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6073Re: Dodds with Oliver

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  • John O
    Jul 18, 2008
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      Thank you, Howard... While Rust lists Junie Cobb on Little
      Bits/Struggling, others seem assured of Dodds: I'd agree he's more likely.

      Some other dates (addressed here before, perhaps) where Dodds's
      presence may be questionable:

      10-5-23 King Oliver and His Creole Jazz Band
      The recent Archeophone/Off the Record CD lists the clarinetist as
      "unknown" on Alligator Hop and Zulus Ball, and "possibly replaced by
      Johnny Dodds" on Workingman Blues and Krooked Blues. I would think
      Johnny is confirmed for the entire date, both aurally and because
      Louis, Lil, and Baby identified him here... This may be my favorite
      Oliver session: brilliant original tunes, and Stump Evans adds
      another dimension to the band's already unique sound.

      5-28-26 Erskine Tate's Vendome Orchestra
      Frog DGF 39 has "probably Johnny Dodds" for these--recorded the same
      day as the great Lil's Hot Shots sides--but it's hard to hear anything
      which resembles his playing.

      c. November, 1926 Ma Rainey
      Weepin' Woman Blues/Soon This Mornin'--sounds more like Junie Cobb, I
      think.


      --- In RedHotJazz@yahoogroups.com, Howard Rye <howard@...> wrote:
      >
      > My conclusion when I did a piece on the Dodds alternative takes for
      Names &
      > Numbers 28 was as follows:
      >
      > Little Bits ŒE-3164¹ on Neatwork RP2012; ŒE-3165¹ on Timeless CBC1015
      > These are almost certainly not real alternative takes, which may
      account for
      > the omission of ŒE-3164¹ from the Timeless set, and the dubbing by
      Neatwork
      > from an old Decca or MCA issue with howling echo. (If anyone thinks
      they can
      > hear a difference, perhaps they will report.)
      > This does not of course prove that there may not be a real
      alternative take
      > extant. The Oriole 1000 Series listing in Storyville 6 claims E-3164 on
      > Oriole 1008. In Storyville 62, Dolf Rerink reported a copy of
      Vocalion 1035
      > showing Œ64¹ in the wax and that this was aurally different from the
      dubbing
      > on Biltmore 1088. For the moment I cannot resolve this and do not
      have two
      > takes which sound distinct to me.
      >
      > No reports have been received to amplify or clarify this.
      >
      > I would add that long experience (aided no doubt by advancing age,
      > cantakerousness, and probably arrogance and indifference to other
      people¹s
      > opinions) have made me deeply suspicious of people who assure one
      that takes
      > sound distinct unless they actually tell you what the distinctions
      are. I
      > have never knowingly heard the Biltmore dub but I have heard quite
      enough
      > dubbings to know that they can easily sound distinct as a result of the
      > dubbing process while actually being musically identical. As for
      relying on
      > timings, well I lost that degree of faith in record companies, not to
      > mention the domestic tape recorders used in many collector issues, long
      > before the advancing age, etc. kicked in!
      >
      > If anyone wants to know, here are identifying differences for
      Struggling:
      >
      > Struggling E-3166 & E-3167 on Timeless CBC1015
      > First washboard break:
      > E-3166 12 raps.
      > E-3167 10 raps, falling into a distinct 4 + 6
      pattern.
      >
      > So you can be sure these really are different and don¹t just ³sound
      > distinct² to someone.
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