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[SB-r-us] Re: Re: PAHS/AGS /solar supplemented under home heat storage in NNA

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  • Speireag Alden
    ... No. He recommends plenty of earth cover, but that s not incompatible with strawbale construction. For instance, you could have the exposed walls of
    Message 1 of 8 , May 1, 2005
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      Sgrìobh Michael Lough:

      >I have read the description of PAHS and I dont see it working with
      >SB homes as there is a requirement for an earth cover overall
      >structure isnt there>?

      No. He recommends plenty of earth cover, but that's not
      incompatible with strawbale construction. For instance, you could
      have the exposed walls of strawbale, and the bermed walls done in
      some other fashion. That is essentially what I will have when I get
      done building a new north wall and earth-berm it. Likewise, you can
      have a living roof on top of an otherwise conventionally-built
      strawbale house.

      >I think we can outrule this on the strength of it being not for SB right?


      >I think where we are in NNA we could probably say there is
      >effectively noheat we can use from the deep earth without storing it
      >there first?

      No heat that we can use passively, yes. (There will always be
      areas where the ground heat is warm enough, but they are the
      exception rather than the rule.)

      Heat pumps are another story, of course.

      >I can see heating up a mass under a floor and the heat rising over
      >the months but for how many months after it rained all October? I
      >know I know the earth is dry because of the umbrella but what dried
      >it? Thewind? Surely not the heat from the solar HEATEDpiped in air
      >/glycol ?

      Yep. It starts wet, and it gets dryer over time. Since you are
      largely preventing the introduction of new moisture, it will get
      dryer until it reaches some kind of equilibrium state. Remember that
      it doesn't have to be bone dry; it just has to be dry enough so that
      the groundwater is not moving, and thereby transporting heat. In
      fact, if it retains some non-moving moisture, that just makes it a
      better thermal battery.

      >How much heat can be left after annual drying for storing after
      >doing this every year ?

      It doesn't have to dry all the way annually. If your ground has
      so much groundwater in it that you going to have to dry it out
      annually even after you are preventing the introduction of moisture
      from above, then you probably shouldn't he attempting an AGS system.

      >(The wastage of this system must be huge just trying to keep some of
      >it warm long enough and hoping it (some) will come up in a few

      60-80% "wasted", according to Stephens, which is why you would
      use only completely renewable heat source for it. I'd rule out
      anything which produces pollution, too, like wood, even if you could
      argue that it is renewable.

      But if the sunlight is falling on you, there's no harm in putting
      it where it's most useful.

      >better to be on a daily / monthly heating flywheel more efficient
      >to use heat as it is created rather than an annual one maybe?

      Sure, if you have it at the time. But the whole point of an
      annual system is that when you have the heat (in the warm months) is
      not when you want it (in the cold months). So if you can store the
      heat without using non-renewable energy sources, you should.

      >Maybe a system that will
      >provide a significant temperature lift overnight in a SB from
      >4 hours of sun the day before?

      Why would you want it overnight? For daily storage, massive
      passive solar works fine. Even in my drafty house, at 10°F or 20°F
      outside, and 60°F at dawn inside, by noon we're topping 70°F. If I'm
      up until the wee hours, I put on a sweatshirt.

      >We assume it is impossible this far North to create a system that
      >uses no supplemental heat at all in NNA in Winter?

      You can assume it all you want. I'd rather find a way to do it
      than just say, "Well, it can't be done, so let's burn as little
      fossil fuel as we can."

      >With a daily /monthly heat capture mass storage system you could
      >always have the option of a fluid to air heat exchange on sunny days
      >for diversion to anywhere you liked with the right ducting (or

      Do both. The systems aren't mutually exclusive.

      >Well I asked Don Stephens to get involved in this question but no
      >answerŠWhat do we make of this I say?

      That he's busy. He told me so, off-list, and said he'd post when
      he got caught up.


      In certain circumstances, urgent circumstances, desperate
      circumstances, profanity furnishes a relief denied even to prayer.
      --Mark Twain
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