Regarding student retention....
The system has changed over the past few years, at least in my part of
the world. The traditional model of students attending college and then
transferring to university no longer holds as the dominant model
anymore. Retention is also a problem for the big universities. I learned
this at a meeting I attended a few months ago with representatives of
anthropology departments at colleges and universities from throughout
the province and the government bureaucrats who try to keep track of all
the transfer arrangements. I imagine the same is happening elsewhere.
Students are much more apt to treat their education as a smorgasbord
these days. In my area, there are almost the same number of students
transferring from the research-intensive universities to colleges as the
reverse. The same is true for the transfers between teaching-intensive
universities and colleges; and between research-intensive universities
and teaching-intensive universities.The information is not anecdotal. It
is real data. The big universities are sometimes in denial (they can't
imagine why any student would ever leave them), but it is happening.
>>> Lloyd Miller <lloyd.miller@...> 12/1/2011 1:22 PM >>>
You're very right, Deborah—yet one more reason, I think, why
community colleges are different and distinct from other institutions of
On Nov 30, 2011, at 2:01 PM, Deborah Shepherd wrote:
> Very good points, Lloyd.
> Another major problem with the "retention" paradigm is that it
> community colleges (such as my former campus) for serving students
> want one or a few courses, such as professionals, retirees, and even
> students from other institutions who need to pick up a particular
> that is filled or not scheduled when they need it. Retention is a
> measure of success when it is applied to the appropriate student
> it is no measure of either institutional or teaching success.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On
> Lloyd Miller
> Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2011 1:48 AM
> To: SACC ListServ
> Subject: [SACC-L] teacher pay for retention, not learning
> Moved by the article on foreign student recruiters I sent recently, I
> the following letter to the editors of the Des Moines Register. I
> if they'll publish it; always a toss-up.
> The Register's Associated Press article, "Motives of foreign student
> recruiters under fire" (11/26/2011), ought to be a warning to those
> teachers' job security to depend on student success. In order to
> college enrollments, international student recruiters are paid by the
> of students they recruit. Up to 95% of Chinese students falsify
> applications, and many foreign students who do arrive are exempt
> language and other required proficiency tests.
> Does anyone doubt that if teacher pay were based on the number of
> who passed their courses, grades would improve and class retention
> would rise? Teachers who maintain academic standards and require that
> students "do the work" typically face pressures. College trustees
> reward their chief executives for increased enrollments irrespective
> academic quality, and administrators serve at the pleasure of their
> Many counselors and advisors, whose jobs involve hearing student
> come to see themselves as student advocates who must defend their
> against unfair and tyrannical teachers. And finally, many students
> lobby their instructors to make passing a course easier for them.
> Academic tenure and (for Iowa community colleges) continuing
> the only protections college teachers have for maintaining their
> integrity. If course enrollment and completion rates replace real
> teachers will do whatever they can to keep their jobs.
> Lloyd Miller
> (Retired community college teacher)
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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