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Re: [Pythagorean-L] Re: Intro to vegetarian cooking

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  • ghorban khalafy
    I have a new Idea of Mathematical foundation Is our world a real objective or it is a simple idea of being alive? please answer me erhan thanks
    Message 1 of 12 , Sep 7, 2009
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      I have a new Idea of Mathematical foundation
      Is our world a real objective or it is a simple idea of being alive?
      please answer me erhan
      thanks


      From: Erhan Berber <eb799@...>
      To: Pythagorean-L@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 8:04:31 PM
      Subject: Re: [Pythagorean-L] Re: Intro to vegetarian cooking

       

      I am listening...  Go ahead and share your idea with those of us, loyals...
       
      Erhan
      NJ


      From: senior_sezar2006 <senior_sezar2006@ yahoo.com>
      To: Pythagorean- L@yahoogroups. com
      Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 3:29:07 AM
      Subject: [Pythagorean- L] Re: Intro to vegetarian cooking

       

      I have a new idea of living
      is there anybody to hear me?



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    • jensav55
      ... Perhaps I might interpret the question here to be, is the cosmos more legitimately considered (1) as a material entity (or a collection of material
      Message 2 of 12 , Sep 7, 2009
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        --- In Pythagorean-L@yahoogroups.com, ghorban khalafy <senior_sezar2006@...> wrote:
        >
        > I have a new Idea of Mathematical foundation
        > Is our world a real objective or it is a simple idea of being alive?

        Perhaps I might interpret the question here to be, is the cosmos more legitimately considered (1) as a material entity (or a collection of material entities), or at any rate as something objective and utterly independent of any structure of intelligibility which might attempt to express its laws and organization; or (2) as the product of certain laws, principles and structures which, because they are also the laws, principles and structures of living beings and of consciousness, are in fact better apprehended by the introspection of living, conscious beings than by objectifying analysis.

        If this is something like what you mean, I'd say (2). However, if you mean by "a simple idea of being alive" something more like what is generally termed "subjective idealism" or "solipsism", i.e., the notion that "there's nothing out there", I disagree, and I think that Pythagoreans would disagree as well, for the simple reason that the logical principles indispensable to one's experience of oneself must, if nothing else, be counted among the things that really exist, from which can be derived the One, the Dyad, the Triad and the Tetrad. Therefore these, and other principles that can be inferred from them, must be "real objects" or "really objective".


        Edward Butler
        http://henadology.wordpress.com/
      • ghorban khalafy
        Hello Dear Edward,it is of great pleasure to find a Pythagorean. my new idae of this world and our lives is somehow complicating, I will send my full Idea
        Message 3 of 12 , Sep 9, 2009
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          Hello Dear Edward,it is of great pleasure to find a Pythagorean.
          my new idae of this world and our lives is somehow complicating,
          I will send my full Idea within some weeks,
          where do you live?
          can we get more friendly?


          From: jensav55 <epb223@...>
          To: Pythagorean-L@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 11:08:51 PM
          Subject: [Pythagorean-L] Cosmology

           

          --- In Pythagorean- L@yahoogroups. com, ghorban khalafy <senior_sezar2006@ ...> wrote:
          >
          > I have a new Idea of Mathematical foundation
          > Is our world a real objective or it is a simple idea of being alive?

          Perhaps I might interpret the question here to be, is the cosmos more legitimately considered (1) as a material entity (or a collection of material entities), or at any rate as something objective and utterly independent of any structure of intelligibility which might attempt to express its laws and organization; or (2) as the product of certain laws, principles and structures which, because they are also the laws, principles and structures of living beings and of consciousness, are in fact better apprehended by the introspection of living, conscious beings than by objectifying analysis.

          If this is something like what you mean, I'd say (2). However, if you mean by "a simple idea of being alive" something more like what is generally termed "subjective idealism" or "solipsism", i.e., the notion that "there's nothing out there", I disagree, and I think that Pythagoreans would disagree as well, for the simple reason that the logical principles indispensable to one's experience of oneself must, if nothing else, be counted among the things that really exist, from which can be derived the One, the Dyad, the Triad and the Tetrad. Therefore these, and other principles that can be inferred from them, must be "real objects" or "really objective".

          Edward Butler
          http://henadology. wordpress. com/


        • epb223@gmail.com
          Dear Ghorban, I think it makes more sense to keep discussion on the List, as there isn t nearly enough discussion there. Edward On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 4:30 AM,
          Message 4 of 12 , Sep 9, 2009
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            Dear Ghorban,

            I think it makes more sense to keep discussion on the List, as there isn't nearly enough discussion there.

            Edward


            On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 4:30 AM, ghorban khalafy <senior_sezar2006@...> wrote:
             

            Hello Dear Edward,it is of great pleasure to find a Pythagorean.
            my new idae of this world and our lives is somehow complicating,
            I will send my full Idea within some weeks,
            where do you live?
            can we get more friendly?


            From: jensav55 <epb223@...>
            To: Pythagorean-L@yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Monday, September 7, 2009 11:08:51 PM
            Subject: [Pythagorean-L] Cosmology

             

            --- In Pythagorean- L@yahoogroups. com, ghorban khalafy <senior_sezar2006@ ...> wrote:
            >
            > I have a new Idea of Mathematical foundation
            > Is our world a real objective or it is a simple idea of being alive?

            Perhaps I might interpret the question here to be, is the cosmos more legitimately considered (1) as a material entity (or a collection of material entities), or at any rate as something objective and utterly independent of any structure of intelligibility which might attempt to express its laws and organization; or (2) as the product of certain laws, principles and structures which, because they are also the laws, principles and structures of living beings and of consciousness, are in fact better apprehended by the introspection of living, conscious beings than by objectifying analysis.

            If this is something like what you mean, I'd say (2). However, if you mean by "a simple idea of being alive" something more like what is generally termed "subjective idealism" or "solipsism", i.e., the notion that "there's nothing out there", I disagree, and I think that Pythagoreans would disagree as well, for the simple reason that the logical principles indispensable to one's experience of oneself must, if nothing else, be counted among the things that really exist, from which can be derived the One, the Dyad, the Triad and the Tetrad. Therefore these, and other principles that can be inferred from them, must be "real objects" or "really objective".

            Edward Butler
            http://henadology. wordpress. com/



          • Wayne
            ... Oh, I have slipped the surly bounds of earth And danced the skies on laughter-silvered wings; Sunward I ve climbed and joined the tumbling mirth Of
            Message 5 of 12 , Oct 18, 2009
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              --- In Pythagorean-L@yahoogroups.com, fenianson@... wrote:
              >
              > Greetings all,
              >
              > I was wondering what people on this list make of the last few lines of Pythagoras' Golden Verses:
              >
              > "Let reason, the gift divine, be thy highest guide;
              > Then should you be separated from the body, and soar in the aether,
              > You will be imperishable, a divinity, a mortal no more."
              >
              > I would love to know how people interpret these lines and what they
              > might mean to them....Thanks!
              >
              > Evritos


              Oh, I have slipped the surly bounds of earth
              And danced the skies on laughter-silvered wings;
              Sunward I've climbed and joined the tumbling mirth
              Of sun-split clouds -- and done a thousand things
              You have not dreamed of -- wheeled and soared and swung
              High in the sunlit silence. Hovering there,
              I've chased the shouting wind along and flung
              My eager craft through footless halls of air.
              Up, up the long delirious, burning blue
              I've topped the windswept heights with easy grace
              Where never lark or even eagle flew.
              And, while with silent, lifting mind I've trod
              The high untrespassed sanctity of space,
              Put out my hand and touched the face of God."
              -- "High Flight" by John Gillespie Magee Jr.
            • Larry D. Rafey
              This would seem to imply that Pythagoras believed reason to be infinite in nature; i.e., beyond measure ... beyond number! Humans are unique in their ability
              Message 6 of 12 , Oct 18, 2009
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                 This would seem to imply that Pythagoras believed reason to be infinite in nature; i.e., beyond measure ... beyond number!
                 Humans are unique in their ability to translate the environment through a network of sensations into the Metaphysical (the mother of art, literature, myth, idea, good, evil, regligion, civilization, etc.). The knowledge of just how this is accomplished continues to be the Holy Grail of Psychology (and Science at large). But reason as we know it (i.e., discursive reason) is based entirely on language, is therefore derivative in nature and  will inevitably terminate in paradox, imagination ... and eventually ... silence!
                  B. Russell attempted to build a great edifice of mathematical precision based entirely on rational logic. But his tower was reduced to so much rubble by K. Godel, whose 'proof' implied that reason can only be applied 'in the small' and not to vast systems, which invariably invite paradox. 
                  By its very nature, reason (a product of the perceiving mind) can only operate in terms of duality ... subject/object ... either/or ... and surely infinity lay beyond such classification (unless, of course, the Infinite be ranked among its objects....????).
                 
                 
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Wayne
                Sent: Sunday, October 18, 2009 11:16 AM
                Subject: [Pythagorean-L] Re: On Becoming....

                 



                --- In Pythagorean- L@yahoogroups. com, fenianson@.. . wrote:
                >
                > Greetings all,
                >
                > I was wondering what people on this list make of the last few lines of Pythagoras' Golden Verses:
                >
                > "Let reason, the gift divine, be thy highest guide;
                > Then should you be separated from the body, and soar in the aether,
                > You will be imperishable, a divinity, a mortal no more."
                >
                > I would love to know how people interpret these lines and what they
                > might mean to them....Thanks!
                >
                > Evritos

                Oh, I have slipped the surly bounds of earth
                And danced the skies on laughter-silvered wings;
                Sunward I've climbed and joined the tumbling mirth
                Of sun-split clouds -- and done a thousand things
                You have not dreamed of -- wheeled and soared and swung
                High in the sunlit silence. Hovering there,
                I've chased the shouting wind along and flung
                My eager craft through footless halls of air.
                Up, up the long delirious, burning blue
                I've topped the windswept heights with easy grace
                Where never lark or even eagle flew.
                And, while with silent, lifting mind I've trod
                The high untrespassed sanctity of space,
                Put out my hand and touched the face of God."
                -- "High Flight" by John Gillespie Magee Jr.

              • Wayne
                ... Reason gives meaning to that which by definition does not exist; Boundlessness, Freedom of Motion, Freedom of Mind, Freedom of Spirit, Freedom from the
                Message 7 of 12 , Nov 13, 2009
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                  --- In Pythagorean-L@yahoogroups.com, fenianson@... wrote:
                  >
                  > Greetings all,
                  >
                  > I was wondering what people on this list make of the last few lines of
                  > Pythagoras' Golden Verses:
                  >
                  > "Let reason, the gift divine, be thy highest guide;
                  > Then should you be separated from the body, and soar in the aether,
                  > You will be imperishable, a divinity, a mortal no more."
                  >
                  > I would love to know how people interpret these lines and what they
                  > might mean to them....Thanks!
                  >
                  > Evritos
                  >


                  Reason gives meaning to that which by definition does not exist;
                  Boundlessness, Freedom of Motion, Freedom of Mind, Freedom of Spirit,
                  Freedom from the Chaos of the Material World of Reality, cause and effect, the Freedom to do as he and she Will, the Freedom to find his and her Bliss.
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