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Re: [SACC-L] footprints

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  • anthropmor@AOL.COM
    Bob- as far as endurance, yes, bipedality is pretty efficient, but I am guessing that the reporter did not understand how that works- persistance hunting, like
    Message 1 of 5 , Mar 3, 2009
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      Bob- as far as endurance, yes, bipedality is pretty efficient, but I am guessing that the reporter did not understand how that works- persistance hunting, like wolves, rather than sheer chasing in the heat, in which any quadruped would quickly leave us running by ourselves.
      ? I will send you a copy of the Science digest story.
      Mike Pavlik


      -----Original Message-----
      From: Bob Muckle <bmuckle@...>
      To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 5:53 pm
      Subject: [SACC-L] footprints






      Last week there was news of some 1.5 million year old 'H. erectus' or 'H. ergaste'r footprints being discovered in Kenya. The original story apparently is in 'Science' but I haven't seen that yet. It hasn't arrived at my college and we don't get on-line access.

      I have a few questions. First, the article I read in the popular press says these are the oldest humanlike footprints. Did I miss something? What about the Australopithecus prints at Laetoli?

      Second, the article suggests that bipedalism may have been used to 'run the animals in the heat', effectively causing them to collapse from exhaustion. It doesn't say, but I'm assuming the thinking is that since bipedalism allows greater endurance, that humans could outlast their prey in the heat. I've never heard this thinking before. Does anyone know of any ethnographies that describe this kind of hunting....running animals in the heat?

      If there isn't any ethnographic comparables, how could you test the hypothesis that they were running the anmals to exhaustion?

      Bob








      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Renee Garcia
      Hello All, I recall hearing the report on NPR world news and thought that the morphologic traits discussed were rather generic. The primary difference between
      Message 2 of 5 , Mar 3, 2009
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        Hello All,

        I recall hearing the report on NPR world news and thought that the morphologic traits discussed were rather generic. The primary difference between these and the Laetoli series is the divergence of the hallux, which does not appear here in the Kenyan sample.

        I disagree that the morphology of the modern human foot has changed shaped due to modern shoes. Apart from the bony irritations that develop from wearing constricting shoes, the phalanges and digits as well as the tarsal bones are not drastically different from those we can see in the archaeological record of just a hundred years ago or so among Native Americans and others who did not wear shoes. Further, modern shoes may change the skeletal morphology of an individual, again small, tight shoes, but I would say that it would be Lamarckian evolution that would produce this kind of change on a population. I am dubious that this is the case.

        Always interested in a good discussion on skeletal morphology.

        Renee Garcia
        Saddleback College


        [http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/45516000/jpg/_45516169_bennett1hr.jpg%5d[http://www.forbiddenhistory.info/files/laetoli.jpg%5d




        ________________________________
        From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com [SACC-L@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Andrew J Petto [ajpetto@...]
        Sent: Tuesday, March 03, 2009 7:21 PM
        To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [SACC-L] footprints


        Actually, both the shape of the modern foot and the length of the toes appear to have been significantly affected by the habit of wearing shoes. I have a slide comparing modern shoe-wearing feet and those that do not.

        Anj

        ------------
        Andrew J Petto, PhD
        Senior Lecturer
        Department of Biological Sciences
        University of Wisconsin -- Milwaukee
        PO Box 413
        Milwaukee WI 53201-0413
        414-229-6784
        FAX: 414-229-3926
        http://www.uwm.edu/~ajpetto

        *************
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        ----- Original Message -----
        From: "Ann Popplestone" <ann.popplestone@...<mailto:ann.popplestone%40tri-c.edu>>
        To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com<mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
        Sent: Tuesday, March 3, 2009 8:34:29 PM GMT -06:00 US/Canada Central
        Subject: RE: [SACC-L] footprints

        They are assuming that the "long toes" on the Laetoli footprints make
        them not human-like. The toes aren't that long. The Laetoli prints are
        very human-like (just small).

        One human couldn't run much of anything to exhaustion. Several humans,
        chasing in turn, have been described as using this technique in a number
        of places. Actually, several experiments in Africa where an
        investigator sneaked up on a zebra or wildebeest and grabbed it by the
        tail indicated that a sneaky hominid could probably have speared a large
        mammal fairly frequently.

        From: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com<mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com<mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf
        Of Bob Muckle
        Sent: Tuesday, March 03, 2009 6:53 PM
        To: SACC-L@yahoogroups.com<mailto:SACC-L%40yahoogroups.com>
        Subject: [SACC-L] footprints

        Last week there was news of some 1.5 million year old 'H. erectus' or
        'H. ergaste'r footprints being discovered in Kenya. The original story
        apparently is in 'Science' but I haven't seen that yet. It hasn't
        arrived at my college and we don't get on-line access.

        I have a few questions. First, the article I read in the popular press
        says these are the oldest humanlike footprints. Did I miss something?
        What about the Australopithecus prints at Laetoli?

        Second, the article suggests that bipedalism may have been used to 'run
        the animals in the heat', effectively causing them to collapse from
        exhaustion. It doesn't say, but I'm assuming the thinking is that since
        bipedalism allows greater endurance, that humans could outlast their
        prey in the heat. I've never heard this thinking before. Does anyone
        know of any ethnographies that describe this kind of hunting....running
        animals in the heat?

        If there isn't any ethnographic comparables, how could you test the
        hypothesis that they were running the anmals to exhaustion?

        Bob

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





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