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liquid aeration

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  • Clint D
    I didn t treat my lawn with the stuff all winter long and sort of lost track of what it was doing. A few weeks ago, I applied a treatment and will apply it
    Message 1 of 12 , Mar 31, 2007
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      I didn't treat my lawn with the stuff all winter long and sort of lost track of what it was doing. A few weeks ago, I applied a treatment and will apply it again within a few weeks.

      Is it working? Well, I can't be certained because I'm not doing any real test. I just added a new area to my mowing area and I had a very hard time getting the stakes to go into the ground...actually broke several of them. The new area had never been treated with the liquid aeration. But, on the areas that had been treated, the stakes went in without breaking, but still somewhat difficult. I'm not sure if it had something to do with the sod holding the moisture in longer, or if the treatments are working. Today I dug in my flowerbed and it was noticeably easier to deal with. The clay was less rock-like and seemed to break apart like dirt.

      However, if it stuck a shovel into the ground, it won't sink in deep like the website indicates. If there's any improvement, it's not exactly the results you'd expect after reading their website.

      I have about half a bottle left and I intend to finish it up. At the end of the bottle, I'll determine if I'll buy more. So far, I think it's having some impact... I emailed the owner of the company last year and he did tell me that it's a slow process with clay soil and it could take a year or more to get the best results.

      Clint


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Mike Reed
      My rule of thumb when helping customers select installation supplies is to have one stake, I recommend the metal garden staples, every 16 inches where there
      Message 2 of 12 , Mar 31, 2007
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        My rule of thumb when helping customers select installation supplies is to
        have one stake, I recommend the metal garden staples, every 16 inches where
        there will be no foot traffic, such as against a fence or next to the house,
        and 12 inch spacing where there will be foot traffic such as the lawn edge
        or near walk ways. Then I apply a simple rule "If a person wearing thin
        flip-flops could get their shoe under the wire, you need another stake".

        Mike Reed
        NMI Enterprises, LLC. - PowerMow.com
        11608 W. 127th Terr. Overland Park, KS  66213-3536
        voice: 913.685.2700 fax: 913.897.8032 cell: 913.206.2800

        http://WikiWindow.net - http://WordCents.com - http://SEO-PositionOne.com
        http://RememberedBy.Us - http://WaveFilter.com - http://PowerMow.com
        http://PassSafe.com - http://KC-Mustangs.com - http://WaterAsAFuel.com
        http://MyQBox.com - http://AllMinds.com - http://InvisibleInbox.com
        http://NMIEnterprises.com - http://UnlimitedPotential.com



        -----Original Message-----
        From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
        Of Christopher Zach
        Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2007 8:23 PM
        To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire

        IGGY & Svetlana wrote:
        > What you are describing is highly irregular -
        > is this a new set up of a couple of weeks ago or so?

        Yes, I just got the wire and stakes and staked out a perimeter this
        week. It's possible I need more than 50 stakes; what seems to happen is
        the robot goes halfway over the wire, then backs up and takes the wire
        with it a foot or so. Then it's stuck and calls for help.

        Another possibility is that this mower has over 400 hours on the clock
        and the front wheel is a bit... well it's still round but somewhat worn.
        Perhaps I should replace it when I replace the rear tires?

        Also is there a general rule of thumb on how many pegs to be putting
        down? Is 50 enough for about 300 feet of wire?

        > Also, raise your mower's front and rear wheels for now till the grass
        grows over the wire and shields it from the blades and wheels. Front wheel
        as well as rear wheels can loosen up the wire and pegs if freshly installed.
        Under normal conditions pegs 3-6 ft apart will be OK. When I install wire I
        over tighten it so the wire is like a guitar string - I like to keep my
        wires straight for proper mowing effect.

        That's a good idea; I'll run the front and rear wheels up to max detent.
        There really isn't much grass growing except for a few tufts, so it's
        not going to matter much right now. It's more to watch it run around and
        enjoy it.

        > It may help when you set the zones to mow grass manually
        > with regular mower on the perimeter really low (basically
        > scalp it on the perimeter but be careful not to cut to the roots)
        > and then peg the wire as close and as tight to the ground as you can.

        Right now the grass is really low (I aerated the ground in the fall with
        a plug aerator and the grass is just starting to wake up now) but I will
        get another 50 stakes and re-stake it.

        Thank you.

        Chris





        Yahoo! Groups Links
      • Danny Miller
        An important part is to always plant the stakes on the lowest part of the ground. Such as, you ve planted your corner on rough ground. There is a low spot 2
        Message 3 of 12 , Apr 1, 2007
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          An important part is to always plant the stakes on the lowest part of
          the ground. Such as, you've planted your corner on rough ground. There
          is a low spot 2 ft away, maybe only 1/2" lower than the rest of the
          ground. Stake it in the low spot. Then there's a low spot but it's
          only 1 ft away. Use that.

          This does 2 things. First it won't "bridge" over the low spots.
          Second, it actually applies some downward force over the remaining spans
          as they flow over high areas and that keeps it stuck to the ground.

          It helps to take a weedeater and "scalp" the grass off the ground before
          putting down the wire. Most grass recovers in only month or so in my
          experience and grows right over the wire as long as you avoid winter and
          summer heat when the grass is dormant or stressed.

          Also you can bury wire pretty effectively by just using an edger. I've
          gone in when the ground is really dry due to lack of rain, trenched down
          like 1.5" with the edger, then used a shop vac to just suck out all the
          loose dirt leaving a nice, sharp trench. If the soil is just the right
          moisture consistency, it might hold the trench open by itself. When you
          have a good trench, you don't need stakes over convex areas (hills) at
          all. Over convex ground, as long as you don't pull the wire tight you
          might be able to slack it in there or hold it down with bits of wire
          coathangers (if you don't have official Robomower (TM) stakes) or
          whatever. Just kick the ground back over the trench, or pour the
          contents of the shop vac back over it.

          Danny

          Mike Reed wrote:

          >My rule of thumb when helping customers select installation supplies is to
          >have one stake, I recommend the metal garden staples, every 16 inches where
          >there will be no foot traffic, such as against a fence or next to the house,
          >and 12 inch spacing where there will be foot traffic such as the lawn edge
          >or near walk ways. Then I apply a simple rule "If a person wearing thin
          >flip-flops could get their shoe under the wire, you need another stake".
          >
          >Mike Reed
          >NMI Enterprises, LLC. - PowerMow.com
          >11608 W. 127th Terr. Overland Park, KS 66213-3536
          >voice: 913.685.2700 fax: 913.897.8032 cell: 913.206.2800
          >
          >http://WikiWindow.net - http://WordCents.com - http://SEO-PositionOne.com
          >http://RememberedBy.Us - http://WaveFilter.com - http://PowerMow.com
          >http://PassSafe.com - http://KC-Mustangs.com - http://WaterAsAFuel.com
          >http://MyQBox.com - http://AllMinds.com - http://InvisibleInbox.com
          >http://NMIEnterprises.com - http://UnlimitedPotential.com
          >
          >
          >
          >-----Original Message-----
          >From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
          >Of Christopher Zach
          >Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2007 8:23 PM
          >To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
          >Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire
          >
          >IGGY & Svetlana wrote:
          >
          >
          >>What you are describing is highly irregular -
          >>
          >>
          > > is this a new set up of a couple of weeks ago or so?
          >
          >Yes, I just got the wire and stakes and staked out a perimeter this
          >week. It's possible I need more than 50 stakes; what seems to happen is
          >the robot goes halfway over the wire, then backs up and takes the wire
          >with it a foot or so. Then it's stuck and calls for help.
          >
          >Another possibility is that this mower has over 400 hours on the clock
          >and the front wheel is a bit... well it's still round but somewhat worn.
          >Perhaps I should replace it when I replace the rear tires?
          >
          >Also is there a general rule of thumb on how many pegs to be putting
          >down? Is 50 enough for about 300 feet of wire?
          >
          >
          >
          >>Also, raise your mower's front and rear wheels for now till the grass
          >>
          >>
          >grows over the wire and shields it from the blades and wheels. Front wheel
          >as well as rear wheels can loosen up the wire and pegs if freshly installed.
          >Under normal conditions pegs 3-6 ft apart will be OK. When I install wire I
          >over tighten it so the wire is like a guitar string - I like to keep my
          >wires straight for proper mowing effect.
          >
          >That's a good idea; I'll run the front and rear wheels up to max detent.
          >There really isn't much grass growing except for a few tufts, so it's
          >not going to matter much right now. It's more to watch it run around and
          >enjoy it.
          >
          >
          >
          >>It may help when you set the zones to mow grass manually
          >>with regular mower on the perimeter really low (basically
          >>
          >>
          > > scalp it on the perimeter but be careful not to cut to the roots)
          >
          >
          >>and then peg the wire as close and as tight to the ground as you can.
          >>
          >>
          >
          >Right now the grass is really low (I aerated the ground in the fall with
          >a plug aerator and the grass is just starting to wake up now) but I will
          >get another 50 stakes and re-stake it.
          >
          >Thank you.
          >
          >Chris
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Dan Barclay
          Wow, every 12 to 16 inches is a *lot* of stakes. I don t use anywhere near that many and I haven t had a problem. The trick for me has been to pull the wire
          Message 4 of 12 , Apr 1, 2007
          • 0 Attachment
            Wow, every 12 to 16 inches is a *lot* of stakes. I don't use anywhere near
            that many and I haven't had a problem.



            The trick for me has been to pull the wire tight and to make sure it gets
            down in the grass. FWIW, within a few weeks you won't need any stakes at
            all if you've pulled it tight enough to get down in the grass. The grass
            will grow over the wire and pull it down to the ground level.



            I use a stake roughly every step. That is, walk the perimeter and drop a
            stake every time your right foot hits the ground. On the first stake I
            drive I wrap the wire around it once to hold, then I push the stakes in,
            pulling the wire enough to get the slack out, as I go around the perimeter.




            The wire will be "in the air" if it goes over a "dip", so put an extra stake
            at the bottom of the dip to pull it down.



            Once you get the stakes I place, you can go around and tamp some or all of
            them in a little more which will pull the wire tight to the ground. If the
            wire is still loose you tamp the stake a bit more, up to an inch or so below
            ground level. If that doesn't do it you can put some more stakes in. Each
            stake is equivalent to pulling 2 or 3 inches of wire.



            Having said that, there may be some types of grass that don't grow over the
            wire and pull it down. I'm not familiar with those. If that's the case I'd
            consider changing grass<g>. The stakes should only be necessary long
            enough to get the grass to grow over the wire.



            Dan







            _____

            From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
            Of Mike Reed
            Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2007 9:28 AM
            To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: RE: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire



            My rule of thumb when helping customers select installation supplies is to
            have one stake, I recommend the metal garden staples, every 16 inches where
            there will be no foot traffic, such as against a fence or next to the house,
            and 12 inch spacing where there will be foot traffic such as the lawn edge
            or near walk ways. Then I apply a simple rule "If a person wearing thin
            flip-flops could get their shoe under the wire, you need another stake".

            Mike Reed
            NMI Enterprises, LLC. - PowerMow.com
            11608 W. 127th Terr. Overland Park, KS 66213-3536
            voice: 913.685.2700 fax: 913.897.8032 cell: 913.206.2800

            http://WikiWindow. <http://WikiWindow.net> net - http://WordCents.
            <http://WordCents.com> com - http://SEO-Position
            <http://SEO-PositionOne.com> One.com
            http://RememberedBy <http://RememberedBy.Us> .Us - http://WaveFilter.
            <http://WaveFilter.com> com - http://PowerMow. <http://PowerMow.com> com
            http://PassSafe. <http://PassSafe.com> com - http://KC-Mustangs.
            <http://KC-Mustangs.com> com - http://WaterAsAFuel <http://WaterAsAFuel.com>
            .com
            http://MyQBox. <http://MyQBox.com> com - http://AllMinds.
            <http://AllMinds.com> com - http://InvisibleInb <http://InvisibleInbox.com>
            ox.com
            http://NMIEnterpris <http://NMIEnterprises.com> es.com - http://UnlimitedPot
            <http://UnlimitedPotential.com> ential.com

            -----Original Message-----
            From: RoboMower@yahoogrou <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
            [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogrou <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com] On
            Behalf
            Of Christopher Zach
            Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2007 8:23 PM
            To: RoboMower@yahoogrou <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
            Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire

            IGGY & Svetlana wrote:
            > What you are describing is highly irregular -
            > is this a new set up of a couple of weeks ago or so?

            Yes, I just got the wire and stakes and staked out a perimeter this
            week. It's possible I need more than 50 stakes; what seems to happen is
            the robot goes halfway over the wire, then backs up and takes the wire
            with it a foot or so. Then it's stuck and calls for help.

            Another possibility is that this mower has over 400 hours on the clock
            and the front wheel is a bit... well it's still round but somewhat worn.
            Perhaps I should replace it when I replace the rear tires?

            Also is there a general rule of thumb on how many pegs to be putting
            down? Is 50 enough for about 300 feet of wire?

            > Also, raise your mower's front and rear wheels for now till the grass
            grows over the wire and shields it from the blades and wheels. Front wheel
            as well as rear wheels can loosen up the wire and pegs if freshly installed.
            Under normal conditions pegs 3-6 ft apart will be OK. When I install wire I
            over tighten it so the wire is like a guitar string - I like to keep my
            wires straight for proper mowing effect.

            That's a good idea; I'll run the front and rear wheels up to max detent.
            There really isn't much grass growing except for a few tufts, so it's
            not going to matter much right now. It's more to watch it run around and
            enjoy it.

            > It may help when you set the zones to mow grass manually
            > with regular mower on the perimeter really low (basically
            > scalp it on the perimeter but be careful not to cut to the roots)
            > and then peg the wire as close and as tight to the ground as you can.

            Right now the grass is really low (I aerated the ground in the fall with
            a plug aerator and the grass is just starting to wake up now) but I will
            get another 50 stakes and re-stake it.

            Thank you.

            Chris

            Yahoo! Groups Links





            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Mike Reed
            The trick to the wire is using the metal garden staples. You place them by hand and just step on them to push them in. Unlike the plastic stakes, even in hard
            Message 5 of 12 , Apr 1, 2007
            • 0 Attachment
              The trick to the wire is using the metal garden staples. You place them by
              hand and just step on them to push them in. Unlike the plastic stakes, even
              in hard soil they don't break and you don't need a hammer. You can lay the
              wire very quickly. They are also only $0.20 each or less at the hardware or
              lawn and garden store. I get them at Westlake Hardware if you have one near
              you.

              Using your stride to measure where to peg isn't a bad idea, but it is too
              wide for high traffic areas. The average stride is between 2 and 3 feet
              depending on the size of the person. 4 to 6 feet per peg is a bit wide for
              high traffic areas unless the ground is very level. Even tight wire can
              stretch and flex nearly an inch per foot of span, so at 4 to 6 feet per peg,
              you can easily have between 4 and 6 inches of variance in position at the
              middle point of the wire when snagged or pulled. I'd still recommend 12 and
              16 inch spacing... but them again I don't want to get sued by some idiot
              crossing my lawn and getting hurt, and I don't want to worry about the weed
              wacker catching the wire or the mower pulling and stretching the wire. As
              easy and cheap as it is to do it right, I don't see a reason for wider
              spacing.

              If you have very level ground and there will be no foot traffic, I'd still
              not exceed 24 inches per peg, just to avoid wire stretching and to keep a
              good line for the mower to follow. Where there will be foot traffic, no
              matter what spacing you use, the flip-flop test is still a good guide.



              -----Original Message-----
              From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
              Of Dan Barclay
              Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2007 1:19 PM
              To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire

              Wow, every 12 to 16 inches is a *lot* of stakes. I don't use anywhere near
              that many and I haven't had a problem.



              The trick for me has been to pull the wire tight and to make sure it gets
              down in the grass. FWIW, within a few weeks you won't need any stakes at
              all if you've pulled it tight enough to get down in the grass. The grass
              will grow over the wire and pull it down to the ground level.



              I use a stake roughly every step. That is, walk the perimeter and drop a
              stake every time your right foot hits the ground. On the first stake I
              drive I wrap the wire around it once to hold, then I push the stakes in,
              pulling the wire enough to get the slack out, as I go around the perimeter.




              The wire will be "in the air" if it goes over a "dip", so put an extra stake
              at the bottom of the dip to pull it down.



              Once you get the stakes I place, you can go around and tamp some or all of
              them in a little more which will pull the wire tight to the ground. If the
              wire is still loose you tamp the stake a bit more, up to an inch or so below
              ground level. If that doesn't do it you can put some more stakes in. Each
              stake is equivalent to pulling 2 or 3 inches of wire.



              Having said that, there may be some types of grass that don't grow over the
              wire and pull it down. I'm not familiar with those. If that's the case I'd
              consider changing grass<g>. The stakes should only be necessary long
              enough to get the grass to grow over the wire.



              Dan







              _____

              From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
              Of Mike Reed
              Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2007 9:28 AM
              To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: RE: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire



              My rule of thumb when helping customers select installation supplies is to
              have one stake, I recommend the metal garden staples, every 16 inches where
              there will be no foot traffic, such as against a fence or next to the house,
              and 12 inch spacing where there will be foot traffic such as the lawn edge
              or near walk ways. Then I apply a simple rule "If a person wearing thin
              flip-flops could get their shoe under the wire, you need another stake".

              Mike Reed
              NMI Enterprises, LLC. - PowerMow.com
              11608 W. 127th Terr. Overland Park, KS 66213-3536
              voice: 913.685.2700 fax: 913.897.8032 cell: 913.206.2800

              http://WikiWindow. <http://WikiWindow.net> net - http://WordCents.
              <http://WordCents.com> com - http://SEO-Position
              <http://SEO-PositionOne.com> One.com
              http://RememberedBy <http://RememberedBy.Us> .Us - http://WaveFilter.
              <http://WaveFilter.com> com - http://PowerMow. <http://PowerMow.com> com
              http://PassSafe. <http://PassSafe.com> com - http://KC-Mustangs.
              <http://KC-Mustangs.com> com - http://WaterAsAFuel <http://WaterAsAFuel.com>
              .com
              http://MyQBox. <http://MyQBox.com> com - http://AllMinds.
              <http://AllMinds.com> com - http://InvisibleInb <http://InvisibleInbox.com>
              ox.com
              http://NMIEnterpris <http://NMIEnterprises.com> es.com - http://UnlimitedPot
              <http://UnlimitedPotential.com> ential.com

              -----Original Message-----
              From: RoboMower@yahoogrou <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
              [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogrou <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com] On
              Behalf
              Of Christopher Zach
              Sent: Saturday, March 31, 2007 8:23 PM
              To: RoboMower@yahoogrou <mailto:RoboMower%40yahoogroups.com> ps.com
              Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire

              IGGY & Svetlana wrote:
              > What you are describing is highly irregular -
              > is this a new set up of a couple of weeks ago or so?

              Yes, I just got the wire and stakes and staked out a perimeter this
              week. It's possible I need more than 50 stakes; what seems to happen is
              the robot goes halfway over the wire, then backs up and takes the wire
              with it a foot or so. Then it's stuck and calls for help.

              Another possibility is that this mower has over 400 hours on the clock
              and the front wheel is a bit... well it's still round but somewhat worn.
              Perhaps I should replace it when I replace the rear tires?

              Also is there a general rule of thumb on how many pegs to be putting
              down? Is 50 enough for about 300 feet of wire?

              > Also, raise your mower's front and rear wheels for now till the grass
              grows over the wire and shields it from the blades and wheels. Front wheel
              as well as rear wheels can loosen up the wire and pegs if freshly installed.
              Under normal conditions pegs 3-6 ft apart will be OK. When I install wire I
              over tighten it so the wire is like a guitar string - I like to keep my
              wires straight for proper mowing effect.

              That's a good idea; I'll run the front and rear wheels up to max detent.
              There really isn't much grass growing except for a few tufts, so it's
              not going to matter much right now. It's more to watch it run around and
              enjoy it.

              > It may help when you set the zones to mow grass manually
              > with regular mower on the perimeter really low (basically
              > scalp it on the perimeter but be careful not to cut to the roots)
              > and then peg the wire as close and as tight to the ground as you can.

              Right now the grass is really low (I aerated the ground in the fall with
              a plug aerator and the grass is just starting to wake up now) but I will
              get another 50 stakes and re-stake it.

              Thank you.

              Chris

              Yahoo! Groups Links





              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




              Yahoo! Groups Links
            • Matt Cooper
              Mike (and all), You are right... the metal thick wire staples are an excellent alternative to the Robomower pegs as long as the ground is soft enough...
              Message 6 of 12 , Apr 1, 2007
              • 0 Attachment
                Mike (and all),

                You are right... the metal thick wire staples are an excellent alternative to the Robomower pegs as long as the ground is soft enough... because as you say, the wire staples never break (but they do bend when the ground is hard). In many instances if you have hard, dry clay soil or rocky soil and try a peg and staple side by side to compare one will break and the other will bend. The staples are a good alternative to the pegs because they are at your local hardware store when you run out of robomower pegs. Note: The wire staple is one inch wide and if the wire is not held down as rigidly as the peg. A solution to this is to wrap the wire around the staple once... and it holds much better.

                If the ground is hard and you cannot put either one of these into the ground - - the best thing to do is to fill a water jug and pour a small amount of water at the spot, use one tap of the hammer and then go to the next peg/staple and do the same. Then come back 5 minutes later and the water will have soaked enough to allow you to drive the staple/peg the rest of the way. Note: For stake spacing, use this rule of thumb: Do not put a peg every set so and so feet... most yards have "ups and downs" (crests and troughs). at first, put your pegs only on the "downs" (troughs) and the slight or heavy left and right turns (keeping the wire as tight as possible). After you have completed the wire loop for your zone then do the following: Perform the trip test: In the next two weeks will will your family or neighbors or animals trip their feet on any given spot? If so, peg it or staple it! Will the robomower "trip or move it with its wheels? If so, peg or staple it!
                That is all you should be concerned with and you will use the least amount of tie downs.

                Most of all... Do not take anyone's advise if you think have thought of something you think is better...even mine! That's how newer and better ideas are born.

                Matt Cooper, Owner of AutoMate Tools
                Friendly Robotics Authorized Sales and Service, specializing in complete and partial
                upgrades
                (Software, circuit boards, gear sets, etc - a full service company)
                Phone # (214) 538-0409, Located at Mesquite, Texas - Serving all USA and Canada
                Robomower users mower demonstrations for the Dallas/Fort Worth Area







                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Danny Miller
                I ve not had good general success with straight steel stakes. I had a ton of those with the Invisible Pet Fence wire. What happened is they pull out of the
                Message 7 of 12 , Apr 1, 2007
                • 0 Attachment
                  I've not had good general success with straight steel stakes. I had a
                  ton of those with the Invisible Pet Fence wire. What happened is they
                  pull out of the ground quite easily because there's no rear-facing teeth
                  to grip the ground like Robomower's design. It help if you lay the wire
                  without giving it tension, but then it's loose and tends to snag and
                  pull out anyways.

                  But then it's also important to note that pegs actually are only
                  necessary until the grass grows over it. As long as you can keep from
                  pulling it up before then, the pegs eventually won't matter. If your
                  grass is growing aggressively, it might be a month, or it might be a
                  year. Or in shaded areas you may be unable to ever grow grass to cover
                  it, so if you have a limited number of the quality Robomower stakes, be
                  sure to use them there and at short spacings.

                  Danny

                  Matt Cooper wrote:

                  >Mike (and all),
                  >
                  > You are right... the metal thick wire staples are an excellent alternative to the Robomower pegs as long as the ground is soft enough... because as you say, the wire staples never break (but they do bend when the ground is hard). In many instances if you have hard, dry clay soil or rocky soil and try a peg and staple side by side to compare one will break and the other will bend. The staples are a good alternative to the pegs because they are at your local hardware store when you run out of robomower pegs. Note: The wire staple is one inch wide and if the wire is not held down as rigidly as the peg. A solution to this is to wrap the wire around the staple once... and it holds much better.
                  >
                  > If the ground is hard and you cannot put either one of these into the ground - - the best thing to do is to fill a water jug and pour a small amount of water at the spot, use one tap of the hammer and then go to the next peg/staple and do the same. Then come back 5 minutes later and the water will have soaked enough to allow you to drive the staple/peg the rest of the way. Note: For stake spacing, use this rule of thumb: Do not put a peg every set so and so feet... most yards have "ups and downs" (crests and troughs). at first, put your pegs only on the "downs" (troughs) and the slight or heavy left and right turns (keeping the wire as tight as possible). After you have completed the wire loop for your zone then do the following: Perform the trip test: In the next two weeks will will your family or neighbors or animals trip their feet on any given spot? If so, peg it or staple it! Will the robomower "trip or move it with its wheels? If so, peg or staple it!
                  > That is all you should be concerned with and you will use the least amount of tie downs.
                  >
                  > Most of all... Do not take anyone's advise if you think have thought of something you think is better...even mine! That's how newer and better ideas are born.
                  >
                  > Matt Cooper, Owner of AutoMate Tools
                  >Friendly Robotics Authorized Sales and Service, specializing in complete and partial
                  >upgrades
                  > (Software, circuit boards, gear sets, etc - a full service company)
                  > Phone # (214) 538-0409, Located at Mesquite, Texas - Serving all USA and Canada
                  > Robomower users mower demonstrations for the Dallas/Fort Worth Area
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                • Mike Reed
                  Excellent advise sir. One tidbit that I might add is that running the garden staple as close to parallel as possible to the wire helps to maintain a straight
                  Message 8 of 12 , Apr 1, 2007
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Excellent advise sir. One tidbit that I might add is that running the garden
                    staple as close to parallel as possible to the wire helps to maintain a
                    straight path with as little slippage as possible. Intuitively we might want
                    to put the staples in perpendicular to the wire, but this gives a full inch
                    of possible play. I created a simple drawing and uploaded it to the files
                    area. (GardenStaplesAsPegs.gif)

                    I want to second the notion that Matt stated. "Most of all... Do not take
                    anyone's advice if you think have thought of something you think is
                    better...even mine! That's how newer and better ideas are born."


                    -----Original Message-----
                    From: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com [mailto:RoboMower@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                    Of Matt Cooper
                    Sent: Sunday, April 01, 2007 5:45 PM
                    To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                    Subject: RE: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire

                    Mike (and all),

                    You are right... the metal thick wire staples are an excellent alternative
                    to the Robomower pegs as long as the ground is soft enough... because as you
                    say, the wire staples never break (but they do bend when the ground is
                    hard). In many instances if you have hard, dry clay soil or rocky soil and
                    try a peg and staple side by side to compare one will break and the other
                    will bend. The staples are a good alternative to the pegs because they are
                    at your local hardware store when you run out of robomower pegs. Note: The
                    wire staple is one inch wide and if the wire is not held down as rigidly as
                    the peg. A solution to this is to wrap the wire around the staple once...
                    and it holds much better.

                    If the ground is hard and you cannot put either one of these into the
                    ground - - the best thing to do is to fill a water jug and pour a small
                    amount of water at the spot, use one tap of the hammer and then go to the
                    next peg/staple and do the same. Then come back 5 minutes later and the
                    water will have soaked enough to allow you to drive the staple/peg the rest
                    of the way. Note: For stake spacing, use this rule of thumb: Do not put a
                    peg every set so and so feet... most yards have "ups and downs" (crests and
                    troughs). at first, put your pegs only on the "downs" (troughs) and the
                    slight or heavy left and right turns (keeping the wire as tight as
                    possible). After you have completed the wire loop for your zone then do the
                    following: Perform the trip test: In the next two weeks will will your
                    family or neighbors or animals trip their feet on any given spot? If so,
                    peg it or staple it! Will the robomower "trip or move it with its wheels?
                    If so, peg or staple it!
                    That is all you should be concerned with and you will use the least amount
                    of tie downs.

                    Most of all... Do not take anyone's advise if you think have thought of
                    something you think is better...even mine! That's how newer and better ideas
                    are born.

                    Matt Cooper, Owner of AutoMate Tools
                    Friendly Robotics Authorized Sales and Service, specializing in complete and
                    partial
                    upgrades
                    (Software, circuit boards, gear sets, etc - a full service company)
                    Phone # (214) 538-0409, Located at Mesquite, Texas - Serving all USA and
                    Canada
                    Robomower users mower demonstrations for the Dallas/Fort Worth Area







                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                    Yahoo! Groups Links
                  • Roy Strutt
                    I ve replaced my perimeter wire but do not use stakes to hold it. I make a half inch cut into the lawn and just push the wire into the cut so that it is half
                    Message 9 of 12 , Apr 2, 2007
                    • 0 Attachment
                      I've replaced my perimeter wire but do not use stakes to hold it.
                      I make a half inch cut into the lawn and just push the wire into
                      the cut so that it is half an inch below the surface.
                      Close the cut, much easier if the ground is damp, and alls well.
                      RS.

                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: "Danny Miller" <dannym@...>
                      To: <RoboMower@yahoogroups.com>
                      Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 12:40 AM
                      Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire


                      I've not had good general success with straight steel stakes. I had a
                      ton of those with the Invisible Pet Fence wire. What happened is they
                      pull out of the ground quite easily because there's no rear-facing teeth
                      to grip the ground like Robomower's design. It help if you lay the wire
                      without giving it tension, but then it's loose and tends to snag and
                      pull out anyways.

                      But then it's also important to note that pegs actually are only
                      necessary until the grass grows over it. As long as you can keep from
                      pulling it up before then, the pegs eventually won't matter. If your
                      grass is growing aggressively, it might be a month, or it might be a
                      year. Or in shaded areas you may be unable to ever grow grass to cover
                      it, so if you have a limited number of the quality Robomower stakes, be
                      sure to use them there and at short spacings.

                      Danny

                      Matt Cooper wrote:

                      >Mike (and all),
                      >
                      > You are right... the metal thick wire staples are an excellent
                      > alternative to the Robomower pegs as long as the ground is soft enough...
                      > because as you say, the wire staples never break (but they do bend when
                      > the ground is hard). In many instances if you have hard, dry clay soil or
                      > rocky soil and try a peg and staple side by side to compare one will break
                      > and the other will bend. The staples are a good alternative to the pegs
                      > because they are at your local hardware store when you run out of
                      > robomower pegs. Note: The wire staple is one inch wide and if the wire
                      > is not held down as rigidly as the peg. A solution to this is to wrap the
                      > wire around the staple once... and it holds much better.
                      >
                      > If the ground is hard and you cannot put either one of these into the
                      > ground - - the best thing to do is to fill a water jug and pour a small
                      > amount of water at the spot, use one tap of the hammer and then go to the
                      > next peg/staple and do the same. Then come back 5 minutes later and the
                      > water will have soaked enough to allow you to drive the staple/peg the
                      > rest of the way. Note: For stake spacing, use this rule of thumb: Do
                      > not put a peg every set so and so feet... most yards have "ups and downs"
                      > (crests and troughs). at first, put your pegs only on the "downs"
                      > (troughs) and the slight or heavy left and right turns (keeping the wire
                      > as tight as possible). After you have completed the wire loop for your
                      > zone then do the following: Perform the trip test: In the next two weeks
                      > will will your family or neighbors or animals trip their feet on any given
                      > spot? If so, peg it or staple it! Will the robomower "trip or move it
                      > with its wheels? If so, peg or staple it!
                      > That is all you should be concerned with and you will use the least amount
                      > of tie downs.
                      >
                      > Most of all... Do not take anyone's advise if you think have thought of
                      > something you think is better...even mine! That's how newer and better
                      > ideas are born.
                      >
                      > Matt Cooper, Owner of AutoMate Tools
                      >Friendly Robotics Authorized Sales and Service, specializing in complete
                      >and partial
                      >upgrades
                      > (Software, circuit boards, gear sets, etc - a full service company)
                      > Phone # (214) 538-0409, Located at Mesquite, Texas - Serving all USA and
                      > Canada
                      > Robomower users mower demonstrations for the Dallas/Fort Worth Area
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >Yahoo! Groups Links
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                    • IGGY & Svetlana
                      I discovered the hard way last year that utility lines and sprinkler tubing can be very close to the surface though it s supposed to be 8 inches or more below.
                      Message 10 of 12 , Apr 2, 2007
                      • 0 Attachment
                        I discovered the hard way last year that utility lines and sprinkler tubing can be very close to the surface though it's supposed to be 8 inches or more below. Was working in the yard and shovel sliced through sprinkler tubing which was just below the surface. Be careful with slicing dirt - you may get electrocuted if the wiring is not properly installed - make sure you get a marking service mark the location of all utilities.

                        IGGY

                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: Roy Strutt
                        To: RoboMower@yahoogroups.com
                        Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 7:55 AM
                        Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire


                        I've replaced my perimeter wire but do not use stakes to hold it.
                        I make a half inch cut into the lawn and just push the wire into
                        the cut so that it is half an inch below the surface.
                        Close the cut, much easier if the ground is damp, and alls well.
                        RS.

                        ----- Original Message -----
                        From: "Danny Miller" <dannym@...>
                        To: <RoboMower@yahoogroups.com>
                        Sent: Monday, April 02, 2007 12:40 AM
                        Subject: Re: [RoboMower] Snagging the wire

                        I've not had good general success with straight steel stakes. I had a
                        ton of those with the Invisible Pet Fence wire. What happened is they
                        pull out of the ground quite easily because there's no rear-facing teeth
                        to grip the ground like Robomower's design. It help if you lay the wire
                        without giving it tension, but then it's loose and tends to snag and
                        pull out anyways.

                        But then it's also important to note that pegs actually are only
                        necessary until the grass grows over it. As long as you can keep from
                        pulling it up before then, the pegs eventually won't matter. If your
                        grass is growing aggressively, it might be a month, or it might be a
                        year. Or in shaded areas you may be unable to ever grow grass to cover
                        it, so if you have a limited number of the quality Robomower stakes, be
                        sure to use them there and at short spacings.

                        Danny

                        Matt Cooper wrote:

                        >Mike (and all),
                        >
                        > You are right... the metal thick wire staples are an excellent
                        > alternative to the Robomower pegs as long as the ground is soft enough...
                        > because as you say, the wire staples never break (but they do bend when
                        > the ground is hard). In many instances if you have hard, dry clay soil or
                        > rocky soil and try a peg and staple side by side to compare one will break
                        > and the other will bend. The staples are a good alternative to the pegs
                        > because they are at your local hardware store when you run out of
                        > robomower pegs. Note: The wire staple is one inch wide and if the wire
                        > is not held down as rigidly as the peg. A solution to this is to wrap the
                        > wire around the staple once... and it holds much better.
                        >
                        > If the ground is hard and you cannot put either one of these into the
                        > ground - - the best thing to do is to fill a water jug and pour a small
                        > amount of water at the spot, use one tap of the hammer and then go to the
                        > next peg/staple and do the same. Then come back 5 minutes later and the
                        > water will have soaked enough to allow you to drive the staple/peg the
                        > rest of the way. Note: For stake spacing, use this rule of thumb: Do
                        > not put a peg every set so and so feet... most yards have "ups and downs"
                        > (crests and troughs). at first, put your pegs only on the "downs"
                        > (troughs) and the slight or heavy left and right turns (keeping the wire
                        > as tight as possible). After you have completed the wire loop for your
                        > zone then do the following: Perform the trip test: In the next two weeks
                        > will will your family or neighbors or animals trip their feet on any given
                        > spot? If so, peg it or staple it! Will the robomower "trip or move it
                        > with its wheels? If so, peg or staple it!
                        > That is all you should be concerned with and you will use the least amount
                        > of tie downs.
                        >
                        > Most of all... Do not take anyone's advise if you think have thought of
                        > something you think is better...even mine! That's how newer and better
                        > ideas are born.
                        >
                        > Matt Cooper, Owner of AutoMate Tools
                        >Friendly Robotics Authorized Sales and Service, specializing in complete
                        >and partial
                        >upgrades
                        > (Software, circuit boards, gear sets, etc - a full service company)
                        > Phone # (214) 538-0409, Located at Mesquite, Texas - Serving all USA and
                        > Canada
                        > Robomower users mower demonstrations for the Dallas/Fort Worth Area
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >Yahoo! Groups Links
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >






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