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RE: [SACC-L] Re: SACC Name Change

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  • Hare II, William E
    I will cast my vote to keep our current name intact. Recent economic pressures in our state have forced increases in class enrollment caps making it even
    Message 1 of 10 , Oct 9, 2011
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      I will cast my "vote" to keep our current name intact. Recent economic pressures in our state have forced increases in class enrollment caps making it even more difficult to maintain the quality of instruction that many seek from community colleges (i.e. small classes, direct interaction with professors, more personal assistance, etc.). While I have had limited opportunities to participate in SACC due to budget restraints, the two annual meetings I have attended have been highlights in my career. Furthermore, the sense of connection and support I get from the members has been very important for me as I am the only anthropologist at my school and I often feel isolated (I had to give a presentation to my academic division to explain what anthropology is!)

      I agree that the name change may mean an eventual lost of identity for the community college professors. Better to work on recruitment with our current name and mission than to risk extinction through AAA politics.

      Will

      William E Hare II
      Associate Professor of Anthropology



      -----Original Message-----
      From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com on behalf of Laura Gonzalez
      Sent: Sun 10/9/2011 10:46 AM
      To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: SACC Name Change

      I think all of us having this discussion on the executive board are only
      interested in increasing the numbers of our section, while continuing to
      grow our resources and networking opportunities.



      Personally, I am not married to the idea of the name change. I just believe
      it would be the best way to increase our numbers while making our name
      accurately represent the section's purpose as stated in our mission and
      by-laws:



      "The purpose of this organization shall be

      a. to stimulate communication and co operation among anthropologists and
      teachers of anthropology in community colleges, four-year colleges,
      universities and pre-collegiate institutions; and

      b. to stimulate instructional, curriculum, and program development in the
      schools and to aid in the improvement of the teaching of anthropology."



      Now that we have identified AAA politics, I believe we can navigate them
      successfully. Nonetheless, all of us on the exec would be happy to hear and
      discuss your workable ideas about positive steps forward to reach more
      community college teachers in addition to or in lieu of a name change.



      You can send your ideas directly to our current president, Mel Johnson at
      majohns1@... or to me (incoming president) at lagonzal@....



      Laura



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Chuck & Gail Ellenbaum
      Reading the comments from folks I highly respect within SACC and reading much of the same AAA crap we got in the 70s and 80s as we were ranked at the bottom of
      Message 2 of 10 , Oct 10, 2011
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        Reading the comments from folks I highly respect within SACC and
        reading much of the same AAA crap we got in the 70s and 80s as we were
        ranked at the bottom of the food chain, I believe we should keep our
        name and full speed ahead to work on getting new members. Would it
        help SACC if people like me who couldn't wait to get out of AAA
        rejoined AAA and had SACC as our section? It is a cheap price to pay
        to maintain our identity. There are some very good people in the AAA,
        but for me, its institutional persona has been somewhat rancid. Let
        us continue to run our wonderful SACC with its welcoming friendliness
        and not worry about the rest of the AAA.

        Chuck


        On Oct 8, 2011, at 6:00 PM, Lloyd Miller wrote:

        > Barry, your comments inspired my missive; Chuck's and Mark's too.
        > Sorry I didn't give appropriate attribution. Earlier, I wondered
        > whether we so-called "silverbacks" were just a bunch of old-timers
        > trying to resist change. I was somewhat ambivalent about the name
        > change and shared some of my reservations with Laura privately,
        > though generally supported it. However, after reading Virginia's
        > emails to Laura and those of some other AAA section leaders, I
        > realized (as Sherlock Holmes would say) that the game was afoot.
        >
        > Lloyd
        >
        >
        > On Oct 8, 2011, at 5:34 PM, Barry Kass wrote:
        >
        >> Ummm.......if anyone recalls, about a month or so ago I sent out a
        >> plea on
        >> this listserve that we should keep our current title of SACC, and
        >> stated
        >> some reasons why. It's gratifying that I'm now starting to see some
        >> agreement with my point of view.
        >> Barry
        >>
        >> On Sat, Oct 8, 2011 at 6:16 PM, Mark Lewine <mlewine@...>
        >> wrote:
        >>
        >>> Lloyd always says it better, and this in particular needed to be
        >>> said...Laura was right about the name change in an academic world
        >>> without
        >>> poliltics...I cannot tell you how disgusted i was when past AAA
        >>> Pres. Setha
        >>> Low, pulled me into her cab after I was voted chair of the
        >>> Committee on
        >>> Anthropology Education, and told me that she and the Council on
        >>> Anthropology
        >>> Education (CAE) would give me the nominees for the next
        >>> year...after I told
        >>> her that would not happen and violated our democratic process,
        >>> that we had
        >>> determined that SACC would nominate one member representing
        >>> community
        >>> colleges, COTA would nominate one representing universities, CAE
        >>> would
        >>> nominate one representing K-12 programs, and that we would also
        >>> seek out
        >>> Archaeology section, Linguistics section, and Museum education for
        >>> public
        >>> outreach nomination...she looked at me as if I were a talking
        >>> bird...similar
        >>> experience at the CAE meeting where they 'told me' that they were
        >>> the
        >>> umbrella section for all education...(99.9% of their research and
        >>> panel
        >>> presentations are on K-12...they have had 1 paper on community
        >>> college
        >>> part-time teachering in urban Chicago by a sociologist grad.
        >>> student over
        >>> the past 10 years)...LAURA AND SACC'ERS, I AM RELIEVED THAT WE ARE
        >>> KEEPING
        >>> OUR CC IDENTITY, CAN STILL REACH OUT TO ALL OTHERS AS WE HAVE
        >>> OUTSTANDING
        >>> EXAMPLES OF UNIVERSITY MEMBERS AND LEADERS: REMEMBER OUR LATE RACE
        >>> TEACHING
        >>> EXPERT LEN LIEBERMAN...AND DOROTHY DAVIS, AND OTHERS...LET'S GET
        >>> MORE...LET'S GET CREATIVE AND REACH OUT TO NON AAA MEMBERS WITH A
        >>> CREATIVE
        >>> STATUS ON OUR WEBSITE AND AT OUR MEETINGS AS AD HOC 'MEMBERS'...
        >>> ----- Original Message -----
        >>> From: Lloyd Miller
        >>> To: Melvin Johnson
        >>> Cc: Laura Gonzalez ; Tad McIlwraith ; Autumn Cahoon ;
        >>> nives@... ;
        >>> Tim Sullivan ; Becky Stein-Frankle ; Bob Muckle ; Ann Kaupp ;
        >>> katnvivi@... ; Mark Lewine
        >>> Sent: Saturday, October 08, 2011 5:16 AM
        >>> Subject: Re: SACC Name Change
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> Yes Mel, I agree. I sense the rancid stink of university politics
        >>> that I
        >>> haven't smelled since graduate school. Someone once said that the
        >>> level of
        >>> sanctimonious viciousness in academic politics is inversely
        >>> proportional to
        >>> the importance of the issues. One reason why I so enjoy SACC is
        >>> that such
        >>> behavior is delightfully absent.
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> I thought about all this as I rode through some gorgeous terrain
        >>> the past
        >>> few days. I think we should keep our name of SACC and proudly
        >>> remain an
        >>> organization of community college anthropologists that welcomes
        >>> any and all
        >>> teachers of anthropology to join us. Laura, your communications on
        >>> this
        >>> matter have been excellent. I don't want you to feel for a second
        >>> that all
        >>> you've done on this issue has been in vain or inadequate. With the
        >>> board's
        >>> assent, I'd recommend that you write a nice, short note to
        >>> Virginia, et.al.
        >>> saying sweetly, in effect, "Thanks for your considerable help and
        >>> advice on
        >>> this matter. We've decided to keep our name and continue to work
        >>> toward
        >>> increasing our membership and fulfilling our stated mission." (You
        >>> can say
        >>> it better.)
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> Here's why. As SACC, our section has protected "tenure" with AAA.
        >>> None of
        >>> us knows for sure whether a name change would lead to increased
        >>> membership.
        >>> It is possible that matters of membership are quite beyond our
        >>> control in
        >>> any case. As Mark stated, one avenue toward our having more
        >>> influence in AAA
        >>> is for SACC members to fill AAA board and committee positions, and
        >>> I've
        >>> received some emails from AAA inviting (even begging) people to
        >>> nominate
        >>> themselves.
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> Though small, we have managed to produce a biannual publication, a
        >>> first-rate website, and annual meetings that are second to none.
        >>> I'd hate to
        >>> see all that disappear or be diluted. And Virginia's stick and
        >>> carrot
        >>> messages contain an implicit warning: AAA would not allow us to
        >>> survive.
        >>> With a name change, we'd lose our status within several years for
        >>> insufficient membership. Or, if many other non-CC people joined,
        >>> we'd soon
        >>> become a minority in the very organization we created, and community
        >>> colleges would cease to be represented.
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> Ironically, SACC has status in AAA beyond its numbers precisely
        >>> because
        >>> we're unique and we teach 50 percent or so of the nation's
        >>> students who take
        >>> undergraduate anthropology courses. In fact, this statistic is not
        >>> received
        >>> well by many in AAA. Furthermore, many of our non-CC colleagues
        >>> feel that
        >>> the students we teach probably do not deserve a college education,
        >>> I mean,
        >>> if they did, wouldn't they be at a four-year college or
        >>> university? And what
        >>> are community colleges but second-rate versions of "real" colleges
        >>> and
        >>> universities; not all of their teachers even have PhDs, for
        >>> Heaven's sake!
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> We have had some friends in AAA as Mark's excellent historical
        >>> review
        >>> shows, and I believe that people like Virginia and former AAA
        >>> President Don
        >>> Brenneis are sincere in their admiration of us. But while SACC is
        >>> about
        >>> collegiality, comradeship, and even friendship, AAA is not. AAA
        >>> officers
        >>> come and go, but its status-conscious bureaucracy remains. If SACC
        >>> goes
        >>> under, few of them will shed tears. It will just reinforce
        >>> suspicions of our
        >>> unworthiness and that we probably didn't deserve to survive anyway.
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> Membership aside, I think attendance at our San Diego meetings
        >>> might be a
        >>> watershed for SACC. California has the largest number of community
        >>> college
        >>> anthropologists. We should have a sizable turnout. I hope so.
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> Bottom line: Irrespective of our official, dues-paying numbers, we
        >>> remain
        >>> a body of community college anthropologists that includes us
        >>> officers and a
        >>> fluid collection of listserv members, many of whom are probably
        >>> not AAA
        >>> members. We have protected status as a AAA section and therefore, by
        >>> default, represent the world of community college anthropology
        >>> (and by
        >>> extension community colleges in general) to the AAA. Perhaps we
        >>> should think
        >>> about ways we could connect with, and serve as resources to, the
        >>> vast
        >>> numbers of people who teach anthropology in community colleges
        >>> (adjuncts,
        >>> people from other disciplines with the minimum required anthro.
        >>> training,
        >>> etc.), few if any who will ever join AAA.
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> Sorry, I didn't intend to write so much.
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> Lloyd
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> On Oct 7, 2011, at 9:51 PM, Melvin Johnson wrote:
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> I don't know--there is a political game being played here, which
        >>> I do
        >>> not trust. Why the tone should be so different is worrisome.
        >>>
        >>> Mel Johnson
        >>>
        >>> "Life is a banquet, and most poor suckers are starving to death."
        >>> --Mame
        >>> Dennis
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
        >>> From: ltgonzalez@...
        >>> To: ltgonzalez@...; majohns1@...; tad.mcilwraith@...
        >>> ;
        >>> akcahoon@...; nives@...;tsullivan@...; rls@...
        >>> ;
        >>> bmuckle@...; KAUPPA@...; lloyd.miller@...;
        >>> katnvivi@...
        >>> Subject: RE: SACC Name Change
        >>> Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2011 07:45:13 -0700
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> More from Virginia ˆ She has been peppering my inbox with short
        >>> „ideas‰
        >>> like this, which do not have the same tone as the emails sent with
        >>> Bill
        >>> Davis on the cc list.
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> Laura
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> Good morning, Laura!
        >>>
        >>> I was just thinking of how you might achieve your goals and
        >>> perhaps (1)
        >>> avoid past tensions among Sections, and (2) indeed appeal to a lot
        >>> of other
        >>> people in anthro (something I think your proposed name change
        >>> could indeed
        >>> accomplish, perhaps to a greater extent that you expect). I could
        >>> easily see
        >>> a renamed SACC (with some rewording or partial reorganization)
        >>> turning into
        >>> a mid-sized Section of 400-600 people. I think of the many
        >>> anthropologists I
        >>> know for whom anthro teaching is a very high personal priority and
        >>> who may
        >>> choose a "SAT" as their 2nd or 3rd Section.
        >>>
        >>> On the other hand, this might indeed mean somewhat less attention
        >>> to
        >>> CC's and I would hate to end up with a AAA without a Section that
        >>> pays close
        >>> attention to community colleges. So subcommittees--even if just
        >>> 2-3--could
        >>> work to achieve several goals at once.
        >>>
        >>> All the best,
        >>> Virginia
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>> ------------------------------------
        >>>
        >>> Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups
        >>> Links
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>>
        >>
        >>
        >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >> ------------------------------------
        >>
        >> Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------
        >
        > Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
      • Lynch, Brian M
        Hope everyone has read about the Gov. of Florida, and his comments about how the State doesn t need anthropologists. How ill informed! The AAA has quickly
        Message 3 of 10 , Oct 11, 2011
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          Hope everyone has read about the Gov. of Florida, and his comments about
          how the State doesn't need anthropologists. How ill informed! The AAA
          has quickly replied.


          Brian
        • kent morris
          not to stereotype, but Republicans can be pretty stupid in that regard... ... From: Lynch, Brian M Subject: [SACC-L] Governor of Fla:
          Message 4 of 10 , Oct 11, 2011
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            not to stereotype, but Republicans can be pretty stupid in that regard...

            --- On Tue, 10/11/11, Lynch, Brian M <blynch@...> wrote:


            From: Lynch, Brian M <blynch@...>
            Subject: [SACC-L] Governor of Fla: "We don't need anthropology/anthropologists"!!
            To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Tuesday, October 11, 2011, 1:26 PM


            Hope everyone has read about the Gov. of Florida, and his comments about
            how the State doesn't need anthropologists.  How ill informed!  The AAA
            has quickly replied.


            Brian



            ------------------------------------

            Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Lloyd Miller
            Thanks for this, Brian; I hadn t heard. I read the Miami Herald s report and Virginia s response, then submitted the following comment to the Herald: Miami
            Message 5 of 10 , Oct 11, 2011
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              Thanks for this, Brian; I hadn't heard. I read the Miami Herald's report and Virginia's response, then submitted the following comment to the Herald:

              Miami Herald Florida Wires
              Dear Editor,
              Regarding your AP article, �State doesn�t need more anthropologists,� (Oct 11, 2011): In questioning anthropology�s worth in the job market, Governor Scott overlooks its considerable value as an integral component of a college liberal arts education.
              The study of anthropology can broaden citizens� understanding of the human species: who we are, where we came from and how we got here. It also increases our abilities to understand complex social and political issues globally, and to participate more wisely in democratic processes.
              Anthropology includes the first 99 percent of human history, from the beginnings of the Primate Order some 65 million years ago through the origins, evolution, and rise of our species. It studies in detail the nature of world cultures, past and present, from tribal societies to civilizations. Its studies of family and kinship include all kinds, not just those of mainstream US. These are but a few of the unique contributions anthropology makes to the intellectual arsenal of educated American citizens.
              For a more detailed discussion of this topic, see my commentary �Of What Value is Anthropology?� in the fall 2011 issue of Teaching Anthropology: SACC Notes, available to the public at saccweb.net (website of the Society for Anthropology in Community Colleges).
              Sincerely,
              Lloyd Miller, Editor, Teaching Anthropology: SACC Notes
              650 48th St.
              Des Moines, IA 50312
              ( 515) 255-0975




              On Oct 11, 2011, at 3:26 PM, Lynch, Brian M wrote:

              > Hope everyone has read about the Gov. of Florida, and his comments about
              > how the State doesn't need anthropologists. How ill informed! The AAA
              > has quickly replied.
              >
              > Brian
              >
              >



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Andrew Petto
              This is good, Lloyd, but I have been searching (admittedly without much luck) for specifics of Scott s actual programs and plans. So far all I can see is
              Message 6 of 10 , Oct 11, 2011
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                This is good, Lloyd, but I have been searching (admittedly without
                much luck) for specifics of Scott's actual programs and plans. So far
                all I can see is what he is against and what he has eliminated.

                I suspect, however, that for things like the toll roads plan in the
                piece posted here by Jason, we could point to every one of his projects
                (if we could find them), and say, "Yup, anthropologists have something
                to do with that!"

                For example, for all the engineers and mathematicians that he hopes to
                create, the "human factors" that we must project in order to build
                something that people will use to its fullest extent is an area of
                expertise that anthropologists have. It is whom engineering and
                industrial design firms hire to do this work and it is who trains the
                staff in these engineering and design firms to understand and
                incorporate these "human factors" in their models.

                Something like that.

                I think I can make this work with the toll road example, but it would be
                good if there were, say, a top-10 list of things that Rick Scott wants
                to do that relies on expertise that anthropologists have.

                Anj

                On 10/11/2011 17:53, Lloyd Miller wrote:
                > Thanks for this, Brian; I hadn't heard. I read the Miami Herald's report and Virginia's response, then submitted the following comment to the Herald:
                >
                > Miami Herald Florida Wires
                > Dear Editor,
                > Regarding your AP article, "State doesn't need more anthropologists," (Oct 11, 2011): In questioning anthropology's worth in the job market, Governor Scott overlooks its considerable value as an integral component of a college liberal arts education.
                > The study of anthropology can broaden citizens' understanding of the human species: who we are, where we came from and how we got here. It also increases our abilities to understand complex social and political issues globally, and to participate more wisely in democratic processes.
                > Anthropology includes the first 99 percent of human history, from the beginnings of the Primate Order some 65 million years ago through the origins, evolution, and rise of our species. It studies in detail the nature of world cultures, past and present, from tribal societies to civilizations. Its studies of family and kinship include all kinds, not just those of mainstream US. These are but a few of the unique contributions anthropology makes to the intellectual arsenal of educated American citizens.
                > For a more detailed discussion of this topic, see my commentary "Of What Value is Anthropology?" in the fall 2011 issue of Teaching Anthropology: SACC Notes, available to the public at saccweb.net (website of the Society for Anthropology in Community Colleges).
                > Sincerely,
                > Lloyd Miller, Editor, Teaching Anthropology: SACC Notes
                > 650 48th St.
                > Des Moines, IA 50312
                > ( 515) 255-0975
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > On Oct 11, 2011, at 3:26 PM, Lynch, Brian M wrote:
                >
                >> Hope everyone has read about the Gov. of Florida, and his comments about
                >> how the State doesn't need anthropologists. How ill informed! The AAA
                >> has quickly replied.
                >>
                >> Brian
                >>
                >>
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >

                --

                -----------------------------
                Andrew J Petto, PhD
                Senior Lecturer
                Department of Biological Sciences
                University of Wisconsin -- Milwaukee
                PO Box 413
                Milwaukee WI 53201-0413
                CapTel Line: 1-877-243-2823
                Telephone: 414-229-6784
                FAX: 414-229-3926
                https://pantherfile.uwm.edu/ajpetto/www/index.htm

                *************
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