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Fw: Another crop circle problem

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  • D Dresser
    Hi, I have an RL 1000 (and previously an 850) on which I customarily have done the service for a number of years. But here is a problem that I have not solved
    Message 1 of 8 , Jun 29, 2013
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      Hi,

      I have an RL 1000 (and previously an 850) on which I customarily have done the service for a number of years. But here is a problem that I have not solved --

      While using the mower last week, it stopped after less than an hour and began turning small circles, with wheels rotating in opposite directions, while continuing to mow. Several times since, I have tried to run the mower which resulted in the same behavior. I did get it to follow a wire in Edge mode once, but it ran very slowly and looked like it wanted to stop edging and return to making circles, sort of like a puppy straining on its leash. Most times, when set on Edge, it simply protests that it is too close to the perimeter wire.

      The mower works fine in manual mode.

      What I have tried so far: (1) blowing out the interior; (2) looking for loose wires and obviously failed electronic parts. No success.

      Any suggestions?

      Thanks,
      Don


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Danny Miller
      Recalibration the Direction Finder. Service- 12321- something about direction finder Do it on a smooth, level surface. It will begin a sequence which takes
      Message 2 of 8 , Jun 29, 2013
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        Recalibration the Direction Finder.

        Service->12321->something about "direction finder"

        Do it on a smooth, level surface. It will begin a sequence which takes
        over control of the motors and turns itself around a few times on its own,

        Danny

        On 6/29/2013 9:38 AM, D Dresser wrote:
        >
        > Hi,
        >
        > I have an RL 1000 (and previously an 850) on which I customarily have done the service for a number of years. But here is a problem that I have not solved --
        >
        > While using the mower last week, it stopped after less than an hour and began turning small circles, with wheels rotating in opposite directions, while continuing to mow. Several times since, I have tried to run the mower which resulted in the same behavior. I did get it to follow a wire in Edge mode once, but it ran very slowly and looked like it wanted to stop edging and return to making circles, sort of like a puppy straining on its leash. Most times, when set on Edge, it simply protests that it is too close to the perimeter wire.
        >
        > The mower works fine in manual mode.
        >
        > What I have tried so far: (1) blowing out the interior; (2) looking for loose wires and obviously failed electronic parts. No success.
        >
        > Any suggestions?
        >
        > Thanks,
        > Don
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------
        >
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
      • D Dresser
        Thank you. On the RL 1000, it is called the “DK Calibration”. Works fine. Looking further, I ran the various tests, which had all worked before. This
        Message 3 of 8 , Jun 29, 2013
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          Thank you. On the RL 1000, it is called the “DK Calibration”. Works fine.

          Looking further, I ran the various tests, which had all worked before. This time it failed the Drive Motor Test, sometimes with error code #144 and sometimes with #244. Sometimes it passed. My best guess is that I have a loose wire connection.

          If anyone thinks it might be something else, please advise.

          Thanks,
          Don


          From: Danny Miller
          Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 2:51 PM
          To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Fw: Another crop circle problem


          Recalibration the Direction Finder.

          Service->12321->something about "direction finder"

          Do it on a smooth, level surface. It will begin a sequence which takes
          over control of the motors and turns itself around a few times on its own,

          Danny

          On 6/29/2013 9:38 AM, D Dresser wrote:
          >
          > Hi,
          >
          > I have an RL 1000 (and previously an 850) on which I customarily have done the service for a number of years. But here is a problem that I have not solved --
          >
          > While using the mower last week, it stopped after less than an hour and began turning small circles, with wheels rotating in opposite directions, while continuing to mow. Several times since, I have tried to run the mower which resulted in the same behavior. I did get it to follow a wire in Edge mode once, but it ran very slowly and looked like it wanted to stop edging and return to making circles, sort of like a puppy straining on its leash. Most times, when set on Edge, it simply protests that it is too close to the perimeter wire.
          >
          > The mower works fine in manual mode.
          >
          > What I have tried so far: (1) blowing out the interior; (2) looking for loose wires and obviously failed electronic parts. No success.
          >
          > Any suggestions?
          >
          > Thanks,
          > Don
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • D Dresser
          Well, I still need help. There were no loose wires to the drive motors, as far as I could tell. Besides, the fact that I can drive and turn the RL 1000
          Message 4 of 8 , Jun 29, 2013
          • 0 Attachment
            Well, I still need help. There were no loose wires to the drive motors, as far as I could tell. Besides, the fact that I can drive and turn the RL 1000 manually suggests that it is not quite so simple.

            Does anyone know what exactly the Drive Motor Test is measuring, or what the Advanced information associated with that test – the MSR and PWM numbers -- mean?

            Thanks,
            Don

            From: D Dresser
            Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 5:28 PM
            To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Fw: Another crop circle problem


            Thank you. On the RL 1000, it is called the “DK Calibration”. Works fine.

            Looking further, I ran the various tests, which had all worked before. This time it failed the Drive Motor Test, sometimes with error code #144 and sometimes with #244. Sometimes it passed. My best guess is that I have a loose wire connection.

            If anyone thinks it might be something else, please advise.

            Thanks,
            Don

            From: Danny Miller
            Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 2:51 PM
            To: mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Fw: Another crop circle problem

            Recalibration the Direction Finder.

            Service->12321->something about "direction finder"

            Do it on a smooth, level surface. It will begin a sequence which takes
            over control of the motors and turns itself around a few times on its own,

            Danny

            On 6/29/2013 9:38 AM, D Dresser wrote:
            >
            > Hi,
            >
            > I have an RL 1000 (and previously an 850) on which I customarily have done the service for a number of years. But here is a problem that I have not solved --
            >
            > While using the mower last week, it stopped after less than an hour and began turning small circles, with wheels rotating in opposite directions, while continuing to mow. Several times since, I have tried to run the mower which resulted in the same behavior. I did get it to follow a wire in Edge mode once, but it ran very slowly and looked like it wanted to stop edging and return to making circles, sort of like a puppy straining on its leash. Most times, when set on Edge, it simply protests that it is too close to the perimeter wire.
            >
            > The mower works fine in manual mode.
            >
            > What I have tried so far: (1) blowing out the interior; (2) looking for loose wires and obviously failed electronic parts. No success.
            >
            > Any suggestions?
            >
            > Thanks,
            > Don
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • rann_georgia
            I was going to suggest that you take a brick or something to raise the raise the wheels and rest them above the ground and then turn the drive wheels. This
            Message 5 of 8 , Jun 30, 2013
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              I was going to suggest that you take a brick or something to raise the raise the wheels and rest them above the ground and then turn the drive wheels. This would measure resistance on each motor, if one is harder to turn than the other, you have narrowed the problems. Or, if in turning one or both motors suddenly it spins almost without effort, you've discovered that dreaded pinon gear problem that I and many other people have experienced.

              During orientation of my unit, it would rotate in circles, pause, rotate a bit more and then pause again, repeat, etc.

              I am in agreement that it's unlikely a loose wire. Having taken these electric motors out, the ground (I assume it's the ground) is riveted to one motor. The other connections appears to be a good quality type of connector.

              One possibility that I can think of for it gives an error sometimes and not others is heat. Perhaps a motor is going bad and then overheats kicking in one of the safety devices of the unit or the motor when hot then begins to fail.



              --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com, "D Dresser" <ddresser@...> wrote:
              >
              > Well, I still need help. There were no loose wires to the drive motors, as far as I could tell. Besides, the fact that I can drive and turn the RL 1000 manually suggests that it is not quite so simple.
              >
              > Does anyone know what exactly the Drive Motor Test is measuring, or what the Advanced information associated with that test â€" the MSR and PWM numbers -- mean?
              >
              > Thanks,
              > Don
              >
              > From: D Dresser
              > Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 5:28 PM
              > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Fw: Another crop circle problem
              >
              >
              > Thank you. On the RL 1000, it is called the “DK Calibration”. Works fine.
              >
              > Looking further, I ran the various tests, which had all worked before. This time it failed the Drive Motor Test, sometimes with error code #144 and sometimes with #244. Sometimes it passed. My best guess is that I have a loose wire connection.
              >
              > If anyone thinks it might be something else, please advise.
              >
              > Thanks,
              > Don
              >
              > From: Danny Miller
              > Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 2:51 PM
              > To: mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Fw: Another crop circle problem
              >
              > Recalibration the Direction Finder.
              >
              > Service->12321->something about "direction finder"
              >
              > Do it on a smooth, level surface. It will begin a sequence which takes
              > over control of the motors and turns itself around a few times on its own,
              >
              > Danny
              >
              > On 6/29/2013 9:38 AM, D Dresser wrote:
              > >
              > > Hi,
              > >
              > > I have an RL 1000 (and previously an 850) on which I customarily have done the service for a number of years. But here is a problem that I have not solved --
              > >
              > > While using the mower last week, it stopped after less than an hour and began turning small circles, with wheels rotating in opposite directions, while continuing to mow. Several times since, I have tried to run the mower which resulted in the same behavior. I did get it to follow a wire in Edge mode once, but it ran very slowly and looked like it wanted to stop edging and return to making circles, sort of like a puppy straining on its leash. Most times, when set on Edge, it simply protests that it is too close to the perimeter wire.
              > >
              > > The mower works fine in manual mode.
              > >
              > > What I have tried so far: (1) blowing out the interior; (2) looking for loose wires and obviously failed electronic parts. No success.
              > >
              > > Any suggestions?
              > >
              > > Thanks,
              > > Don
              > >
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > ------------------------------------
              > >
              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • TinaP
              Hi Don, I have had the 144 error twice on my RL-1000. This first time it was due to a bad connection on the drive motor. The motor had overloaded and
              Message 6 of 8 , Jul 2, 2013
              • 0 Attachment
                Hi Don,
                I have had the 144 error twice on my RL-1000. This first time it was due to a bad connection on the drive motor. The motor had overloaded and evidently smoked the connection tab. The tab was covered in soot and was brittle and broke off the end of the mower when I tried to clean it. I soldered the wire directly to the motor and that fixed my problem the first time. I also covered the root that it got stuck on that I think caused this issue in the first place.
                I recently got this error message a couple of weeks ago and it had me stumped for a while. The motors all looked fine and it would work fine in manual mode. When I ran the tests the only error message I could get was 144 which pointed to a motor problem. My motor was working fine so I knew that was not the real issue. I opened up my other 1000 and started started swapping parts. It turns out it was the odometer board that was failing causing a motor error.
                Before I swapped the parts I disconnected the odometer board and ran the mover. With the odometer disconnected it would run about 4 or 5 passes in my yard and then it would start spinning around at a very high rate of speed. Perhaps someone here knows a way to test the odometer board. I am not sure if this is your problem, but if it is, it is an easy $40 fix.

                Good Luck and keep us posted,
                William
                --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com, "D Dresser" <ddresser@...> wrote:
                >
                > Thank you. On the RL 1000, it is called the “DK Calibration”. Works fine.
                >
                > Looking further, I ran the various tests, which had all worked before. This time it failed the Drive Motor Test, sometimes with error code #144 and sometimes with #244. Sometimes it passed. My best guess is that I have a loose wire connection.
                >
                > If anyone thinks it might be something else, please advise.
                >
                > Thanks,
                > Don
                >
                >
                > From: Danny Miller
                > Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 2:51 PM
                > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Fw: Another crop circle problem
                >
                >
                > Recalibration the Direction Finder.
                >
                > Service->12321->something about "direction finder"
                >
                > Do it on a smooth, level surface. It will begin a sequence which takes
                > over control of the motors and turns itself around a few times on its own,
                >
                > Danny
                >
                > On 6/29/2013 9:38 AM, D Dresser wrote:
                > >
                > > Hi,
                > >
                > > I have an RL 1000 (and previously an 850) on which I customarily have done the service for a number of years. But here is a problem that I have not solved --
                > >
                > > While using the mower last week, it stopped after less than an hour and began turning small circles, with wheels rotating in opposite directions, while continuing to mow. Several times since, I have tried to run the mower which resulted in the same behavior. I did get it to follow a wire in Edge mode once, but it ran very slowly and looked like it wanted to stop edging and return to making circles, sort of like a puppy straining on its leash. Most times, when set on Edge, it simply protests that it is too close to the perimeter wire.
                > >
                > > The mower works fine in manual mode.
                > >
                > > What I have tried so far: (1) blowing out the interior; (2) looking for loose wires and obviously failed electronic parts. No success.
                > >
                > > Any suggestions?
                > >
                > > Thanks,
                > > Don
                > >
                > >
                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > ------------------------------------
                > >
                > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
              • Charles Grenkow
                Like William I disconnected the wire connectors to the motors and both connectors were black and sooty from arcing. Worked fine in manual mode but not in
                Message 7 of 8 , Jul 2, 2013
                • 0 Attachment
                  Like William I disconnected the wire connectors to the motors and both connectors were black and sooty from arcing. Worked fine in manual mode but not in auto.
                  Cleaned them up with electric contact spray and fine sanded the spades. Put them back together, then crimped them to ensure a solid contact. Problem went away. Checked and cleaned with spray all other cpade connectors I could find in the machine. I like William's idea about checking the odometer board also - never heard that one before.



                  Cheers,

                  Chuck



                  To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                  From: tinapropes@...
                  Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 12:53:50 +0000
                  Subject: [RoboMower] Re: Fw: Another crop circle problem






                  Hi Don,
                  I have had the 144 error twice on my RL-1000. This first time it was due to a bad connection on the drive motor. The motor had overloaded and evidently smoked the connection tab. The tab was covered in soot and was brittle and broke off the end of the mower when I tried to clean it. I soldered the wire directly to the motor and that fixed my problem the first time. I also covered the root that it got stuck on that I think caused this issue in the first place.
                  I recently got this error message a couple of weeks ago and it had me stumped for a while. The motors all looked fine and it would work fine in manual mode. When I ran the tests the only error message I could get was 144 which pointed to a motor problem. My motor was working fine so I knew that was not the real issue. I opened up my other 1000 and started started swapping parts. It turns out it was the odometer board that was failing causing a motor error.
                  Before I swapped the parts I disconnected the odometer board and ran the mover. With the odometer disconnected it would run about 4 or 5 passes in my yard and then it would start spinning around at a very high rate of speed. Perhaps someone here knows a way to test the odometer board. I am not sure if this is your problem, but if it is, it is an easy $40 fix.

                  Good Luck and keep us posted,
                  William
                  --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com, "D Dresser" <ddresser@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Thank you. On the RL 1000, it is called the ���DK Calibration���. Works fine.
                  >
                  > Looking further, I ran the various tests, which had all worked before. This time it failed the Drive Motor Test, sometimes with error code #144 and sometimes with #244. Sometimes it passed. My best guess is that I have a loose wire connection.
                  >
                  > If anyone thinks it might be something else, please advise.
                  >
                  > Thanks,
                  > Don
                  >
                  >
                  > From: Danny Miller
                  > Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 2:51 PM
                  > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Fw: Another crop circle problem
                  >
                  >
                  > Recalibration the Direction Finder.
                  >
                  > Service->12321->something about "direction finder"
                  >
                  > Do it on a smooth, level surface. It will begin a sequence which takes
                  > over control of the motors and turns itself around a few times on its own,
                  >
                  > Danny
                  >
                  > On 6/29/2013 9:38 AM, D Dresser wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Hi,
                  > >
                  > > I have an RL 1000 (and previously an 850) on which I customarily have done the service for a number of years. But here is a problem that I have not solved --
                  > >
                  > > While using the mower last week, it stopped after less than an hour and began turning small circles, with wheels rotating in opposite directions, while continuing to mow. Several times since, I have tried to run the mower which resulted in the same behavior. I did get it to follow a wire in Edge mode once, but it ran very slowly and looked like it wanted to stop edging and return to making circles, sort of like a puppy straining on its leash. Most times, when set on Edge, it simply protests that it is too close to the perimeter wire.
                  > >
                  > > The mower works fine in manual mode.
                  > >
                  > > What I have tried so far: (1) blowing out the interior; (2) looking for loose wires and obviously failed electronic parts. No success.
                  > >
                  > > Any suggestions?
                  > >
                  > > Thanks,
                  > > Don
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ------------------------------------
                  > >
                  > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >







                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Danny Miller
                  Crimping them is a bad idea. They make contact because of their spring shape, crushing the shape makes reliably contact unlikely. I would replace the
                  Message 8 of 8 , Jul 2, 2013
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Crimping them is a bad idea. They make contact because of their spring
                    shape, crushing the shape makes reliably contact unlikely.

                    I would replace the connectors with new ones. They're called "Faston"
                    and probably have them at Radio Shack or auto parts stores, but you need
                    to get one that matches both the tab size (there's only 2 common sizes
                    and they look pretty different) AND the wire gauge.

                    Soldering directly to the tabs would be more reliable, but those tabs
                    are set in nylon to space them off the metal housing. Soldering the tabs
                    makes the nylon melt, so you'd have to be skilled to do this safely.

                    The odometers are NOT prone to failure. However, IIRC there was a
                    problem with the odometer plugs into the board. I heard that from one
                    of the service guys, and I heard in later models the odometers are
                    soldered directly to the board. As a experienced board designer, I
                    don't see how this can be the case- it's a low-current terminal and the
                    same sort of plug used on the bumper sensors etc. No logical reason for
                    unique problems here. I think an incompetent tech had another problem
                    and mistakenly blamed the plug.

                    Danny

                    On 7/2/2013 12:41 PM, Charles Grenkow wrote:
                    > Like William I disconnected the wire connectors to the motors and both connectors were black and sooty from arcing. Worked fine in manual mode but not in auto.
                    > Cleaned them up with electric contact spray and fine sanded the spades. Put them back together, then crimped them to ensure a solid contact. Problem went away. Checked and cleaned with spray all other cpade connectors I could find in the machine. I like William's idea about checking the odometer board also - never heard that one before.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Cheers,
                    >
                    > Chuck
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                    > From: tinapropes@...
                    > Date: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 12:53:50 +0000
                    > Subject: [RoboMower] Re: Fw: Another crop circle problem
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Hi Don,
                    > I have had the 144 error twice on my RL-1000. This first time it was due to a bad connection on the drive motor. The motor had overloaded and evidently smoked the connection tab. The tab was covered in soot and was brittle and broke off the end of the mower when I tried to clean it. I soldered the wire directly to the motor and that fixed my problem the first time. I also covered the root that it got stuck on that I think caused this issue in the first place.
                    > I recently got this error message a couple of weeks ago and it had me stumped for a while. The motors all looked fine and it would work fine in manual mode. When I ran the tests the only error message I could get was 144 which pointed to a motor problem. My motor was working fine so I knew that was not the real issue. I opened up my other 1000 and started started swapping parts. It turns out it was the odometer board that was failing causing a motor error.
                    > Before I swapped the parts I disconnected the odometer board and ran the mover. With the odometer disconnected it would run about 4 or 5 passes in my yard and then it would start spinning around at a very high rate of speed. Perhaps someone here knows a way to test the odometer board. I am not sure if this is your problem, but if it is, it is an easy $40 fix.
                    >
                    > Good Luck and keep us posted,
                    > William
                    > --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com, "D Dresser" <ddresser@...> wrote:
                    >> Thank you. On the RL 1000, it is called the “DK Calibration”. Works fine.
                    >>
                    >> Looking further, I ran the various tests, which had all worked before. This time it failed the Drive Motor Test, sometimes with error code #144 and sometimes with #244. Sometimes it passed. My best guess is that I have a loose wire connection.
                    >>
                    >> If anyone thinks it might be something else, please advise.
                    >>
                    >> Thanks,
                    >> Don
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> From: Danny Miller
                    >> Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2013 2:51 PM
                    >> To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                    >> Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Fw: Another crop circle problem
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> Recalibration the Direction Finder.
                    >>
                    >> Service->12321->something about "direction finder"
                    >>
                    >> Do it on a smooth, level surface. It will begin a sequence which takes
                    >> over control of the motors and turns itself around a few times on its own,
                    >>
                    >> Danny
                    >>
                    >> On 6/29/2013 9:38 AM, D Dresser wrote:
                    >>> Hi,
                    >>>
                    >>> I have an RL 1000 (and previously an 850) on which I customarily have done the service for a number of years. But here is a problem that I have not solved --
                    >>>
                    >>> While using the mower last week, it stopped after less than an hour and began turning small circles, with wheels rotating in opposite directions, while continuing to mow. Several times since, I have tried to run the mower which resulted in the same behavior. I did get it to follow a wire in Edge mode once, but it ran very slowly and looked like it wanted to stop edging and return to making circles, sort of like a puppy straining on its leash. Most times, when set on Edge, it simply protests that it is too close to the perimeter wire.
                    >>>
                    >>> The mower works fine in manual mode.
                    >>>
                    >>> What I have tried so far: (1) blowing out the interior; (2) looking for loose wires and obviously failed electronic parts. No success.
                    >>>
                    >>> Any suggestions?
                    >>>
                    >>> Thanks,
                    >>> Don
                    >>>
                    >>>
                    >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >>>
                    >>>
                    >>>
                    >>> ------------------------------------
                    >>>
                    >>> Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >>>
                    >>>
                    >>>
                    >>>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >>
                    >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >>
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------------------------------
                    >
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
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