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9463Re: [RedHotJazz] Armstrong's 1929 Mahogany Hall Stomp - different speeds

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  • lastofthebarons
    May 11, 2013
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      The version on, "The Complete Louis Armstrong Vol. 5 "Tight Like This" 1928-1931 Disc 1" by Fr�meaux et Cie is 3:22.

      One of the reasons for a disparity in, apparent, length is where the engineer decided he had enough silence at both start and finish. You then have to add on the amount of silence that they decided to have between each track. There is usually at least 2 seconds and, very often more. Consequently tracks taken from the same original source can have up to around 10 seconds variation or more. Also to be factored in is the speed at which the original was played. Was pitch corrected by turntable speed or by electronic means.

      In some ways, digitization has complicated the issue. The only way to get to the original timing is to get the original master and, knowing the key the piece was played in, to adjust the turntable speed to match the pitch. We have to put an awful lot of faith in, sometimes, unknowledgeable sound engineers.

      Cheers,

      Marc

      On 11 May 2013, at 00:41, Richard Fannan <rfannan1@...> wrote:

      > I have three versions of Mahogany Hall Stomp on CD and loaded into iTunes. A
      >
      > The one from the Complete Hot Fives and Hot, according to the iTunes info, is 3:17.
      >
      > The one from Portrait of an Artist, according to the iTunes info, is 3:20
      >
      > The one from History of Jazz, a set on Platco, according to the iTunes info, is 3:35
      >
      > Listening to them, I couldn't detect any tempo differences.
      >
      > Don't have the one on Louis in New York
      >
      > On May 10, 2013, at 2:03 PM, Andrew Taylor <agt2@...> wrote:
      >
      > > Looking online, the cd set /Louis Armstrong : portrait of the artist as
      > > a young man, 1923-1934/ (which I don't have) has Mahogany Hall Stomp
      > > listed as 3:13, even shorter - Andrew
      > > On 5/10/2013 3:55 PM, Andrew Taylor wrote:
      > > > Hi all,
      > > >
      > > > Wondered if any of you had noticed the following and had any opinions
      > > > or observations about the following.
      > > >
      > > > I was listening just now (on iTunes) to probably my favorite Armstrong
      > > > tune, *Mahogany Hall Stomp* from 1929. It was the version from
      > > > Columbia's /Vol V: Louis iin New York/ CD. Then out of curiousity I
      > > > switched to the same recording included (as an additional track) on
      > > > the Phil Schaap-produced /The Complete Hot Five and Hot Sevens
      > > > Recordings/. 4-volume set.
      > > > In addition to being brighter than the Columbia CD version (too much
      > > > so), the Schaap one was distinctly faster than the Columbia one.
      > > >
      > > > I just checked the length on iTunes, and indeed Schaap's clocks in at
      > > > 3:17, as opposed to Columbia's 3:27.
      > > >
      > > > I much prefer the Columbia one, but I grew up listening to that one
      > > > (came out in 1990, Schaap's came out in 2000) so that doesn't
      > > > necessarily make it better or more accurate. I'm 42, so the Columbia
      > > > series was my first introduction to much of Armstrong's 1920s work.
      > > > For me the Schaap Mahogany loses the perfectly measured groove of the
      > > > Columbia one.
      > > >
      > > > Has anyone else noticed this, or have an opinion? I expect there are
      > > > better recordings than either of these, but these are what I know.
      > > >
      > > > The first cassette of Hot Fives I got in the 1980s /was //all/
      > > > recorded at strange speeds!
      > > >
      > > > Thanks for any insights,
      > > >
      > > > Andrew Taylor
      > >
      > > --
      > > Andrew Taylor, MLS
      > > Associate Curator, Visual Resources
      > > Department of Art History, Rice University
      > > 713-348-4836
      > >
      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      > >
      > >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >



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