCaernovan
> > Castle's> battlements. I pointed out Edward I was using> crossbowsattackers
> > from the battlements, the longbow was in the> hands of the
> > (who, I did not need to remind> her, lost).>> CharlesGroups
> > O'Connor>> __________________________________> Do you Yahoo!?>
> > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free web site building tool. Try it!>
> > http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/>>
> > ---8<---------------------------------------------> Brought to you
> > YahooGroups Ad Free in 2003 by Medieval Mart> Get Medieval at Mad
> > Macsen's http://www.medievalmart.com/>> [Email to
> > SCA-Archeryfirstname.lastname@example.org to leave this list]>>>
> > Yahoo! Groups Links>> To visit your group on the web, go to:>
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-Archery/>> To unsubscribe from
> > this group, send an email to:>
> > SCA-Archeryemail@example.com>> Your use of Yahoo!
> > is subject to:>--------------------Brought
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/>>>---8<-------------------------
> > to you YahooGroups Ad Free in 2003 by Medieval MartGet Medievalat Mad
> > Macsen's http://www.medievalmart.com/%5bEmail toGroups
> > SCA-Archeryfirstname.lastname@example.org to leave this list]Yahoo!
> > LinksTo visit your group on the web, gothis
> > to:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-Archery/To unsubscribe from
> > group, send an email to:SCA-Archery-unsubscribe@y... use oflist]
> > Yahoo! Groups is subject to:http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> > _______________________________________________
> > Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
> > The most personalized portal on the Web!
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > ---8<---------------------------------------------
> > Brought to you YahooGroups Ad Free in 2003 by Medieval Mart
> > Get Medieval at Mad Macsen's http://www.medievalmart.com/
> > [Email to SCA-Archeryemail@example.com to leave this
> >less than an hour using period tools, a horn and sinew compsite takes
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SCA-Archery/
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > SCA-Archeryfirstname.lastname@example.org
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >I can tiller a "D" long bow from a stave to a shootable bow in
9mo to a year using period glues and methods