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Fwd: Gobekli Tepe

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  • Lloyd Miller
    To my archaeology colleagues: I just received this. It sounds like another Erich von Daniken-style ruse but I can t find a reference to it on snopes.com.
    Message 1 of 11 , Sep 10, 2011
      To my archaeology colleagues:

      I just received this. It sounds like another Erich von Daniken-style ruse but I can't find a reference to it on snopes.com. Perhaps someone can explain it.

      Lloyd

      Begin forwarded message:

      > The structures on this site were built about 12,000 years ago (10,000BC) and intentionally buried with sand about 8,000 years ago.
      >
      > No one knows who these people were, what the massive buildings were for, or why they were buried. Just for reference, these massive structures were built during the last ice age and are more than 7,000 years older than any other structure we have yet discovered on our planet. As I watched this I was in awe of what is shown and discussed, 13 years of work and only an estimated 5% had been uncovered!!! This would truly be amazing beyond words to see
      >
      > http://www.wimp.com/unexplainedstructure/
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Barry Kass
      Hi Lloyd, National Geographic magazine ( June/2011 ) has a major article about Gobekli Tepe in Turkey. It is an authentic site, and very fascinating. Barry
      Message 2 of 11 , Sep 10, 2011
        Hi Lloyd,
        National Geographic magazine ( June/2011 ) has a major article about
        Gobekli Tepe in Turkey.
        It is an authentic site, and very fascinating.
        Barry


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Lloyd Miller
        Thanks, Barry. My call for help was premature. I subsequently Googled the site and found a plethora of information on it. Should have done that first.
        Message 3 of 11 , Sep 10, 2011
          Thanks, Barry. My call for help was premature. I subsequently Googled the site and found a plethora of information on it. Should have done that first. Apparently, the site was examined first in the 1960s and dismissed as just an abandoned cemetery, then researched again int he 1990s.

          I receive so many things on the Internet that are either phony or downright scams that I may have become overly suspicious.

          Lloyd


          On Sep 10, 2011, at 10:47 AM, Barry Kass wrote:

          > Hi Lloyd,
          > National Geographic magazine ( June/2011 ) has a major article about
          > Gobekli Tepe in Turkey.
          > It is an authentic site, and very fascinating.
          > Barry
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • bmuckle@capilanou.ca
          Reminds me of another real ongoing archaeology project in California. The film sets of the 1923 epic The Ten Commandments were deliberately covered with sand
          Message 4 of 11 , Sep 10, 2011
            Reminds me of another real ongoing archaeology project in California. The film sets of the 1923 epic "The Ten Commandments" were deliberately covered with sand after filming, and archaeologists have re-disvered them. I'm not really suggesting that there was a four thousand year movie shoot after which the director chose to bury the set though.

            Bob
            Sent wirelessly from my BlackBerry device on the Bell network.
            Envoy� sans fil par mon terminal mobile BlackBerry sur le r�seau de Bell.

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Lloyd Miller <lloyd.miller@...>
            Sender: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2011 10:27:26
            To: SACC ListServ<SACC-L@yahoogroups.com>
            Reply-To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [SACC-L] Fwd: Gobekli Tepe

            To my archaeology colleagues:

            I just received this. It sounds like another Erich von Daniken-style ruse but I can't find a reference to it on snopes.com. Perhaps someone can explain it.

            Lloyd

            Begin forwarded message:

            > The structures on this site were built about 12,000 years ago (10,000BC) and intentionally buried with sand about 8,000 years ago.
            >
            > No one knows who these people were, what the massive buildings were for, or why they were buried. Just for reference, these massive structures were built during the last ice age and are more than 7,000 years older than any other structure we have yet discovered on our planet. As I watched this I was in awe of what is shown and discussed, 13 years of work and only an estimated 5% had been uncovered!!! This would truly be amazing beyond words to see
            >
            > http://www.wimp.com/unexplainedstructure/
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >



            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • dianne.chidester@gvltec.edu
            Lloyd, You re not alone about feeling scammed. I watched the History.com site and saw what I always warn my students about. Be sure to check sources. Who is
            Message 5 of 11 , Sep 12, 2011
              Lloyd, You're not alone about feeling scammed. I watched the
              History.com site and saw what I always warn my students about. Be sure
              to check sources. Who is the voice of authority? Does this make sense?
              What is the science presented?

              My gripe with the history.com site is that affiliations are not given
              and many of the voices of authority are investigative journalists. (I'm
              not against this, just tell me what your qualifications are.) The "tone"
              is also a problem for me. Everything is a mystery, everything has
              biblical connections, information is nearly whispered so it all seems
              somehow magical.

              Carl Sagan wrote a "baloney detector kit"
              http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/baloney.html
              And I tell students to check it out.

              Cheers!
              Dianne

              -----Original Message-----
              From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
              Of Lloyd Miller
              Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2011 11:55 AM
              To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe

              Thanks, Barry. My call for help was premature. I subsequently Googled
              the site and found a plethora of information on it. Should have done
              that first. Apparently, the site was examined first in the 1960s and
              dismissed as just an abandoned cemetery, then researched again int he
              1990s.

              I receive so many things on the Internet that are either phony or
              downright scams that I may have become overly suspicious.

              Lloyd


              On Sep 10, 2011, at 10:47 AM, Barry Kass wrote:

              > Hi Lloyd,
              > National Geographic magazine ( June/2011 ) has a major article about
              > Gobekli Tepe in Turkey.
              > It is an authentic site, and very fascinating.
              > Barry
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >



              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



              ------------------------------------

              Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links




              This electronic mail message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original message. To the best of our ability and knowledge, this mail message has been scanned and is free of viruses and malware.
            • Deborah Shepherd
              Thank you for the Carl Sagan baloney detector kit, Dianne. That s a keeper. As for History.com, I m fully with you there. Too often I have found that my
              Message 6 of 11 , Sep 12, 2011
                Thank you for the Carl Sagan baloney detector kit, Dianne. That's a keeper.



                As for History.com, I'm fully with you there. Too often I have found that my
                students have watched many History channel shows (which is why they enrolled
                in anthropology and archaeology courses), but they don't know about the PBS
                channel (what PBS channel?) and never heard of the program NOVA* (or
                American Experience). Well, I should once again post the disclaimer that I
                have taught in Michele Bachmann's district. I'm sure there are different
                students elsewhere.



                However, I think it is important to realize that the History Channel mantra
                of "it's a mystery" is not just a simple marketing ploy. This attitude feeds
                into a growing American religious-based anti-science undercurrent. Even in
                archaeology class, I have encountered students who absolutely resent having
                their mysteries explained. They fight it and argue about the possibilities
                of truly ridiculous and bizarre things. This puzzled me until I realized
                that they weren't defending the fairy tales so much as clinging to the
                spiritual sense of mystery in the face of the glaring light of science.
                Suddenly, by explaining the Nazca lines, I was inadvertently attacking their
                spirituality, which by extension means their Christian faith (for they
                regularly attend churches which warn them against the evils of science and
                scientists, a la Rick Perry). It's the only explanation I can give for the
                backlash I received on such occasions and, by extension, why the History
                channel is so popular. Mystery demands faith, not science.



                * Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                programs, now?



                Deborah



                From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                dianne.chidester@...
                Sent: Monday, September 12, 2011 1:57 PM
                To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe





                Lloyd, You're not alone about feeling scammed. I watched the
                History.com site and saw what I always warn my students about. Be sure
                to check sources. Who is the voice of authority? Does this make sense?
                What is the science presented?

                My gripe with the history.com site is that affiliations are not given
                and many of the voices of authority are investigative journalists. (I'm
                not against this, just tell me what your qualifications are.) The "tone"
                is also a problem for me. Everything is a mystery, everything has
                biblical connections, information is nearly whispered so it all seems
                somehow magical.

                Carl Sagan wrote a "baloney detector kit"
                http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/baloney.html
                And I tell students to check it out.

                Cheers!
                Dianne

                -----Original Message-----
                From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
                [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf
                Of Lloyd Miller
                Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2011 11:55 AM
                To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
                Subject: Re: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe

                Thanks, Barry. My call for help was premature. I subsequently Googled
                the site and found a plethora of information on it. Should have done
                that first. Apparently, the site was examined first in the 1960s and
                dismissed as just an abandoned cemetery, then researched again int he
                1990s.

                I receive so many things on the Internet that are either phony or
                downright scams that I may have become overly suspicious.

                Lloyd

                On Sep 10, 2011, at 10:47 AM, Barry Kass wrote:

                > Hi Lloyd,
                > National Geographic magazine ( June/2011 ) has a major article about
                > Gobekli Tepe in Turkey.
                > It is an authentic site, and very fascinating.
                > Barry
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
                >

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                ------------------------------------

                Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links

                This electronic mail message is for the sole use of the intended
                recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any
                unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you
                are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and
                destroy all copies of the original message. To the best of our ability and
                knowledge, this mail message has been scanned and is free of viruses and
                malware.





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Anthropmor
                Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA programs, now? did you notice that the subject s are getting more selective? Much as I
                Message 7 of 11 , Sep 12, 2011
                  Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                  programs, now?






                  did you notice that the subject s are getting more selective?
                  Much as I enjoyed the coverage of industrial chemists, I've noticed more of that creeping in.
                  Mike Pavlik


                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Deborah Shepherd <shephdj@...>
                  To: SACC-L <SACC-L@yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Mon, Sep 12, 2011 2:21 pm
                  Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe




                  Thank you for the Carl Sagan baloney detector kit, Dianne. That's a keeper.

                  As for History.com, I'm fully with you there. Too often I have found that my
                  students have watched many History channel shows (which is why they enrolled
                  in anthropology and archaeology courses), but they don't know about the PBS
                  channel (what PBS channel?) and never heard of the program NOVA* (or
                  American Experience). Well, I should once again post the disclaimer that I
                  have taught in Michele Bachmann's district. I'm sure there are different
                  students elsewhere.

                  However, I think it is important to realize that the History Channel mantra
                  of "it's a mystery" is not just a simple marketing ploy. This attitude feeds
                  into a growing American religious-based anti-science undercurrent. Even in
                  archaeology class, I have encountered students who absolutely resent having
                  their mysteries explained. They fight it and argue about the possibilities
                  of truly ridiculous and bizarre things. This puzzled me until I realized
                  that they weren't defending the fairy tales so much as clinging to the
                  spiritual sense of mystery in the face of the glaring light of science.
                  Suddenly, by explaining the Nazca lines, I was inadvertently attacking their
                  spirituality, which by extension means their Christian faith (for they
                  regularly attend churches which warn them against the evils of science and
                  scientists, a la Rick Perry). It's the only explanation I can give for the
                  backlash I received on such occasions and, by extension, why the History
                  channel is so popular. Mystery demands faith, not science.

                  * Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                  programs, now?

                  Deborah

                  From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                  dianne.chidester@...
                  Sent: Monday, September 12, 2011 1:57 PM
                  To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe

                  Lloyd, You're not alone about feeling scammed. I watched the
                  History.com site and saw what I always warn my students about. Be sure
                  to check sources. Who is the voice of authority? Does this make sense?
                  What is the science presented?

                  My gripe with the history.com site is that affiliations are not given
                  and many of the voices of authority are investigative journalists. (I'm
                  not against this, just tell me what your qualifications are.) The "tone"
                  is also a problem for me. Everything is a mystery, everything has
                  biblical connections, information is nearly whispered so it all seems
                  somehow magical.

                  Carl Sagan wrote a "baloney detector kit"
                  http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/baloney.html
                  And I tell students to check it out.

                  Cheers!
                  Dianne

                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>;
                  [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>; ] On Behalf
                  Of Lloyd Miller
                  Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2011 11:55 AM
                  To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>;
                  Subject: Re: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe

                  Thanks, Barry. My call for help was premature. I subsequently Googled
                  the site and found a plethora of information on it. Should have done
                  that first. Apparently, the site was examined first in the 1960s and
                  dismissed as just an abandoned cemetery, then researched again int he
                  1990s.

                  I receive so many things on the Internet that are either phony or
                  downright scams that I may have become overly suspicious.

                  Lloyd

                  On Sep 10, 2011, at 10:47 AM, Barry Kass wrote:

                  > Hi Lloyd,
                  > National Geographic magazine ( June/2011 ) has a major article about
                  > Gobekli Tepe in Turkey.
                  > It is an authentic site, and very fascinating.
                  > Barry
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                  ------------------------------------

                  Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links

                  This electronic mail message is for the sole use of the intended
                  recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any
                  unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you
                  are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and
                  destroy all copies of the original message. To the best of our ability and
                  knowledge, this mail message has been scanned and is free of viruses and
                  malware.

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Deborah Shepherd
                  And the recent program on the new WTC brought up the question of why the original towers fell but then completely dropped it (that was right after the
                  Message 8 of 11 , Sep 12, 2011
                    And the recent program on the new WTC brought up the question of why the
                    original towers fell but then completely dropped it (that was right after
                    the architect of the new building had said that he hadn't believed the old
                    towers could fall). Just weird. Also, I heard the narrator say that the
                    multi-ton panes of external glass "made in the US" for the new building were
                    shipped all the way to China for etching "because it was cheaper."

                    Can't forget to add those plugs supporting production outsourcing.

                    Koch was also involved in a PBS program on Stonehenge which was a terrible
                    mishmash of research and what-ifs. One of the experimental archaeology
                    sequences looked like a reject idea from Time Team.


                    On Mon, Sep 12, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Anthropmor <anthropmor@...> wrote:

                    > **
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                    > programs, now?
                    >
                    > did you notice that the subject s are getting more selective?
                    > Much as I enjoyed the coverage of industrial chemists, I've noticed more of
                    > that creeping in.
                    > Mike Pavlik
                    >
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: Deborah Shepherd <shephdj@...>
                    > To: SACC-L <SACC-L@yahoogroups.com>
                    > Sent: Mon, Sep 12, 2011 2:21 pm
                    > Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                    >
                    > Thank you for the Carl Sagan baloney detector kit, Dianne. That's a keeper.
                    >
                    > As for History.com, I'm fully with you there. Too often I have found that
                    > my
                    > students have watched many History channel shows (which is why they
                    > enrolled
                    > in anthropology and archaeology courses), but they don't know about the PBS
                    > channel (what PBS channel?) and never heard of the program NOVA* (or
                    > American Experience). Well, I should once again post the disclaimer that I
                    > have taught in Michele Bachmann's district. I'm sure there are different
                    > students elsewhere.
                    >
                    > However, I think it is important to realize that the History Channel mantra
                    > of "it's a mystery" is not just a simple marketing ploy. This attitude
                    > feeds
                    > into a growing American religious-based anti-science undercurrent. Even in
                    > archaeology class, I have encountered students who absolutely resent having
                    > their mysteries explained. They fight it and argue about the possibilities
                    > of truly ridiculous and bizarre things. This puzzled me until I realized
                    > that they weren't defending the fairy tales so much as clinging to the
                    > spiritual sense of mystery in the face of the glaring light of science.
                    > Suddenly, by explaining the Nazca lines, I was inadvertently attacking
                    > their
                    > spirituality, which by extension means their Christian faith (for they
                    > regularly attend churches which warn them against the evils of science and
                    > scientists, a la Rick Perry). It's the only explanation I can give for the
                    > backlash I received on such occasions and, by extension, why the History
                    > channel is so popular. Mystery demands faith, not science.
                    >
                    > * Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                    > programs, now?
                    >
                    > Deborah
                    >
                    > From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                    > dianne.chidester@...
                    > Sent: Monday, September 12, 2011 1:57 PM
                    > To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                    >
                    > Lloyd, You're not alone about feeling scammed. I watched the
                    > History.com site and saw what I always warn my students about. Be sure
                    > to check sources. Who is the voice of authority? Does this make sense?
                    > What is the science presented?
                    >
                    > My gripe with the history.com site is that affiliations are not given
                    > and many of the voices of authority are investigative journalists. (I'm
                    > not against this, just tell me what your qualifications are.) The "tone"
                    > is also a problem for me. Everything is a mystery, everything has
                    > biblical connections, information is nearly whispered so it all seems
                    > somehow magical.
                    >
                    > Carl Sagan wrote a "baloney detector kit"
                    > http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/baloney.html
                    > And I tell students to check it out.
                    >
                    > Cheers!
                    > Dianne
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>;
                    > [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>; ] On
                    > Behalf
                    >
                    > Of Lloyd Miller
                    > Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2011 11:55 AM
                    > To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>;
                    > Subject: Re: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                    >
                    > Thanks, Barry. My call for help was premature. I subsequently Googled
                    > the site and found a plethora of information on it. Should have done
                    > that first. Apparently, the site was examined first in the 1960s and
                    > dismissed as just an abandoned cemetery, then researched again int he
                    > 1990s.
                    >
                    > I receive so many things on the Internet that are either phony or
                    > downright scams that I may have become overly suspicious.
                    >
                    > Lloyd
                    >
                    > On Sep 10, 2011, at 10:47 AM, Barry Kass wrote:
                    >
                    > > Hi Lloyd,
                    > > National Geographic magazine ( June/2011 ) has a major article about
                    > > Gobekli Tepe in Turkey.
                    > > It is an authentic site, and very fascinating.
                    > > Barry
                    > >
                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    > ------------------------------------
                    >
                    > Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    > This electronic mail message is for the sole use of the intended
                    > recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any
                    > unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you
                    > are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email
                    > and
                    > destroy all copies of the original message. To the best of our ability and
                    > knowledge, this mail message has been scanned and is free of viruses and
                    > malware.
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >
                    >


                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • Lloyd Miller
                    Dianne, Thanks much for the Sagan baloney detector kit; I shall treasure it. Though I had read several of Sagan s books, I somehow missed this. I may order the
                    Message 9 of 11 , Sep 12, 2011
                      Dianne,

                      Thanks much for the Sagan baloney detector kit; I shall treasure it. Though I had read several of Sagan's books, I somehow missed this. I may order the book too. Also, thanks for reassuring me that I am "not alone!" And Deborah and Mike, thanks for your enlightening comments. Deborah, Michele Bachmann notwithstanding, the students I remember (and the ones Bev and my son moan about regularly) are pretty much the same.

                      A cousin (whom I certainly love) and several non-academic age mates receive these kinds of things fairly regularly and often forwards them to me. So, I customarily check them out on Snopes or some other urban legend-busting site and email them back with the news that (usually), "No, that's not true," and either paste in the information or explain to them more briefly in my own words why such and such is a myth. Far from being offended, they thank me and express appreciation for my "researching these things and setting them straight." Of course, they could easily look up the information themselves, but I don't have the heart to tell them that.

                      Lloyd



                      On Sep 12, 2011, at 4:04 PM, Deborah Shepherd wrote:

                      > And the recent program on the new WTC brought up the question of why the
                      > original towers fell but then completely dropped it (that was right after
                      > the architect of the new building had said that he hadn't believed the old
                      > towers could fall). Just weird. Also, I heard the narrator say that the
                      > multi-ton panes of external glass "made in the US" for the new building were
                      > shipped all the way to China for etching "because it was cheaper."
                      >
                      > Can't forget to add those plugs supporting production outsourcing.
                      >
                      > Koch was also involved in a PBS program on Stonehenge which was a terrible
                      > mishmash of research and what-ifs. One of the experimental archaeology
                      > sequences looked like a reject idea from Time Team.
                      >
                      >
                      > On Mon, Sep 12, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Anthropmor <anthropmor@...> wrote:
                      >
                      >> **
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                      >> programs, now?
                      >>
                      >> did you notice that the subject s are getting more selective?
                      >> Much as I enjoyed the coverage of industrial chemists, I've noticed more of
                      >> that creeping in.
                      >> Mike Pavlik
                      >>
                      >>
                      >> -----Original Message-----
                      >> From: Deborah Shepherd <shephdj@...>
                      >> To: SACC-L <SACC-L@yahoogroups.com>
                      >> Sent: Mon, Sep 12, 2011 2:21 pm
                      >> Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                      >>
                      >> Thank you for the Carl Sagan baloney detector kit, Dianne. That's a keeper.
                      >>
                      >> As for History.com, I'm fully with you there. Too often I have found that
                      >> my
                      >> students have watched many History channel shows (which is why they
                      >> enrolled
                      >> in anthropology and archaeology courses), but they don't know about the PBS
                      >> channel (what PBS channel?) and never heard of the program NOVA* (or
                      >> American Experience). Well, I should once again post the disclaimer that I
                      >> have taught in Michele Bachmann's district. I'm sure there are different
                      >> students elsewhere.
                      >>
                      >> However, I think it is important to realize that the History Channel mantra
                      >> of "it's a mystery" is not just a simple marketing ploy. This attitude
                      >> feeds
                      >> into a growing American religious-based anti-science undercurrent. Even in
                      >> archaeology class, I have encountered students who absolutely resent having
                      >> their mysteries explained. They fight it and argue about the possibilities
                      >> of truly ridiculous and bizarre things. This puzzled me until I realized
                      >> that they weren't defending the fairy tales so much as clinging to the
                      >> spiritual sense of mystery in the face of the glaring light of science.
                      >> Suddenly, by explaining the Nazca lines, I was inadvertently attacking
                      >> their
                      >> spirituality, which by extension means their Christian faith (for they
                      >> regularly attend churches which warn them against the evils of science and
                      >> scientists, a la Rick Perry). It's the only explanation I can give for the
                      >> backlash I received on such occasions and, by extension, why the History
                      >> channel is so popular. Mystery demands faith, not science.
                      >>
                      >> * Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                      >> programs, now?
                      >>
                      >> Deborah
                      >>
                      >> From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                      >> dianne.chidester@...
                      >> Sent: Monday, September 12, 2011 1:57 PM
                      >> To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
                      >> Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                      >>
                      >> Lloyd, You're not alone about feeling scammed. I watched the
                      >> History.com site and saw what I always warn my students about. Be sure
                      >> to check sources. Who is the voice of authority? Does this make sense?
                      >> What is the science presented?
                      >>
                      >> My gripe with the history.com site is that affiliations are not given
                      >> and many of the voices of authority are investigative journalists. (I'm
                      >> not against this, just tell me what your qualifications are.) The "tone"
                      >> is also a problem for me. Everything is a mystery, everything has
                      >> biblical connections, information is nearly whispered so it all seems
                      >> somehow magical.
                      >>
                      >> Carl Sagan wrote a "baloney detector kit"
                      >> http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/baloney.html
                      >> And I tell students to check it out.
                      >>
                      >> Cheers!
                      >> Dianne
                      >>
                      >> -----Original Message-----
                      >> From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>;
                      >> [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>; ] On
                      >> Behalf
                      >>
                      >> Of Lloyd Miller
                      >> Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2011 11:55 AM
                      >> To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>;
                      >> Subject: Re: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                      >>
                      >> Thanks, Barry. My call for help was premature. I subsequently Googled
                      >> the site and found a plethora of information on it. Should have done
                      >> that first. Apparently, the site was examined first in the 1960s and
                      >> dismissed as just an abandoned cemetery, then researched again int he
                      >> 1990s.
                      >>
                      >> I receive so many things on the Internet that are either phony or
                      >> downright scams that I may have become overly suspicious.
                      >>
                      >> Lloyd
                      >>
                      >> On Sep 10, 2011, at 10:47 AM, Barry Kass wrote:
                      >>
                      >>> Hi Lloyd,
                      >>> National Geographic magazine ( June/2011 ) has a major article about
                      >>> Gobekli Tepe in Turkey.
                      >>> It is an authentic site, and very fascinating.
                      >>> Barry
                      >>>
                      >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >>>
                      >>>
                      >>
                      >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >>
                      >> ------------------------------------
                      >>
                      >> Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >>
                      >> This electronic mail message is for the sole use of the intended
                      >> recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any
                      >> unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you
                      >> are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email
                      >> and
                      >> destroy all copies of the original message. To the best of our ability and
                      >> knowledge, this mail message has been scanned and is free of viruses and
                      >> malware.
                      >>
                      >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >>
                      >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ------------------------------------
                      >
                      > Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >
                      >
                      >
                    • Kaupp, Ann
                      Don t forget the David H. Koch Hall of Human Origins at the Natural History Museum http://humanorigins.si.edu/ ... From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
                      Message 10 of 11 , Sep 13, 2011
                        Don't forget the David H. Koch Hall of Human Origins at the Natural History Museum http://humanorigins.si.edu/




                        -----Original Message-----
                        From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Deborah Shepherd
                        Sent: Monday, September 12, 2011 5:04 PM
                        To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
                        Subject: Re: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe

                        And the recent program on the new WTC brought up the question of why the
                        original towers fell but then completely dropped it (that was right after
                        the architect of the new building had said that he hadn't believed the old
                        towers could fall). Just weird. Also, I heard the narrator say that the
                        multi-ton panes of external glass "made in the US" for the new building were
                        shipped all the way to China for etching "because it was cheaper."

                        Can't forget to add those plugs supporting production outsourcing.

                        Koch was also involved in a PBS program on Stonehenge which was a terrible
                        mishmash of research and what-ifs. One of the experimental archaeology
                        sequences looked like a reject idea from Time Team.


                        On Mon, Sep 12, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Anthropmor <anthropmor@...> wrote:

                        > **
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                        > programs, now?
                        >
                        > did you notice that the subject s are getting more selective?
                        > Much as I enjoyed the coverage of industrial chemists, I've noticed more of
                        > that creeping in.
                        > Mike Pavlik
                        >
                        >
                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: Deborah Shepherd <shephdj@...>
                        > To: SACC-L <SACC-L@yahoogroups.com>
                        > Sent: Mon, Sep 12, 2011 2:21 pm
                        > Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                        >
                        > Thank you for the Carl Sagan baloney detector kit, Dianne. That's a keeper.
                        >
                        > As for History.com, I'm fully with you there. Too often I have found that
                        > my
                        > students have watched many History channel shows (which is why they
                        > enrolled
                        > in anthropology and archaeology courses), but they don't know about the PBS
                        > channel (what PBS channel?) and never heard of the program NOVA* (or
                        > American Experience). Well, I should once again post the disclaimer that I
                        > have taught in Michele Bachmann's district. I'm sure there are different
                        > students elsewhere.
                        >
                        > However, I think it is important to realize that the History Channel mantra
                        > of "it's a mystery" is not just a simple marketing ploy. This attitude
                        > feeds
                        > into a growing American religious-based anti-science undercurrent. Even in
                        > archaeology class, I have encountered students who absolutely resent having
                        > their mysteries explained. They fight it and argue about the possibilities
                        > of truly ridiculous and bizarre things. This puzzled me until I realized
                        > that they weren't defending the fairy tales so much as clinging to the
                        > spiritual sense of mystery in the face of the glaring light of science.
                        > Suddenly, by explaining the Nazca lines, I was inadvertently attacking
                        > their
                        > spirituality, which by extension means their Christian faith (for they
                        > regularly attend churches which warn them against the evils of science and
                        > scientists, a la Rick Perry). It's the only explanation I can give for the
                        > backlash I received on such occasions and, by extension, why the History
                        > channel is so popular. Mystery demands faith, not science.
                        >
                        > * Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                        > programs, now?
                        >
                        > Deborah
                        >
                        > From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                        > dianne.chidester@...
                        > Sent: Monday, September 12, 2011 1:57 PM
                        > To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
                        > Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                        >
                        > Lloyd, You're not alone about feeling scammed. I watched the
                        > History.com site and saw what I always warn my students about. Be sure
                        > to check sources. Who is the voice of authority? Does this make sense?
                        > What is the science presented?
                        >
                        > My gripe with the history.com site is that affiliations are not given
                        > and many of the voices of authority are investigative journalists. (I'm
                        > not against this, just tell me what your qualifications are.) The "tone"
                        > is also a problem for me. Everything is a mystery, everything has
                        > biblical connections, information is nearly whispered so it all seems
                        > somehow magical.
                        >
                        > Carl Sagan wrote a "baloney detector kit"
                        > http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/baloney.html
                        > And I tell students to check it out.
                        >
                        > Cheers!
                        > Dianne
                        >
                        > -----Original Message-----
                        > From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>;
                        > [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>; ] On
                        > Behalf
                        >
                        > Of Lloyd Miller
                        > Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2011 11:55 AM
                        > To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>;
                        > Subject: Re: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                        >
                        > Thanks, Barry. My call for help was premature. I subsequently Googled
                        > the site and found a plethora of information on it. Should have done
                        > that first. Apparently, the site was examined first in the 1960s and
                        > dismissed as just an abandoned cemetery, then researched again int he
                        > 1990s.
                        >
                        > I receive so many things on the Internet that are either phony or
                        > downright scams that I may have become overly suspicious.
                        >
                        > Lloyd
                        >
                        > On Sep 10, 2011, at 10:47 AM, Barry Kass wrote:
                        >
                        > > Hi Lloyd,
                        > > National Geographic magazine ( June/2011 ) has a major article about
                        > > Gobekli Tepe in Turkey.
                        > > It is an authentic site, and very fascinating.
                        > > Barry
                        > >
                        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        > >
                        > >
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        > ------------------------------------
                        >
                        > Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        > This electronic mail message is for the sole use of the intended
                        > recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any
                        > unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you
                        > are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email
                        > and
                        > destroy all copies of the original message. To the best of our ability and
                        > knowledge, this mail message has been scanned and is free of viruses and
                        > malware.
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                        >


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                        ------------------------------------

                        Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links
                      • Deborah Shepherd
                        Oh! From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kaupp, Ann Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2011 9:14 AM To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
                        Message 11 of 11 , Sep 13, 2011
                          Oh!



                          From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                          Kaupp, Ann
                          Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2011 9:14 AM
                          To: 'SACC-L@yahoogroups.com'
                          Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe






                          Don't forget the David H. Koch Hall of Human Origins at the Natural History
                          Museum http://humanorigins.si.edu/

                          -----Original Message-----
                          From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
                          [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf
                          Of Deborah Shepherd
                          Sent: Monday, September 12, 2011 5:04 PM
                          To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
                          Subject: Re: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe

                          And the recent program on the new WTC brought up the question of why the
                          original towers fell but then completely dropped it (that was right after
                          the architect of the new building had said that he hadn't believed the old
                          towers could fall). Just weird. Also, I heard the narrator say that the
                          multi-ton panes of external glass "made in the US" for the new building were
                          shipped all the way to China for etching "because it was cheaper."

                          Can't forget to add those plugs supporting production outsourcing.

                          Koch was also involved in a PBS program on Stonehenge which was a terrible
                          mishmash of research and what-ifs. One of the experimental archaeology
                          sequences looked like a reject idea from Time Team.

                          On Mon, Sep 12, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Anthropmor <anthropmor@...
                          <mailto:anthropmor%40aol.com> > wrote:

                          > **
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                          > programs, now?
                          >
                          > did you notice that the subject s are getting more selective?
                          > Much as I enjoyed the coverage of industrial chemists, I've noticed more
                          of
                          > that creeping in.
                          > Mike Pavlik
                          >
                          >
                          > -----Original Message-----
                          > From: Deborah Shepherd <shephdj@... <mailto:shephdj%40gmail.com> >
                          > To: SACC-L <SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com> >
                          > Sent: Mon, Sep 12, 2011 2:21 pm
                          > Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                          >
                          > Thank you for the Carl Sagan baloney detector kit, Dianne. That's a
                          keeper.
                          >
                          > As for History.com, I'm fully with you there. Too often I have found that
                          > my
                          > students have watched many History channel shows (which is why they
                          > enrolled
                          > in anthropology and archaeology courses), but they don't know about the
                          PBS
                          > channel (what PBS channel?) and never heard of the program NOVA* (or
                          > American Experience). Well, I should once again post the disclaimer that I
                          > have taught in Michele Bachmann's district. I'm sure there are different
                          > students elsewhere.
                          >
                          > However, I think it is important to realize that the History Channel
                          mantra
                          > of "it's a mystery" is not just a simple marketing ploy. This attitude
                          > feeds
                          > into a growing American religious-based anti-science undercurrent. Even in
                          > archaeology class, I have encountered students who absolutely resent
                          having
                          > their mysteries explained. They fight it and argue about the possibilities
                          > of truly ridiculous and bizarre things. This puzzled me until I realized
                          > that they weren't defending the fairy tales so much as clinging to the
                          > spiritual sense of mystery in the face of the glaring light of science.
                          > Suddenly, by explaining the Nazca lines, I was inadvertently attacking
                          > their
                          > spirituality, which by extension means their Christian faith (for they
                          > regularly attend churches which warn them against the evils of science and
                          > scientists, a la Rick Perry). It's the only explanation I can give for the
                          > backlash I received on such occasions and, by extension, why the History
                          > channel is so popular. Mystery demands faith, not science.
                          >
                          > * Are you aware that one of the Koch brothers is a regular funder of NOVA
                          > programs, now?
                          >
                          > Deborah
                          >
                          > From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
                          [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf
                          Of
                          > dianne.chidester@... <mailto:dianne.chidester%40gvltec.edu>
                          > Sent: Monday, September 12, 2011 1:57 PM
                          > To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
                          > Subject: RE: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                          >
                          > Lloyd, You're not alone about feeling scammed. I watched the
                          > History.com site and saw what I always warn my students about. Be sure
                          > to check sources. Who is the voice of authority? Does this make sense?
                          > What is the science presented?
                          >
                          > My gripe with the history.com site is that affiliations are not given
                          > and many of the voices of authority are investigative journalists. (I'm
                          > not against this, just tell me what your qualifications are.) The "tone"
                          > is also a problem for me. Everything is a mystery, everything has
                          > biblical connections, information is nearly whispered so it all seems
                          > somehow magical.
                          >
                          > Carl Sagan wrote a "baloney detector kit"
                          > http://users.tpg.com.au/users/tps-seti/baloney.html
                          > And I tell students to check it out.
                          >
                          > Cheers!
                          > Dianne
                          >
                          > -----Original Message-----
                          > From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
                          <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>;
                          > [mailto:SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
                          <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>; ] On
                          > Behalf
                          >
                          > Of Lloyd Miller
                          > Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2011 11:55 AM
                          > To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
                          <mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>;
                          > Subject: Re: [SACC-L] Re: Fwd: Gobekli Tepe
                          >
                          > Thanks, Barry. My call for help was premature. I subsequently Googled
                          > the site and found a plethora of information on it. Should have done
                          > that first. Apparently, the site was examined first in the 1960s and
                          > dismissed as just an abandoned cemetery, then researched again int he
                          > 1990s.
                          >
                          > I receive so many things on the Internet that are either phony or
                          > downright scams that I may have become overly suspicious.
                          >
                          > Lloyd
                          >
                          > On Sep 10, 2011, at 10:47 AM, Barry Kass wrote:
                          >
                          > > Hi Lloyd,
                          > > National Geographic magazine ( June/2011 ) has a major article about
                          > > Gobekli Tepe in Turkey.
                          > > It is an authentic site, and very fascinating.
                          > > Barry
                          > >
                          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          > >
                          > >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          > ------------------------------------
                          >
                          > Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >
                          > This electronic mail message is for the sole use of the intended
                          > recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any
                          > unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you
                          > are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email
                          > and
                          > destroy all copies of the original message. To the best of our ability and
                          > knowledge, this mail message has been scanned and is free of viruses and
                          > malware.
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          >
                          >

                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                          ------------------------------------

                          Find out more at our web site http://saccweb.net/ Yahoo! Groups Links





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