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Josephine Baker

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  • Peter L Reid
    Hi All, Once again I have fallen prey to cheap CD s, this time a double of Josephine Baker. Apart from her photo on the covers and actual CD s there is no
    Message 1 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
      Hi All,
      Once again I have fallen prey to cheap CD's, this time a double of
      Josephine Baker.
      Apart from her photo on the covers and actual CD's there is no
      information at all.
      Not a bad CD, and for French music and vocals I prefer her to Edith Piaff.
      Can anybody tell me who the band is that backs her on "You're Driving Me
      Crazy"?
      In the final vocal chorus there is a muted trumpet/cornet(?) behind her
      as well as a rather
      fine trombone.
      Prompted me to play the track twice. I presume they are French, then
      again a lot of
      musicians from the US were in Paris prior to the Second World War.

      Peter L.
    • Patrice Champarou
      They were the band from the Casino de Paris, most probably the whole list of musicians mentioned by Scott http://www.redhotjazz.com/bakermj.html because it was
      Message 2 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
        They were the band from the Casino de Paris, most probably the whole list of
        musicians mentioned by Scott
        http://www.redhotjazz.com/bakermj.html
        because it was a single day session. Several known names there (Pills,
        Tabet... and even Oscar Aleman, I need to check this further).
        One online thing here :
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7OnRFqeeHo
        only shows stills while the song is playing, but they seem to match the
        contemporaneous event (the show called "Paris qui remue")

        Patrice

        -----Message d'origine-----
        From: Peter L Reid
        Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2011 2:12 PM
        To: Red Hot Jazz
        Subject: [RedHotJazz] Josephine Baker

        Hi All,
        Once again I have fallen prey to cheap CD's, this time a double of
        Josephine Baker.
        Apart from her photo on the covers and actual CD's there is no
        information at all.
        Not a bad CD, and for French music and vocals I prefer her to Edith Piaff.
        Can anybody tell me who the band is that backs her on "You're Driving Me
        Crazy"?
        In the final vocal chorus there is a muted trumpet/cornet(?) behind her
        as well as a rather
        fine trombone.
        Prompted me to play the track twice. I presume they are French, then
        again a lot of
        musicians from the US were in Paris prior to the Second World War.

        Peter L.
      • Howard Rye
        These are listed by Robert Pernet in his Belgian Jazz Discography, because trumpeters Léon Jacobs and René Compère, and trombonist Jules Testaert were
        Message 3 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
          These are listed by Robert Pernet in his Belgian Jazz Discography, because
          trumpeters Léon Jacobs and René Compère, and trombonist Jules Testaert were
          Belgians. Received wisdom is that Jacobs and Testaert are the soloists but I
          am not sure how anyone knows this. Jacobs had been Baker¹s bandleader at the
          Folies Bergère in 1927 and is the leader on some of her best jazz records.

          Joe Hayman, generally listed as the alto saxophonist on the 1931 session was
          an African-American, who came to Europe with Josephine in the Revue Nègre
          and was in the 1929 Blackbirds in Paris. His presence is actually very
          unlikely on a session in Paris in June 1931 because he returned to New York
          from Villafranca on 21 April 1931 and as far as anyone knows did not come
          back to Europe until 1934 when he played with Romeu Silva (often called
          Romeo Silver as an anglicization) who is listed as the tenor player on the
          Baker records. This leads me to feel he may have come back earlier than is
          currently known but June 1931 still seems unlikely.

          Frankly, I doubt there is any more evidence Oscar Aléman is on these discs.

          on 25/09/2011 13:12, Peter L Reid at reid1947@... wrote:

          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > Hi All,
          > Once again I have fallen prey to cheap CD's, this time a double of
          > Josephine Baker.
          > Apart from her photo on the covers and actual CD's there is no
          > information at all.
          > Not a bad CD, and for French music and vocals I prefer her to Edith Piaff.
          > Can anybody tell me who the band is that backs her on "You're Driving Me
          > Crazy"?
          > In the final vocal chorus there is a muted trumpet/cornet(?) behind her
          > as well as a rather
          > fine trombone.
          > Prompted me to play the track twice. I presume they are French, then
          > again a lot of
          > musicians from the US were in Paris prior to the Second World War.
          >
          > Peter L.
          >
          >
          >
          >


          Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
          howard@...
          Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Patrice Champarou
          I replied much, much too fast, trusting two suspicious sources, one book by a Phyllis Rose and, apparently, Scott s page as well. I do not know who invented
          Message 4 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
            I replied much, much too fast, trusting two suspicious sources, one book by
            a Phyllis Rose and,
            apparently, Scott's page as well.
            I do not know who invented the approximative date of July 1930 for some of
            Joséphine's hits, which she was to perform on stage only in late
            September, but it is denied by one Frémeaux compilation, according to which
            the tracks recorded with the Mélodic Jazz du Casino de Paris ranged from
            October 1930 to December 1932 - with a special mention for two of them
            supposed to feature Oscar Aleman, Confessin’, and My Fate Is In Your Hands,
            in June 30th 1931.

            From which I fear that the "collective personnel" actually includes whoever
            was known to have joined the Casino band some time or other.

            Patrice
          • Patrice Champarou
            ... From: Peter L Reid Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2011 2:12 PM To: Red Hot Jazz Subject: [RedHotJazz] Josephine Baker ... Maybe I failed to suspect that this
            Message 5 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
              -----Message d'origine-----
              From: Peter L Reid
              Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2011 2:12 PM
              To: Red Hot Jazz
              Subject: [RedHotJazz] Josephine Baker

              > Not a bad CD, and for French music and vocals I prefer her to Edith Piaff.

              Maybe I failed to suspect that this line requested some kind of, er...
              reaction :-)

              Not trying to argue about whatever is a matter of taste, I strongly reject
              the basis of the comparison. The only link between both singers is,
              obviously, national fame, but the comparison can stop here.

              Although she made her first steps on a stage much, much later than
              Joséphine, Edith Piaf belonged to an older, deeply rooted repertoire
              performed by the likes of Fréhel (with such miserabilist songs as Les mômes
              de la cloche), she did inherit the accordion songs performed in the
              guinguettes, and even happened to pay her tribute to rural French folklore
              (La Julie) - all of which are totally absent from whatever Joséphine ever
              sang. Piaf never performed in any other costume than her sempiternal black
              dress, and she never appeared in fashionable revues meant for the Parisian
              bourgeoisie, with feathers or bananas stuck anywhere onto her body. She was
              a "child from the gutter" just as well, but hers was the French gutter, and
              she stuck to it because a) that was her commercial trademark and b) she just
              could no help, even when she happened to talk in Parisian slang to a
              hairdresser.

              Joséphine Baker's music and lyrics were meant from the start as completely
              "exotic" stuff, unrelated to any French tradition.
              Even her accent permanently denied that she was singing in French, the same
              way as Maurice Chevalier intendedly refused to sound like anything else but
              a French guy performing American songs - when he did. Her songs were
              thoroughly made up for the part she was supposed to play, as the national
              symbol of some imaginary West Indies, Africa, or black America, according to
              the needs and opportunities of the time. "French music", by no means...
              French music is something completely different, not discussed on this list,
              interesting in itself but quite away from any jazz criteria.

              Of course, Edith Piaf also recorded in a nearly-jazz context (Browning, Un
              Monsieur me suit dans la rue...), in which she completely missed the
              instinctive, ambiguous "blue notes" (J'ai dansé avec l'amour) which were
              familiar to most American singers of the time. Technically speaking, she
              could have overcome that, but the national audience rather asked for a
              performer "singing from the heart", as long as she was labeled French.

              Although I am not a true addict, I have to admit that the difference between
              Edith Piaf and most of her contemporaries (Joséphine, and even more
              Mistinguett, included) was that she probably lacked the brightness of a
              formatted professional, but she *could* sing!

              Patrice
            • louis
              I could not have put it any better. I absolutely second what Patrice wrote here. Louis ... From: Patrice Champarou To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com Sent: Sunday,
              Message 6 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
                I could not have put it any better.
                I absolutely second what Patrice wrote here.

                Louis

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Patrice Champarou
                To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2011 7:28 PM
                Subject: Re: [RedHotJazz] Josephine Baker





                -----Message d'origine-----
                From: Peter L Reid
                Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2011 2:12 PM
                To: Red Hot Jazz
                Subject: [RedHotJazz] Josephine Baker

                > Not a bad CD, and for French music and vocals I prefer her to Edith Piaff.

                Maybe I failed to suspect that this line requested some kind of, er...
                reaction :-)

                Not trying to argue about whatever is a matter of taste, I strongly reject
                the basis of the comparison. The only link between both singers is,
                obviously, national fame, but the comparison can stop here.

                Although she made her first steps on a stage much, much later than
                Joséphine, Edith Piaf belonged to an older, deeply rooted repertoire
                performed by the likes of Fréhel (with such miserabilist songs as Les mômes
                de la cloche), she did inherit the accordion songs performed in the
                guinguettes, and even happened to pay her tribute to rural French folklore
                (La Julie) - all of which are totally absent from whatever Joséphine ever
                sang. Piaf never performed in any other costume than her sempiternal black
                dress, and she never appeared in fashionable revues meant for the Parisian
                bourgeoisie, with feathers or bananas stuck anywhere onto her body. She was
                a "child from the gutter" just as well, but hers was the French gutter, and
                she stuck to it because a) that was her commercial trademark and b) she just
                could no help, even when she happened to talk in Parisian slang to a
                hairdresser.

                Joséphine Baker's music and lyrics were meant from the start as completely
                "exotic" stuff, unrelated to any French tradition.
                Even her accent permanently denied that she was singing in French, the same
                way as Maurice Chevalier intendedly refused to sound like anything else but
                a French guy performing American songs - when he did. Her songs were
                thoroughly made up for the part she was supposed to play, as the national
                symbol of some imaginary West Indies, Africa, or black America, according to
                the needs and opportunities of the time. "French music", by no means...
                French music is something completely different, not discussed on this list,
                interesting in itself but quite away from any jazz criteria.

                Of course, Edith Piaf also recorded in a nearly-jazz context (Browning, Un
                Monsieur me suit dans la rue...), in which she completely missed the
                instinctive, ambiguous "blue notes" (J'ai dansé avec l'amour) which were
                familiar to most American singers of the time. Technically speaking, she
                could have overcome that, but the national audience rather asked for a
                performer "singing from the heart", as long as she was labeled French.

                Although I am not a true addict, I have to admit that the difference between
                Edith Piaf and most of her contemporaries (Joséphine, and even more
                Mistinguett, included) was that she probably lacked the brightness of a
                formatted professional, but she *could* sing!

                Patrice





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Howard Rye
                I would go further and say that while I think Jo Baker¹s earlier work is underrated in jazz terms, and her dancing in terms of jazz dance also, on a wider
                Message 7 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
                  I would go further and say that while I think Jo Baker¹s earlier work is
                  underrated in jazz terms, and her dancing in terms of jazz dance also, on a
                  wider canvas of judging vernacular musics on their own terms, Edith Piaf is
                  an incomparably superior and more important artist. One can speak of Bessie
                  Smith or Billie Holiday is the same breath as Piaf, but not La Baker!


                  on 25/09/2011 18:32, louis at louis.iosub@... wrote:

                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > I could not have put it any better.
                  > I absolutely second what Patrice wrote here.
                  >
                  > Louis
                  >
                  > ----- Original Message -----
                  > From: Patrice Champarou
                  > To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RedHotJazz%40yahoogroups.com>
                  > Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2011 7:28 PM
                  > Subject: Re: [RedHotJazz] Josephine Baker
                  >
                  > -----Message d'origine-----
                  > From: Peter L Reid
                  > Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2011 2:12 PM
                  > To: Red Hot Jazz
                  > Subject: [RedHotJazz] Josephine Baker
                  >
                  >> > Not a bad CD, and for French music and vocals I prefer her to Edith Piaff.
                  >
                  > Maybe I failed to suspect that this line requested some kind of, er...
                  > reaction :-)
                  >
                  > Not trying to argue about whatever is a matter of taste, I strongly reject
                  > the basis of the comparison. The only link between both singers is,
                  > obviously, national fame, but the comparison can stop here.
                  >
                  > Although she made her first steps on a stage much, much later than
                  > Joséphine, Edith Piaf belonged to an older, deeply rooted repertoire
                  > performed by the likes of Fréhel (with such miserabilist songs as Les mômes
                  > de la cloche), she did inherit the accordion songs performed in the
                  > guinguettes, and even happened to pay her tribute to rural French folklore
                  > (La Julie) - all of which are totally absent from whatever Joséphine ever
                  > sang. Piaf never performed in any other costume than her sempiternal black
                  > dress, and she never appeared in fashionable revues meant for the Parisian
                  > bourgeoisie, with feathers or bananas stuck anywhere onto her body. She was
                  > a "child from the gutter" just as well, but hers was the French gutter, and
                  > she stuck to it because a) that was her commercial trademark and b) she just
                  > could no help, even when she happened to talk in Parisian slang to a
                  > hairdresser.
                  >
                  > Joséphine Baker's music and lyrics were meant from the start as completely
                  > "exotic" stuff, unrelated to any French tradition.
                  > Even her accent permanently denied that she was singing in French, the same
                  > way as Maurice Chevalier intendedly refused to sound like anything else but
                  > a French guy performing American songs - when he did. Her songs were
                  > thoroughly made up for the part she was supposed to play, as the national
                  > symbol of some imaginary West Indies, Africa, or black America, according to
                  > the needs and opportunities of the time. "French music", by no means...
                  > French music is something completely different, not discussed on this list,
                  > interesting in itself but quite away from any jazz criteria.
                  >
                  > Of course, Edith Piaf also recorded in a nearly-jazz context (Browning, Un
                  > Monsieur me suit dans la rue...), in which she completely missed the
                  > instinctive, ambiguous "blue notes" (J'ai dansé avec l'amour) which were
                  > familiar to most American singers of the time. Technically speaking, she
                  > could have overcome that, but the national audience rather asked for a
                  > performer "singing from the heart", as long as she was labeled French.
                  >
                  > Although I am not a true addict, I have to admit that the difference between
                  > Edith Piaf and most of her contemporaries (Joséphine, and even more
                  > Mistinguett, included) was that she probably lacked the brightness of a
                  > formatted professional, but she *could* sing!
                  >
                  > Patrice
                  >
                  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >


                  Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
                  howard@...
                  Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098




                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Patrice Champarou
                  I suppose everyone here already knows this footage, but although it is a youtube theft , I had never seen it with such picture quality :
                  Message 8 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
                    I suppose everyone here already knows this footage, but although it is a
                    youtube "theft", I had never seen it with such picture quality :
                    http://www.youtube.com/user/OtisSpain#p/u/6/UZvqvNYJmC4
                    I wonder about the way it was shot... according to the info about the DVD
                    "At The Jazz Band Ball", it was a 1932 (not 34) performance shot for a film
                    called Københaven Kalundborg Og? (who would doubt that? ;-)), with a later
                    recorded soundtrack. This is where my brother and I seriously wonder :
                    obviously, Louis is quite away from the microphone at times, whereas the
                    sound is perfect; but on the other hand, it is quite unlikely that he later
                    dubbed his own performance with such a perfect synchronization, so.... a
                    studio recording with carefully hidden mikes, with a fake audience? Does
                    anyone know?
                  • Richard Havers
                    Patrice I ve always believed it was recorded in a studio and then had the audience clip at the start just tacked onto the film. Look at the camera positions,
                    Message 9 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
                      Patrice

                      I've always believed it was recorded in a studio and then had the audience clip at the start just tacked onto the film. Look at the camera positions, they just don't feel right when compared to other theatre films. Even the cutaway to the clapping audience doesn't look real. It's also the same section of the audience each time there's a cutaway.

                      It was shot on 21 October 1933.

                      Cheers

                      Richard

                      On 25 Sep 2011, at 20:36, Patrice Champarou wrote:

                      > I suppose everyone here already knows this footage, but although it is a
                      > youtube "theft", I had never seen it with such picture quality :
                      > http://www.youtube.com/user/OtisSpain#p/u/6/UZvqvNYJmC4
                      > I wonder about the way it was shot... according to the info about the DVD
                      > "At The Jazz Band Ball", it was a 1932 (not 34) performance shot for a film
                      > called K�benhaven Kalundborg Og? (who would doubt that? ;-)), with a later
                      > recorded soundtrack. This is where my brother and I seriously wonder :
                      > obviously, Louis is quite away from the microphone at times, whereas the
                      > sound is perfect; but on the other hand, it is quite unlikely that he later
                      > dubbed his own performance with such a perfect synchronization, so.... a
                      > studio recording with carefully hidden mikes, with a fake audience? Does
                      > anyone know?
                      >
                      >



                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Bob Smith
                      København, Kalundborg og-? simply means Copenhagen, Kalundborg and-? as in where else than Kalundborg and Copenhagen does Louis play? The personnel,
                      Message 10 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
                        "København, Kalundborg og-?" simply means "Copenhagen, Kalundborg and-?" as
                        in "where else than Kalundborg and Copenhagen does Louis play?"
                        The personnel, according to Jos Willems' complete discography of Louis
                        Armstrong - 'All of Me', is:
                        Louis Armstrong (tpt,vcl); Charles D. Johnson (tpt); Lionel Guimaraes (tbn);
                        Peter duCongé, Henry Tyree, Fletcher Allen (reeds); Justo Barreto (p);
                        German Arago (bs); Oliver Tines (d). Recorded, as Richard says, October 21,
                        1933.

                        Regards

                        Bob Smith
                      • Howard Rye
                        This is also Klaus Stratemann s view in Louis Armstrong On The Screen . He thinks the other performances in the film, by Roy Fox, Erik Tuxen, Teddy Brown, and
                        Message 11 of 19 , Sep 25, 2011
                          This is also Klaus Stratemann's view in 'Louis Armstrong On The Screen'. He
                          thinks the other performances in the film, by Roy Fox, Erik Tuxen, Teddy
                          Brown, and Lili Gyenes were also filmed in the studio, Fox and Brown in
                          London.

                          Though Stratemann appears to accept the 21 October 1933 date, this is the
                          date of his first appearance at the Tivoli Concert Hall in Copenhagen. If
                          the footage was not in fact filmed there then presumably any date during
                          Armstrong's trip to Denmark is possible. He left London on 19 October and
                          apparently arrived at Copenhagen the same day. They seem to have had the
                          20th off, appeared at the Tivoli on 21, 22, 23 October, then moved on to
                          Stockholm where they arrived on the 24th. There were two concerts on the
                          21st and 22nd and three on the 23rd.


                          on 25/09/2011 20:49, Richard Havers at rhavers1@... wrote:

                          > Patrice
                          >
                          > I've always believed it was recorded in a studio and then had the audience
                          > clip at the start just tacked onto the film. Look at the camera positions,
                          > they just don't feel right when compared to other theatre films. Even the
                          > cutaway to the clapping audience doesn't look real. It's also the same section
                          > of the audience each time there's a cutaway.
                          >
                          > It was shot on 21 October 1933.
                          >
                          > Cheers
                          >
                          > Richard
                          >
                          > On 25 Sep 2011, at 20:36, Patrice Champarou wrote:
                          >
                          >> I suppose everyone here already knows this footage, but although it is a
                          >> youtube "theft", I had never seen it with such picture quality :
                          >> http://www.youtube.com/user/OtisSpain#p/u/6/UZvqvNYJmC4
                          >> I wonder about the way it was shot... according to the info about the DVD
                          >> "At The Jazz Band Ball", it was a 1932 (not 34) performance shot for a film
                          >> called Københaven Kalundborg Og? (who would doubt that? ;-)), with a later
                          >> recorded soundtrack. This is where my brother and I seriously wonder :
                          >> obviously, Louis is quite away from the microphone at times, whereas the
                          >> sound is perfect; but on the other hand, it is quite unlikely that he later
                          >> dubbed his own performance with such a perfect synchronization, so.... a
                          >> studio recording with carefully hidden mikes, with a fake audience? Does
                          >> anyone know?
                          >>
                          >>
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > ------------------------------------
                          >
                          > ------------------------------------
                          >
                          > Yahoo! Groups Links
                          >
                          >
                          >


                          Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
                          howard@...
                          Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098
                        • Peter L Reid
                          ... Hi All, I don t wish to get in a bun fight over the merits or otherwise of Edith Piaff. I will state up front I have never liked her singing. I would
                          Message 12 of 19 , Sep 26, 2011
                            On 26/09/2011 3:32 AM, louis wrote:
                            >
                            > I could not have put it any better.
                            > I absolutely second what Patrice wrote here.
                            >
                            > Louis
                            >
                            Hi All,
                            I don't wish to get in a bun fight over the merits or otherwise of Edith
                            Piaff.
                            I will state up front I have never liked her singing.
                            I would listen to Bessie Smith or Billie Holiday or Joshephine Baker
                            in preference to Piaff any day,
                            That however is the wonderful aspect of the music people like, and why
                            there is,
                            and has been, such a wide diversification of music types and styles
                            since the
                            year dot. If that wasn't so we wouldn't have this discussion forum would we?
                            My comment re Piaff was not meant to generate a reaction, and I am sorry
                            Patrice if that was what I intimated. It was a personal sentiment only.

                            Peter L.


                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • kimpa1943
                            According to cd Storyville 1018348 the film was recorded at Tivoli Concert Hall, Copenhagen Oct 20 1933. Notes and tour schedule by wellknown
                            Message 13 of 19 , Sep 27, 2011
                              According to cd Storyville 1018348 the film was recorded at Tivoli Concert Hall, Copenhagen Oct 20 1933. Notes and tour schedule by wellknown Armstrong-researcher Gosta Hagglof. The 3 nrs released in cleaned sound. /kim


                              --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, Howard Rye <howard@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > This is also Klaus Stratemann's view in 'Louis Armstrong On The Screen'. He
                              > thinks the other performances in the film, by Roy Fox, Erik Tuxen, Teddy
                              > Brown, and Lili Gyenes were also filmed in the studio, Fox and Brown in
                              > London.
                              >
                              > Though Stratemann appears to accept the 21 October 1933 date, this is the
                              > date of his first appearance at the Tivoli Concert Hall in Copenhagen. If
                              > the footage was not in fact filmed there then presumably any date during
                              > Armstrong's trip to Denmark is possible. He left London on 19 October and
                              > apparently arrived at Copenhagen the same day. They seem to have had the
                              > 20th off, appeared at the Tivoli on 21, 22, 23 October, then moved on to
                              > Stockholm where they arrived on the 24th. There were two concerts on the
                              > 21st and 22nd and three on the 23rd.
                              >
                              >
                              > on 25/09/2011 20:49, Richard Havers at rhavers1@... wrote:
                              >
                              > > Patrice
                              > >
                              > > I've always believed it was recorded in a studio and then had the audience
                              > > clip at the start just tacked onto the film. Look at the camera positions,
                              > > they just don't feel right when compared to other theatre films. Even the
                              > > cutaway to the clapping audience doesn't look real. It's also the same section
                              > > of the audience each time there's a cutaway.
                              > >
                              > > It was shot on 21 October 1933.
                              > >
                              > > Cheers
                              > >
                              > > Richard
                              > >
                              > > On 25 Sep 2011, at 20:36, Patrice Champarou wrote:
                              > >
                              > >> I suppose everyone here already knows this footage, but although it is a
                              > >> youtube "theft", I had never seen it with such picture quality :
                              > >> http://www.youtube.com/user/OtisSpain#p/u/6/UZvqvNYJmC4
                              > >> I wonder about the way it was shot... according to the info about the DVD
                              > >> "At The Jazz Band Ball", it was a 1932 (not 34) performance shot for a film
                              > >> called Københaven Kalundborg Og? (who would doubt that? ;-)), with a later
                              > >> recorded soundtrack. This is where my brother and I seriously wonder :
                              > >> obviously, Louis is quite away from the microphone at times, whereas the
                              > >> sound is perfect; but on the other hand, it is quite unlikely that he later
                              > >> dubbed his own performance with such a perfect synchronization, so.... a
                              > >> studio recording with carefully hidden mikes, with a fake audience? Does
                              > >> anyone know?
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > ------------------------------------
                              > >
                              > > ------------------------------------
                              > >
                              > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                              >
                              > Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
                              > howard@...
                              > Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098
                              >
                            • David Weiner
                              When first seeing this at a collectors group from film collector Dave Chertok in the late 70s, the question of whether Louis was filmed in a studio or on the
                              Message 14 of 19 , Sep 27, 2011
                                When first seeing this at a collectors group from film collector Dave
                                Chertok in the late 70s, the question of whether Louis was filmed in a
                                studio or on the concert stage was discussed. I recall the consensus was
                                that it was done live in the concert hall, clues being the shaky camera work
                                (when dollying in for a closeup of Louis) and the audible audience yells
                                during the choruses of "Tiger Rag" - "One!" "Two!" "Three!" and so on. The
                                audience visual shot almost certainly was tacked on, though.

                                Dave Weiner

                                --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, Howard Rye <howard@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > This is also Klaus Stratemann's view in 'Louis Armstrong On The Screen'.
                                He
                                > thinks the other performances in the film, by Roy Fox, Erik Tuxen, Teddy
                                > Brown, and Lili Gyenes were also filmed in the studio, Fox and Brown in
                                > London.
                                >
                                > Though Stratemann appears to accept the 21 October 1933 date, this is the
                                > date of his first appearance at the Tivoli Concert Hall in Copenhagen. If
                                > the footage was not in fact filmed there then presumably any date during
                                > Armstrong's trip to Denmark is possible. He left London on 19 October and
                                > apparently arrived at Copenhagen the same day. They seem to have had the
                                > 20th off, appeared at the Tivoli on 21, 22, 23 October, then moved on to
                                > Stockholm where they arrived on the 24th. There were two concerts on the
                                > 21st and 22nd and three on the 23rd.
                                >
                                >
                                > on 25/09/2011 20:49, Richard Havers at rhavers1@... wrote:
                                >
                                > > Patrice
                                > >
                                > > I've always believed it was recorded in a studio and then had the
                                audience
                                > > clip at the start just tacked onto the film. Look at the camera
                                positions,
                                > > they just don't feel right when compared to other theatre films. Even
                                the
                                > > cutaway to the clapping audience doesn't look real. It's also the same
                                section
                                > > of the audience each time there's a cutaway.
                                > >
                                > > It was shot on 21 October 1933.
                                > >
                                > > Cheers
                                > >
                                > > Richard
                                > >
                                > > On 25 Sep 2011, at 20:36, Patrice Champarou wrote:
                                > >
                                > >> I suppose everyone here already knows this footage, but although it is
                                a
                                > >> youtube "theft", I had never seen it with such picture quality :
                                > >> http://www.youtube.com/user/OtisSpain#p/u/6/UZvqvNYJmC4
                                > >> I wonder about the way it was shot... according to the info about the
                                DVD
                                > >> "At The Jazz Band Ball", it was a 1932 (not 34) performance shot for a
                                film
                                > >> called Københaven Kalundborg Og? (who would doubt that? ;-)), with a
                                later
                                > >> recorded soundtrack. This is where my brother and I seriously wonder :
                                > >> obviously, Louis is quite away from the microphone at times, whereas
                                the
                                > >> sound is perfect; but on the other hand, it is quite unlikely that he
                                later
                                > >> dubbed his own performance with such a perfect synchronization, so....
                                a
                                > >> studio recording with carefully hidden mikes, with a fake audience?
                                Does
                                > >> anyone know?
                                > >>
                                > >>
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                > > ------------------------------------
                                > >
                                > > ------------------------------------
                                > >
                                > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                > >
                                > >
                                > >
                                >
                                >
                                > Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
                                > howard@...
                                > Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098
                                >




                                ------------------------------------

                                ------------------------------------

                                Yahoo! Groups Links
                              • Howard Rye
                                I hesitate to put this forward without evidence but the notion that it was recorded in the concert hall on Friday 20 October, a day for which no public
                                Message 15 of 19 , Sep 27, 2011
                                  I hesitate to put this forward without evidence but the notion that it was
                                  recorded in the concert hall on Friday 20 October, a day for which no public
                                  engagement is known, but without an audience, certainly fits all the known
                                  facts. This would amount to a film of a rehearsal I suppose. Or is Hagglof
                                  claiming that there was in fact an additional public performance on this
                                  date not reported by earlier sources?


                                  on 27/09/2011 17:25, kimpa1943 at k.altsund@... wrote:

                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > According to cd Storyville 1018348 the film was recorded at Tivoli Concert
                                  > Hall, Copenhagen Oct 20 1933. Notes and tour schedule by wellknown
                                  > Armstrong-researcher Gosta Hagglof. The 3 nrs released in cleaned sound. /kim
                                  >
                                  > --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com <mailto:RedHotJazz%40yahoogroups.com> ,
                                  > Howard Rye <howard@...> wrote:
                                  >> >
                                  >> > This is also Klaus Stratemann's view in 'Louis Armstrong On The Screen'. He
                                  >> > thinks the other performances in the film, by Roy Fox, Erik Tuxen, Teddy
                                  >> > Brown, and Lili Gyenes were also filmed in the studio, Fox and Brown in
                                  >> > London.
                                  >> >
                                  >> > Though Stratemann appears to accept the 21 October 1933 date, this is the
                                  >> > date of his first appearance at the Tivoli Concert Hall in Copenhagen. If
                                  >> > the footage was not in fact filmed there then presumably any date during
                                  >> > Armstrong's trip to Denmark is possible. He left London on 19 October and
                                  >> > apparently arrived at Copenhagen the same day. They seem to have had the
                                  >> > 20th off, appeared at the Tivoli on 21, 22, 23 October, then moved on to
                                  >> > Stockholm where they arrived on the 24th. There were two concerts on the
                                  >> > 21st and 22nd and three on the 23rd.
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> > on 25/09/2011 20:49, Richard Havers at rhavers1@... wrote:
                                  >> >
                                  >>> > > Patrice
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > > I've always believed it was recorded in a studio and then had the
                                  >>> audience
                                  >>> > > clip at the start just tacked onto the film. Look at the camera
                                  >>> positions,
                                  >>> > > they just don't feel right when compared to other theatre films. Even
                                  the
                                  >>> > > cutaway to the clapping audience doesn't look real. It's also the same
                                  >>> section
                                  >>> > > of the audience each time there's a cutaway.
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > > It was shot on 21 October 1933.
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > > Cheers
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > > Richard
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > > On 25 Sep 2011, at 20:36, Patrice Champarou wrote:
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>>> > >> I suppose everyone here already knows this footage, but although it is
                                  a
                                  >>>> > >> youtube "theft", I had never seen it with such picture quality :
                                  >>>> > >> http://www.youtube.com/user/OtisSpain#p/u/6/UZvqvNYJmC4
                                  >>>> > >> I wonder about the way it was shot... according to the info about the
                                  DVD
                                  >>>> > >> "At The Jazz Band Ball", it was a 1932 (not 34) performance shot for a
                                  film
                                  >>>> > >> called Københaven Kalundborg Og? (who would doubt that? ;-)), with a
                                  >>>> later
                                  >>>> > >> recorded soundtrack. This is where my brother and I seriously wonder :
                                  >>>> > >> obviously, Louis is quite away from the microphone at times, whereas
                                  the
                                  >>>> > >> sound is perfect; but on the other hand, it is quite unlikely that he
                                  >>>> later
                                  >>>> > >> dubbed his own performance with such a perfect synchronization, so....
                                  a
                                  >>>> > >> studio recording with carefully hidden mikes, with a fake audience?
                                  Does
                                  >>>> > >> anyone know?
                                  >>>> > >>
                                  >>>> > >>
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > > ------------------------------------
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > > ------------------------------------
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > >
                                  >>> > >
                                  >> >
                                  >> >
                                  >> > Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
                                  >> > howard@...
                                  >> > Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098
                                  >> >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >


                                  Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
                                  howard@...
                                  Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098




                                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                • Peter Reid
                                  1931 Josephine Baker You re Driving Me Crazy Can someone help me with the name of the band please and specifically the muted trumpet (cornet) behind her
                                  Message 16 of 19 , Nov 21, 2014
                                    1931 Josephine Baker
                                    "You're Driving Me Crazy"
                                    Can someone help me with the name of the band please and specifically
                                    the muted trumpet (cornet)
                                    behind her vocal. Another "el cheapo" double CD bereft of any
                                    information except the recording year.

                                    Peter L
                                  • Patrice Champarou
                                    ... From: Peter Reid reid1947@impulse.net.au [RedHotJazz] Sent: Friday, November 21, 2014 12:08 PM To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com Subject: [RedHotJazz]
                                    Message 17 of 19 , Nov 21, 2014
                                      -----Message d'origine-----
                                      From: Peter Reid reid1947@... [RedHotJazz]
                                      Sent: Friday, November 21, 2014 12:08 PM
                                      To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com
                                      Subject: [RedHotJazz] Josephine Baker

                                      1931 Josephine Baker
                                      "You're Driving Me Crazy"
                                      Can someone help me with the name of the band please and specifically
                                      the muted trumpet (cornet)
                                      behind her vocal.

                                      Le Mélodie-Jazz du Casino de Paris sous la direction de M. Edmond Mahieux, I
                                      could not find the personnel but it may be a good starting point.
                                      P.
                                    • ROBERT R. CALDER
                                      Josephine Baker (vcl)  le Melodic Jazz du Casino de Paris : Léon Jacobs, René Compère (tp) Jules Testaert (tb) André Sauré (sopranino,cl,vln) Joe Hayman
                                      Message 18 of 19 , Nov 21, 2014
                                        Josephine Baker (vcl)  le Melodic Jazz du Casino de Paris : Léon Jacobs, René Compère (tp) Jules
                                        Testaert (tb) André Sauré (sopranino,cl,vln) Joe Hayman (as) Romeo Silva (ts) Luis Lopez
                                        Da Silva (bassax) Gabriel Radics (vln) Fritz Stamer (p) Oscar Aleman (g) Sigismund Beck (b)

                                        Bibiano Miranda de Abreu (d) Paris, June 6, 1931



                                        You're drivin' me crazy AAD (F)251277-2
                                        You're the one I care for


                                        This is the extent of personnel details in the Bruyninckx discography I have.

                                        There was no record available of earlier session personnels and this was the last date listed.

                                        Maybe more info has been unearthed, but this is the session asked about.

                                        I see the date was the birthday of a friend of mine who had a fetching photo of Josephine B in his study..
                                        Nice too to be reminded of him,.

                                        Robert
                                      • Peter Reid
                                        Thank you Patrice and Robert for your help. Whoever the trumpeter behind Josephine is, Leon or Rene, he is great. Peter L On 11/22/2014 1:23 AM, ROBERT R.
                                        Message 19 of 19 , Nov 21, 2014
                                          Thank you Patrice and Robert for your help. Whoever the trumpeter behind Josephine is, Leon or Rene,
                                          he is great.

                                          Peter L

                                          On 11/22/2014 1:23 AM, 'ROBERT R. CALDER' serapion@... [RedHotJazz] wrote:
                                           



                                          Josephine Baker (vcl)  le Melodic Jazz du Casino de Paris : Léon Jacobs, René Compère (tp) Jules
                                          Testaert (tb) André Sauré (sopranino,cl,vln) Joe Hayman (as) Romeo Silva (ts) Luis Lopez
                                          Da Silva (bassax) Gabriel Radics (vln) Fritz Stamer (p) Oscar Aleman (g) Sigismund Beck (b)

                                          Bibiano Miranda de Abreu (d) Paris, June 6, 1931

                                          You're drivin' me crazy AAD (F)251277-2
                                          You're the one I care for

                                          This is the extent of personnel details in the Bruyninckx discography I have.

                                          There was no record available of earlier session personnels and this was the last date listed.

                                          Maybe more info has been unearthed, but this is the session asked about.

                                          I see the date was the birthday of a friend of mine who had a fetching photo of Josephine B in his study..
                                          Nice too to be reminded of him,.

                                          Robert


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