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Re: [RedHotJazz] ODJB Victor Timings/JRTD Secret Technology

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  • Michael Rader
    Dave John RT was credited with absolute pitch, but if you want to know his secret, then go to: http://www.jazzoracle.com/team/index.asp and scroll half way
    Message 1 of 2 , Jul 2, 2005
      Dave

      John RT was credited with absolute pitch, but if you want to know his secret, then go to: http://www.jazzoracle.com/team/index.asp and scroll half way down.

      Cheers

      Michael
      RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com schrieb am 02.07.05 04:47:10:
      >
      > Recent acquisition allows comparison CDs, JRT Timeless with RCA Bluebird,
      > ODJB Victors. The latter, a scholarly issue, claims pitch rectification. JRT
      > always did rectify as far as I know. However, only on 5 tracks are the
      > timings similar. 8 have the RCA slower, 6 faster, both by from 1-3 secs. But
      > 4 tracks show a large disparity, with the RCA consistently around 10 sec
      > faster, approx. a 5% speed differential. The tracks are Margie, Palesteena,
      > Home Again Blues, Crazy Blues.
      >
      > My pitch is not good enough to make listening conclusive but the sound of
      > Benny Krueger's alto does sound even nearer to sop. on these tracks than
      > elsewhere, also the trombone is suspiciously high. So I reckon that JRT, as
      > usual, got it right. I guess it is possible to check pitch electronically
      > these days and how did JRT do it, still with his very good ear ?
      >
      > Generally, the Timeless is preferable, more detail, more top and bottom and
      > I particularly note the startling presence of the bass drum on the earliest
      > tracks, my floor shook and these are 1917 acoustics. Whatever happened to
      > the notion that early drummers could not record their full kit ? The RCA
      > also suffers the disadvantage of NoNoise although the underlying converted
      > surface chunter is not as intrusive as in many issues. However,
      > subjectively, the sound --the tone --of the instruments is fuller, richer ,
      > more 'real' on the RCA, particularly noticeable on La Rocca's cornet, which
      > never have I heard so impressively, and Shields clarinet. I guess this
      > indicates that there are no definitive issues and that alternative versions
      > of such seminal works are desirable.
      >
      > I cannot end without comment on the music. Generally extremely fine and
      > worthy of far greater esteem than the critics of the post-war generation
      > allowed. 'Margie', floating along at the slower JRT tempo is a particularly
      > fine track in no way ,to me, demanding the 'listless ' label bestowed upon
      > it by the renowned Max Harrison in 'Essential Jazz Records'-1.
      >
      >
      >
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      >
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    • David Brown
      MichaelYes, I thought you d know. Thanks. JRT covers pitch on www.jazzrescue.com under FAQs.What this reveals is that it is not an exact science and this
      Message 2 of 2 , Jul 2, 2005
        Michael

        Yes, I thought you'd know. Thanks. JRT covers pitch on www.jazzrescue.com
        under FAQs.

        What this reveals is that it is not an exact science and this would
        certainly account for the minor discrepancies from one pitch corrected
        edition to another as in the Timeless v.v. RCA ODJBs. However, with a 5%
        variation somebody has got it wrong. My piano tuner turned up with a wee box
        which reads off the pitch and I guess that a similar gadget must be
        applicable to recordings. Would we back JRT's redoubtable ear against this ?

        Above all we have the question as to whether the musicians are playing 'in
        tune'. 'Close enough for jazz' was the old pro's saying and also if tuning
        to the piano we know the state of many of those in the Jazz world.

        Dave



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