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Re: [RedHotJazz] Jazz without New Orleans (was Re: New Orleans)

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  • Patrice Champarou
    ... From: tommersl ... In a way, this is what I had in mind. I was about to tell Howard that if I should write my own definition of jazz, it probably wouldn t
    Message 1 of 61 , May 3 9:34 AM
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      ----- Original Message -----
      From: tommersl

      > The question makes me think about someone like W.C. Handy who wasn't
      > born into Blues but learnt about it after he already had a classical
      > music background. However , his music is more Jazz than the
      > traditional Blues that inspired Handy (the Delta Blues as instance).
      > It makes me think wether the Jazz was something that was going to
      > happen regardless of the New Orleans connection.

      In a way, this is what I had in mind. I was about to tell Howard that if I
      should write my own definition of jazz, it probably wouldn't match what I
      regard as essential... but it does not mean that the essential came first.

      I think the question has more to do with the intercourse between composed
      music and folk elements than with racial considerations (although there is
      an obvious link in our case). I really don't mind thinking that "hot"
      soloists or bandleaders may have inserted their talent and individuality
      into some kind
      of highly popular, slick or caricatural dance music, turning the caricature
      into an art form - just like ragtime composers and black minstrels had done
      before!
      For African-American musicians, for people like Handy or... Ellington, to go
      back to the original statement that started the thread, it meant having at
      last a grasp on what had always been labeled as 'Ethiopian music', 'coon
      songs' etc., consciously claiming and adorning caricatural elements until
      everyone was forced to regard them as true inventivity (which makes me think
      of Ralph Elison rather than Scott Fitzgerald, but it took me decades until I
      could make the connection).
      For people like Bix and probably many more youngsters of the period, it
      meant 'playing like blacks' and actually taking their inspiration out of
      something more interesting than contemporary dance bands - either real negro
      performers, or just the way they figured out negro bands would play. Pure
      creativity in any case, and as far as black musicians are concerned I think
      that regarding them as creators rather than mere transmitters of an
      imaginary African musical tradition would be a greater tribute to pay to
      their musical talent than the common idea of blues coming straight from the
      coasts of West Africa and giving birth to jazz (do I need a tin hat too?;)

      Since you vaguely know what I think about it, Handy and the Delta blues will
      deserve another reply some time or other.

      Maybe ;-)

      Patrice
    • Nigel Burlinson
      Annette was issued as Dot Dare on: Diva 2792/Harmony 792H (I Wanna Be Loved By You & Is There Anything Wrong In That?) and Diva 2829/Harmony 829H (I Faw Down
      Message 61 of 61 , Oct 17, 2012
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        Annette was issued as "Dot Dare" on:

        Diva 2792/Harmony 792H (I Wanna Be Loved By You & Is There Anything Wrong In That?)
        and
        Diva 2829/Harmony 829H (I Faw Down An' Go Boom) & Don't Be Like That)


        Nigel


        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Bob Smith
        To: RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2012 12:39 PM
        Subject: [RedHotJazz] Annette Hanshaw, Puritone 1041



        Dear Patrice,

        I used the long URL, and that opened the E-Bay page. I then made a new TinyURL, and this resulted in exactly the same letter combination that you obtained, and this also worked fine. So I then tried your TinyURL again, and this also worked fine today!

        I must confess that it's difficult to be wise about the Internet.

        I've also had a look at the Tom Lord Jazz Discography (2011 edition). This says that the 'Dot Dare' pseudonym was only used on the two titles that are on Puritone, but doesn't mention the Puritone record, only naming the Harmony issue (Harmony 829-H) as does 'Jazz Directory' (1952 edition).

        Kind Regards

        Bob Smith

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