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Re: vitrified hill forts in ohio

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  • mike white
    attached is the layout of a hilltop with ancient stone works in ohio. at first glance most would agree that it seems to be well fortified, and defensive in
    Message 1 of 4 , Nov 2, 2001
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         attached is the layout of a hilltop with ancient stone works in ohio.  at first glance most would agree that it seems to be well fortified, and defensive in nature, however the walls were broad and low, 3-5 high, 15-20ft wide at base, like a levee.  the enclosure even has a natural water reservoir.  the biggest mystery, besides the purpose of the walls, is the fact that the walls and gates show that intense heat was directed at them, vitrifying and fusing the stone !!!  brings to mind the vitrified hillforts of scotland, also unexplained.  signal fires seems an unlikely cause.   personally, i think this could be the work of people different from the mound builders, even though in the general area of intense moundbuilder culture.    i will crunch posts, as before.  
       
       
      kr
      mike 
       
       
    • Paul Troemner
      Mike, Were the walls vitrified on all sides, or just on the inner sides, or just on the outer sides? How hot does a corn field fire get? Broad and low walls
      Message 2 of 4 , Nov 2, 2001
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        Mike,

        Were the walls vitrified on all sides, or just on the
        inner sides, or just on the outer sides?

        How hot does a corn field fire get?

        Broad and low walls may have been the base for wooden
        palisades. If the palisades were set afire, perhaps
        that could also have contributed to the vitrification.

        My guess is the enemies of the wall builders tried to
        burn them out, burn them down, and burn their fields.
        Or else the wall builders heaped brush over the walls
        and set the brush afire to fuse the stones in the wall
        together, thus making the walls more difficult to
        pilfer materials for other building construction.

        Ross County has a number of other earthworks. The
        county also has the other end of a straight 60 mi.
        long Hopewell road coming from the Newark, Ohio
        earthworks. I would guess the Hopewell built this
        walled area.

        Paul

        --- mike white <infoplz@...> wrote:
        >
        > attached is the layout of a hilltop with ancient
        > stone works in ohio. at first glance most would
        > agree that it seems to be well fortified, and
        > defensive in nature, however the walls were broad
        > and low, 3-5 high, 15-20ft wide at base, like a
        > levee. the enclosure even has a natural water
        > reservoir. the biggest mystery, besides the purpose
        > of the walls, is the fact that the walls and gates
        > show that intense heat was directed at them,
        > vitrifying and fusing the stone !!! brings to mind
        > the vitrified hillforts of scotland, also
        > unexplained. signal fires seems an unlikely cause.
        > personally, i think this could be the work of
        > people different from the mound builders, even
        > though in the general area of intense moundbuilder
        > culture. i will crunch posts, as before.
        >
        >
        > kr
        > mike
        >
        >
        >

        > ATTACHMENT part 2 image/jpeg name=bourneville.jpg


        > ATTACHMENT part 3 image/jpeg name=vitrified.jpg



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      • mike white
        hi paul, friends im looking deeper, and cannot answer you fully at this time. i will say that there are several hill forts of the same character built by the
        Message 3 of 4 , Nov 2, 2001
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          hi paul, friends
           
             im looking deeper, and cannot answer you fully at this time.  i will say that there are several hill forts of the same character built by the same people.  many show the same intense heat directed at the stones.  all appear to have been conquered and the walls thrown down.  i have difficulty accepting the hopewell and adena classifications, and rarely think in those terms.   in scotland they piled tons of wood against similar vitrified walls, trying to recreate the effect, but were unable to cause the fusion and vitrification present.  i think these predate the hopewell and adena moundbuilders.  these latter people seemed unconcerned about building defensive fortresses, many times placing the moat on the inside of walls, etc.  they were making statements.  several of the same class of stone forts have twin mounds just outside their main gates, a likely place for records and time capsules, imho.  i spent much time walking and studying the mounds and enclosures, and am of the opinion they are the work of a different people, probably separated by thousands of years from the earlier stone forts.  imho   i hope to explore this mystery next spring by fieldwork.   i will try to determine how and where the heat was directed.  for all we know it may be evidence of superior weapons used in ancient times.   are these posts and attachments worthy to be continued?  
           
          regards
          mike
           
           
          ----- Original Message -----
          Sent: Friday, November 02, 2001 6:12 AM
          Subject: Re: [Precolumbian_Inscriptions] Re: vitrified hill forts in ohio

          Mike,

          Were the walls vitrified on all sides, or just on the
          inner sides, or just on the outer sides?

          How hot does a corn field fire get?

          Broad and low walls may have been the base for wooden
          palisades.  If the palisades were set afire, perhaps
          that could also have contributed to the vitrification.

          My guess is the enemies of the wall builders tried to
          burn them out, burn them down, and burn their fields.
          Or else the wall builders heaped brush over the walls
          and set the brush afire to fuse the stones in the wall
          together, thus making the walls more difficult to
          pilfer materials for other building construction.

          Ross County has a number of other earthworks.  The
          county also has the other end of a straight 60 mi.
          long Hopewell road coming from the Newark, Ohio
          earthworks.  I would guess the Hopewell built this
          walled area.

          Paul

          --- mike white <infoplz@...> wrote:
          >
          >    attached is the layout of a hilltop with ancient
          > stone works in ohio.  at first glance most would
          > agree that it seems to be well fortified, and
          > defensive in nature, however the walls were broad
          > and low, 3-5 high, 15-20ft wide at base, like a
          > levee.  the enclosure even has a natural water
          > reservoir.  the biggest mystery, besides the purpose
          > of the walls, is the fact that the walls and gates
          > show that intense heat was directed at them,
          > vitrifying and fusing the stone !!!  brings to mind
          > the vitrified hillforts of scotland, also
          > unexplained.  signal fires seems an unlikely cause.
          >  personally, i think this could be the work of
          > people different from the mound builders, even
          > though in the general area of intense moundbuilder
          > culture.    i will crunch posts, as before. 
          >
          >
          > kr
          > mike 
          >
          >
          >

          > ATTACHMENT part 2 image/jpeg name=bourneville.jpg


          > ATTACHMENT part 3 image/jpeg name=vitrified.jpg



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        • Pam Giese
          Paul wrote: Broad and low walls may have been the base for wooden palisades. If the palisades were set afire, perhaps that could also have contributed to the
          Message 4 of 4 , Nov 2, 2001
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            Paul wrote:
            Broad and low walls may have been the base for wooden
            palisades.  If the palisades were set afire, perhaps
            that could also have contributed to the vitrification.
             
            Yes!  This was my first thought too.  The low rising walls sound very much like the walls that surround Angel Mounds outside Evansville, IN.   These were thought to be the base for wooden palisades.
             
            When I visited Angel Mounds last year, I was with a co-worker who's a medieval re-enacter. He had trouble buying into the standard definintion of the site and kept pointing out similarities to a medieval fort --to the point of showing how a trebuchet positioned on the three small mounds would have been able to defend the whole city.  The trebuchet idea also made more sense to explain the presence of small stones all around the perimeter.  The posters said that the stones were thrown out by the inhabitants, probably as defence...Wouldn't a people sophisticated enough to built such a city be able to come up with a better defense that throwingout handfuls of stones through windows?
             
            (It also fits in with the legend of Templars visiting the new world...)

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