Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [RedHotJazz] Another myth?

Expand Messages
  • Howard Rye
    ... The Camille Allen recording is believed to have been made for Sunset. This - and indeed the identification of the singer and the recording date - rests on
    Message 1 of 5 , Sep 12, 2006
    • 0 Attachment
      on 12/9/06 6:17, Mordechai Litzman at folke613@... wrote:

      > (On the RHJ site there is an unreleased test pressing from 1922 with Sonny
      > Clay on piano and Camille Allen, vocal. Is this recording from those returned
      > from Arto? And while you check this out, listen to "Punishing the Piano" with
      > Clay from 1925 on the Triumph label; another "fingerbuster").

      The Camille Allen recording is believed to have been made for Sunset. This -
      and indeed the identification of the singer and the recording date - rests
      on information given by Sonny Clay, who also recalled a second title which
      does not appear to have survived.

      It is unreleased only on 78. It can be heard on LPs (Harlequin HQ2007,
      Fantasy SHN4033 - this latter is the correct number, there is a typo in B &
      G) and CD (Document DOCD5518).

      Howard Rye, 20 Coppermill Lane, London, England, E17 7HB
      howard@...
      Tel/FAX: +44 20 8521 1098
    • spacelights
      ... Creole Jazz Band) made a couple of recordings in Los Angeles/Santa Monica in July 1922 on the Nordskog label [snip] ... masters were sent to the Arto
      Message 2 of 5 , Sep 12, 2006
      • 0 Attachment
        --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, Mordechai Litzman <folke613@...> wrote:
        >
        >As you all know Spike's Seven Pods of Peppers (Kid Ory's Original
        Creole Jazz Band) made a couple of recordings in Los Angeles/Santa
        Monica in July 1922 on the Nordskog label

        [snip]

        > Since there was no record pressing plant in the west, the wax
        masters were sent to the Arto pressing plant in Orange, New Jersey,
        and it appears that a number of these wax masters melted in transport.
        To make matters worse, the Arto plant went bankrupt in 1923, and some
        80 recordings were lost.
        > According to some accounts, among those were recordings of Jelly
        Roll Morton and King Oliver.
        > However, in a well researched article on early California recordings
        by Allan Sutton, there is a footnote stating that some of the masters
        were returned and that they are in the possession of a Nordskog family
        member.
        > Does anybody have any information about this, or is this just
        another myth?
        >
        > (On the RHJ site there is an unreleased test pressing from 1922 with
        Sonny Clay on piano and Camille Allen, vocal. Is this recording from
        those returned from Arto? And while you check this out, listen to
        "Punishing the Piano" with Clay from 1925 on the Triumph label;
        another "fingerbuster").


        Very intriguing stuff--notes for 'Sonny Clay - West Coast Jazz' (Frog
        DGF 53) state that the Camille Allen test was owned by Clay himself.
        "Punishing The Piano" is a showpiece, indeed...

        Clay also recorded for the Sunset label around this time, which
        reminded me of the mysterious 'Sunset Band' test of "Wolverine
        Stomp"/"Ivy" (issued on Frog DGF28). Might this be a California group
        after all? 'Storyville 2000-1' questions the assertion that it's
        Carroll Dickerson, and mentions:

        "...similar pressing characteristics between the test, various
        Rodeheaver pressings and a number of Paramount releases... Max
        [Vreede] concluded that the same pressing plant was probably
        responsible for all of these and this could account for the use of a
        Puritan label face down on the Sunset test..."

        Could this have been pressed by the Arto plant, as some sort of early
        test for the Sunset label? Is there any known connection between
        Sunshine (a label apparently reserved to paste on Ory's Nordskog
        records) and Sunset? Coincidence perhaps, but the one illustration of
        a Sunset record in Rust's 'The American Record Label Book' shows
        another Morton tune, "Milenburg [sic] Joys" on Sunset 1117.
      • Mordechai Litzman
        For a very interesting and detailed history of the early California labels, and the history of Sunset records, go to Google and look up California Record
        Message 3 of 5 , Sep 12, 2006
        • 0 Attachment
          For a very interesting and detailed history of the early California labels, and the history of Sunset records, go to Google and look up "California Record Labels and Studios in the early 20's". In addition to the historical information, there are color pictures of all the labels.
          It appears that the Sunset records were pressed in Indiana at the Starr Piano Recording Co.

          spacelights <spacelights@...> wrote: --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, Mordechai Litzman <folke613@...> wrote:
          >
          >As you all know Spike's Seven Pods of Peppers (Kid Ory's Original
          Creole Jazz Band) made a couple of recordings in Los Angeles/Santa
          Monica in July 1922 on the Nordskog label

          [snip]

          > Since there was no record pressing plant in the west, the wax
          masters were sent to the Arto pressing plant in Orange, New Jersey,
          and it appears that a number of these wax masters melted in transport.
          To make matters worse, the Arto plant went bankrupt in 1923, and some
          80 recordings were lost.
          > According to some accounts, among those were recordings of Jelly
          Roll Morton and King Oliver.
          > However, in a well researched article on early California recordings
          by Allan Sutton, there is a footnote stating that some of the masters
          were returned and that they are in the possession of a Nordskog family
          member.
          > Does anybody have any information about this, or is this just
          another myth?
          >
          > (On the RHJ site there is an unreleased test pressing from 1922 with
          Sonny Clay on piano and Camille Allen, vocal. Is this recording from
          those returned from Arto? And while you check this out, listen to
          "Punishing the Piano" with Clay from 1925 on the Triumph label;
          another "fingerbuster").

          Very intriguing stuff--notes for 'Sonny Clay - West Coast Jazz' (Frog
          DGF 53) state that the Camille Allen test was owned by Clay himself.
          "Punishing The Piano" is a showpiece, indeed...

          Clay also recorded for the Sunset label around this time, which
          reminded me of the mysterious 'Sunset Band' test of "Wolverine
          Stomp"/"Ivy" (issued on Frog DGF28). Might this be a California group
          after all? 'Storyville 2000-1' questions the assertion that it's
          Carroll Dickerson, and mentions:

          "...similar pressing characteristics between the test, various
          Rodeheaver pressings and a number of Paramount releases... Max
          [Vreede] concluded that the same pressing plant was probably
          responsible for all of these and this could account for the use of a
          Puritan label face down on the Sunset test..."

          Could this have been pressed by the Arto plant, as some sort of early
          test for the Sunset label? Is there any known connection between
          Sunshine (a label apparently reserved to paste on Ory's Nordskog
          records) and Sunset? Coincidence perhaps, but the one illustration of
          a Sunset record in Rust's 'The American Record Label Book' shows
          another Morton tune, "Milenburg [sic] Joys" on Sunset 1117.






          ---------------------------------
          Do you Yahoo!?
          Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail.

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.