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Re: [RedHotJazz] Re: Jelly Roll Morton lecture

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  • Dan Van Landingham
    You right of course,but having been a shortwave radio buff since I was a kid,I owned num- erous radios from 1930s(depression era consoles and table models to
    Message 1 of 12 , Jun 5, 2008
      You right of course,but having been a shortwave radio buff since I was a kid,I owned num-
      erous radios from 1930s(depression era consoles and table models to ham radio sets th-
      at covered all of the international shortwave frequencies and the bands the hams used to
      broadcast in code)to the mid 1960s.I can say that I've owned them from A(Airline,Atwat-
      er Kent circa 1936)to Zenith(the Transoceanics from 1946 to 1953).Those sets have to
      be played otherwise the components will fail on a moment's notice.I've had that happen to
      me on numerous occasions.I also owned a couple of Grundigs and a Loewe Optima which
      is still in storage in Lometa,Texas.On one occasion,I caught a broadcast from VOA and
      heard Dick Sudhalter on cornet.I was not all impressed with him:give me Red Nichols or
      Bobby Hackett any time.

      --- On Thu, 6/5/08, hvandervink <vanderha@...> wrote:

      From: hvandervink <vanderha@...>
      Subject: [RedHotJazz] Re: Jelly Roll Morton lecture
      To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com
      Date: Thursday, June 5, 2008, 2:25 PM







      Hi Dan,

      Usually I listen to the BBC on-line at http://www.bbc co.uk/radio4/
      <http://www.bbc co.uk/radio4/> . It is a bit easier than cranking up
      the old short-wave.

      Hans

      --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogro ups.com, Dan Van Landingham
      <danvanlandingham@ ...> wrote:
      >
      > What frequency is BBC4 on?Since I'm here on the west coast of the
      U.S.,I'll have to figure
      > out the time here.I've got an old post World War II general coverage
      short wave receiver in
      > my shed I can bring in and fashion a jury rigged antenna for it.If
      memory serves,I have to
      > add eight or nine hours to Pacific Daylight Savings Time to get
      GMT/UTC.I'm familiar with
      > Jelly's transcriptions of his music but as to his lectures I am
      not.What I do remember is
      > he used to have some business cards that claimed he was the inventor
      of jazz,stomp and'
      > swing in the year of 1902.Has anyone came up with any proof regarding
      his birth year?Y-
      > ears ago,I had read it was 1885.
      > --- On Thu, 6/5/08, Robert Greenwood &lt;robertgreenwood _54uk@... &gt;
      wrote:
      >
      > From: Robert Greenwood &lt;robertgreenwood _54uk@... &gt;
      > Subject: [RedHotJazz] Re: Jelly Roll Morton lecture
      > To: RedHotJazz@yahoogro ups.com
      > Date: Thursday, June 5, 2008, 3:11 AM
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > This is a reminder that this event is taking place at the British
      > Museum this evening.
      > Marybeth Hamilton also presents this Saturday's edition of The
      > Archive Hour on BBC Radio 4 at 8.00 pm when she will also discuss the
      > Jelly Roll Morton Library of Congress recordings.
      > And those who heard and enjoyed the Ken Colyer edition of BBC Radio
      > 3's Jazz Library which was broadcast on 18th April, might like to
      > know that the Listeners' Feedback edition of Jazz Library is due to
      > go out at 10.30 pm on Friday 27th June and includes further coverage
      > of Ken's recorded output as well as the Christie Brothers Stompers'
      > version of Creole Song that should have been played in the original
      > programme instead of Heebie Jeebies.
      >
      > Robert Greenwood
      >
      > --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogro ups.com, "Marco Romano" &lt;m15romano@
      ..&gt;
      > wrote:
      > &gt;
      > &gt;
      > &gt; Thank you Mr. Greenwood. Here is the booking details page,
      > &gt;
      > &gt;
      > http://www.britishm useum.org/ whats_on/ events_calendar/ american_
      music.a
      > sp\
      > &gt; x
      > &gt;
      > &lt;http://www.britishm useum.org/ whats_on/ events_calendar/
      american_ music.
      > as\
      > &gt; px&gt;
      > &gt;
      > &gt; I hope that we can have a report from any British person who
      might
      > &gt; attend.
      > &gt;
      > &gt; Marco Romano.
      > &gt;
      > &gt;
      > &gt; --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogro ups.com, "Robert Greenwood"
      > &gt; &lt;robertgreenwood _ 54uk@&gt; wrote:
      > &gt; &gt;
      > &gt; &gt; Marybeth Hamilton, of Birkbeck College, and author of In
      Search
      > of the
      > &gt; &gt; Blues is to deliver a lecture on the Jelly Roll Morton
      Library of
      > &gt; &gt; Congress recordings at 6.30 pm on Thursday 5th June in the
      > Stevenson
      > &gt; &gt; Lecture Theatre at the British Museum. The lecture is
      entitled
      > &gt; American
      > &gt; &gt; Music: Imagining New Orleans and is one of the events to tie
      in
      > with
      > &gt; &gt; the BM exhibition The American Scene: Prints from Hopper to
      > Pollock.
      > &gt; &gt; Excellent exhibition, by the way�
      > &gt; &gt; Robert Greenwood
      > &gt; &gt;
      > &gt;
      > &gt;
      > &gt;
      > &gt;
      > &gt; [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > &gt;
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


















      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Robert Greenwood
      ... There s not a lot to report, Marco. I suspect that what I heard last night was a preview of what we will hear tomorrow evening on Radio 4. Marybeth
      Message 2 of 12 , Jun 6, 2008
        --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, "Marco Romano" <m15romano@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > Thank you Mr. Greenwood.
        >
        > I hope that you will be attending the event so that you can give a
        > verdict of the lecture.
        >
        > Marco Romano.
        >

        There's not a lot to report, Marco. I suspect that what I heard last
        night was a preview of what we will hear tomorrow evening on Radio 4.
        Marybeth Hamilton is an historian and doesn't even seem particularly
        interested in, or to have any great love for, the music. She
        certainly did not discuss Morton's music and concentrated instead on
        the stories of gamblers, hoodlums, and sharp dressers, and played
        substantial extracts from the Lomax interviews. I suspect that, as an
        academic, she has found in the Morton Library of Congress recordings
        a Subject with a capital S. Perhaps I am cynical, but this all helps
        to retain her academic tenure and, after all, her audience is
        probably a bunch of students and other academics with no interest
        whatsoever in the likes of Jelly Roll Morton. Her interest in Morton
        seems not to extend beyond the LoC sessions which she seems to treat
        as a sociological phenomenon. Alarm bells rang for me when, at the
        end of her lecture, no questions from the floor were invited. On the
        whole, she was very patronising about the interest shown in New
        Orleans music and viewed it as mere romanticism. We heard the usual
        stuff about how the Red Hot Peppers sides were highly prized by white
        collectors but were a matter of indifference to African-Americans.
        Oh, and she implied that Mamie Desdumes was maybe a figment of
        Jelly's colourful imagination.
        My verdict is that, with so much real expert knowledge around, a much
        better, more informed, and more sympathetic lecture could have been
        given, but not by Dr Hamilton.

        Robert Greenwood
      • Tony Standish
        Welll, I googled Mamie D. and you can get her DVDs on the net. So she must exist Did the lady deny the existence of Black Benny, too? Maybe he wasn t a bad,
        Message 3 of 12 , Jun 6, 2008
          Welll, I googled Mamie D. and you can get her DVDs on the net. So she must
          exist Did the lady deny the existence of Black Benny, too? Maybe he wasn't a
          bad, bad man! Maybe he didn't exist either..
          Robert - I hope the seats were comfortable, and was there sherry?
          And who were those white collectors, 'way back then? Even Derrick
          Stewart-Baxter would have been a mere babe, or a glint in his daddy's eye.
          Sometimes our burden is so hard to bear....
          Tony Standish
          ----- Original Message -----
          From: "Robert Greenwood" <robertgreenwood_54uk@...>
          To: <RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Friday, June 06, 2008 7:37 PM
          Subject: [RedHotJazz] Re: Jelly Roll Morton lecture


          > --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, "Marco Romano" <m15romano@...>
          > wrote:
          >>
          >> Thank you Mr. Greenwood.
          >>
          >> I hope that you will be attending the event so that you can give a
          >> verdict of the lecture.
          >>
          >> Marco Romano.
          >>
          >
          > There's not a lot to report, Marco. I suspect that what I heard last
          > night was a preview of what we will hear tomorrow evening on Radio 4.
          > Marybeth Hamilton is an historian and doesn't even seem particularly
          > interested in, or to have any great love for, the music. She
          > certainly did not discuss Morton's music and concentrated instead on
          > the stories of gamblers, hoodlums, and sharp dressers, and played
          > substantial extracts from the Lomax interviews. I suspect that, as an
          > academic, she has found in the Morton Library of Congress recordings
          > a Subject with a capital S. Perhaps I am cynical, but this all helps
          > to retain her academic tenure and, after all, her audience is
          > probably a bunch of students and other academics with no interest
          > whatsoever in the likes of Jelly Roll Morton. Her interest in Morton
          > seems not to extend beyond the LoC sessions which she seems to treat
          > as a sociological phenomenon. Alarm bells rang for me when, at the
          > end of her lecture, no questions from the floor were invited. On the
          > whole, she was very patronising about the interest shown in New
          > Orleans music and viewed it as mere romanticism. We heard the usual
          > stuff about how the Red Hot Peppers sides were highly prized by white
          > collectors but were a matter of indifference to African-Americans.
          > Oh, and she implied that Mamie Desdumes was maybe a figment of
          > Jelly's colourful imagination.
          > My verdict is that, with so much real expert knowledge around, a much
          > better, more informed, and more sympathetic lecture could have been
          > given, but not by Dr Hamilton.
          >
          > Robert Greenwood
          >
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
        • Robert Greenwood
          ... Hahaha. No, Tony, the seats were quite uncomfortable and there was no sherry and no canapés. She did say that many of the LoC recordings were unplayable
          Message 4 of 12 , Jun 6, 2008
            --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, "Tony Standish" <mojohand@...> wrote:

            > Robert - I hope the seats were comfortable, and was there sherry?

            > Sometimes our burden is so hard to bear....
            > Tony Standish

            Hahaha. No, Tony, the seats were quite uncomfortable and there was no
            sherry and no canapés. She did say that many of the LoC recordings were
            unplayable on the BBC but we were not treated to any of the unplayables
            last night, either. I look forward to her lecture on Speckled Red's The
            Dirtier Dozens and The Dirtiest Dozens…
            Robert
          • Marco Romano
            Hello Mr. Greenwood. Thank you very much for taking time out to give all of us on this group your erudite version of the lecture. In my opinion Marybeth
            Message 5 of 12 , Jun 6, 2008
              Hello Mr. Greenwood.

              Thank you very much for taking time out to give all of us on this
              group your erudite version of the lecture.

              In my opinion Marybeth Hamilton could not be a very good historian if
              she discounts Mamie Desdunes as being a real person. There is a whole
              lot of information by Mr. Peter Hanley about her and her family at,

              http://www.doctorjazz.co.uk/portnewor.html

              I am going to make an attempt to listen to the BBC radio program on
              Sunday. Thank you.

              Marco Romano.

              --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Greenwood"
              <robertgreenwood_54uk@...> wrote:
              >
              > There's not a lot to report, Marco. I suspect that what I heard
              last
              > night was a preview of what we will hear tomorrow evening on Radio
              4.
              > Marybeth Hamilton is an historian and doesn't even seem
              particularly
              > interested in, or to have any great love for, the music. She
              > certainly did not discuss Morton's music and concentrated instead
              on
              > the stories of gamblers, hoodlums, and sharp dressers, and played
              > substantial extracts from the Lomax interviews. I suspect that, as
              an
              > academic, she has found in the Morton Library of Congress
              recordings
              > a Subject with a capital S. Perhaps I am cynical, but this all
              helps
              > to retain her academic tenure and, after all, her audience is
              > probably a bunch of students and other academics with no interest
              > whatsoever in the likes of Jelly Roll Morton. Her interest in
              Morton
              > seems not to extend beyond the LoC sessions which she seems to
              treat
              > as a sociological phenomenon. Alarm bells rang for me when, at the
              > end of her lecture, no questions from the floor were invited. On
              the
              > whole, she was very patronising about the interest shown in New
              > Orleans music and viewed it as mere romanticism. We heard the usual
              > stuff about how the Red Hot Peppers sides were highly prized by
              white
              > collectors but were a matter of indifference to African-Americans.
              > Oh, and she implied that Mamie Desdumes was maybe a figment of
              > Jelly's colourful imagination.
              > My verdict is that, with so much real expert knowledge around, a
              much
              > better, more informed, and more sympathetic lecture could have been
              > given, but not by Dr Hamilton.
              >
              > Robert Greenwood
              >
            • Robert Greenwood
              ... Dr Hamilton gave no indication whatever that she had looked into Mike Meddings excellent web site or had taken into account the invaluable research work
              Message 6 of 12 , Jun 6, 2008
                --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, "Marco Romano" <m15romano@...> wrote:
                >
                > Hello Mr. Greenwood.
                >
                > Thank you very much for taking time out to give all of us on this
                > group your erudite version of the lecture.
                >
                > In my opinion Marybeth Hamilton could not be a very good historian if
                > she discounts Mamie Desdunes as being a real person. There is a whole
                > lot of information by Mr. Peter Hanley about her and her family at,
                >
                > http://www.doctorjazz.co.uk/portnewor.html
                >

                Dr Hamilton gave no indication whatever that she had looked into Mike
                Meddings' excellent web site or had taken into account the invaluable
                research work found there, but as someone hidden away in a university
                department, she is never likely to be called to account by any of her
                colleagues. I do not dismiss academia, by the way. I am a graduate
                myself and have a daughter at university. I just think that academic
                standards should be higher and that research should be thorough. Mamie
                Desdunes last night was written off as a three-fingered prostitute
                Jelly had known in his youth. Hamilton's tone implied that maybe
                Desdunes never existed.
                Robert
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