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Re: Stanford Reports: HGH therapy will NOT reverse the effects of aging

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  • fgddd
    comments below... ... http://www.ivanhoe.com/channels/p_channelstory.cfm?channelid=CHAN- 100000&storyid=15334 ...
    Message 1 of 5 , Jan 30, 2007
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      comments below...

      --- In Rejuvenation@yahoogroups.com, Randy Ice wrote:

      > Hi Ellis:
      >
      > Here is the kind of continuing nonsensical propaganda being
      > thrown out at MD's by our so called "advanced" medical care system
      > here in the US! HGH hasn't cost "$1000 a month" for over 10 years,
      > but that number is constantly bandied about to scare folks away
      > from it.
      >
      > Enlightenment will come very SLOWLY here in "the land of the free!"
      >
      > Randy Ice P.T., C.C.S.
      > Vintage Medical Group
      > Temecula,Calif
      > www.lookfeelyoung.com
      >
      > Click here to go directly to the article:
      http://www.ivanhoe.com/channels/p_channelstory.cfm?channelid=CHAN-
      100000&storyid=15334
      > (AOL users <A
      HREF="http://www.ivanhoe.com/channels/p_channelstory.cfm?
      channelid=CHAN-100000&storyid=15334">click here</A>.)
      >
      >
      > [Hello Randy... Whooops! So then I guess it isn't true that
      > I am aging as slowly as I thought... - Ellis]


      Isn't it amazing, they have now gone from the original compilation
      of the 31 studies totaling 221 subjects to 500.

      I sincerely believe that this type of misinformation is put out by
      the insurance companies.

      fgddd



      [I don't know who likes to put out this misinformation, but it
      is sad that nobody takes leadership to gather and show the
      opposite, which I think is the truth: that thousands of people
      are using growth hormones and other hormones and getting
      excellent results, and no side effects of any kind much less
      CANCER, ACROMEGALIA, DIABETES, and all the other side effects
      they think we might get.

      Insurance companies should actually be in favor of HGH and
      other hormones because I think they will cause fewer or delayed
      claims for life insurance, and fewer and less costly claims for
      major medical expenses.

      But where are the statistics of the hundreds of thousands of
      persons who have used HGH for many years now, which I think
      would show a DECREASE in the incidence of cancer, and maybe
      a DECREASE in the incidence of diabetes? (there is no reason
      that I can think of that HGH, itself, should decrease the
      incidence of diabetes... nor does it increase it... but I think
      people who are taking HGH might also be interested in eating
      correctly...)

      In 8 years as moderator of Rejuvenation, and thousands of posts
      and thousands of persons who have reported using HGH for several
      years, there has only been ONE PERSON who blamed getting cancer
      because he said he had received HGH as a child (that was somebody
      who had HGH deficiency, and who had NOT USED HGH for 6 years
      prior to his discovery of cancer in his body.... so I argued that
      perhaps he got cancer BECAUSE HE HAD NOT used HGH for several
      years.)

      Where is the American Academy of Anti Aging Medicine? Where is
      Life Extension Foundation?

      Where is Ellis Toussier? Here I am. Why don't we try to
      gather some statistics here? I'll see what I can do... Maybe
      there is a survey software or a database that I can set up.

      - Ellis]
    • fgddd
      ... free! ... There are lots of studies out there. I just began using HGH this past month, but before I did I researched all the literature I could find.
      Message 2 of 5 , Feb 5, 2007
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        --- In Rejuvenation@yahoogroups.com, "fgddd" <fgddd@...> wrote:
        >
        > comments below...
        >
        > --- In Rejuvenation@yahoogroups.com, Randy Ice wrote:
        >
        > > Hi Ellis:
        > >
        > > Here is the kind of continuing nonsensical propaganda being
        > > thrown out at MD's by our so called "advanced" medical care system
        > > here in the US! HGH hasn't cost "$1000 a month" for over 10 years,
        > > but that number is constantly bandied about to scare folks away
        > > from it.
        > >
        > > Enlightenment will come very SLOWLY here in "the land of the
        free!"
        > >
        > > Randy Ice P.T., C.C.S.
        > > Vintage Medical Group
        > > Temecula,Calif
        > > www.lookfeelyoung.com
        > >
        > > Click here to go directly to the article:
        > http://www.ivanhoe.com/channels/p_channelstory.cfm?channelid=CHAN-
        > 100000&storyid=15334
        > > (AOL users <A
        > HREF="http://www.ivanhoe.com/channels/p_channelstory.cfm?
        > channelid=CHAN-100000&storyid=15334">click here</A>.)
        > >
        > >
        > > [Hello Randy... Whooops! So then I guess it isn't true that
        > > I am aging as slowly as I thought... - Ellis]
        >
        >
        > Isn't it amazing, they have now gone from the original compilation
        > of the 31 studies totaling 221 subjects to 500.
        >
        > I sincerely believe that this type of misinformation is put out by
        > the insurance companies.
        >
        > fgddd
        >
        >
        >
        > [I don't know who likes to put out this misinformation, but it
        > is sad that nobody takes leadership to gather and show the
        > opposite, which I think is the truth: that thousands of people
        > are using growth hormones and other hormones and getting
        > excellent results, and no side effects of any kind much less
        > CANCER, ACROMEGALIA, DIABETES, and all the other side effects
        > they think we might get.
        >
        > Insurance companies should actually be in favor of HGH and
        > other hormones because I think they will cause fewer or delayed
        > claims for life insurance, and fewer and less costly claims for
        > major medical expenses.
        >
        > But where are the statistics of the hundreds of thousands of
        > persons who have used HGH for many years now, which I think
        > would show a DECREASE in the incidence of cancer, and maybe
        > a DECREASE in the incidence of diabetes? (there is no reason
        > that I can think of that HGH, itself, should decrease the
        > incidence of diabetes... nor does it increase it... but I think
        > people who are taking HGH might also be interested in eating
        > correctly...)
        >
        > In 8 years as moderator of Rejuvenation, and thousands of posts
        > and thousands of persons who have reported using HGH for several
        > years, there has only been ONE PERSON who blamed getting cancer
        > because he said he had received HGH as a child (that was somebody
        > who had HGH deficiency, and who had NOT USED HGH for 6 years
        > prior to his discovery of cancer in his body.... so I argued that
        > perhaps he got cancer BECAUSE HE HAD NOT used HGH for several
        > years.)
        >
        > Where is the American Academy of Anti Aging Medicine? Where is
        > Life Extension Foundation?
        >
        > Where is Ellis Toussier? Here I am. Why don't we try to
        > gather some statistics here? I'll see what I can do... Maybe
        > there is a survey software or a database that I can set up.
        >
        > - Ellis]


        There are lots of studies out there. I just began using HGH this
        past month, but before I did I researched all the literature I could
        find. Lots and lots of pros and cons. It seemed to me that the
        cons were those MD's who usually stressed there should be more
        studies done.


        [The "cons" are written by doctors who DO NOT use and have never
        used growth hormone, and who of course DO NOT and never have
        prescribed it to their patients, so they have never really
        experienced HGH.

        Thomas Perls, who unfortunately is also a doctor, says that growth
        hormone causes acromegalia, cancer, diabetes, etc. and other side
        effects including that it PROBABLY SHORTENS LIFESPAN... I don't know
        why he is so against us using HGH if WE THINK it is doing good for
        our body, but he is on the warpath... - Ellis]

        Problems is that most of the pros seem to be sponored by the drug
        companies, which is usually true in most medical cases,
        consequently these studies do not portray an ethical non-bias
        results.

        The FDA has even issued statements such as "more research
        needs to be done in this field." Also many of the studies use far
        higher HGH doses than would normally be recommended and while the
        results are very positive, the average person using HGH would take
        much longer to see such results because of lower prescribed doses by
        legitmate MD's.

        Remember we are "what have you done for me today society."

        Lastly, I think there also is a lot of misinformation put out by
        those in the anti-aging business. I'm talking about those who
        really charge outrageous fees for consultation and blood test and
        then charge equally outrageous sums for the HGH.

        The Pharmaceuticals are equally responsible for this high cost.

        [High cost does not make it a scam. Cost has nothing to do
        with whether it is true that it is good for our body, or if
        it is true that it causes acromegalia, etc. - Ellis]


        This is not a medicine that was 20 years in the making with 4 phase
        testing. This is a readily avaible medicine, and I stress medicine,
        because that is what it is to those who truly need it.

        [This is a medical miracle. Just think of how incredible it
        is that SOMEBODY EVEN THOUGHT of taking a tiny one cell animal,
        removing the DNA, replacing the DNA with the DNA of human
        growth hormone, or insulin, or EPO, etc.. and coming out with
        a one cell animal that "thinks" it is growth hormone and then
        duplicates as growth hormone. This is incredible. It was a
        cross of David Copperfield and Louis Pasteur that came up with
        something so unbelievable as this, which has now made it possible
        for ME to be able to INJECT REAL AUTHENTIC HUMAN GROWTH HORMONE.

        Cleopatra would have given up her slave's arm and a leg if she
        could have had authentic growth hormone and been able to stay
        young and beautiful, as I am doing without having to pay anybody's
        arm and a leg. If you think about it like this, growth
        hormone is really very cheap.

        So I am not against the pharmaceuticals making a bundle of
        profit for this amazing product, although I do wish that they
        would have a little more HEART, which is lacking at the top.

        But A LACK OF HEART is something that many DOCTORS are also
        guilty of. In any case, that the pharmaceuticals and doctors
        are making a big profit is not a good reason for Thomas Perls
        to be against us using HGH.

        It is sad that this is the way economics works, but this is how
        it works in the U.S.A. and in Mexico and England, and also in
        China or Russia or Cuba too: Money talks...

        So you better have money to pay for your growth hormone if you
        want to take growth hormone, because you won't convince the
        Government of any country to hand out growth hormone to everybody
        who wants to AVOID AGING.

        But... you can manufacture growth hormone in your own body, if
        you know how to do it... but only I think I know how to do it,
        and I haven't told anybody how to do it... yet. - Ellis]




        Every doctortorial student understands the "review of literature" of
        his subject or topic. Using this system would help us all understand
        all of the real and imagined benefits of HGH and how it could or
        would be of benefit to all of us.

        FGDDD


        [The problem is that it isn't a contest to see which side of the
        argument can write more baloney or misinformation, count how many
        pros and how many cons, and then whoever has more, wins.

        I am amazed and saddened that there are so many doctors and
        politicians that are AGAINST the use of hormones that I know are
        GOOD FOR MY BODY, because I have had the good fortune to be able
        to buy them without controversy, and secondly because I have been
        able to afford them.

        But I am also AFRAID that the doctors and politicians who have
        never USED growth hormone themselves want to limit OUR use of
        growth hormone. And I think they are going to succeed to limit
        MY use of growth hormone and EPO and testosterone, eventually,
        maybe even soon....

        It hasn't happened yet, but I am certain it will happen eventually.

        At that point, growth hormone and EPO will become as illegal as
        marijuana, or GHB, which were legal at some point in history,
        and then became illegal in the U.S.A. which later pressured the
        world to make it illegal everywhere... whether right or wrong,
        when it is illegal you lose sight of whether or not it has any
        medical uses which are good for anybody, for example cancer
        patients, or just plain OLD MEN AND WOMEN like you or me. Why
        cancer patients should have to buy marijuana or morphine on the
        black market to ease their pain, if that is what it does and
        that is what they want, is beyond me. But that is how it is.

        - Ellis]
      • CHUCK FRASHER
        They really weren t commenting on the benefits of HGH. They were just saying that it does not extend life span. [How can they say it does not extend life span,
        Message 3 of 5 , Feb 6, 2007
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          They really weren't commenting on the benefits of HGH. They were
          just saying that it does not extend life span.

          [How can they say it does not extend life span, if nobody has
          ever taken growth hormone for more than 15 years, or so? Mice
          studies can be slanted to show whatever statistic you want.
          Show me human studies that show it improves quality of life but
          shortens or does not extend lifespan. - Ellis]

          I personally have a broader definition of an antiaging therapy.
          I am not so concerned about extending life span as I am improving
          the quality of life. In fact, I would gladly give up some of my
          life span to improve the quality of life. If it makes your skin
          better and your muscles a little more firm and makes you feel
          better, then that is dimishing the symptoms of aging and therefore
          is an antiaging therapy.

          But that does not mean that it will extend life span to any
          significant degree. I personally don't care about that. If I want
          to extend life span, I'll practice calorie restriction.



          [Hello Chuck... I agree with you that quality of life is
          all we can prove we are having, NOW... but... if we are all
          FEELING BETTER and LOOKING BETTER and NOT GETTING SICK, you
          don't have to be a genius in statistics to be able to PREDICT
          that AVERAGE LIFESPAN is also, necessarily, going to be extended.

          In any case, I have ALREADY lived SIXTY ONE YEARS HEALTHY...
          If I should die SUDDENLY of a heart attack (which comes from
          diabetes) or of cancer (which is more incurable when there is
          diabetes) or of kidney disease (which comes from diabetes) I
          would still be HAPPY AND GRATEFUL that I have used GROWTH HORMONE
          and TESTOSTERONE and EPO and INSULIN for the past 9 years.
          (HGH, 9 years... Testosterone about 6 years... EPO about 5
          years... Insulin about 5 years... also DHEA and MELATONIN...
          and I have dabbled with Oxytocin, and Progesterone, and thyroid,
          and Human Corionic Gonadotropin and a few others, probably...)

          I think I am not going to die of a heart attack very soon, and
          I think I am not going to die of cancer very soon, and I think
          I am not going to die of diabetes very soon, and I think I am
          not going to die of kidney disease very soon... so... what am I
          going to die of, and when? As long as I can say I am YOUNG, I
          cannot say I think I am going to DIE soon, and I am still YOUNG.

          I also think I am not going to die of Sarcopenia, or of Parkinson,
          or of senility... There is no such thing as dying of "old age" in
          my book, you must die for a reason. You can't die because the
          clock has turned too many times. My father died of "old age"
          according to the doctors, (he got a stroke, at age 94) but he died
          of diabetes, according to me. If he had not had diabetes, he would
          not have gotten his stroke. He also would not have had sarcopenia,
          which might also have helped bring on his stroke.

          I am in tip top health at age 61... I have no pains in my body...
          I have a full crop of hair on my head, and it is mostly dark brown..
          I have not slowed down in any way that I can tell, yet... in the
          past 10 years I have gotten BETTER physically than I was 10 years
          ago. I have not changed at all when I look at myself in the mirror,
          except that I have FEWER wrinkles today than I had at age 51, and
          my skin is LESS DRY and more TIGHT today than at age 51.. I think I
          walk FASTER today than I did at age 51, and I am MORE sexually
          active today than I was at age 51.

          I am glad to say I have a very healthy "Dirty Mind"... I really am
          happy that I am "A Dirty Old Man"... Better a "Dirty Old Man" than
          a "Dead Old Man" as, sadly, some of my classmates and schoolmates
          already are...

          As George Burns said "Sex at age 90 is like trying to shoot pool
          with a rope."

          I want to write that I can still sink it in, at age 100.

          Confessions of a Dirty Old Man
          http://www.rajeun.net/confessions.html

          So... I expect that some day I will die of an ACCIDENT, or from
          POLLUTION related disease like radiation or chemical poisoning...
          but I don't think I will die of "OLD AGE," whatever that is...

          And if I don't die of an ACCIDENT or POLLUTION, then I really do
          think there is a good chance to get to age 100, healthy. But
          then the challenge becomes to get to age 100 WITH OUR MIND still
          working well, which is why it is so important to avoid LOSS OF
          NEURONS.

          Will anybody still want to play CHESS with me at age 100? Will
          I still be writing, at age 100? Will I still be intelligent
          enough to be moderator of Rejuvenation, at age 100?

          I think so, but I don't know so. Nobody knows, but according to
          STATISTICS I SHOULDN'T BE ALIVE at age 100... And if I am alive, I
          SHOULD BE PRETTY HARMLESS.

          No sir, that is not how I picture myself 39 years from now. I am
          harmless by choice, not by necessity. But I'll be able to tell
          you more, 10 years from now, then 20 and then 30 years from now...

          Well, guys, please stay tuned to Rejuvenation for 39 more years
          and you will know the end of this story. I am inviting all of
          you to my 100th birthday party, which I picture in my mind that
          I will have in Can Cun, at the Royal Mayan, with a table dancer
          on my laps, I hope.

          The PROBABILITY of this birthday party occurring is less than 1 in
          a half a million. And the probability of my 120th birthday party
          ever occurring is less than 1 in a billion, and even less, that I
          WILL KNOW IT.

          But I will bet that I will be there for both of them, unless I die
          of an accident or of pollution before then.

          Stanford reports be damned. Take your bad news somwhere else.
          This is Rejuvenation, we only have good news to report, here.
          HGH works... we already know it improves our quality of life, and
          I will bet it extends our lifespan, too.

          Has anybody had a BAD experience with injectible Growth Hormone
          replacement therapy?

          Does anybody know somebody who took growth hormone for more than
          one year and has a bad experience to report?

          Please tell us about it. Also, please report bad experience with
          testosterone, EPO, or insulin. I have nothing but good things to
          say about these hormones.

          Thanks for writing. - Ellis]














          fgddd wrote:
          comments below...

          --- In Rejuvenation@yahoogroups.com, Randy Ice wrote:

          > Hi Ellis:
          >
          > Here is the kind of continuing nonsensical propaganda being
          > thrown out at MD's by our so called "advanced" medical care system
          > here in the US! HGH hasn't cost "$1000 a month" for over 10 years,
          > but that number is constantly bandied about to scare folks away
          > from it.
          >
          > Enlightenment will come very SLOWLY here in "the land of the free!"
          >
          > Randy Ice P.T., C.C.S.
          > Vintage Medical Group
          > Temecula,Calif
          > www.lookfeelyoung.com
          >
          > Click here to go directly to the article:
          http://www.ivanhoe.com/channels/p_channelstory.cfm?channelid=CHAN-
          100000&storyid=15334
          > (AOL users <A
          HREF="http://www.ivanhoe.com/channels/p_channelstory.cfm?
          channelid=CHAN-100000&storyid=15334">click here</A>.)
          >
          >
          > [Hello Randy... Whooops! So then I guess it isn't true that
          > I am aging as slowly as I thought... - Ellis]

          Isn't it amazing, they have now gone from the original compilation
          of the 31 studies totaling 221 subjects to 500.

          I sincerely believe that this type of misinformation is put out by
          the insurance companies.

          fgddd

          [I don't know who likes to put out this misinformation, but it
          is sad that nobody takes leadership to gather and show the
          opposite, which I think is the truth: that thousands of people
          are using growth hormones and other hormones and getting
          excellent results, and no side effects of any kind much less
          CANCER, ACROMEGALIA, DIABETES, and all the other side effects
          they think we might get.

          Insurance companies should actually be in favor of HGH and
          other hormones because I think they will cause fewer or delayed
          claims for life insurance, and fewer and less costly claims for
          major medical expenses.

          But where are the statistics of the hundreds of thousands of
          persons who have used HGH for many years now, which I think
          would show a DECREASE in the incidence of cancer, and maybe
          a DECREASE in the incidence of diabetes? (there is no reason
          that I can think of that HGH, itself, should decrease the
          incidence of diabetes... nor does it increase it... but I think
          people who are taking HGH might also be interested in eating
          correctly...)

          In 8 years as moderator of Rejuvenation, and thousands of posts
          and thousands of persons who have reported using HGH for several
          years, there has only been ONE PERSON who blamed getting cancer
          because he said he had received HGH as a child (that was somebody
          who had HGH deficiency, and who had NOT USED HGH for 6 years
          prior to his discovery of cancer in his body.... so I argued that
          perhaps he got cancer BECAUSE HE HAD NOT used HGH for several
          years.)

          Where is the American Academy of Anti Aging Medicine? Where is
          Life Extension Foundation?

          Where is Ellis Toussier? Here I am. Why don't we try to
          gather some statistics here? I'll see what I can do... Maybe
          there is a survey software or a database that I can set up.

          - Ellis]
        • Curtis Wiggins
          Dear Sir/Madam: [... Sir... ] I would like to start a Rejuvenation Program but I do not know how I would obtain a prescription for such a purpose. Please
          Message 4 of 5 , Feb 14, 2007
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            Dear Sir/Madam:

            [... Sir... ]


            I would like to start a Rejuvenation Program but I do not know how
            I would obtain a prescription for such a purpose.

            Please enlighten me!

            Thank you for your help.

            Curtis L. Wiggins

            [Hello Curtis...

            I'm glad to tell you, you don't NEED a prescription for 90%
            of my Rejuvenation Program... As far as I know, it is still
            legal for you to EAT CORRECTLY without a doctor's permission...
            and that is really 50% of the whole package.

            And it is still legal for you to do exercises and to drink
            vitamins and take care of your skin, without a doctor's
            prescription. If you do only those four anti-aging therapies,
            I predict that you will be better off, and healthier, than
            if you don't.

            You should see an anti-aging doctor, which you can find
            in the directory of the American Academy of Anti-Aging
            Medicine...

            http://www.worldhealth.net/

            If you don't find one near you, you can learn a lot here on
            Rejuvenation... but you will need a doctor to guide you with
            a hormone replacement therapy. - Ellis]
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