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Re: [ProgAndOther] Porcupine Tree/Digital Progressive

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  • Noah Samuel Lesgold
    ... I heard some songs which failed to suck, but also haven t thrilled me (from the most recent albums). Haven t heard their older stuff at all. Basically
    Message 1 of 20 , Jan 2, 2001
      On Tue, 2 Jan 2001, Roy DeRousse wrote:

      > Am I the only person in the prog world who does not "get" this band?
      > They're OK, but I don't understand the high esteem that most people
      > seem to have for them. I'm not a huge Pink Floyd fan either, so maybe
      > that helps to explain it?

      I heard some songs which failed to suck, but also haven't thrilled me
      (from the most recent albums). Haven't heard their older stuff at all.
      Basically I'll give them a chance at NEARfest to please me or not, and
      based on that decide whether or not to buy any of their stuff.

      --
      Noah Lesgold | Hell is in Gorham, NY, on SR247, E of Canandaigua
      nlesgold@... | http://www.cif.rochester.edu/~nlesgold
      (or)nlesgold@... | (updated for the first time in a year)

      "Jellybean is a prominent patent attorney who can think with his spines.
      he likes collie-spaniel crosses, red ink, and beating people up."
    • Jerry Keller
      ... i absolutely hate the term ear candy . what does it really mean? jerry
      Message 2 of 20 , Jan 2, 2001
        >bob said
        > Then I found a cheap copy of "Stupid Dream" at an Encore bookstore's
        > going out of business sale and decided to try again. That one was
        > even more poppish, glossy, "ear candy" than _Sky_ was. Again I was
        > not impressed.

        i absolutely hate the term "ear candy".
        what does it really mean?
        jerry
      • Noah Samuel Lesgold
        ... If I were to use it, I d mean something that was pleasing on the surface, but shallow - not too much depth to it. Some of the Alan Parsons Project s work
        Message 3 of 20 , Jan 2, 2001
          On Tue, 2 Jan 2001, Jerry Keller wrote:

          > >bob said
          > > Then I found a cheap copy of "Stupid Dream" at an Encore bookstore's
          > > going out of business sale and decided to try again. That one was
          > > even more poppish, glossy, "ear candy" than _Sky_ was. Again I was
          > > not impressed.
          >
          > i absolutely hate the term "ear candy".
          > what does it really mean?

          If I were to use it, I'd mean something that was pleasing on the surface,
          but shallow - not too much depth to it. Some of the Alan Parsons
          Project's work falls under that category, for example (though I made a mix
          CD-R of their better work today for someone interested in the group).

          --
          Noah Lesgold | Hell is in Gorham, NY, on SR247, E of Canandaigua
          nlesgold@... | http://www.cif.rochester.edu/~nlesgold
          (or)nlesgold@... | (updated for the first time in a year)

          "Jellybean is a prominent patent attorney who can think with his spines.
          he likes collie-spaniel crosses, red ink, and beating people up."
        • Grace Warren
          ... Actually, I m only so-so about PT myself. I have Signify and Stupid Dream. I like Signify a lot and don t like Stupid Dream so much, but it s not bad
          Message 4 of 20 , Jan 2, 2001
            At 12:55 PM 1/2/2001 -0800, you wrote:
            >Am I the only person in the prog world who does not "get" this band? They're
            >OK, but I don't understand the high esteem that most people seem to have for
            >them. I'm not a huge Pink Floyd fan either, so maybe that helps to
            >explain it?


            Actually, I'm only so-so about PT myself. I have Signify and Stupid
            Dream. I like Signify a lot and don't like Stupid Dream so much, but it's
            not bad either. It's been awhile, though, since I've listened to either,
            so I'd be hard-pressed to discuss the differences between the two right
            now. I've never quite understood the Pink Floyd comparisons though. But
            then again, I never understood the Genesis-Marillion comparisons either,
            so what do I know? :-)

            However, they are still one of the groups I am really looking forward to
            seeing at NearFest.

            Cheers,

            Grace

            ---------------
            NOW PLAYING: Underground Railroad - Through & Through (another definite
            top 10 of 2000 for me)
          • Gary Varney
            ... While I love _The Sky Moves Sideways_, the later poppy stuff does absolutely nothing for me (well, the song Waiting from _Signify_ was catchy, but it
            Message 5 of 20 , Jan 2, 2001
              Roy DeRousse wrote:

              > Am I the only person in the prog world who does not "get" this band? They're
              > OK, but I don't understand the high esteem that most people seem to have for
              > them. I'm not a huge Pink Floyd fan either, so maybe that helps to explain it?

              While I love _The Sky Moves Sideways_, the later poppy stuff does absolutely
              nothing for me (well, the song "Waiting" from _Signify_ was catchy, but it grew
              tiresome fairly rapidly). For me, _Staircase Infinities_ fits a description that
              Noah gave today, to wit: the album fails to suck, but it doesn't thrill me either.

              Grace, you said you didn't get the Floyd/Tree comparison. Have you heard _The
              Sky..._? I think the comparisons/influences are very overt on that disc.

              -g
              NP: Galactic Cowboys, s/t
            • Brandon Wu
              ... I am a big Floyd fan as well. I have Signify and it bores the hell out of me, though admittedly I probably haven t given it the attention is deserves.
              Message 6 of 20 , Jan 2, 2001
                --- "Bob Eichler" <eichler@e...> wrote:
                > You are not alone. I find Porcupine Tree to be *vastly* overrated.
                > I'm a big Floyd fan, so when I found a used copy of PT's _The Sky
                > Moves Sideways_ (which often seemed to get compared favorably with
                > _Wish You Were Here_), I grabbed it. It was an OK album, but I
                > couldn't see what all the hype was about.

                I am a big Floyd fan as well. I have "Signify" and it bores the
                hell out of me, though admittedly I probably haven't given it the
                attention is deserves.

                -B

                --
                Ground and Sky Progressive Rock Informational Resource
                http://www.progreviews.com/
                np: mp3 from autechre "tri repetae++"
              • upnsm0ke
                ... They re ... for ... explain it? No, you re not the only person. Myself and a few people I know tried _Signify_, which was ok for a while, but that was
                Message 7 of 20 , Jan 2, 2001
                  > From: Roy DeRousse <roylayer@...>
                  >
                  > Am I the only person in the prog world who does not "get" this band?
                  They're
                  > OK, but I don't understand the high esteem that most people seem to have
                  for
                  > them. I'm not a huge Pink Floyd fan either, so maybe that helps to
                  explain it?

                  No, you're not the only person. Myself and a few people I know tried
                  _Signify_, which was ok for a while, but that was pretty much it. The live
                  album had its moments, but I sold it quite some time ago.

                  E-Man
                • stevesly@aol.com
                  Roy wrote:
                  Message 8 of 20 , Jan 3, 2001
                    Roy wrote:

                    << Am I the only person in the prog world who does not "get" this band?
                    They're
                    OK, but I don't understand the high esteem that most people seem to have for
                    them. I'm not a huge Pink Floyd fan either, so maybe that helps to explain
                    it?<<

                    I think this a classic example of the current division among prog rock fans.
                    It seems that the people who "get" Porcupine Tree tend to be the same ones
                    that are "normally" attracted to more melodic (accessable?) prog. The people
                    who have posted as "not getting it" seem to be the same ones usually
                    attracted to the more "expirimental" (avante?) prog (ie Bob, Brandon, Gary,
                    ect.) This is not to say that members of one group can't like bands from the
                    other group, but there does seem to be a general division amongst fans of
                    this genre. Personally I love Porcupine Tree, and I think the main appeal
                    for me is that they are simply outstanding songwriters. For people who hold
                    instrumental prowes as their main attraction, Porcupine Tree probably does
                    not fit the bill, as instrumentally there are a lot of prog bands out there
                    that are technically better musicians than PT. Steven Wilson is a very good,
                    but not great guitarist, but like David Gilmour it is his style that is the
                    attraction for me. The same can be sai
                    d about Richard Barbieri (keys). After seeing them live he is probably one
                    of the more average prog keys players I have seen when it comes to pure
                    technical skill, but it is what he creates sonically with his instruments
                    that make the difference for me. He is simply very effective at what he does
                    (to make another Floyd comparison, he is very similar to Richard Wright in
                    this manner) Anyway, I think they are great, but it does not surprise me
                    that some members of this list do not care for them.

                    Steve Sly
                  • Roy DeRousse
                    I m surprised at the number of people who have agreed with me about Porcupine Tree. I didn t mean to start a revolt or anything! I am actually sort of
                    Message 9 of 20 , Jan 3, 2001
                      I'm surprised at the number of people who have agreed with me about Porcupine
                      Tree. I didn't mean to start a revolt or anything! I am actually sort of
                      envious of those who do enjoy the band so much. I have many friends who
                      normally share my tastes in music, yet love PT. I feel like I missing out on
                      something.

                      --- stevesly@... wrote:
                      > I think this a classic example of the current division among prog rock fans.
                      > It seems that the people who "get" Porcupine Tree tend to be the same ones
                      > that are "normally" attracted to more melodic (accessable?) prog. The people
                      > who have posted as "not getting it" seem to be the same ones usually
                      > attracted to the more "expirimental" (avante?) prog (ie Bob, Brandon, Gary,
                      > ect.) This is not to say that members of one group can't like bands from the
                      > other group, but there does seem to be a general division amongst fans of

                      I agree with you in general, but what is strange in my case is that I DO enjoy
                      good pop music (as well as some of the more experimental prog). I love XTC,
                      Split Enz, and Jellyfish, for example.

                      > this manner) Anyway, I think they are great, but it does not surprise me
                      > that some members of this list do not care for them.

                      Believe it or not, I AM looking forward to seeing them live at NF. I am hoping
                      that seeing them live might open my eyes to something that I'm missing.


                      =====
                      Have fun!

                      Roy DeRousse
                      relayer@... (Please use this, not the yahoo.com address. Thanks!)

                      __________________________________________________
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                    • Brandon Wu
                      ... It might surprise some people that I m the same way: although I m bored by a lot of neo and prog-metal, I very much like good popular music - classic rock,
                      Message 10 of 20 , Jan 3, 2001
                        --- Roy DeRousse <roylayer@y...> wrote:
                        >
                        > I agree with you in general, but what is strange in my case is that
                        > I DO enjoy good pop music (as well as some of the more experimental
                        > prog). I love XTC, Split Enz, and Jellyfish, for example.

                        It might surprise some people that I'm the same way: although I'm
                        bored by a lot of neo and prog-metal, I very much like good popular
                        music - classic rock, alternative rock, indie rock, hip-hop,
                        electronica, world beat, bop and post-bop jazz (ok, so that's not
                        really "popular music"), and so on. And I do like quite a bit of
                        prog-metal.

                        However, I'm somewhat tired of the more "mainstream" progressive
                        stuff... and Genesis never did it for me, I only like the very best
                        of Yes, and I despise ELP. Hmm...

                        -B

                        --
                        Ground and Sky Progressive Rock Informational Resource
                        http://www.progreviews.com/
                        np: massive attack, "blue lines"
                      • stevesly@aol.com
                        In a message dated 01/03/2001 1:37:25 PM Eastern Standard Time, ... It really did not surprise me at all. People usually really love Porcupine Tree or don t
                        Message 11 of 20 , Jan 3, 2001
                          In a message dated 01/03/2001 1:37:25 PM Eastern Standard Time,
                          roylayer@... writes:


                          >>I'm surprised at the number of people who have agreed with me about
                          Porcupine
                          Tree.  I didn't mean to start a revolt or anything!  I am actually sort of
                          envious of those who do enjoy the band so much.  I have many friends who
                          normally share my tastes in music, yet love PT.  I feel like I missing out
                          on
                          something.<<


                          It really did not surprise me at all.  People usually really love Porcupine
                          Tree or don't get them at all.  There does not seem to be much middle ground.
                            The album either made the top 10 list (mostly top 5) or was not even
                          mentioned at all.  It is still #1 in the poll, but not by much.

                          Steve Sly  
                        • upnsm0ke
                          ... Blasphemy!!! =D E-Man
                          Message 12 of 20 , Jan 4, 2001
                            > From: Brandon Wu <brandon@...>
                            >
                            > and I despise ELP.

                            Blasphemy!!!

                            =D

                            E-Man
                          • Brandon Wu
                            ... Uh-oh... the cat s out of the bag. Here s more ammo: I m not real big on Canterbury or Krautrock, Jethro Tull doesn t do it for me, I *still* haven t
                            Message 13 of 20 , Jan 4, 2001
                              --- "upnsm0ke" <upnsm0ke@g...> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > and I despise ELP.
                              >
                              > Blasphemy!!!

                              Uh-oh... the cat's out of the bag. Here's more ammo: I'm not real
                              big on Canterbury or Krautrock, Jethro Tull doesn't do it for me,
                              I *still* haven't heard any Gong, and Phil Collins is da man! *

                              > Does he buy food? Even if he bought them secondhand, that would be
                              > like $5K. Actually, that's ridiculous. How the hell would he find
                              > time to listen to everything, let alone absorb and really "get
                              > into" a disc? It would all just sound like a bunch of notes and
                              > warbles, if he was goin' though disc after disc after disc....

                              Speaking for myself, I usually listen to music every single minute
                              I'm alone and many that I'm not. I can probably listen to, oh,
                              10+ albums in a day if I had the free time, which I often do. At
                              that rate 230 discs a year is easy, and 500 is possible. Of course,
                              I do seem to be finding it necessary to expand my musical tastes,
                              as that many discs in the same genre gets old after a while. Hence
                              my recent non-prog kick.

                              I just wonder how the classical collectors that have libraries in
                              the five-digit range can possibly digest all *their* music.

                              -B

                              * I was lying about one of those... you can probably guess which.

                              --
                              Ground and Sky Progressive Rock Informational Resource
                              http://www.progreviews.com/
                              np: nada
                            • upnsm0ke
                              ... I can handle that. ... Songs From The Wood, Stormwatch. At the very least. =) ... You talkin about that T. Rex guy? ;-) ... Damn straight!!!!
                              Message 14 of 20 , Jan 4, 2001
                                > From: Brandon Wu <brandon@...>
                                >
                                > > > and I despise ELP.
                                > >
                                > > Blasphemy!!!
                                >
                                > Uh-oh... the cat's out of the bag. Here's more ammo: I'm not real
                                > big on Canterbury or Krautrock,

                                I can handle that.

                                > Jethro Tull doesn't do it for me,

                                Songs From The Wood, Stormwatch. At the very least. =)

                                > I *still* haven't heard any Gong

                                You talkin' about that T. Rex guy? ;-)

                                > and Phil Collins is da man! *

                                Damn straight!!!! Su-su-sussudio!!!

                                Hey, I do like Phil's voice, and some of his pop stuff.

                                > > Does he buy food? Even if he bought them secondhand, that would be
                                > > like $5K. Actually, that's ridiculous. How the hell would he find
                                > > time to listen to everything, let alone absorb and really "get
                                > > into" a disc? It would all just sound like a bunch of notes and
                                > > warbles, if he was goin' though disc after disc after disc....
                                >
                                > Speaking for myself, I usually listen to music every single minute
                                > I'm alone and many that I'm not. I can probably listen to, oh,
                                > 10+ albums in a day if I had the free time, which I often do.

                                I can't. No boombox on the job, haha!

                                > At that rate 230 discs a year is easy, and 500 is possible. Of course,
                                > I do seem to be finding it necessary to expand my musical tastes,
                                > as that many discs in the same genre gets old after a while.
                                > Hence my recent non-prog kick.

                                Non-prog is good for maintaining an, eh, balance. I've been listening to
                                lots of non-prog, e.g. fusion, funk, trance, alternative, soundtracks, etc.

                                E-Man
                              • Brandon Wu
                                ... I am deathly afraid of genre narrowmindedness - there s so much good music out there that isn t prog, and I try to make a conscious effort to seek it out.
                                Message 15 of 20 , Jan 4, 2001
                                  --- In ProgAndOther@egroups.com, "upnsm0ke" <upnsm0ke@g...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Non-prog is good for maintaining an, eh, balance. I've been
                                  > listening to lots of non-prog, e.g. fusion, funk, trance,
                                  > alternative, soundtracks, etc.

                                  I am deathly afraid of genre narrowmindedness - there's so much
                                  good music out there that isn't prog, and I try to make a conscious
                                  effort to seek it out. It's quite rewarding, and I still have the
                                  gratification of knowing that I haven't yet found anything I like,
                                  as a whole, better than the progressive rock genre.

                                  Once I make my next big prog order I expect to be back on the prog
                                  track again... and then hopefully I will have the motivation to
                                  update Ground & Sky.

                                  -B

                                  --
                                  Ground and Sky Progressive Rock Informational Resource
                                  http://www.progreviews.com/
                                  np: mogwai, "young team"
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