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Re: [RoboMower] Motor Drive Problem

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  • Douglas B. George
    ... Okay... what diagnostic tests can be run, and how do you do it? Doug
    Message 1 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
    • 0 Attachment
      On 2010-09-20 11:08 AM, Dirt Nap wrote:
      > The mover that was killed with the reverse polarity can be fixed by
      > replacing the main board. The mower with the drive issue I would do
      > diagnostic testing on it before trying to narrow it down

      Okay... what diagnostic tests can be run, and how do you do it?

      Doug
    • Danny Miller
      Mine had long been doing the drunken mower routine where it veers off to one side, then turns back and veers the other way, instead of a clean straight line.
      Message 2 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
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        Mine had long been doing the "drunken mower" routine where it veers
        off to one side, then turns back and veers the other way, instead of a
        clean straight line.
        It didn't have a problem being manually driven straight.

        I went into the Service menu and had it recalibrate the Direction
        Keeper. I hadn't done that since the initial setup- and now it goes
        straight!

        Danny

        On 9/20/2010 1:37 PM, Douglas B. George wrote:
        > On 2010-09-20 11:08 AM, Dirt Nap wrote:
        >> The mover that was killed with the reverse polarity can be fixed by
        >> replacing the main board. The mower with the drive issue I would do
        >> diagnostic testing on it before trying to narrow it down
        > Okay... what diagnostic tests can be run, and how do you do it?
        >
        > Doug
        >
        >
      • Doug
        I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector. It s wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
        Message 3 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
        • 0 Attachment
          I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector. It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117) when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into the XLR receptacle.

          So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both batteries in the pack individually.

          --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com, "leecee01" <leecee01@...> wrote:
          >
          > I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again. What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and I need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several years ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than the batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
          > Carollee
          >
        • jeff
          What is th ebutton sequence to recalibrate it? Mine drives drunk sometimes too! ________________________________ From: Danny Miller
          Message 4 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
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            What is th ebutton sequence to recalibrate it? Mine drives "drunk" sometimes
            too!




            ________________________________
            From: Danny Miller <dannym@...>
            To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
            Cc: Douglas B. George <dg@...>
            Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 12:21:40 PM
            Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Motor Drive Problem

             
            Mine had long been doing the "drunken mower" routine where it veers
            off to one side, then turns back and veers the other way, instead of a
            clean straight line.
            It didn't have a problem being manually driven straight.

            I went into the Service menu and had it recalibrate the Direction
            Keeper. I hadn't done that since the initial setup- and now it goes
            straight!

            Danny

            On 9/20/2010 1:37 PM, Douglas B. George wrote:
            > On 2010-09-20 11:08 AM, Dirt Nap wrote:
            >> The mover that was killed with the reverse polarity can be fixed by
            >> replacing the main board. The mower with the drive issue I would do
            >> diagnostic testing on it before trying to narrow it down
            > Okay... what diagnostic tests can be run, and how do you do it?
            >
            > Doug
            >
            >







            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • jeff
            I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must charge each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?
            Message 5 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
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              I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must charge
              each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?




              ________________________________
              From: Doug <Doug@...>
              To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 1:31:33 PM
              Subject: [RoboMower] Re: external charger

               
              I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector.
              It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
              BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117)
              when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into the
              XLR receptacle.

              So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both batteries
              in the pack individually.

              --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com, "leecee01" <leecee01@...> wrote:
              >
              > I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again.
              >What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and I
              >need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several years
              >ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than the
              >batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
              > Carollee
              >







              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Danny Miller
              Service- 12321- DK Calibration, IIRC. Make sure you have the mower on a level, highly tractionable surface like concrete or a deck. Note that a driveway is
              Message 6 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
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                Service-> 12321->DK Calibration, IIRC.

                Make sure you have the mower on a level, highly tractionable surface
                like concrete or a deck. Note that a driveway is always sloped to drain
                water so you might want to look for something flatter, sidewalks are
                often flatter.

                Danny

                On 9/20/2010 3:48 PM, jeff wrote:
                > What is th ebutton sequence to recalibrate it? Mine drives "drunk" sometimes
                > too!
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ________________________________
                > From: Danny Miller<dannym@...>
                > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                > Cc: Douglas B. George<dg@...>
                > Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 12:21:40 PM
                > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Motor Drive Problem
                >
                >
                > Mine had long been doing the "drunken mower" routine where it veers
                > off to one side, then turns back and veers the other way, instead of a
                > clean straight line.
                > It didn't have a problem being manually driven straight.
                >
                > I went into the Service menu and had it recalibrate the Direction
                > Keeper. I hadn't done that since the initial setup- and now it goes
                > straight!
                >
                > Danny
                >
                > On 9/20/2010 1:37 PM, Douglas B. George wrote:
                >> On 2010-09-20 11:08 AM, Dirt Nap wrote:
                >>> The mover that was killed with the reverse polarity can be fixed by
                >>> replacing the main board. The mower with the drive issue I would do
                >>> diagnostic testing on it before trying to narrow it down
                >> Okay... what diagnostic tests can be run, and how do you do it?
                >>
                >> Doug
                >>
                >>
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >
              • Dan Barclay
                You don’t have to charge them separately if you get a battery minder that is for 24v systems. I bought one for my airplane… I’ve never used it on my
                Message 7 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
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                  You don’t have to charge them separately if you get a battery minder that is for 24v systems.



                  I bought one for my airplane… I’ve never used it on my airplane, I always have it hooked up to my extra mower batteries <g>.



                  The 24v minders are a bit more expensive, but not as flexible as splitting to allow you to use 12v minders. With the 12v you can always use it on your car if you want. In addition, if you get a 24v you might want to get the non-aviation model. The aviation model is tweaked a little for aviation usage… more to increase battery life than charge. The final charge level is slightly lower than other chargers I think.



                  Dan



                  From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of jeff
                  Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 3:52 PM
                  To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger





                  I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must charge
                  each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?

                  ________________________________
                  From: Doug <Doug@... <mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> >
                  To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                  Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 1:31:33 PM
                  Subject: [RoboMower] Re: external charger


                  I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector.
                  It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
                  BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117)
                  when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into the
                  XLR receptacle.

                  So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both batteries
                  in the pack individually.

                  --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> , "leecee01" <leecee01@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again.
                  >What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and I
                  >need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several years
                  >ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than the
                  >batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
                  > Carollee
                  >

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Danny Miller
                  But this does not provide the superior balancing of two 12v chargers (with a modified 3-wire pack). The difference is that with two batteries in series, the
                  Message 8 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
                  • 0 Attachment
                    But this does not provide the superior balancing of two 12v chargers
                    (with a modified 3-wire pack).

                    The difference is that with two batteries in series, the charger might
                    be designed to shut off at 13.8v/batt, but it's added up. They might be
                    14v and 13.6v and the 24v charger wouldn't know the difference between
                    that and an even 13.8v and 13.8v.

                    Danny

                    On 9/20/2010 4:16 PM, Dan Barclay wrote:
                    > You don’t have to charge them separately if you get a battery minder that is for 24v systems.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > I bought one for my airplane… I’ve never used it on my airplane, I always have it hooked up to my extra mower batteries<g>.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > The 24v minders are a bit more expensive, but not as flexible as splitting to allow you to use 12v minders. With the 12v you can always use it on your car if you want. In addition, if you get a 24v you might want to get the non-aviation model. The aviation model is tweaked a little for aviation usage… more to increase battery life than charge. The final charge level is slightly lower than other chargers I think.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Dan
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of jeff
                    > Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 3:52 PM
                    > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must charge
                    > each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?
                    >
                    > ________________________________
                    > From: Doug<Doug@...<mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> >
                    > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                    > Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 1:31:33 PM
                    > Subject: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                    >
                    >
                    > I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector.
                    > It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
                    > BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117)
                    > when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into the
                    > XLR receptacle.
                    >
                    > So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both batteries
                    > in the pack individually.
                    >
                    > --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> , "leecee01"<leecee01@...> wrote:
                    >> I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again.
                    >> What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and I
                    >> need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several years
                    >> ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than the
                    >> batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
                    >> Carollee
                    >>
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------------------------------
                    >
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                  • jeff
                    I know they are balance and not to be grinded but how about a file to just clean and put an edge back on? Lots of grass gunk and only 1 year old
                    Message 9 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
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                      I know they are balance and not to be grinded but how about a file to just clean
                      and put an edge back on? Lots of grass gunk and only 1 year old




                      ________________________________
                      From: Danny Miller <dannym@...>
                      To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                      Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 2:30:18 PM
                      Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger

                       
                      But this does not provide the superior balancing of two 12v chargers
                      (with a modified 3-wire pack).

                      The difference is that with two batteries in series, the charger might
                      be designed to shut off at 13.8v/batt, but it's added up. They might be
                      14v and 13.6v and the 24v charger wouldn't know the difference between
                      that and an even 13.8v and 13.8v.

                      Danny

                      On 9/20/2010 4:16 PM, Dan Barclay wrote:
                      > You don’t have to charge them separately if you get a battery minder that is
                      >for 24v systems.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > I bought one for my airplane… I’ve never used it on my airplane, I always have
                      >it hooked up to my extra mower batteries<g>.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > The 24v minders are a bit more expensive, but not as flexible as splitting to
                      >allow you to use 12v minders. With the 12v you can always use it on your car if
                      >you want. In addition, if you get a 24v you might want to get the non-aviation
                      >model. The aviation model is tweaked a little for aviation usage… more to
                      >increase battery life than charge. The final charge level is slightly lower than
                      >other chargers I think.
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > Dan
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                      >jeff
                      > Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 3:52 PM
                      > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                      > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must
                      charge
                      > each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?
                      >
                      > ________________________________
                      > From: Doug<Doug@...<mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> >
                      > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                      > Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 1:31:33 PM
                      > Subject: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                      >
                      >
                      > I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector.
                      > It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
                      > BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117)
                      > when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into
                      the
                      > XLR receptacle.
                      >
                      > So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both
                      >batteries
                      > in the pack individually.
                      >
                      > --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ,
                      >"leecee01"<leecee01@...> wrote:
                      >> I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again.
                      >> What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and
                      >I
                      >> need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several
                      >years
                      >> ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than
                      >the
                      >> batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
                      >> Carollee
                      >>
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > ------------------------------------
                      >
                      > Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >







                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Richard Gard
                      I clean out the blade wells, clean the blades, and use a file to put a little edge and remove any knicks at least every 2 or 3 weeks.  It is not a perfect
                      Message 10 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
                      • 0 Attachment
                        I clean out the blade wells, clean the blades, and use a file to put a little edge and remove any knicks at least every 2 or 3 weeks.  It is not a perfect job, maybe 85%.  It makes a big difference to my lawn, especially if I am getting brown edge on the cut because the blades are pulling more than cutting.
                         
                        ~R in Connecticut


                        --- On Mon, 9/20/10, jeff <rainycityguy@...> wrote:


                        From: jeff <rainycityguy@...>
                        Subject: [RoboMower] interim blade cleanup and sharper
                        To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                        Date: Monday, September 20, 2010, 5:42 PM


                         



                        I know they are balance and not to be grinded but how about a file to just clean
                        and put an edge back on? Lots of grass gunk and only 1 year old

                        ________________________________
                        From: Danny Miller <dannym@...>
                        To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 2:30:18 PM
                        Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger

                         
                        But this does not provide the superior balancing of two 12v chargers
                        (with a modified 3-wire pack).

                        The difference is that with two batteries in series, the charger might
                        be designed to shut off at 13.8v/batt, but it's added up. They might be
                        14v and 13.6v and the 24v charger wouldn't know the difference between
                        that and an even 13.8v and 13.8v.

                        Danny

                        On 9/20/2010 4:16 PM, Dan Barclay wrote:
                        > You don’t have to charge them separately if you get a battery minder that is
                        >for 24v systems.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > I bought one for my airplane… I’ve never used it on my airplane, I always have
                        >it hooked up to my extra mower batteries<g>.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > The 24v minders are a bit more expensive, but not as flexible as splitting to
                        >allow you to use 12v minders. With the 12v you can always use it on your car if
                        >you want. In addition, if you get a 24v you might want to get the non-aviation
                        >model. The aviation model is tweaked a little for aviation usage… more to
                        >increase battery life than charge. The final charge level is slightly lower than
                        >other chargers I think.
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Dan
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                        >jeff
                        > Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 3:52 PM
                        > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                        > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must
                        charge
                        > each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?
                        >
                        > ________________________________
                        > From: Doug<Doug@...<mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> >
                        > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                        > Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 1:31:33 PM
                        > Subject: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                        >
                        >
                        > I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector.
                        > It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
                        > BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117)
                        > when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into
                        the
                        > XLR receptacle.
                        >
                        > So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both
                        >batteries
                        > in the pack individually.
                        >
                        > --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ,
                        >"leecee01"<leecee01@...> wrote:
                        >> I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again.
                        >> What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and
                        >I
                        >> need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several
                        >years
                        >> ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than
                        >the
                        >> batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
                        >> Carollee
                        >>
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------------------------------
                        >
                        > Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >

                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]











                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Robert Silva
                        I have my blades sharpened professionally every year and do touch-ups periodically with a hand sharpener gizmo. -Bob ... [Non-text portions of this message
                        Message 11 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
                        • 0 Attachment
                          I have my blades sharpened professionally every year and do touch-ups periodically with a hand sharpener gizmo.

                          -Bob

                          On Sep 20, 2010, at 5:42 PM, jeff <rainycityguy@...> wrote:

                          > I know they are balance and not to be grinded but how about a file to just clean
                          > and put an edge back on? Lots of grass gunk and only 1 year old
                          >
                          > ________________________________
                          > From: Danny Miller <dannym@...>
                          > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                          > Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 2:30:18 PM
                          > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                          >
                          >
                          > But this does not provide the superior balancing of two 12v chargers
                          > (with a modified 3-wire pack).
                          >
                          > The difference is that with two batteries in series, the charger might
                          > be designed to shut off at 13.8v/batt, but it's added up. They might be
                          > 14v and 13.6v and the 24v charger wouldn't know the difference between
                          > that and an even 13.8v and 13.8v.
                          >
                          > Danny
                          >
                          > On 9/20/2010 4:16 PM, Dan Barclay wrote:
                          > > You don’t have to charge them separately if you get a battery minder that is
                          > >for 24v systems.
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > I bought one for my airplane… I’ve never used it on my airplane, I always have
                          > >it hooked up to my extra mower batteries<g>.
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > The 24v minders are a bit more expensive, but not as flexible as splitting to
                          > >allow you to use 12v minders. With the 12v you can always use it on your car if
                          > >you want. In addition, if you get a 24v you might want to get the non-aviation
                          > >model. The aviation model is tweaked a little for aviation usage… more to
                          > >increase battery life than charge. The final charge level is slightly lower than
                          > >other chargers I think.
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > Dan
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                          > >jeff
                          > > Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 3:52 PM
                          > > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                          > > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must
                          > charge
                          > > each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?
                          > >
                          > > ________________________________
                          > > From: Doug<Doug@...<mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> >
                          > > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                          > > Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 1:31:33 PM
                          > > Subject: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector.
                          > > It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
                          > > BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117)
                          > > when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into
                          > the
                          > > XLR receptacle.
                          > >
                          > > So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both
                          > >batteries
                          > > in the pack individually.
                          > >
                          > > --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ,
                          > >"leecee01"<leecee01@...> wrote:
                          > >> I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again.
                          > >> What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and
                          > >I
                          > >> need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several
                          > >years
                          > >> ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than
                          > >the
                          > >> batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
                          > >> Carollee
                          > >>
                          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > ------------------------------------
                          > >
                          > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          > >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          >


                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Dan Barclay
                          As long as they are “sister batteries” (all batts used in battery packs should stay together from birth to death) it shouldn’t matter much. It’s like
                          Message 12 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
                          • 0 Attachment
                            As long as they are “sister batteries” (all batts used in battery packs should stay together from birth to death) it shouldn’t matter much.



                            It’s like looking for 12 - 2volt chargers. That is… it’s better but not enough better to matter a lot in the long run.



                            For folks who swap batteries between packs, yea it can matter.



                            Dan



                            From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny Miller
                            Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 4:30 PM
                            To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                            Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger





                            But this does not provide the superior balancing of two 12v chargers
                            (with a modified 3-wire pack).

                            The difference is that with two batteries in series, the charger might
                            be designed to shut off at 13.8v/batt, but it's added up. They might be
                            14v and 13.6v and the 24v charger wouldn't know the difference between
                            that and an even 13.8v and 13.8v.

                            Danny

                            On 9/20/2010 4:16 PM, Dan Barclay wrote:
                            > You don’t have to charge them separately if you get a battery minder that is for 24v systems.
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > I bought one for my airplane… I’ve never used it on my airplane, I always have it hooked up to my extra mower batteries<g>.
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > The 24v minders are a bit more expensive, but not as flexible as splitting to allow you to use 12v minders. With the 12v you can always use it on your car if you want. In addition, if you get a 24v you might want to get the non-aviation model. The aviation model is tweaked a little for aviation usage… more to increase battery life than charge. The final charge level is slightly lower than other chargers I think.
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > Dan
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of jeff
                            > Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 3:52 PM
                            > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                            > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must charge
                            > each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?
                            >
                            > ________________________________
                            > From: Doug<Doug@... <mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> <mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> >
                            > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                            > Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 1:31:33 PM
                            > Subject: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                            >
                            >
                            > I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector.
                            > It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
                            > BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117)
                            > when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into the
                            > XLR receptacle.
                            >
                            > So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both batteries
                            > in the pack individually.
                            >
                            > --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> , "leecee01"<leecee01@...> wrote:
                            >> I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again.
                            >> What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and I
                            >> need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several years
                            >> ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than the
                            >> batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
                            >> Carollee
                            >>
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > ------------------------------------
                            >
                            > Yahoo! Groups Links
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >





                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Danny Miller
                            We re talking about batteries. You re talking about blades. The prohibition against blade sharpening had long since been busted. It s actually a great idea to
                            Message 13 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
                            • 0 Attachment
                              We're talking about batteries. You're talking about blades.

                              The prohibition against blade sharpening had long since been busted.
                              It's actually a great idea to use a knife sharpener on the blades
                              regularly. If you are skilled with a file or grinding stone, by all
                              means use those, just don't try to change the bevel angle to something
                              thinner than it was designed as.

                              Danny

                              On 9/20/2010 4:42 PM, jeff wrote:
                              > I know they are balance and not to be grinded but how about a file to just clean
                              > and put an edge back on? Lots of grass gunk and only 1 year old
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > ________________________________
                              > From: Danny Miller<dannym@...>
                              > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                              > Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 2:30:18 PM
                              > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                              >
                              >
                              > But this does not provide the superior balancing of two 12v chargers
                              > (with a modified 3-wire pack).
                              >
                              > The difference is that with two batteries in series, the charger might
                              > be designed to shut off at 13.8v/batt, but it's added up. They might be
                              > 14v and 13.6v and the 24v charger wouldn't know the difference between
                              > that and an even 13.8v and 13.8v.
                              >
                              > Danny
                              >
                              > On 9/20/2010 4:16 PM, Dan Barclay wrote:
                              >> You don’t have to charge them separately if you get a battery minder that is
                              >> for 24v systems.
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> I bought one for my airplane… I’ve never used it on my airplane, I always have
                              >> it hooked up to my extra mower batteries<g>.
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> The 24v minders are a bit more expensive, but not as flexible as splitting to
                              >> allow you to use 12v minders. With the 12v you can always use it on your car if
                              >> you want. In addition, if you get a 24v you might want to get the non-aviation
                              >> model. The aviation model is tweaked a little for aviation usage… more to
                              >> increase battery life than charge. The final charge level is slightly lower than
                              >> other chargers I think.
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> Dan
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                              >> jeff
                              >> Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 3:52 PM
                              >> To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                              >> Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must
                              > charge
                              >> each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?
                              >>
                              >> ________________________________
                              >> From: Doug<Doug@...<mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> >
                              >> To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                              >> Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 1:31:33 PM
                              >> Subject: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector.
                              >> It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
                              >> BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117)
                              >> when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into
                              > the
                              >> XLR receptacle.
                              >>
                              >> So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both
                              >> batteries
                              >> in the pack individually.
                              >>
                              >> --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ,
                              >> "leecee01"<leecee01@...> wrote:
                              >>> I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again.
                              >>> What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and
                              >> I
                              >>> need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several
                              >> years
                              >>> ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than
                              >> the
                              >>> batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
                              >>> Carollee
                              >>>
                              >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> ------------------------------------
                              >>
                              >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > ------------------------------------
                              >
                              > Yahoo! Groups Links
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                            • Danny Miller
                              Given the issues in lead-acid quality, the matching of sister batteries is not all that consistent. But yeah there s 6 cells in each battery anyways. Some
                              Message 14 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Given the issues in lead-acid quality, the matching of "sister
                                batteries" is not all that consistent.

                                But yeah there's 6 cells in each battery anyways. Some people got the
                                idea there's stacks of places inside running back-to-back, but no,
                                they're 6 isolated pockets inside the case with no physical connection
                                except the busbar. They don't share acid. There's no balancing inside
                                a pack.

                                Actually a charge balancer doesn't resolve all problems with mismatched
                                batteries, either. If you're running them all the way down, the weaker
                                batt can be driven to a much lower voltage than intended if the other
                                batt still has a strong voltage on it. A balancer won't address
                                discharge issues.

                                But, there is SOME value in two 12v chargers. It's not all that
                                absolute is all.

                                Danny

                                On 9/20/2010 5:07 PM, Dan Barclay wrote:
                                > As long as they are “sister batteries” (all batts used in battery packs should stay together from birth to death) it shouldn’t matter much.
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > It’s like looking for 12 - 2volt chargers. That is… it’s better but not enough better to matter a lot in the long run.
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > For folks who swap batteries between packs, yea it can matter.
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > Dan
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Danny Miller
                                > Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 4:30 PM
                                > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                                > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > But this does not provide the superior balancing of two 12v chargers
                                > (with a modified 3-wire pack).
                                >
                                > The difference is that with two batteries in series, the charger might
                                > be designed to shut off at 13.8v/batt, but it's added up. They might be
                                > 14v and 13.6v and the 24v charger wouldn't know the difference between
                                > that and an even 13.8v and 13.8v.
                                >
                                > Danny
                                >
                                > On 9/20/2010 4:16 PM, Dan Barclay wrote:
                                >> You don’t have to charge them separately if you get a battery minder that is for 24v systems.
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> I bought one for my airplane… I’ve never used it on my airplane, I always have it hooked up to my extra mower batteries<g>.
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> The 24v minders are a bit more expensive, but not as flexible as splitting to allow you to use 12v minders. With the 12v you can always use it on your car if you want. In addition, if you get a 24v you might want to get the non-aviation model. The aviation model is tweaked a little for aviation usage… more to increase battery life than charge. The final charge level is slightly lower than other chargers I think.
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> Dan
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ] On Behalf Of jeff
                                >> Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 3:52 PM
                                >> To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                                >> Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must charge
                                >> each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?
                                >>
                                >> ________________________________
                                >> From: Doug<Doug@...<mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> <mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> >
                                >> To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                                >> Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 1:31:33 PM
                                >> Subject: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector.
                                >> It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
                                >> BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117)
                                >> when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into the
                                >> XLR receptacle.
                                >>
                                >> So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both batteries
                                >> in the pack individually.
                                >>
                                >> --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> , "leecee01"<leecee01@...> wrote:
                                >>> I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again.
                                >>> What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and I
                                >>> need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several years
                                >>> ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than the
                                >>> batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
                                >>> Carollee
                                >>>
                                >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> ------------------------------------
                                >>
                                >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >>
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > ------------------------------------
                                >
                                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                              • Christopher Zach
                                ... On an unhappy pair I have seen 15.1 and 12.5.... But whatever works. The killer in that scenario is that on the next run the 12 volt battery gets dragged
                                Message 15 of 26 , Sep 20, 2010
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Danny Miller wrote:
                                  > But this does not provide the superior balancing of two 12v chargers
                                  > (with a modified 3-wire pack).
                                  >
                                  > The difference is that with two batteries in series, the charger might
                                  > be designed to shut off at 13.8v/batt, but it's added up. They might be
                                  > 14v and 13.6v and the 24v charger wouldn't know the difference between
                                  > that and an even 13.8v and 13.8v.

                                  On an unhappy pair I have seen 15.1 and 12.5....

                                  But whatever works. The killer in that scenario is that on the next run
                                  the 12 volt battery gets dragged down to 10 while the other is at 12.x.
                                  Still above 22 volts, so the mower keeps on rolling........

                                  I'm watching this with the Paktrakr. It's kind of fun. And on charge
                                  it's putting .4a into the pack at start of charge, I can check it anytime.

                                  Chris
                                • Rad
                                  If the blades are just dull from cutting grass, you should be able to sharpen them with the same (small) amount of metal to both sides. I ve done it
                                  Message 16 of 26 , Sep 29, 2010
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    If the blades are just dull from cutting grass, you should be able to sharpen them with the same (small) amount of metal to both sides. I've done it successfully more than once.

                                    If you need to remove a serious amount of metal to get a nick out you'll have to balance the blade after sharpening, which isn't impossible, but is fussier than with a standard rotary mower blade because of the angle of the blades.



                                    --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com, jeff <rainycityguy@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > I know they are balance and not to be grinded but how about a file to just clean
                                    > and put an edge back on? Lots of grass gunk and only 1 year old
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > ________________________________
                                    > From: Danny Miller <dannym@...>
                                    > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                                    > Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 2:30:18 PM
                                    > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                                    >
                                    >  
                                    > But this does not provide the superior balancing of two 12v chargers
                                    > (with a modified 3-wire pack).
                                    >
                                    > The difference is that with two batteries in series, the charger might
                                    > be designed to shut off at 13.8v/batt, but it's added up. They might be
                                    > 14v and 13.6v and the 24v charger wouldn't know the difference between
                                    > that and an even 13.8v and 13.8v.
                                    >
                                    > Danny
                                    >
                                    > On 9/20/2010 4:16 PM, Dan Barclay wrote:
                                    > > You don’t have to charge them separately if you get a battery minder that is
                                    > >for 24v systems.
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > I bought one for my airplane… I’ve never used it on my airplane, I always have
                                    > >it hooked up to my extra mower batteries<g>.
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > The 24v minders are a bit more expensive, but not as flexible as splitting to
                                    > >allow you to use 12v minders. With the 12v you can always use it on your car if
                                    > >you want. In addition, if you get a 24v you might want to get the non-aviation
                                    > >model. The aviation model is tweaked a little for aviation usage… more to
                                    > >increase battery life than charge. The final charge level is slightly lower than
                                    > >other chargers I think.
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > Dan
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                                    > >jeff
                                    > > Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 3:52 PM
                                    > > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                                    > > Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > I have a Battery minder. Is it true unless I do what oyu did that I must
                                    > charge
                                    > > each batter seperately and outside of the cradle?
                                    > >
                                    > > ________________________________
                                    > > From: Doug<Doug@...<mailto:Doug%40SmithsRus.com> >
                                    > > To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com>
                                    > > Sent: Mon, September 20, 2010 1:31:33 PM
                                    > > Subject: [RoboMower] Re: external charger
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > I cut a hole in the top of all my battery packs and mounted an XLR connector.
                                    > > It's wired to access both batteries separately. Then I picked up two
                                    > > BatteryMINDer Charger/Maintainer/Desulphators (1.3 Amp, 12 Volt, Model# 12117)
                                    > > when they were on sale at Northern Tool. I wired them together to plug into
                                    > the
                                    > > XLR receptacle.
                                    > >
                                    > > So now I have a fast external charger with conditioning that does both
                                    > >batteries
                                    > > in the pack individually.
                                    > >
                                    > > --- In RoboMower@yahoogroups.com<mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ,
                                    > >"leecee01"<leecee01@> wrote:
                                    > >> I posted this message several days ago but don't see it, so here goes again.
                                    > >> What is your opinion on the cost of the external chargers. Mine just died and
                                    > >I
                                    > >> need a new one but the cost has gone from under a hundred dollars several
                                    > >years
                                    > >> ago to about $170 today. Can't understand why so expensive. (Cost more than
                                    > >the
                                    > >> batteries) Anyone know where to get one cheaper.
                                    > >> Carollee
                                    > >>
                                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > ------------------------------------
                                    > >
                                    > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    >
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