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Earres PRINCE : the lost pianist

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  • Jeff PITET from France
    I m Jeff PITET and I run the French website dedicated to Cab CALLOWAY ... I wrote several short articles about musicians from his orchestra and I m currently
    Message 1 of 5 , Feb 28, 2008
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      I'm Jeff PITET and I run the French website dedicated to Cab CALLOWAY
      : www.thehidehoblog.com

      I wrote several short articles about musicians from his orchestra and
      I'm currently writing one about Earres PRINCE.
      And I must admit that it's more than difficult. Even his birth date
      (1907? 1903 ?) and his death are unknown to me.
      I've managed to get some clues about his first sides with the Happy
      Four, Sarah Wilson, Andy Preer and the Missourians, of course thanks
      to the REDHOTJAZZ website and Collectors Item 06 LP.
      Then he's fired in mars 1931 by Cab who has wanted to hire Benny Payne
      for a longtime.
      He's back on the saddle with his longtime friend Harry Dial in 1946.
      But between those 2 dates, there's nothing. Dial fires Prince due to
      his "lack of talent", although there were friends since childhood
      (with sax player Andy Brown and trumpet player Shirley Clay).

      Prince reappears in 1951 with The Four Buddies and The Falcons, two
      doo-wop groups. Then he totally disappears, except for an interview by
      Frank DRIGGS in 1956, with Reuben Reeves and Harry Dial
      (http://library.umkc.edu/spec-col/driggs-inv.htm), but I can't access it.
      Where has he gone ? When did he die ?
      I'm must say that I'm confused: I've asked many people in France,
      England, Switzerland and Belgium but without result.

      I was hoping that perhaps one of you could have any information about
      this poor fellow, forgotten by every dictionary. The tiniest clue
      would be very helpful!

      Thank you for your help.
    • Howard Rye
      International Musician reports of The Missourians show him as Earres M. Prince, which, given how rare the name is, strongly suggests that he is the Earres
      Message 2 of 5 , Feb 28, 2008
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        International Musician reports of The Missourians show him as Earres M.
        Prince, which, given how rare the name is, strongly suggests that he is the
        Earres Martin Prince who registered for the draft in St. Louis in 1918, even
        though he is not shown as a musician and was working for the MK&T Freight
        Office. If this identification holds good he was born in Jackson, Missouri,
        on 26 September 1896.

        The Earres M. Prince born 1896 was a Private in the U.S. Army whose service
        started on 26 September 1918, and who died on 23 April 1957 and is buried in
        Long Island National Cemetery.

        He is not indexed in any census under the name Earres Prince. No doubt some
        lateral thinking about indexing errors would uncover him.

        It must be stressed that there is no proof that Earres Martin Prince
        1896-1957 is the pianist!


        Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
        howard@...
        Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098
      • Bob Eagle
        My notes are as follows: EARRES PRINCE (piano) was born Earres M. Prince on 26 September 1896, possibly at Texas, Lee County, Arkansas. He enlisted in the US
        Message 3 of 5 , Feb 28, 2008
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          My notes are as follows:


          EARRES PRINCE (piano) was born Earres M. Prince on 26 September 1896, possibly at Texas, Lee County, Arkansas.
          He enlisted in the US Army on 26 September 1918.
          His Army service ended on 28 November 1918, when he was still a Private.
          He recorded at New York City in 1925 for OKeh, behind Sara Martin.
          He died on 23 April 1957 and was interred at Long Island National Cemetery, 2040 Wellwood Avenue, Farmingdale, New York 11735-1211, Section 2a Site 4499, on 26 April 1957.

          So, now we have identical birth and death dates but some discrepancy as to origin. I regret to say that I have no idea of the source of the report as to Arkansas origin.

          Bob

          Howard Rye <howard@...> wrote:
          International Musician reports of The Missourians show him as Earres M.
          Prince, which, given how rare the name is, strongly suggests that he is the
          Earres Martin Prince who registered for the draft in St. Louis in 1918, even
          though he is not shown as a musician and was working for the MK&T Freight
          Office. If this identification holds good he was born in Jackson, Missouri,
          on 26 September 1896.

          The Earres M. Prince born 1896 was a Private in the U.S. Army whose service
          started on 26 September 1918, and who died on 23 April 1957 and is buried in
          Long Island National Cemetery.

          He is not indexed in any census under the name Earres Prince. No doubt some
          lateral thinking about indexing errors would uncover him.

          It must be stressed that there is no proof that Earres Martin Prince
          1896-1957 is the pianist!

          Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
          howard@...
          Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098






          ---------------------------------
          Get the name you always wanted with the new y7mail email address.

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Jeff PITET from France
          Howard, Bob, Thank you very much for those great news (for me!). I had a doubt about that Earres M. Prince, but that first name is quite rare. It is difficult
          Message 4 of 5 , Feb 28, 2008
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            Howard, Bob,

            Thank you very much for those great news (for me!). I had a doubt
            about that Earres M. Prince, but that first name is quite rare.
            It is difficult to get an idea about his talent because he never
            really had a chance to get a prominent rank with the tunes he played.
            Unfortunately, even his good friend Harry Dial fired him in 1946.

            There's a title named after him, "Prince's boogie", that he certainly
            wrote. Alfred Bell recorded it at the piano with Harry Dial's quartet
            (march 1950). There's only one broadcast of Dial with Prince at the
            piano recorded on august 27, 1946 (IAJRC7), but I don't own it. If you
            have the opportunity to listen to it, please tell me what you think
            about his playing.
            It seems that the last job Prince had was pianist at the LUCKY's (a
            stipper club) in New York, with Lester Boone and Harry Dial. When he
            died he was replaced by Jimmy Reynolds. So, this 1956 interview by
            Frank DRIGGS seems to be his final testimony.


            Whatever happens next, I would like to thank you sincerely for the
            wonderful help you provided me. So fast, so efficient!


            Jeff PITET


            --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, Bob Eagle <prof_hi_jinx@...> wrote:
            >
            > My notes are as follows:
            >
            >
            > EARRES PRINCE (piano) was born Earres M. Prince on 26 September
            1896, possibly at Texas, Lee County, Arkansas.
            > He enlisted in the US Army on 26 September 1918.
            > His Army service ended on 28 November 1918, when he was still a
            Private.
            > He recorded at New York City in 1925 for OKeh, behind Sara Martin.
            > He died on 23 April 1957 and was interred at Long Island National
            Cemetery, 2040 Wellwood Avenue, Farmingdale, New York 11735-1211,
            Section 2a Site 4499, on 26 April 1957.
            >
            > So, now we have identical birth and death dates but some
            discrepancy as to origin. I regret to say that I have no idea of the
            source of the report as to Arkansas origin.
            >
            > Bob
            >
            > Howard Rye <howard@...> wrote:
            > International Musician reports of The Missourians show him
            as Earres M.
            > Prince, which, given how rare the name is, strongly suggests that he
            is the
            > Earres Martin Prince who registered for the draft in St. Louis in
            1918, even
            > though he is not shown as a musician and was working for the MK&T
            Freight
            > Office. If this identification holds good he was born in Jackson,
            Missouri,
            > on 26 September 1896.
            >
            > The Earres M. Prince born 1896 was a Private in the U.S. Army whose
            service
            > started on 26 September 1918, and who died on 23 April 1957 and is
            buried in
            > Long Island National Cemetery.
            >
            > He is not indexed in any census under the name Earres Prince. No
            doubt some
            > lateral thinking about indexing errors would uncover him.
            >
            > It must be stressed that there is no proof that Earres Martin Prince
            > 1896-1957 is the pianist!
            >
            > Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
            > howard@...
            > Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > ---------------------------------
            > Get the name you always wanted with the new y7mail email address.
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
          • Bob Eagle
            Howard is correct in implying that an unusual spelling is no guarantee of finding someone in the census. Using the next of kin in the 1918 draft card (Corra),
            Message 5 of 5 , Feb 28, 2008
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              Howard is correct in implying that an unusual spelling is no guarantee of finding someone in the census.

              Using the next of kin in the 1918 draft card (Corra), we find Cora and her husband Greely (both aged 38) at 2630 Randolph Street, St Louis in the 1910 Census, with 13-year-old son Eris (sic). Cora had had 3 children, of whom only 2 survived to 1910.

              Living at the same address (!) was the family of Harry Dial, then aged 3, born in Alabama to Charles and Clara Dial. This accords with what we know of Harry.

              The presence of Dial in the same building clinches it for me. Such long coincidences just don't happen without cause.

              Greely (a butcher) and Cora had been listed in St Louis in 1900, with son Eris (sic) M. Prince, whose birth month was September 1896, born MO.

              Just when it seemed we would all know how to pronounce Earres (as Eris), the 1920 Census lists him as Areas, with the family name spelled Prinz. He was a laborer at that time.

              He seems not to be listed in the 1930 census, but his 1942 draft card has him in NY, with wife Ruth, and he was working at Chancellor Manor, Newark. I assume this was a club, but it is only an assumption.

              None of this has any connection with Arkansas, so I think that doubt has been resolved, also.

              Bob


              Jeff PITET from France <thehidehoblog@...> wrote:
              Howard, Bob,

              Thank you very much for those great news (for me!). I had a doubt
              about that Earres M. Prince, but that first name is quite rare.
              It is difficult to get an idea about his talent because he never
              really had a chance to get a prominent rank with the tunes he played.
              Unfortunately, even his good friend Harry Dial fired him in 1946.

              There's a title named after him, "Prince's boogie", that he certainly
              wrote. Alfred Bell recorded it at the piano with Harry Dial's quartet
              (march 1950). There's only one broadcast of Dial with Prince at the
              piano recorded on august 27, 1946 (IAJRC7), but I don't own it. If you
              have the opportunity to listen to it, please tell me what you think
              about his playing.
              It seems that the last job Prince had was pianist at the LUCKY's (a
              stipper club) in New York, with Lester Boone and Harry Dial. When he
              died he was replaced by Jimmy Reynolds. So, this 1956 interview by
              Frank DRIGGS seems to be his final testimony.

              Whatever happens next, I would like to thank you sincerely for the
              wonderful help you provided me. So fast, so efficient!

              Jeff PITET

              --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, Bob Eagle <prof_hi_jinx@...> wrote:
              >
              > My notes are as follows:
              >
              >
              > EARRES PRINCE (piano) was born Earres M. Prince on 26 September
              1896, possibly at Texas, Lee County, Arkansas.
              > He enlisted in the US Army on 26 September 1918.
              > His Army service ended on 28 November 1918, when he was still a
              Private.
              > He recorded at New York City in 1925 for OKeh, behind Sara Martin.
              > He died on 23 April 1957 and was interred at Long Island National
              Cemetery, 2040 Wellwood Avenue, Farmingdale, New York 11735-1211,
              Section 2a Site 4499, on 26 April 1957.
              >
              > So, now we have identical birth and death dates but some
              discrepancy as to origin. I regret to say that I have no idea of the
              source of the report as to Arkansas origin.
              >
              > Bob
              >
              > Howard Rye <howard@...> wrote:
              > International Musician reports of The Missourians show him
              as Earres M.
              > Prince, which, given how rare the name is, strongly suggests that he
              is the
              > Earres Martin Prince who registered for the draft in St. Louis in
              1918, even
              > though he is not shown as a musician and was working for the MK&T
              Freight
              > Office. If this identification holds good he was born in Jackson,
              Missouri,
              > on 26 September 1896.
              >
              > The Earres M. Prince born 1896 was a Private in the U.S. Army whose
              service
              > started on 26 September 1918, and who died on 23 April 1957 and is
              buried in
              > Long Island National Cemetery.
              >
              > He is not indexed in any census under the name Earres Prince. No
              doubt some
              > lateral thinking about indexing errors would uncover him.
              >
              > It must be stressed that there is no proof that Earres Martin Prince
              > 1896-1957 is the pianist!
              >
              > Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
              > howard@...
              > Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ---------------------------------
              > Get the name you always wanted with the new y7mail email address.
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >






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