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Whistle Help

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  • deanw3576
    Iam looking for a little help with whistle rockets.On take off there are maybe three or four pops then smooths out like LINK
    Message 1 of 8 , Apr 3, 2012
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      Iam looking for a little help with whistle rockets.On take off there are maybe three or four "pops" then smooths out like LINK (not that much popping and not my motor).Is it the fuel,pressing technique,tooling?This happens with my long winded screamers and regular whistle rockets.LWS is 1lb Wolters hybrid,regular whistle is Wolters Extreme tooling-fuel is the  formulas supplied with the tooling.I am looking for a place to start.

                                                   Dean

    • Andy Holcomb
      The popping is usually caused by pockets of the Vaseline or mineral oil boiling into a vapor and interrupting the burn. What percentage are you using? Andy ...
      Message 2 of 8 , Apr 3, 2012
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        The popping is usually caused by pockets of the Vaseline or mineral oil
        boiling into a vapor and interrupting the burn. What percentage are you
        using?


        Andy

        -----Original Message-----
        From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
        [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of deanw3576
        Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:44 PM
        To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Whistle Help



        Iam looking for a little help with whistle rockets.On take off there are
        maybe three or four "pops" then smooths out like LINK
        <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dc7U6Dkiksg&feature=related> (not that much
        popping and not my motor).Is it the fuel,pressing technique,tooling?This
        happens with my long winded screamers and regular whistle rockets.LWS is 1lb
        Wolters hybrid,regular whistle is Wolters Extreme tooling-fuel is the
        formulas supplied with the tooling.I am looking for a place to start.

        Dean
      • deanw3576
        Andy,I have been substituting mineral oil for vaseline for obvious reasons is this my FAIL?
        Message 3 of 8 , Apr 3, 2012
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          Andy,I have been substituting mineral oil for vaseline for obvious reasons is this my FAIL?
          --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb" <andrew_holcomb@...> wrote:
          >
          > The popping is usually caused by pockets of the Vaseline or mineral oil
          > boiling into a vapor and interrupting the burn. What percentage are you
          > using?
          >
          >
          > Andy
          >
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
          > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of deanw3576
          > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:44 PM
          > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Whistle Help
          >
          >
          >
          > Iam looking for a little help with whistle rockets.On take off there are
          > maybe three or four "pops" then smooths out like LINK
          > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dc7U6Dkiksg&feature=related> (not that much
          > popping and not my motor).Is it the fuel,pressing technique,tooling?This
          > happens with my long winded screamers and regular whistle rockets.LWS is 1lb
          > Wolters hybrid,regular whistle is Wolters Extreme tooling-fuel is the
          > formulas supplied with the tooling.I am looking for a place to start.
          >
          > Dean
          >
        • Andy Holcomb
          No, mineral oil should be fine. I wonder if maybe it s not being dispersed evenly through the mix? What solvent are you dissolving it in? ... From:
          Message 4 of 8 , Apr 4, 2012
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            No, mineral oil should be fine. I wonder if maybe it's not being dispersed
            evenly through the mix? What solvent are you dissolving it in?


            -----Original Message-----
            From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
            [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of deanw3576
            Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 8:36 PM
            To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Re: Whistle Help

            Andy,I have been substituting mineral oil for vaseline for obvious reasons
            is this my FAIL?
            --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb"
            <andrew_holcomb@...> wrote:
            >
            > The popping is usually caused by pockets of the Vaseline or mineral
            > oil boiling into a vapor and interrupting the burn. What percentage
            > are you using?
            >
            >
            > Andy
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
            > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
            > deanw3576
            > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:44 PM
            > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Whistle Help
            >
            >
            >
            > Iam looking for a little help with whistle rockets.On take off there
            > are maybe three or four "pops" then smooths out like LINK
            > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dc7U6Dkiksg&feature=related> (not
            > that much popping and not my motor).Is it the fuel,pressing
            > technique,tooling?This happens with my long winded screamers and
            > regular whistle rockets.LWS is 1lb Wolters hybrid,regular whistle is
            > Wolters Extreme tooling-fuel is the formulas supplied with the tooling.I
            am looking for a place to start.
            >
            > Dean
            >




            ------------------------------------

            Yahoo! Groups Links
          • deanw3576
            Andy, solvent used is lacquer thinner per instructions but i do mix in a zip-lock bag wet.My mixing method is fuel and catalist are screened then added to bag
            Message 5 of 8 , Apr 4, 2012
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              Andy, solvent used is lacquer thinner per instructions but i do mix in a zip-lock bag wet.My mixing method is fuel and catalist are screened then added to bag followed with mineral oil(measured oil is cut with solvent before adding),solvent is then added and oxidizer last.Bag is then squeezed and kneeded for maybe 5 minutes.

              --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb" <andrew_holcomb@...> wrote:
              >
              > No, mineral oil should be fine. I wonder if maybe it's not being dispersed
              > evenly through the mix? What solvent are you dissolving it in?
              >
              >
              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
              > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of deanw3576
              > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 8:36 PM
              > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Re: Whistle Help
              >
              > Andy,I have been substituting mineral oil for vaseline for obvious reasons
              > is this my FAIL?
              > --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb"
              > <andrew_holcomb@> wrote:
              > >
              > > The popping is usually caused by pockets of the Vaseline or mineral
              > > oil boiling into a vapor and interrupting the burn. What percentage
              > > are you using?
              > >
              > >
              > > Andy
              > >
              > > -----Original Message-----
              > > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
              > > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
              > > deanw3576
              > > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:44 PM
              > > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
              > > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Whistle Help
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > Iam looking for a little help with whistle rockets.On take off there
              > > are maybe three or four "pops" then smooths out like LINK
              > > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dc7U6Dkiksg&feature=related> (not
              > > that much popping and not my motor).Is it the fuel,pressing
              > > technique,tooling?This happens with my long winded screamers and
              > > regular whistle rockets.LWS is 1lb Wolters hybrid,regular whistle is
              > > Wolters Extreme tooling-fuel is the formulas supplied with the tooling.I
              > am looking for a place to start.
              > >
              > > Dean
              > >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > ------------------------------------
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
            • Andy Holcomb
              Hmmm... When I used mineral oil, I used Colman Fuel as the solvent, but I know rocket man Steve Laduke uses lacquer thinner too. Although, a fellow on
              Message 6 of 8 , Apr 5, 2012
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                Hmmm... When I used mineral oil, I used Colman Fuel as the solvent, but I
                know "rocket man" Steve Laduke uses lacquer thinner too. Although, a fellow
                on Passfire, who works in the paint/ink/films industry, once said that
                "lacquer thinner is an arbitrary mixture of whatever happens to condense out
                of the crude oil feedstock at a certain temperature range". So, you may have
                weird hydrocarbons in there that are interfering with the way the mineral
                oil dissolves. You should try an experiment, and put some lacquer thinner
                and mineral oil in a glass container, and see if it separates if you leave
                it for a bit. Also, does your fuel still have a slight lacquer thinner
                smell? Maybe it's not fully evaporated?

                Andy

                -----Original Message-----
                From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of deanw3576
                Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 10:21 AM
                To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Re: Whistle Help

                Andy, solvent used is lacquer thinner per instructions but i do mix in a
                zip-lock bag wet.My mixing method is fuel and catalist are screened then
                added to bag followed with mineral oil(measured oil is cut with solvent
                before adding),solvent is then added and oxidizer last.Bag is then squeezed
                and kneeded for maybe 5 minutes.

                --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb"
                <andrew_holcomb@...> wrote:
                >
                > No, mineral oil should be fine. I wonder if maybe it's not being
                > dispersed evenly through the mix? What solvent are you dissolving it in?
                >
                >
                > -----Original Message-----
                > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                > deanw3576
                > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 8:36 PM
                > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Re: Whistle Help
                >
                > Andy,I have been substituting mineral oil for vaseline for obvious
                > reasons is this my FAIL?
                > --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb"
                > <andrew_holcomb@> wrote:
                > >
                > > The popping is usually caused by pockets of the Vaseline or mineral
                > > oil boiling into a vapor and interrupting the burn. What percentage
                > > are you using?
                > >
                > >
                > > Andy
                > >
                > > -----Original Message-----
                > > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                > > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                > > deanw3576
                > > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:44 PM
                > > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                > > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Whistle Help
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Iam looking for a little help with whistle rockets.On take off there
                > > are maybe three or four "pops" then smooths out like LINK
                > > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dc7U6Dkiksg&feature=related> (not
                > > that much popping and not my motor).Is it the fuel,pressing
                > > technique,tooling?This happens with my long winded screamers and
                > > regular whistle rockets.LWS is 1lb Wolters hybrid,regular whistle is
                > > Wolters Extreme tooling-fuel is the formulas supplied with the
                > > tooling.I
                > am looking for a place to start.
                > >
                > > Dean
                > >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >




                ------------------------------------

                Yahoo! Groups Links
              • andys_junk_address
                Dean, Any luck? I just checked Sherwin-Williams site, and it appears that lacquer thinner is made up of non-polar solvents (acetone, toluene, ethyl acetate,
                Message 7 of 8 , Apr 21, 2012
                • 0 Attachment
                  Dean,

                  Any luck? I just checked Sherwin-Williams site, and it appears that lacquer thinner is made up of non-polar solvents (acetone, toluene, ethyl acetate, etc.) so as to dissolve things like plastics or resins coatings which are also made of non-polar molecules.

                  Vaseline and mineral oil are both polar molecules, so they won't dissolve in lacquer thinner. However, I think the way that Steve makes it work for him, is that he uses melted vaseline. Because vaseline is a solid at room temperature, it will re-solidify as little tiny pieces/flakes when added and stirred into lacquer thinner. Mineral oil will just mix in as oily drops (like salad dressing), and then recombine into a puddle. This would create an area of whistle fuel that is heavily saturated with oil, and by further mixing you'd have little pockets of heavily oiled comp mixed throughout...creating the farts. ;-)

                  You could try re-wetting what's left of your mix with enough Coleman fuel to make it soupy, mixing it well in a bag, then opening the bag for a period of time to allow enough of the excess Coleman fuel to evaporate so that it's workable for granulation.


                  Andy

                  --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb" <andrew_holcomb@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Hmmm... When I used mineral oil, I used Colman Fuel as the solvent, but I
                  > know "rocket man" Steve Laduke uses lacquer thinner too. Although, a fellow
                  > on Passfire, who works in the paint/ink/films industry, once said that
                  > "lacquer thinner is an arbitrary mixture of whatever happens to condense out
                  > of the crude oil feedstock at a certain temperature range". So, you may have
                  > weird hydrocarbons in there that are interfering with the way the mineral
                  > oil dissolves. You should try an experiment, and put some lacquer thinner
                  > and mineral oil in a glass container, and see if it separates if you leave
                  > it for a bit. Also, does your fuel still have a slight lacquer thinner
                  > smell? Maybe it's not fully evaporated?
                  >
                  > Andy
                  >
                  > -----Original Message-----
                  > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                  > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of deanw3576
                  > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 10:21 AM
                  > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                  > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Re: Whistle Help
                  >
                  > Andy, solvent used is lacquer thinner per instructions but i do mix in a
                  > zip-lock bag wet.My mixing method is fuel and catalist are screened then
                  > added to bag followed with mineral oil(measured oil is cut with solvent
                  > before adding),solvent is then added and oxidizer last.Bag is then squeezed
                  > and kneeded for maybe 5 minutes.
                  >
                  > --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb"
                  > <andrew_holcomb@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > No, mineral oil should be fine. I wonder if maybe it's not being
                  > > dispersed evenly through the mix? What solvent are you dissolving it in?
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > -----Original Message-----
                  > > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                  > > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                  > > deanw3576
                  > > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 8:36 PM
                  > > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                  > > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Re: Whistle Help
                  > >
                  > > Andy,I have been substituting mineral oil for vaseline for obvious
                  > > reasons is this my FAIL?
                  > > --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb"
                  > > <andrew_holcomb@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > > The popping is usually caused by pockets of the Vaseline or mineral
                  > > > oil boiling into a vapor and interrupting the burn. What percentage
                  > > > are you using?
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > Andy
                  > > >
                  > > > -----Original Message-----
                  > > > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                  > > > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                  > > > deanw3576
                  > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:44 PM
                  > > > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                  > > > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Whistle Help
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > Iam looking for a little help with whistle rockets.On take off there
                  > > > are maybe three or four "pops" then smooths out like LINK
                  > > > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dc7U6Dkiksg&feature=related> (not
                  > > > that much popping and not my motor).Is it the fuel,pressing
                  > > > technique,tooling?This happens with my long winded screamers and
                  > > > regular whistle rockets.LWS is 1lb Wolters hybrid,regular whistle is
                  > > > Wolters Extreme tooling-fuel is the formulas supplied with the
                  > > > tooling.I
                  > > am looking for a place to start.
                  > > >
                  > > > Dean
                  > > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > ------------------------------------
                  > >
                  > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >
                • jrsrocket@aol.com
                  Read the label. If you get lacquer thinner made of MEK (methyl ethyl ketone) it s polar enough to keep vaseline and/or mineral oil in a ?solution? emulsion?
                  Message 8 of 8 , Apr 22, 2012
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Read the label.
                    If you get lacquer thinner made of MEK (methyl ethyl ketone) it's polar enough to keep vaseline and/or mineral oil in a ?solution? emulsion? mixture? to make homogenous whistle mix
                    John Steinberg
                     
                    In a message dated 4/21/2012 6:04:10 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, andrew_holcomb@... writes:
                    Dean,

                    Any luck?  I just checked Sherwin-Williams site, and it appears that lacquer thinner is made up of non-polar solvents (acetone, toluene, ethyl acetate, etc.) so as to dissolve things like plastics or resins coatings which are also made of non-polar molecules.

                    Vaseline and mineral oil are both polar molecules, so they won't dissolve in lacquer thinner.  However, I think the way that Steve makes it work for him, is that he uses melted vaseline. Because vaseline is a solid at room temperature, it will re-solidify as little tiny pieces/flakes when added and stirred into lacquer thinner. Mineral oil will just mix in as oily drops (like salad dressing), and then recombine into a puddle. This would create an area of whistle fuel that is heavily saturated with oil, and by further mixing you'd have little pockets of heavily oiled comp mixed throughout...creating the farts. ;-)

                    You could try re-wetting what's left of your mix with enough Coleman fuel to make it soupy, mixing it well in a bag, then opening the bag for a period of time to allow enough of the excess Coleman fuel to evaporate so that it's workable for granulation.


                    Andy

                    --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb" <andrew_holcomb@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hmmm... When I used mineral oil, I used Colman Fuel as the solvent, but I
                    > know "rocket man" Steve Laduke uses lacquer thinner too. Although, a fellow
                    > on Passfire, who works in the paint/ink/films industry, once said that
                    > "lacquer thinner is an arbitrary mixture of whatever happens to condense out
                    > of the crude oil feedstock at a certain temperature range". So, you may have
                    > weird hydrocarbons in there that are interfering with the way the mineral
                    > oil dissolves. You should try an experiment, and put some lacquer thinner
                    > and mineral oil in a glass container, and see if it separates if you leave
                    > it for a bit. Also, does your fuel still have a slight lacquer thinner
                    > smell? Maybe it's not fully evaporated?
                    >
                    > Andy
                    >
                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                    > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of deanw3576
                    > Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 10:21 AM
                    > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Re: Whistle Help
                    >
                    > Andy, solvent used is lacquer thinner per instructions but i do mix in a
                    > zip-lock bag wet.My mixing method is fuel and catalist are screened then
                    > added to bag followed with mineral oil(measured oil is cut with solvent
                    > before adding),solvent is then added and oxidizer last.Bag is then squeezed
                    > and kneeded for maybe 5 minutes.
                    >
                    > --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb"
                    > <andrew_holcomb@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > No, mineral oil should be fine. I wonder if maybe it's not being
                    > > dispersed evenly through the mix? What solvent are you dissolving it in?
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > -----Original Message-----
                    > > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                    > > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                    > > deanw3576
                    > > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 8:36 PM
                    > > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                    > > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Re: Whistle Help
                    > >
                    > > Andy,I have been substituting mineral oil for vaseline for obvious
                    > > reasons is this my FAIL?
                    > > --- In PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com, "Andy Holcomb"
                    > > <andrew_holcomb@> wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > The popping is usually caused by pockets of the Vaseline or mineral
                    > > > oil boiling into a vapor and interrupting the burn. What percentage
                    > > > are you using?
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > Andy
                    > > >
                    > > > -----Original Message-----
                    > > > From: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                    > > > [mailto:PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
                    > > > deanw3576
                    > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 03, 2012 2:44 PM
                    > > > To: PrairieThunderPyrotechnics@yahoogroups.com
                    > > > Subject: [PrairieThunderPyrotechnics] Whistle Help
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > >
                    > > > Iam looking for a little help with whistle rockets.On take off there
                    > > > are maybe three or four "pops" then smooths out like LINK
                    > > > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dc7U6Dkiksg&feature=related>  (not
                    > > > that much popping and not my motor).Is it the fuel,pressing
                    > > > technique,tooling?This happens with my long winded screamers and
                    > > > regular whistle rockets.LWS is 1lb Wolters hybrid,regular whistle is
                    > > > Wolters Extreme tooling-fuel is the formulas supplied with the
                    > > > tooling.I
                    > > am looking for a place to start.
                    > > >
                    > > >                                              Dean
                    > > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > ------------------------------------
                    > >
                    > > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------------------------------
                    >
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >




                    ------------------------------------

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