Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: Reference Book for Western Herbs

Expand Messages
  • rasqual9
    Sorry, when I posted the original, it had my name up and everything, thought that would post here. Stephen Clipp TCM/personal fitness in Charleston SC since
    Message 1 of 18 , Jan 26, 2013
    • 0 Attachment
      Sorry, when I posted the original, it had my name up and everything, thought that would post here.
      Stephen Clipp
      TCM/personal fitness in Charleston SC since '04
      Loveable Rogue.

      --- In PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com, William Morris wrote:
      >
      > To Whom do we speak? I would like to encourage all to use their names in
      > posts so we get to know each other, notwithstanding the intermittent nature
      > of this list serve...;-)
      >
      > I agree with Chris about Michael Tierra's work.
      >
      > I am enjoying David Hoffman's work. It also deals with pharmacognostics.
      >
      > http://www.amazon.com/Medical-Herbalism-Principles-Practices-Medicine/dp/0892817496
      >
      > Warmly,
      >
      > Will
      >
      > --
      > William R. Morris, PhD, DAOM, LAc
      > http://pulsediagnosis.com/
      > http://www.aoma.edu/
      > http://taaom.org/
      >
      > This message, including attachments, contains confidential information and
      > is intended only for the individual(s) named. Any use by others is strictly
      > prohibited. Do not disseminate, distribute or copy this email. Please
      > notify the sender immediately by email if you have received this email by
      > mistake, and delete this email from your system.
      >
    • Luke Terry
      If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I d check out Peter Holmes *Energetics of Western Herbs*. It s a sort of Bensky for western herbs,
      Message 2 of 18 , Jan 26, 2013
      • 0 Attachment
        If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I'd check out Peter Holmes' Energetics of Western Herbs. It's a sort of "Bensky" for western herbs, though not quite so exhaustive.   For hardcore western botanical science, RCT referendes, etc, I really like Kerry Bone's books out of Australia, Principles & Practices of Phytotherapy, and A Clinical Guide to Blending Liquid Herbs.


        On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 4:30 PM, CoreyPine Shane <coreypineus@...> wrote:
         

        Oooh, interesting question. I'm a western herbalist completing training in Chinese herbal medicine, so I have a unique perspective here.

        One of my favorite books explaining western herbs for the Chinese herbalist/acupuncturist is Thomas Avery Garran's "Western Herbs According to Traditional Chinese Medicine." Not as comprehensive as Bensky, only 60 herbs but in-depth descriptions and classified according to Chinese herbal categories. A better choice for a larger materia medica with some basic energetics and formulas according to western body systems is Sharol Tilgner's "Herbal Medicine from the Heart of the Earth".

        Michael Tierra has also done some good work, but "Planetary Herbology" is getting a bit dated, and I don't have his more recent books to report on.

        Be Well
        CoreyPine

        CoreyPine Shane, Holistic Clinical Herbalist, RH (AHG)
        Director, Blue Ridge School of Herbal Medicine

        www.BlueRidgeSchool.org


        Holistic Medicine is about the whole person and also about the society, the environment and the whole earth.


        From: rasqual9 <bluegreendragon9@...>
        To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 10:28 AM

        Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs

         
        Just opened an account with HerbPharm, and am interested in adding 'Western' Herbs to my practice. Any suggestions on a clear, useful reference book or CD-ROM, kind of a 'Western Bensky's?'






        --
        Luke J. Terry, MTOM, Dipl.Ac, L.Ac.

        Acupuncture
        Herbal medicine
        Nutrition
        Functional Fitness
        Health Education & Curriculum Design

        (303) 653-1420

      • Chistopher Macie
        One might also want to glance at the PDR book on herbal suppleents -- comprehensive on research data, and does mention Chinese usages. But very dry. Chris
        Message 3 of 18 , Jan 26, 2013
        • 0 Attachment
          One might also want to glance at the PDR  book on herbal suppleents -- comprehensive on research data, and does mention Chinese usages. But very dry.

          Chris Macie


          From: "Luke Terry" <evolution.intent@...>
          To: "pulsediagnosis" <PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com>
          Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 6:59:19 PM
          Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs

           

          If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I'd check out Peter Holmes' Energetics of Western Herbs. It's a sort of "Bensky" for western herbs, though not quite so exhaustive.   For hardcore western botanical science, RCT referendes, etc, I really like Kerry Bone's books out of Australia, Principles & Practices of Phytotherapy, and A Clinical Guide to Blending Liquid Herbs.


          On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 4:30 PM, CoreyPine Shane <coreypineus@...> wrote:
           

          Oooh, interesting question. I'm a western herbalist completing training in Chinese herbal medicine, so I have a unique perspective here.

          One of my favorite books explaining western herbs for the Chinese herbalist/acupuncturist is Thomas Avery Garran's "Western Herbs According to Traditional Chinese Medicine." Not as comprehensive as Bensky, only 60 herbs but in-depth descriptions and classified according to Chinese herbal categories. A better choice for a larger materia medica with some basic energetics and formulas according to western body systems is Sharol Tilgner's "Herbal Medicine from the Heart of the Earth".

          Michael Tierra has also done some good work, but "Planetary Herbology" is getting a bit dated, and I don't have his more recent books to report on.

          Be Well
          CoreyPine

          CoreyPine Shane, Holistic Clinical Herbalist, RH (AHG)
          Director, Blue Ridge School of Herbal Medicine

          www.BlueRidgeSchool.org


          Holistic Medicine is about the whole person and also about the society, the environment and the whole earth.


          From: rasqual9 <bluegreendragon9@...>
          To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 10:28 AM

          Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs

           
          Just opened an account with HerbPharm, and am interested in adding 'Western' Herbs to my practice. Any suggestions on a clear, useful reference book or CD-ROM, kind of a 'Western Bensky's?'






          --
          Luke J. Terry, MTOM, Dipl.Ac, L.Ac.

          Acupuncture
          Herbal medicine
          Nutrition
          Functional Fitness
          Health Education & Curriculum Design

          (303) 653-1420

        • Z'ev Rosenberg
          Holmes book was written many years ago, with many inaccuracies in terms of assigning Chinese qualities to Western herbs. Z ev Rosenberg ... Z ev Rosenberg, L.
          Message 4 of 18 , Jan 26, 2013
          • 0 Attachment
            Holmes' book was written many years ago, with many inaccuracies in terms of assigning Chinese qualities to Western herbs. 

            Z'ev Rosenberg
            On Jan 26, 2013, at 6:59 PM, Luke Terry <evolution.intent@...> wrote:

            If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I'd check out Peter Holmes' Energetics of Western Herbs. It's a sort of "Bensky" for western herbs, though not quite so exhaustive.   For hardcore western botanical science, RCT referendes, etc, I really like Kerry Bone's books out of Australia, Principles & Practices of Phytotherapy, and A Clinical Guide to Blending Liquid Herbs.


            Z'ev Rosenberg, L. Ac.
            Chair Emeritus/Resident Scholar
            Pacific College of Oriental Medicine
            San Diego, Ca. 



          • William Morris
            I agree w/ Corey, Chris and Z ev, PDR is a pretty good consensus document. Holmes has had substantial criticism amongst senior practitioners East and West.
            Message 5 of 18 , Jan 27, 2013
            • 0 Attachment
              I agree w/ Corey, Chris and Z'ev,

              PDR is a pretty good consensus document. Holmes has had substantial criticism amongst senior practitioners East and West.

              Corey, Thomas Avery Garron's book is very high quality and reliable information that is very well presented.

              My new favorite, just got it: The Canon of Medicine Volume 2: Natural Pharmaceuticals
              Avicenna (Author), Laleh Bakhtiar (Editor). It reminds me of my trip to Italy in 1993 to review the pharmacies in the basilicas. There was not a single agent that did not occur in the Chinese pharmacopoeia. Early Perian medicine was essentially a melting pot of Greek, Ayurvedic and I believe also CHinese work.

              Warmly,

              Will

              On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 10:56 PM, Chistopher Macie <cjmacie@...> wrote:
              >
              >  
              >
              > One might also want to glance at the PDR  book on herbal suppleents -- comprehensive on research data, and does mention Chinese usages. But very dry.
              >
              > Chris Macie
              >
              > ________________________________
              > From: "Luke Terry" <evolution.intent@...>
              > To: "pulsediagnosis" <PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com>
              > Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 6:59:19 PM
              > Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
              >
              >
              >  
              >
              > If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I'd check out Peter Holmes' Energetics of Western Herbs. It's a sort of "Bensky" for western herbs, though not quite so exhaustive.   For hardcore western botanical science, RCT referendes, etc, I really like Kerry Bone's books out of Australia, Principles & Practices of Phytotherapy, and A Clinical Guide to Blending Liquid Herbs.
              >
              >
              > On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 4:30 PM, CoreyPine Shane <coreypineus@...> wrote:
              >>
              >>  
              >>
              >> Oooh, interesting question. I'm a western herbalist completing training in Chinese herbal medicine, so I have a unique perspective here.
              >>
              >> One of my favorite books explaining western herbs for the Chinese herbalist/acupuncturist is Thomas Avery Garran's "Western Herbs According to Traditional Chinese Medicine." Not as comprehensive as Bensky, only 60 herbs but in-depth descriptions and classified according to Chinese herbal categories. A better choice for a larger materia medica with some basic energetics and formulas according to western body systems is Sharol Tilgner's "Herbal Medicine from the Heart of the Earth".
              >>
              >> Michael Tierra has also done some good work, but "Planetary Herbology" is getting a bit dated, and I don't have his more recent books to report on.
              >>
              >> Be Well
              >> CoreyPine
              >>
              >> CoreyPine Shane, Holistic Clinical Herbalist, RH (AHG)
              >> Director, Blue Ridge School of Herbal Medicine
              >>
              >> www.BlueRidgeSchool.org
              >>
              >> Holistic Medicine is about the whole person and also about the society, the environment and the whole earth.
              >>
              >> ________________________________
              >> From: rasqual9 <bluegreendragon9@...>
              >> To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
              >> Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 10:28 AM
              >>
              >> Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
              >>
              >>  
              >> Just opened an account with HerbPharm, and am interested in adding 'Western' Herbs to my practice. Any suggestions on a clear, useful reference book or CD-ROM, kind of a 'Western Bensky's?'
              >>
              >>
              >>
              >
              >
              >
              > --
              > Luke J. Terry, MTOM, Dipl.Ac, L.Ac.
              >
              > Acupuncture
              > Herbal medicine
              > Nutrition
              > Functional Fitness
              > Health Education & Curriculum Design
              >
              > (303) 653-1420
              >
              >




              --
              William R. Morris, PhD, DAOM, LAc
              http://pulsediagnosis.com/
              http://www.aoma.edu/
              http://taaom.org/

              This message, including attachments, contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual(s) named. Any use by others is strictly prohibited. Do not disseminate, distribute or copy this email. Please notify the sender immediately by email if you have received this email by mistake, and delete this email from your system.
            • yehuda frischman
              Just want to add that there is a wonderful historical novel that I would highly recommend called The Physician by Noah Gordon.   Ibn Sina (or the anglicized
              Message 6 of 18 , Jan 27, 2013
              • 0 Attachment
                Just want to add that there is a wonderful historical novel that I would highly recommend called "The Physician" by Noah Gordon.   Ibn Sina (or the anglicized Avicenna), is introduced as the remarkable "prince of physicians," who established the first formal medical school, The Madrassas,  in Isphahan, Persia.  To be a physician one needed to be an expert in surgery, herbalogy, theology, jurisprudence, languages and philosophy, among other subjects.  Ibn Sina insisted upon a very high level and breadth of scholarship, skill, and experience in to qualify as a physician, and the finest physicians in the world were his students and graduates.  This brings to mind a discussion that took place on another list recently, criticizing the poor job prospects and income by graduates of our profession. I see these two issues coming together:  I think that it is much too easy to get into our schools, the instructors generally are much too lax grading students, allowing a mediocre level of scholarship to be acceptable, I don't know if it's still going on, but when I was in school from 2000-2004, cheating was rampant especially among a certain group of foreigners who obviously had difficulty in understanding and expressing themselves in English, and finally, EVERYTHING defers to preparing for the graduation exam and even more importantly, the State Board exam. Again, I can only comment on the state of the education in our profession as of 10 or so years ago, but my understanding, speaking to colleagues and students of mine is that not much has changed. Of course our students need to prepare for these exams, but much more importantly, they need to go to our schools to be trained as excellent physicians.  I really believe that by raising the bar, we can affect an enormous change in the success of our profession.  I would suggest that as with Ibn Sina, students need to get much more practical tutelage and experience.  They need to get a much stronger foundation both relative to the past and to the present, by being taught a much broader survey of classics, they need to take more than just one course in chinese medical language and need to be able to open Chinese medical journals to continue learning cutting edge developments in our profession internationally,  as well as learning to be much more competent in Western medical diagnosis and how to use WELL the tools that Western physicians use.  Ultimately, I think that if didactic course studies were more rigorous and if clinical training was more interactive and challenging we would produce graduates who had greater confidence in their knowledge and greater competence in their abilities.   


                Yehuda L. Frischman, L.Ac, candidate DAOM
                practitioner of CranioSacral Therapy and Traditional Jewish Medicine

                 


                --- On Sun, 1/27/13, William Morris <wmorris33@...> wrote:

                From: William Morris <wmorris33@...>
                Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
                Date: Sunday, January 27, 2013, 2:03 AM

                 

                I agree w/ Corey, Chris and Z'ev,

                PDR is a pretty good consensus document. Holmes has had substantial criticism amongst senior practitioners East and West.

                Corey, Thomas Avery Garron's book is very high quality and reliable information that is very well presented.

                My new favorite, just got it: The Canon of Medicine Volume 2: Natural Pharmaceuticals
                Avicenna (Author), Laleh Bakhtiar (Editor). It reminds me of my trip to Italy in 1993 to review the pharmacies in the basilicas. There was not a single agent that did not occur in the Chinese pharmacopoeia. Early Perian medicine was essentially a melting pot of Greek, Ayurvedic and I believe also CHinese work.

                Warmly,

                Will

                On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 10:56 PM, Chistopher Macie <cjmacie@...> wrote:
                >
                >  
                >
                > One might also want to glance at the PDR  book on herbal suppleents -- comprehensive on research data, and does mention Chinese usages. But very dry.
                >
                > Chris Macie
                >
                > ________________________________
                > From: "Luke Terry" <evolution.intent@...>
                > To: "pulsediagnosis" <PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com>
                > Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 6:59:19 PM
                > Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                >
                >
                >  
                >
                > If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I'd check out Peter Holmes' Energetics of Western Herbs. It's a sort of "Bensky" for western herbs, though not quite so exhaustive.   For hardcore western botanical science, RCT referendes, etc, I really like Kerry Bone's books out of Australia, Principles & Practices of Phytotherapy, and A Clinical Guide to Blending Liquid Herbs.
                >
                >
                > On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 4:30 PM, CoreyPine Shane <coreypineus@...> wrote:
                >>
                >>  
                >>
                >> Oooh, interesting question. I'm a western herbalist completing training in Chinese herbal medicine, so I have a unique perspective here.
                >>
                >> One of my favorite books explaining western herbs for the Chinese herbalist/acupuncturist is Thomas Avery Garran's "Western Herbs According to Traditional Chinese Medicine." Not as comprehensive as Bensky, only 60 herbs but in-depth descriptions and classified according to Chinese herbal categories. A better choice for a larger materia medica with some basic energetics and formulas according to western body systems is Sharol Tilgner's "Herbal Medicine from the Heart of the Earth".
                >>
                >> Michael Tierra has also done some good work, but "Planetary Herbology" is getting a bit dated, and I don't have his more recent books to report on.
                >>
                >> Be Well
                >> CoreyPine
                >>
                >> CoreyPine Shane, Holistic Clinical Herbalist, RH (AHG)
                >> Director, Blue Ridge School of Herbal Medicine
                >>
                >> www.BlueRidgeSchool.org
                >>
                >> Holistic Medicine is about the whole person and also about the society, the environment and the whole earth.
                >>
                >> ________________________________
                >> From: rasqual9 <bluegreendragon9@...>
                >> To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
                >> Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 10:28 AM
                >>
                >> Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                >>
                >>  
                >> Just opened an account with HerbPharm, and am interested in adding 'Western' Herbs to my practice. Any suggestions on a clear, useful reference book or CD-ROM, kind of a 'Western Bensky's?'
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >
                >
                >
                > --
                > Luke J. Terry, MTOM, Dipl.Ac, L.Ac.
                >
                > Acupuncture
                > Herbal medicine
                > Nutrition
                > Functional Fitness
                > Health Education & Curriculum Design
                >
                > (303) 653-1420
                >
                >




                --
                William R. Morris, PhD, DAOM, LAc
                http://pulsediagnosis.com/
                http://www.aoma.edu/
                http://taaom.org/

                This message, including attachments, contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual(s) named. Any use by others is strictly prohibited. Do not disseminate, distribute or copy this email. Please notify the sender immediately by email if you have received this email by mistake, and delete this email from your system.

              • William Morris
                Yehuda - I worked at that school and several others. Yours was one of the worst in regard to what I called authorized cheating per cultural code. Of course, it
                Message 7 of 18 , Jan 27, 2013
                • 0 Attachment
                  Yehuda -

                  I worked at that school and several others. Yours was one of the worst in regard to what I called authorized cheating per cultural code. Of course, it is not an ethical problem in many cultures. That cabal was busted after I did some consultancy work there.

                  I am not authorizing relativism BTW. There is an important book upon the subject called Against Relativism: Cultural Diversity and the Search for Ethical Universals in Medicine by Ruth Macklin.

                  I agree with your concerns. But, we can't generalize to the field based upon single cases. There are schools without the problems you cite. And further, it is a matter of degree.

                  Warmly,

                  Will

                  On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 5:15 AM, yehuda frischman <rebyidel@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >  
                  >
                  > Just want to add that there is a wonderful historical novel that I would highly recommend called "The Physician" by Noah Gordon.   Ibn Sina (or the anglicized Avicenna), is introduced as the remarkable "prince of physicians," who established the first formal medical school, The Madrassas,  in Isphahan, Persia.  To be a physician one needed to be an expert in surgery, herbalogy, theology, jurisprudence, languages and philosophy, among other subjects.  Ibn Sina insisted upon a very high level and breadth of scholarship, skill, and experience in to qualify as a physician, and the finest physicians in the world were his students and graduates.  This brings to mind a discussion that took place on another list recently, criticizing the poor job prospects and income by graduates of our profession. I see these two issues coming together:  I think that it is much too easy to get into our schools, the instructors generally are much too lax grading students, allowing a mediocre level of scholarship to be acceptable, I don't know if it's still going on, but when I was in school from 2000-2004, cheating was rampant especially among a certain group of foreigners who obviously had difficulty in understanding and expressing themselves in English, and finally, EVERYTHING defers to preparing for the graduation exam and even more importantly, the State Board exam. Again, I can only comment on the state of the education in our profession as of 10 or so years ago, but my understanding, speaking to colleagues and students of mine is that not much has changed. Of course our students need to prepare for these exams, but much more importantly, they need to go to our schools to be trained as excellent physicians.  I really believe that by raising the bar, we can affect an enormous change in the success of our profession.  I would suggest that as with Ibn Sina, students need to get much more practical tutelage and experience.  They need to get a much stronger foundation both relative to the past and to the present, by being taught a much broader survey of classics, they need to take more than just one course in chinese medical language and need to be able to open Chinese medical journals to continue learning cutting edge developments in our profession internationally,  as well as learning to be much more competent in Western medical diagnosis and how to use WELL the tools that Western physicians use.  Ultimately, I think that if didactic course studies were more rigorous and if clinical training was more interactive and challenging we would produce graduates who had greater confidence in their knowledge and greater competence in their abilities.  
                  >
                  >
                  > Yehuda L. Frischman, L.Ac, candidate DAOM
                  > practitioner of CranioSacral Therapy and Traditional Jewish Medicine
                  > www.traditionaljewishmedicine.net
                  > www.traditionaljewishmedicine.blogspot.com
                  >
                  >  
                  >
                  >
                  > --- On Sun, 1/27/13, William Morris <wmorris33@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  > From: William Morris <wmorris33@...>
                  > Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                  > To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
                  > Date: Sunday, January 27, 2013, 2:03 AM
                  >
                  >  
                  >
                  > I agree w/ Corey, Chris and Z'ev,
                  >
                  > PDR is a pretty good consensus document. Holmes has had substantial criticism amongst senior practitioners East and West.
                  >
                  > Corey, Thomas Avery Garron's book is very high quality and reliable information that is very well presented.
                  >
                  > My new favorite, just got it: The Canon of Medicine Volume 2: Natural Pharmaceuticals
                  > Avicenna (Author), Laleh Bakhtiar (Editor). It reminds me of my trip to Italy in 1993 to review the pharmacies in the basilicas. There was not a single agent that did not occur in the Chinese pharmacopoeia. Early Perian medicine was essentially a melting pot of Greek, Ayurvedic and I believe also CHinese work.
                  >
                  > Warmly,
                  >
                  > Will
                  >
                  > On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 10:56 PM, Chistopher Macie <cjmacie@...> wrote:
                  > >
                  > >  
                  > >
                  > > One might also want to glance at the PDR  book on herbal suppleents -- comprehensive on research data, and does mention Chinese usages. But very dry.
                  > >
                  > > Chris Macie
                  > >
                  > > ________________________________
                  > > From: "Luke Terry" <evolution.intent@...>
                  > > To: "pulsediagnosis" <PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com>
                  > > Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 6:59:19 PM
                  > > Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >  
                  > >
                  > > If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I'd check out Peter Holmes' Energetics of Western Herbs. It's a sort of "Bensky" for western herbs, though not quite so exhaustive.   For hardcore western botanical science, RCT referendes, etc, I really like Kerry Bone's books out of Australia, Principles & Practices of Phytotherapy, and A Clinical Guide to Blending Liquid Herbs.
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 4:30 PM, CoreyPine Shane <coreypineus@...> wrote:
                  > >>
                  > >>  
                  > >>
                  > >> Oooh, interesting question. I'm a western herbalist completing training in Chinese herbal medicine, so I have a unique perspective here.
                  > >>
                  > >> One of my favorite books explaining western herbs for the Chinese herbalist/acupuncturist is Thomas Avery Garran's "Western Herbs According to Traditional Chinese Medicine." Not as comprehensive as Bensky, only 60 herbs but in-depth descriptions and classified according to Chinese herbal categories. A better choice for a larger materia medica with some basic energetics and formulas according to western body systems is Sharol Tilgner's "Herbal Medicine from the Heart of the Earth".
                  > >>
                  > >> Michael Tierra has also done some good work, but "Planetary Herbology" is getting a bit dated, and I don't have his more recent books to report on.
                  > >>
                  > >> Be Well
                  > >> CoreyPine
                  > >>
                  > >> CoreyPine Shane, Holistic Clinical Herbalist, RH (AHG)
                  > >> Director, Blue Ridge School of Herbal Medicine
                  > >>
                  > >> www.BlueRidgeSchool.org
                  > >>
                  > >> Holistic Medicine is about the whole person and also about the society, the environment and the whole earth.
                  > >>
                  > >> ________________________________
                  > >> From: rasqual9 <bluegreendragon9@...>
                  > >> To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
                  > >> Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 10:28 AM
                  > >>
                  > >> Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                  > >>
                  > >>  
                  > >> Just opened an account with HerbPharm, and am interested in adding 'Western' Herbs to my practice. Any suggestions on a clear, useful reference book or CD-ROM, kind of a 'Western Bensky's?'
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > --
                  > > Luke J. Terry, MTOM, Dipl.Ac, L.Ac.
                  > >
                  > > Acupuncture
                  > > Herbal medicine
                  > > Nutrition
                  > > Functional Fitness
                  > > Health Education & Curriculum Design
                  > >
                  > > (303) 653-1420
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > --
                  > William R. Morris, PhD, DAOM, LAc
                  > http://pulsediagnosis.com/
                  > http://www.aoma.edu/
                  > http://taaom.org/
                  >
                  > This message, including attachments, contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual(s) named. Any use by others is strictly prohibited. Do not disseminate, distribute or copy this email. Please notify the sender immediately by email if you have received this email by mistake, and delete this email from your system.
                  >
                  >




                  --
                  William R. Morris, PhD, DAOM, LAc
                  http://pulsediagnosis.com/
                  http://www.aoma.edu/
                  http://taaom.org/

                  This message, including attachments, contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual(s) named. Any use by others is strictly prohibited. Do not disseminate, distribute or copy this email. Please notify the sender immediately by email if you have received this email by mistake, and delete this email from your system.
                • rasqual9
                  We re getting a bit off track, here, but I m all for higher standards in schools. If I could do it over, I d a gone to Emperor s, where (I was told) it was
                  Message 8 of 18 , Jan 27, 2013
                  • 0 Attachment
                    We're getting a bit off track, here, but I'm all for higher standards in schools. If I could do it over, I'd'a gone to Emperor's, where (I was told) it was Serious Study, and the non-Serious were ejected/quit.

                    Thanks, everyone, for the suggestions so far. Obviously, I have some reading to do.

                    --- In PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com, William Morris wrote:
                    >
                    > Yehuda -
                    >
                    > I worked at that school and several others. Yours was one of the worst in
                    > regard to what I called authorized cheating per cultural code. Of course,
                    > it is not an ethical problem in many cultures. That cabal was busted after
                    > I did some consultancy work there.
                    >
                    > I am not authorizing relativism BTW. There is an important book upon the
                    > subject called *Against Relativism: Cultural Diversity and the Search for
                    > Ethical Universals in Medicine* by Ruth Macklin.
                    >
                    > I agree with your concerns. But, we can't generalize to the field based
                    > upon single cases. There are schools without the problems you cite. And
                    > further, it is a matter of degree.
                    >
                    > Warmly,
                    >
                    > Will
                    >
                    > On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 5:15 AM, yehuda frischman
                    > wrote:
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Just want to add that there is a wonderful historical novel that I would
                    > highly recommend called "The Physician" by Noah Gordon. Ibn Sina (or the
                    > anglicized Avicenna), is introduced as the remarkable "prince of
                    > physicians," who established the first formal medical school, The
                    > Madrassas, in Isphahan, Persia. To be a physician one needed to be an
                    > expert in surgery, herbalogy, theology, jurisprudence, languages and
                    > philosophy, among other subjects. Ibn Sina insisted upon a very high level
                    > and breadth of scholarship, skill, and experience in to qualify as a
                    > physician, and the finest physicians in the world were his students and
                    > graduates. This brings to mind a discussion that took place on another
                    > list recently, criticizing the poor job prospects and income by graduates
                    > of our profession. I see these two issues coming together: I think that it
                    > is much too easy to get into our schools, the instructors generally are
                    > much too lax grading students, allowing a mediocre level of scholarship to
                    > be acceptable, I don't know if it's still going on, but when I was in
                    > school from 2000-2004, cheating was rampant especially among a certain
                    > group of foreigners who obviously had difficulty in understanding and
                    > expressing themselves in English, and finally, EVERYTHING defers to
                    > preparing for the graduation exam and even more importantly, the State
                    > Board exam. Again, I can only comment on the state of the education in our
                    > profession as of 10 or so years ago, but my understanding, speaking to
                    > colleagues and students of mine is that not much has changed. Of course our
                    > students need to prepare for these exams, but much more importantly, they
                    > need to go to our schools to be trained as excellent physicians. I really
                    > believe that by raising the bar, we can affect an enormous change in the
                    > success of our profession. I would suggest that as with Ibn Sina, students
                    > need to get much more practical tutelage and experience. They need to get
                    > a much stronger foundation both relative to the past and to the present, by
                    > being taught a much broader survey of classics, they need to take more than
                    > just one course in chinese medical language and need to be able to open
                    > Chinese medical journals to continue learning cutting edge developments in
                    > our profession internationally, as well as learning to be much more
                    > competent in Western medical diagnosis and how to use WELL the tools that
                    > Western physicians use. Ultimately, I think that if didactic course
                    > studies were more rigorous and if clinical training was more interactive
                    > and challenging we would produce graduates who had greater confidence in
                    > their knowledge and greater competence in their abilities.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Yehuda L. Frischman, L.Ac, candidate DAOM
                    > > practitioner of CranioSacral Therapy and Traditional Jewish Medicine
                    > > www.traditionaljewishmedicine.net
                    > > www.traditionaljewishmedicine.blogspot.com
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > --- On Sun, 1/27/13, William Morris wrote:
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > From: William Morris
                    > > Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                    > > To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
                    > > Date: Sunday, January 27, 2013, 2:03 AM
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > I agree w/ Corey, Chris and Z'ev,
                    > >
                    > > PDR is a pretty good consensus document. Holmes has had substantial
                    > criticism amongst senior practitioners East and West.
                    > >
                    > > Corey, Thomas Avery Garron's book is very high quality and reliable
                    > information that is very well presented.
                    > >
                    > > My new favorite, just got it: The Canon of Medicine Volume 2: Natural
                    > Pharmaceuticals
                    > > Avicenna (Author), Laleh Bakhtiar (Editor). It reminds me of my trip to
                    > Italy in 1993 to review the pharmacies in the basilicas. There was not a
                    > single agent that did not occur in the Chinese pharmacopoeia. Early Perian
                    > medicine was essentially a melting pot of Greek, Ayurvedic and I believe
                    > also CHinese work.
                    > >
                    > > Warmly,
                    > >
                    > > Will
                    > >
                    > > On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 10:56 PM, Chistopher Macie
                    > wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > One might also want to glance at the PDR book on herbal suppleents --
                    > comprehensive on research data, and does mention Chinese usages. But very
                    > dry.
                    > > >
                    > > > Chris Macie
                    > > >
                    > > > ________________________________
                    > > > From: "Luke Terry"
                    > > > To: "pulsediagnosis"
                    > > > Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 6:59:19 PM
                    > > > Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I'd check out
                    > Peter Holmes' Energetics of Western Herbs. It's a sort of "Bensky" for
                    > western herbs, though not quite so exhaustive. For hardcore western
                    > botanical science, RCT referendes, etc, I really like Kerry Bone's books
                    > out of Australia, Principles & Practices of Phytotherapy, and A Clinical
                    > Guide to Blending Liquid Herbs.
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 4:30 PM, CoreyPine Shane
                    > wrote:
                    > > >>
                    > > >>
                    > > >>
                    > > >> Oooh, interesting question. I'm a western herbalist completing
                    > training in Chinese herbal medicine, so I have a unique perspective here.
                    > > >>
                    > > >> One of my favorite books explaining western herbs for the Chinese
                    > herbalist/acupuncturist is Thomas Avery Garran's "Western Herbs According
                    > to Traditional Chinese Medicine." Not as comprehensive as Bensky, only 60
                    > herbs but in-depth descriptions and classified according to Chinese herbal
                    > categories. A better choice for a larger materia medica with some basic
                    > energetics and formulas according to western body systems is Sharol
                    > Tilgner's "Herbal Medicine from the Heart of the Earth".
                    > > >>
                    > > >> Michael Tierra has also done some good work, but "Planetary Herbology"
                    > is getting a bit dated, and I don't have his more recent books to report on.
                    > > >>
                    > > >> Be Well
                    > > >> CoreyPine
                    > > >>
                    > > >> CoreyPine Shane, Holistic Clinical Herbalist, RH (AHG)
                    > > >> Director, Blue Ridge School of Herbal Medicine
                    > > >>
                    > > >> www.BlueRidgeSchool.org
                    > > >>
                    > > >> Holistic Medicine is about the whole person and also about the
                    > society, the environment and the whole earth.
                    > > >>
                    > > >> ________________________________
                    > > >> From: rasqual9
                    > > >> To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
                    > > >> Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 10:28 AM
                    > > >>
                    > > >> Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                    > > >>
                    > > >>
                    > > >> Just opened an account with HerbPharm, and am interested in adding
                    > 'Western' Herbs to my practice. Any suggestions on a clear, useful
                    > reference book or CD-ROM, kind of a 'Western Bensky's?'
                    > > >>
                    > > >>
                    > > >>
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > --
                    > > > Luke J. Terry, MTOM, Dipl.Ac, L.Ac.
                    > > >
                    > > > Acupuncture
                    > > > Herbal medicine
                    > > > Nutrition
                    > > > Functional Fitness
                    > > > Health Education & Curriculum Design
                    > > >
                    > > > (303) 653-1420
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > --
                    > > William R. Morris, PhD, DAOM, LAc
                    > > http://pulsediagnosis.com/
                    > > http://www.aoma.edu/
                    > > http://taaom.org/
                    > >
                    > > This message, including attachments, contains confidential information
                    > and is intended only for the individual(s) named. Any use by others is
                    > strictly prohibited. Do not disseminate, distribute or copy this email.
                    > Please notify the sender immediately by email if you have received this
                    > email by mistake, and delete this email from your system.
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > --
                    > William R. Morris, PhD, DAOM, LAc
                    > http://pulsediagnosis.com/
                    > http://www.aoma.edu/
                    > http://taaom.org/
                    >
                    > This message, including attachments, contains confidential information and
                    > is intended only for the individual(s) named. Any use by others is strictly
                    > prohibited. Do not disseminate, distribute or copy this email. Please
                    > notify the sender immediately by email if you have received this email by
                    > mistake, and delete this email from your system.
                    >
                  • Z'ev Rosenberg
                    Yehuda, I couldn t agree more. . . we need to be teaching the tao of the physician , including medical ethics such as those taught by Maimonides (Ibn Musa),
                    Message 9 of 18 , Jan 27, 2013
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Yehuda,
                        I couldn't agree more. . . we need to be teaching the 'tao of the physician', including medical ethics such as those taught by Maimonides (Ibn Musa), Ibn Sina, and Sun Simiao.  We shouldn't turn Chinese medicine into 'just another profession', it is special and requires a love and care to practice and a lifetime of devotion to the craft.
                        By the way, my wife is reading "The Physician" for the second time. . I've read parts of it myself, it is a great book.

                      Z'ev Rosenberg
                      On Jan 27, 2013, at 3:15 AM, yehuda frischman <rebyidel@...> wrote:

                       

                      Just want to add that there is a wonderful historical novel that I would highly recommend called "The Physician" by Noah Gordon.   Ibn Sina (or the anglicized Avicenna), is introduced as the remarkable "prince of physicians," who established the first formal medical school, The Madrassas,  in Isphahan, Persia.  To be a physician one needed to be an expert in surgery, herbalogy, theology, jurisprudence, languages and philosophy, among other subjects.  Ibn Sina insisted upon a very high level and breadth of scholarship, skill, and experience in to qualify as a physician, and the finest physicians in the world were his students and graduates.  This brings to mind a discussion that took place on another list recently, criticizing the poor job prospects and income by graduates of our profession. I see these two issues coming together:  I think that it is much too easy to get into our schools, the instructors generally are much too lax grading students, allowing a mediocre level of scholarship to be acceptable, I don't know if it's still going on, but when I was in school from 2000-2004, cheating was rampant especially among a certain group of foreigners who obviously had difficulty in understanding and expressing themselves in English, and finally, EVERYTHING defers to preparing for the graduation exam and even more importantly, the State Board exam. Again, I can only comment on the state of the education in our profession as of 10 or so years ago, but my understanding, speaking to colleagues and students of mine is that not much has changed. Of course our students need to prepare for these exams, but much more importantly, they need to go to our schools to be trained as excellent physicians.  I really believe that by raising the bar, we can affect an enormous change in the success of our profession.  I would suggest that as with Ibn Sina, students need to get much more practical tutelage and experience.  They need to get a much stronger foundation both relative to the past and to the present, by being taught a much broader survey of classics, they need to take more than just one course in chinese medical language and need to be able to open Chinese medical journals to continue learning cutting edge developments in our profession internationally,  as well as learning to be much more competent in Western medical diagnosis and how to use WELL the tools that Western physicians use.  Ultimately, I think that if didactic course studies were more rigorous and if clinical training was more interactive and challenging we would produce graduates who had greater confidence in their knowledge and greater competence in their abilities.   


                      Yehuda L. Frischman, L.Ac, candidate DAOM
                      practitioner of CranioSacral Therapy and Traditional Jewish Medicine

                       


                      --- On Sun, 1/27/13, William Morris <wmorris33@...> wrote:

                      From: William Morris <wmorris33@...>
                      Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                      To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
                      Date: Sunday, January 27, 2013, 2:03 AM

                       

                      I agree w/ Corey, Chris and Z'ev,

                      PDR is a pretty good consensus document. Holmes has had substantial criticism amongst senior practitioners East and West.

                      Corey, Thomas Avery Garron's book is very high quality and reliable information that is very well presented.

                      My new favorite, just got it: The Canon of Medicine Volume 2: Natural Pharmaceuticals
                      Avicenna (Author), Laleh Bakhtiar (Editor). It reminds me of my trip to Italy in 1993 to review the pharmacies in the basilicas. There was not a single agent that did not occur in the Chinese pharmacopoeia. Early Perian medicine was essentially a melting pot of Greek, Ayurvedic and I believe also CHinese work.

                      Warmly,

                      Will

                      On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 10:56 PM, Chistopher Macie <cjmacie@...> wrote:
                      >
                      >  
                      >
                      > One might also want to glance at the PDR  book on herbal suppleents -- comprehensive on research data, and does mention Chinese usages. But very dry.
                      >
                      > Chris Macie
                      >
                      > ________________________________
                      > From: "Luke Terry" <evolution.intent@...>
                      > To: "pulsediagnosis" <PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com>
                      > Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 6:59:19 PM
                      > Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                      >
                      >
                      >  
                      >
                      > If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I'd check out Peter Holmes' Energetics of Western Herbs. It's a sort of "Bensky" for western herbs, though not quite so exhaustive.   For hardcore western botanical science, RCT referendes, etc, I really like Kerry Bone's books out of Australia, Principles & Practices of Phytotherapy, and A Clinical Guide to Blending Liquid Herbs.
                      >
                      >
                      > On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 4:30 PM, CoreyPine Shane <coreypineus@...> wrote:
                      >>
                      >>  
                      >>
                      >> Oooh, interesting question. I'm a western herbalist completing training in Chinese herbal medicine, so I have a unique perspective here.
                      >>
                      >> One of my favorite books explaining western herbs for the Chinese herbalist/acupuncturist is Thomas Avery Garran's "Western Herbs According to Traditional Chinese Medicine." Not as comprehensive as Bensky, only 60 herbs but in-depth descriptions and classified according to Chinese herbal categories. A better choice for a larger materia medica with some basic energetics and formulas according to western body systems is Sharol Tilgner's "Herbal Medicine from the Heart of the Earth".
                      >>
                      >> Michael Tierra has also done some good work, but "Planetary Herbology" is getting a bit dated, and I don't have his more recent books to report on.
                      >>
                      >> Be Well
                      >> CoreyPine
                      >>
                      >> CoreyPine Shane, Holistic Clinical Herbalist, RH (AHG)
                      >> Director, Blue Ridge School of Herbal Medicine
                      >>
                      >> www.BlueRidgeSchool.org
                      >>
                      >> Holistic Medicine is about the whole person and also about the society, the environment and the whole earth.
                      >>
                      >> ________________________________
                      >> From: rasqual9 <bluegreendragon9@...>
                      >> To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
                      >> Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 10:28 AM
                      >>
                      >> Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                      >>
                      >>  
                      >> Just opened an account with HerbPharm, and am interested in adding 'Western' Herbs to my practice. Any suggestions on a clear, useful reference book or CD-ROM, kind of a 'Western Bensky's?'
                      >>
                      >>
                      >>
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      > --
                      > Luke J. Terry, MTOM, Dipl.Ac, L.Ac.
                      >
                      > Acupuncture
                      > Herbal medicine
                      > Nutrition
                      > Functional Fitness
                      > Health Education & Curriculum Design
                      >
                      > (303) 653-1420
                      >
                      >




                      --
                      William R. Morris, PhD, DAOM, LAc
                      http://pulsediagnosis.com/
                      http://www.aoma.edu/
                      http://taaom.org/

                      This message, including attachments, contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual(s) named. Any use by others is strictly prohibited. Do not disseminate, distribute or copy this email. Please notify the sender immediately by email if you have received this email by mistake, and delete this email from your system.


                      Z'ev Rosenberg, L. Ac.
                      Chair Emeritus/Resident Scholar
                      Pacific College of Oriental Medicine
                      San Diego, Ca. 



                    • Z'ev Rosenberg
                      Will, Thanks for the tip! I got a copy of an early translation of The Canon of Medicine 30 years ago, glad to hear there is something new out there. Thanks
                      Message 10 of 18 , Jan 27, 2013
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Will,
                           Thanks for the tip!  I got a copy of an early translation of The Canon of Medicine 30 years ago, glad to hear there is something new out there.  Thanks to your tip, I've order Bakhtiar's excerpt from this work on the pulse, and if I like it, I'll order the Natural Pharmaceutical volume.  A bit expensive for me right now. . 

                        Z'ev Rosenberg
                        On Jan 27, 2013, at 2:03 AM, William Morris <wmorris33@...> wrote:

                         

                        I agree w/ Corey, Chris and Z'ev,

                        PDR is a pretty good consensus document. Holmes has had substantial criticism amongst senior practitioners East and West.

                        Corey, Thomas Avery Garron's book is very high quality and reliable information that is very well presented.

                        My new favorite, just got it: The Canon of Medicine Volume 2: Natural Pharmaceuticals
                        Avicenna (Author), Laleh Bakhtiar (Editor). It reminds me of my trip to Italy in 1993 to review the pharmacies in the basilicas. There was not a single agent that did not occur in the Chinese pharmacopoeia. Early Perian medicine was essentially a melting pot of Greek, Ayurvedic and I believe also CHinese work.

                        Warmly,

                        Will

                        On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 10:56 PM, Chistopher Macie <cjmacie@...> wrote:
                        >
                        >  
                        >
                        > One might also want to glance at the PDR  book on herbal suppleents -- comprehensive on research data, and does mention Chinese usages. But very dry.
                        >
                        > Chris Macie
                        >
                        > ________________________________
                        > From: "Luke Terry" <evolution.intent@...>
                        > To: "pulsediagnosis" <PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com>
                        > Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 6:59:19 PM
                        > Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                        >
                        >
                        >  
                        >
                        > If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I'd check out Peter Holmes' Energetics of Western Herbs. It's a sort of "Bensky" for western herbs, though not quite so exhaustive.   For hardcore western botanical science, RCT referendes, etc, I really like Kerry Bone's books out of Australia, Principles & Practices of Phytotherapy, and A Clinical Guide to Blending Liquid Herbs.
                        >
                        >
                        > On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 4:30 PM, CoreyPine Shane <coreypineus@...> wrote:
                        >>
                        >>  
                        >>
                        >> Oooh, interesting question. I'm a western herbalist completing training in Chinese herbal medicine, so I have a unique perspective here.
                        >>
                        >> One of my favorite books explaining western herbs for the Chinese herbalist/acupuncturist is Thomas Avery Garran's "Western Herbs According to Traditional Chinese Medicine." Not as comprehensive as Bensky, only 60 herbs but in-depth descriptions and classified according to Chinese herbal categories. A better choice for a larger materia medica with some basic energetics and formulas according to western body systems is Sharol Tilgner's "Herbal Medicine from the Heart of the Earth".
                        >>
                        >> Michael Tierra has also done some good work, but "Planetary Herbology" is getting a bit dated, and I don't have his more recent books to report on.
                        >>
                        >> Be Well
                        >> CoreyPine
                        >>
                        >> CoreyPine Shane, Holistic Clinical Herbalist, RH (AHG)
                        >> Director, Blue Ridge School of Herbal Medicine
                        >>
                        >> www.BlueRidgeSchool.org
                        >>
                        >> Holistic Medicine is about the whole person and also about the society, the environment and the whole earth.
                        >>
                        >> ________________________________
                        >> From: rasqual9 <bluegreendragon9@...>
                        >> To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
                        >> Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 10:28 AM
                        >>
                        >> Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                        >>
                        >>  
                        >> Just opened an account with HerbPharm, and am interested in adding 'Western' Herbs to my practice. Any suggestions on a clear, useful reference book or CD-ROM, kind of a 'Western Bensky's?'
                        >>
                        >>
                        >>
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > --
                        > Luke J. Terry, MTOM, Dipl.Ac, L.Ac.
                        >
                        > Acupuncture
                        > Herbal medicine
                        > Nutrition
                        > Functional Fitness
                        > Health Education & Curriculum Design
                        >
                        > (303) 653-1420
                        >
                        >




                        --
                        William R. Morris, PhD, DAOM, LAc
                        http://pulsediagnosis.com/
                        http://www.aoma.edu/
                        http://taaom.org/

                        This message, including attachments, contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual(s) named. Any use by others is strictly prohibited. Do not disseminate, distribute or copy this email. Please notify the sender immediately by email if you have received this email by mistake, and delete this email from your system.


                        Z'ev Rosenberg, L. Ac.
                        Chair Emeritus/Resident Scholar
                        Pacific College of Oriental Medicine
                        San Diego, Ca. 



                      • Luke Terry
                        Z ev, and Will, Perhaps one or both of you can direct me towards some well-reasoned and thorough review of Holmes EWH volumes. I was not aware of the flaws of
                        Message 11 of 18 , Jan 27, 2013
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Z'ev, and Will,

                          Perhaps one or both of you can direct me towards some well-reasoned and thorough review of Holmes' EWH volumes. I was not aware of the flaws of this work, and I use these text extensively and have found them invaluable in integrating both western and local herbs into my practice.

                           While the EWH books may not be perfect, to my knowledge no one else has attempted such a comprehensive TCM classification of western herbs. The Gannon work looks quite intriguing (I have added it to the queue,) but it still doesn't seem to occupy the niche that Holmes has filled, however imperfectly.

                          Classical Chinese herbalists had the luxury of freely reprinting older texts, with additional commentary and refinement so that each successive generation of herbalists adds to and improves the body work.  We are to some degree limited by modern concepts of intellectual property and copyright. Nonetheless, it seems clear that there is a niche for an evolution of the EWH text that addresses its shortcomings.


                          On Sun, Jan 27, 2013 at 9:45 AM, Z'ev Rosenberg <zrosenbe@...> wrote:
                           

                          Will,

                             Thanks for the tip!  I got a copy of an early translation of The Canon of Medicine 30 years ago, glad to hear there is something new out there.  Thanks to your tip, I've order Bakhtiar's excerpt from this work on the pulse, and if I like it, I'll order the Natural Pharmaceutical volume.  A bit expensive for me right now. . 

                          Z'ev Rosenberg

                          On Jan 27, 2013, at 2:03 AM, William Morris <wmorris33@...> wrote:

                           

                          I agree w/ Corey, Chris and Z'ev,

                          PDR is a pretty good consensus document. Holmes has had substantial criticism amongst senior practitioners East and West.

                          Corey, Thomas Avery Garron's book is very high quality and reliable information that is very well presented.

                          My new favorite, just got it: The Canon of Medicine Volume 2: Natural Pharmaceuticals
                          Avicenna (Author), Laleh Bakhtiar (Editor). It reminds me of my trip to Italy in 1993 to review the pharmacies in the basilicas. There was not a single agent that did not occur in the Chinese pharmacopoeia. Early Perian medicine was essentially a melting pot of Greek, Ayurvedic and I believe also CHinese work.

                          Warmly,

                          Will

                          On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 10:56 PM, Chistopher Macie <cjmacie@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >  
                          >
                          > One might also want to glance at the PDR  book on herbal suppleents -- comprehensive on research data, and does mention Chinese usages. But very dry.
                          >
                          > Chris Macie
                          >
                          > ________________________________
                          > From: "Luke Terry" <evolution.intent@...>
                          > To: "pulsediagnosis" <PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com>
                          > Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 6:59:19 PM
                          > Subject: Re: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                          >
                          >
                          >  
                          >
                          > If you want a TCM pharmacology review of western herbs, I'd check out Peter Holmes' Energetics of Western Herbs. It's a sort of "Bensky" for western herbs, though not quite so exhaustive.   For hardcore western botanical science, RCT referendes, etc, I really like Kerry Bone's books out of Australia, Principles & Practices of Phytotherapy, and A Clinical Guide to Blending Liquid Herbs.
                          >
                          >
                          > On Sat, Jan 26, 2013 at 4:30 PM, CoreyPine Shane <coreypineus@...> wrote:
                          >>
                          >>  
                          >>
                          >> Oooh, interesting question. I'm a western herbalist completing training in Chinese herbal medicine, so I have a unique perspective here.
                          >>
                          >> One of my favorite books explaining western herbs for the Chinese herbalist/acupuncturist is Thomas Avery Garran's "Western Herbs According to Traditional Chinese Medicine." Not as comprehensive as Bensky, only 60 herbs but in-depth descriptions and classified according to Chinese herbal categories. A better choice for a larger materia medica with some basic energetics and formulas according to western body systems is Sharol Tilgner's "Herbal Medicine from the Heart of the Earth".
                          >>
                          >> Michael Tierra has also done some good work, but "Planetary Herbology" is getting a bit dated, and I don't have his more recent books to report on.
                          >>
                          >> Be Well
                          >> CoreyPine
                          >>
                          >> CoreyPine Shane, Holistic Clinical Herbalist, RH (AHG)
                          >> Director, Blue Ridge School of Herbal Medicine
                          >>
                          >> www.BlueRidgeSchool.org
                          >>
                          >> Holistic Medicine is about the whole person and also about the society, the environment and the whole earth.
                          >>
                          >> ________________________________
                          >> From: rasqual9 <bluegreendragon9@...>
                          >> To: PulseDiagnosis@yahoogroups.com
                          >> Sent: Saturday, January 26, 2013 10:28 AM
                          >>
                          >> Subject: [PulseDiagnosis] Reference Book for Western Herbs
                          >>
                          >>  
                          >> Just opened an account with HerbPharm, and am interested in adding 'Western' Herbs to my practice. Any suggestions on a clear, useful reference book or CD-ROM, kind of a 'Western Bensky's?'
                          >>
                          >>
                          >>
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > --
                          > Luke J. Terry, MTOM, Dipl.Ac, L.Ac.
                          >
                          > Acupuncture
                          > Herbal medicine
                          > Nutrition
                          > Functional Fitness
                          > Health Education & Curriculum Design
                          >
                          > (303) 653-1420
                          >
                          >




                          --
                          William R. Morris, PhD, DAOM, LAc
                          http://pulsediagnosis.com/
                          http://www.aoma.edu/
                          http://taaom.org/

                          This message, including attachments, contains confidential information and is intended only for the individual(s) named. Any use by others is strictly prohibited. Do not disseminate, distribute or copy this email. Please notify the sender immediately by email if you have received this email by mistake, and delete this email from your system.


                          Z'ev Rosenberg, L. Ac.
                          Chair Emeritus/Resident Scholar
                          Pacific College of Oriental Medicine
                          San Diego, Ca. 






                          --
                          Luke J. Terry, MTOM, Dipl.Ac, L.Ac.

                          Acupuncture
                          Herbal medicine
                          Nutrition
                          Functional Fitness
                          Health Education & Curriculum Design

                          (303) 653-1420

                        • matthew
                          Hey Luke, just noticing this thread. Probably the best book on combining Western herbs with Eastern Medicine, are Jeremy Ross s works. There was the first
                          Message 12 of 18 , Mar 1, 2013
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Hey Luke, just noticing this thread. Probably the best book on combining Western herbs with Eastern Medicine, are Jeremy Ross's works.
                            There was the first volume: "Combining Western Herbs and Chinese Medicine" and now he has a 2nd volume out "Clinical Materia Medica".
                            Both are available from Eastland Press.
                            The first volume is prob the one you are looking for. It is set up like Bensky's herbal and has lot of two herb combinations, modifications that are interesting to think about. On the other hand, as a student and friend of Michael Moore, and as a reader of older Eclectic material and Homeopathic texts, there is a lot in this book I could be critical of.
                            For instance, Ross only uses and recommends dried plant Lobelia and seems to indicate that he gets great results from this preparation. Try it your self and see how it makes you feel, its NOT great medicine.
                            But the text has other things that make it of value, esp if Chinese Med is your thing and you are curious about local plants.

                            all bests

                            Matt Haug LAc
                          • Luke Terry
                            Matt, Thanks for the reference, sir. I will look into Ross s books ASAP. I m always looking for great books on local & western herbs to use with and compliment
                            Message 13 of 18 , Mar 1, 2013
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Matt,

                              Thanks for the reference, sir. I will look into Ross's books ASAP. I'm always looking for great books on local & western herbs to use with and compliment TCM herbs. I'm not a fan of lobelia, but I work with a western herbalist who swears by it in very specific instances. And as you implied, self testing has a long and honorable history dating back to, and far predating our own Sheng Nong.



                              Cheers,

                              Luke



                              On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 6:18 PM, matthew <matthaug2002@...> wrote:
                               

                              Hey Luke, just noticing this thread. Probably the best book on combining Western herbs with Eastern Medicine, are Jeremy Ross's works.
                              There was the first volume: "Combining Western Herbs and Chinese Medicine" and now he has a 2nd volume out "Clinical Materia Medica".
                              Both are available from Eastland Press.
                              The first volume is prob the one you are looking for. It is set up like Bensky's herbal and has lot of two herb combinations, modifications that are interesting to think about. On the other hand, as a student and friend of Michael Moore, and as a reader of older Eclectic material and Homeopathic texts, there is a lot in this book I could be critical of.
                              For instance, Ross only uses and recommends dried plant Lobelia and seems to indicate that he gets great results from this preparation. Try it your self and see how it makes you feel, its NOT great medicine.
                              But the text has other things that make it of value, esp if Chinese Med is your thing and you are curious about local plants.

                              all bests

                              Matt Haug LAc






                            • Liat Makmal
                              Hi, I need referral in Bellevue Washington If anyone know someone to treat alcohol addiction recovery. Thanks Liat Levkovitz ... Hi, I need referral in
                              Message 14 of 18 , Mar 15, 2013
                              • 0 Attachment

                                Hi,
                                I need referral in Bellevue Washington 
                                If anyone know someone to treat alcohol addiction recovery.
                                Thanks
                                Liat Levkovitz 



                                 

                                  

                                .

                              Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.