Re: [RLC-Action] Support McCain?!?!
>>Then I guess I'm out of the party. Thank you for clearing that up.When even
the libertarians in the party tell me to support the fascist, the
clear that I do not belong.<<
Oh, give me a break. McCain is a a fool and a tool in many ways, but
a fascist. It really pisses me off when people trot out these
inflammatory words and
try to stick them on people whose only sin is not being ideologically
fanatical enough to suit them. McCain is a moderate. He believe in
Do you like Edmund Burke? In many ways he's the grandfather of
wrote "All government, indeed every human benefit and enjoyment, every
virtue, and every prudent act, is founded on compromise and barter."
He understood the need to balance ideology with pragmatism and it's a
a lot of folks in the 'liberty movement' need to learn.
<i>I'll be waiting for that announcement that the RLC is endorsing
I wouldn't hold my breath on that one. Since he's the GOP nominee it
for a Republican group to issue an endorsement.
The five points that Guy has given us below is the every essence of what I saw as the purpose and strategy for a Republican Liberty Caucus. It is the reason I wholeheartedly joined and support the RLC. None of us can be happy with McCain but that should not be the reason (excuse?) for not working as Guy suggests. We’ve learned from the self-defeating antics of the LP and now have to guard against repeating any of them if we are to be more successful in achieving libertarian ends. –Geo.
From: RLC-Action@yahoogroups.com [mailto: RLC-Action@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of W. Guy Finley
Sent: Wednesday, June 18, 2008 11:18 AM
Subject: [SPAM] Re: [SPAM] Re: [RLC-Action] Support McCain?!?!
You're all over it George. Maybe some want to risk the damage that Obama could do in 4 or 8 years in the White House with a Dem congress behind him, I'm not one of them. Nor do I agree with the lambasting McCain is taking from these quarters.
I think we should have a simple formula for activism in the RLC:
- Work at the local level to identify and support libertarian minded Republicans.
- Work at the local level to attract more to our movement by learning to be better advocates.
- Support change within the GOP at all levels working within the party.
- Remember that we are Republicans. At the end of the day we need to support libertarian Republicans and be advocates of change to those who may not be in lock step with our ideals while remembering that we are all Republicans and share much more in common than we have differences.
- As liberty minded individuals recognize that we all have different ideals and resist submitting people to a libertarian purity test at every juncture.
On Jun 18, 2008, at 9:39 AM, George Blumel wrote:
Listen to Dave –he’s realistic, practical and reasonable in these arguments. None of us would have picked McCain but here we are. Now, we have to do what is best for the country, our Republic. Dave says we can move McCain toward our principles and that is obviously true but, of course, Obama is left all the way. Taxes, spending, defense and what about judges? You have to support McCain and try to influence him and those around him –that is our job, our purpose, to bring others to the understanding of our natural rights, freedom and responsibility. Dave’s idea of the presentation of a liberty agenda is exactly what the RLC’s mission is. Am I right? Or, am I right? -Geo
From: RLC-Action@yahoogro ups.com [mailto: RLC-Action@yahoogro ups.com ] On Behalf Of Dave Nalle
Sent: Tuesday, June 17, 2008 3:53 AM
To: RLC-Action@yahoogro ups.com
Subject: [SPAM] Re: [RLC-Action] Support McCain?!?!
>>Based on this, I don't think it is a stretch to call McCain or the
Neo Cons a bunch of Fascist. <<
'This' being a textbook description of Fascism which doesn't even bear a
superficial resemblance to anything McCain has ever endorsed and bears
only limited resemblance to Neocon policy. If you can read the
definition you posted and think that it applies then you
are existing in a state of altered reality and I can't do much to help you.
>>And as we are part of aw:st="on"> Liberty caucus, I don't see a problem with
having, and sticking to ideals. The big difference is that some of us
don't believe McCain will be better then Obama, or the difference is so
slight it isn't worth compromising our principles.< <
How anyone can even say this is beyond me. McCain wants to lower taxes.
Obama wants to raise them. McCain wants to shrink the welfare state,
including corporate welfare and farm subsidies. Obama wants to expand
it. If it were those two issues alone there would be no justification
for not supporting McCain over Obama.
>>Dave, I am asking what "ACTION" you are suggesting we take tofurther
are cause with your last post.<<
My suggestion would be that we start a campaign to sway McCain - and he
has shown he can be swayed - to a more liberty-oriented perspective.
Not by ranting and cursing at him like some of the more maniacal Paul
supporters, but by outlining and promoting a moderate libertarian agenda
which would fit with his existing beliefs yet fall on the pro-liberty
side of the spectrum of positions which he has taken.
Perhaps we need some sort of plan for the future to promote at the
national convention which will appeal to mainstream Republicans who
still have a fondness for liberty and win some of them over to our
cause. Nothing too radical, but a strong nudge in the right direction -
emphasizing along the way the liberty tradition of the party and staying
away from the nutty stuff.
When the Neocons started out they produced a document like this. A
clear statement of their intent for the future of the party, and it won
over a lot of people.
We need to convince McCain that he can be the guy to bring back the
liberty values of the GOP and that this could be his great legacy. Sell
him on it and we win.