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Peterhead Lore

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  • Linda Adam
    Hello to all, Would there perhaps be a list member who would be aware of Peterhead folklore. Members of my family frequently related stories of the fisher
    Message 1 of 11 , Nov 14, 2000
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      Hello to all,

      Would there perhaps be a list member who would be aware of
      Peterhead folklore. Members of my family frequently
      related stories of the fisher folk who plied the east coast.
      Apparently, this were a rough and rustic nomadic bunch who
      spoke a jargon, or language, which the natives could
      not understand. The men did the fishing, and their womenfolk
      followed them on land up and down the coast. A great uncle
      related that once, when one of them fell ill, she was taken to the
      hospital in Peterhead, where the doctor had to cut through
      several layers of thick clothing to treat the part of anatomy
      affected.

      I'm wondering whether these might have been gypsies (called
      "Travelers" in Scotland). Would they have been native Scots or
      perhaps of Norwegian origin? My mom recalls a lady in Peterhead
      who was referred to as a "fish wife". She had hair so long that it fell
      onto the ground and the matted ball of hair at the end brushed along
      the pavement, sweeping up leaves, twigs and dirt. Not an attractive
      sight!

      Any input would be appreciated.

      With thanks,
      Linda Adam
    • Wade Buchan
      Hi Linda, ... With the development of larger boats, they were able to travel further out to sea and along the coast and then with the steam drifters (first
      Message 2 of 11 , Nov 19, 2000
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        Hi Linda,

        Linda Adam wrote:

        > Would there perhaps be a list member who would be aware of Peterhead
        > folklore. Members of my family frequently related stories of the
        > fisher folk who plied the east coast. Apparently, this were a rough
        > and rustic nomadic bunch who spoke a jargon, or language, which the
        > natives could
        > not understand. The men did the fishing, and their womenfolk followed
        > them on land up and down the coast.

        With the development of larger boats, they were able to travel further
        out to sea and along the coast and then with the steam drifters (first
        1875) they were too expensive to tie up in winter months, therefore the
        drifter men followed the herring fishing around the coasts for nine
        months.

        Winter Seasons: Firth of Forth, Wick, Stornoway, Ireland
        Summer Seasons: Hebrides, Barra, Mallaig, Oban, Ullapool, Shetland,
        Orkney, Wick, Peterhead, Fraserburgh
        Autumn Seasons: Yarmouth, Lowestoft

        During the height of the herring boom (around 1913) the mass movement of
        entire workforce is astonishing. As much as 1163 herring drifters from
        Scotland engaged at the fishing at Anglican ports. With an average of
        ten crew members per boat, plus 5,000 women gutters, with 1,700 coopers;
        this brings up a total of an 18,330 Scottish migratory force. Not
        including the English boats, crew, gutters and curers.

        Hope this helps.

        Regards, Wade.



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Linda Adam
        ... Peterhead ... rough ... the ... followed ... further ... (first ... the ... movement of ... from ... of ... coopers; ... Hi Wade, Thank you for the lesson.
        Message 3 of 11 , Nov 20, 2000
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          --- In Peterhead@egroups.com, Wade Buchan <wsb@a...> wrote:
          > Hi Linda,
          >
          > Linda Adam wrote:
          >
          > > Would there perhaps be a list member who would be aware of
          Peterhead
          > > folklore. Members of my family frequently related stories of the
          > > fisher folk who plied the east coast. Apparently, this were a
          rough
          > > and rustic nomadic bunch who spoke a jargon, or language, which
          the
          > > natives could
          > > not understand. The men did the fishing, and their womenfolk
          followed
          > > them on land up and down the coast.
          >
          > With the development of larger boats, they were able to travel
          further
          > out to sea and along the coast and then with the steam drifters
          (first
          > 1875) they were too expensive to tie up in winter months, therefore
          the
          > drifter men followed the herring fishing around the coasts for nine
          > months.
          >
          > Winter Seasons: Firth of Forth, Wick, Stornoway, Ireland
          > Summer Seasons: Hebrides, Barra, Mallaig, Oban, Ullapool, Shetland,
          > Orkney, Wick, Peterhead, Fraserburgh
          > Autumn Seasons: Yarmouth, Lowestoft
          >
          > During the height of the herring boom (around 1913) the mass
          movement of
          > entire workforce is astonishing. As much as 1163 herring drifters
          from
          > Scotland engaged at the fishing at Anglican ports. With an average
          of
          > ten crew members per boat, plus 5,000 women gutters, with 1,700
          coopers;
          > this brings up a total of an 18,330 Scottish migratory force. Not
          > including the English boats, crew, gutters and curers.
          >
          > Hope this helps.
          >
          > Regards, Wade.
          >
          >
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

          Hi Wade,

          Thank you for the lesson. I am constantly amazed at what information
          you and other List Members have on hand!

          Any idea as to the "jargon" these people spoke? Or was it perhaps
          just
          a mixture of dialects from different localities?

          As a child, I recall thinking my Birnie family, from Peterhead, spoke
          a language that was not at all "Canadian". At times I couldn't
          understand a word they were saying, especially when the entire "clan"
          gathered together. Lots of "dinnas" and "kinnas". Great memories!

          All the best,
          Linda
        • Wilson Family
          ... Fit like? Nae bad! That s how are you - not bad - in the Buchan dialect. It s still the ordinary greeting. I m sure Wade knows more about it, as would
          Message 4 of 11 , Nov 21, 2000
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            At 02:10 21/11/2000, Linda Adam wrote:

            >Any idea as to the "jargon" these people spoke? Or was it perhaps
            >just a mixture of dialects from different localities?


            Fit like? Nae bad!

            That's how are you - not bad - in the Buchan dialect. It's still the
            ordinary greeting.

            I'm sure Wade knows more about it, as would others, but it is fascinating
            to hear it. They switch from accented Scottish English to dialect and back
            between sentences. Even the kids speak it. It is a sort of English I
            suppose - it would be interesting to know if linguistic studies have shown
            its origins. They say "far" for "where" - often substituting f for wh. For
            example, I memorised a sentence I heard: D'ye ken far ye gang the day? (do
            you know where you're going today?)

            My grandfather told me something his father (who emigrated in 1889) told
            him: a man on the wharf at Peterhead said to him as they watched whales
            spouting "Waal Jeemes, a ya watchin' the whaals bhiavin'?" My great
            grandmother apparently always said as they left someone's house after
            visiting, "Lang may yer chimney rum."

            I would be really interested in anything others have to share on this
            topic. I am fascinated by language and the fact that the NE of Scotland
            (or really this little corner of it) has retained such a dialect in the
            face of global media etc. (Not helped by a Peterhead, or really Cruden,
            descendant in Rupert Murdoch!!)

            Regards to everyone,
          • Wade Buchan
            Hi Linda & others, ... Dinna sounds like Doric to me. You can visit DoricNet for more information: http://www.rmple.co.uk/eduweb/sites/grampit/doric.html
            Message 5 of 11 , Nov 21, 2000
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              Hi Linda & others,

              Linda Adam wrote:

              > Any idea as to the "jargon" these people spoke? Or was it perhaps just
              >
              > a mixture of dialects from different localities?
              >
              > As a child, I recall thinking my Birnie family, from Peterhead, spoke
              > a language that was not at all "Canadian". At times I couldn't
              > understand a word they were saying, especially when the entire "clan"
              > gathered together. Lots of "dinnas" and "kinnas". Great memories!

              "Dinna" sounds like Doric to me.

              You can visit DoricNet for more information:
              http://www.rmple.co.uk/eduweb/sites/grampit/doric.html

              Regards, Wade.


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • David Matthew
              That s how are you - not bad - in the Buchan dialect. It s still the ... back ... For ... If you are interested I would suggest the novel Doorways of
              Message 6 of 11 , Nov 21, 2000
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                That's how are you - not bad - in the Buchan dialect. It's still the
                > ordinary greeting.
                >
                > I'm sure Wade knows more about it, as would others, but it is fascinating
                > to hear it. They switch from accented Scottish English to dialect and
                back
                > between sentences. Even the kids speak it. It is a sort of English I
                > suppose - it would be interesting to know if linguistic studies have shown
                > its origins. They say "far" for "where" - often substituting f for wh.
                For
                > example, I memorised a sentence I heard: D'ye ken far ye gang the day? (do
                > you know where you're going today?)
                >
                > My grandfather told me something his father (who emigrated in 1889) told
                > him: a man on the wharf at Peterhead said to him as they watched whales
                > spouting "Waal Jeemes, a ya watchin' the whaals bhiavin'?" My great
                > grandmother apparently always said as they left someone's house after
                > visiting, "Lang may yer chimney rum."
                >
                > I would be really interested in anything others have to share on this
                > topic. I am fascinated by language and the fact that the NE of Scotland
                > (or really this little corner of it) has retained such a dialect in the
                > face of global media etc. (Not helped by a Peterhead, or really Cruden,
                > descendant in Rupert Murdoch!!)

                If you are interested I would suggest the novel 'Doorways of Drumorty' by
                Lorna Moon ( a long-dead cousin of mine) and it takes several readings to
                understand the Buchan Doric. I think it is great that the local lingo is
                still being used, if only I could understand it all!.
                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Wilson Family <wilsontrek@...>
                To: <Peterhead@egroups.com>; <Peterhead@egroups.com>
                Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2000 11:24 AM
                Subject: [Peterhead] Re: Peterhead dialect


                > At 02:10 21/11/2000, Linda Adam wrote:
                >
                > >Any idea as to the "jargon" these people spoke? Or was it perhaps
                > >just a mixture of dialects from different localities?
                >
                >
                > Fit like? Nae bad!
                >
                > That's how are you - not bad - in the Buchan dialect. It's still the
                > ordinary greeting.
                >
                > I'm sure Wade knows more about it, as would others, but it is fascinating
                > to hear it. They switch from accented Scottish English to dialect and
                back
                > between sentences. Even the kids speak it. It is a sort of English I
                > suppose - it would be interesting to know if linguistic studies have shown
                > its origins. They say "far" for "where" - often substituting f for wh.
                For
                > example, I memorised a sentence I heard: D'ye ken far ye gang the day? (do
                > you know where you're going today?)
                >
                > My grandfather told me something his father (who emigrated in 1889) told
                > him: a man on the wharf at Peterhead said to him as they watched whales
                > spouting "Waal Jeemes, a ya watchin' the whaals bhiavin'?" My great
                > grandmother apparently always said as they left someone's house after
                > visiting, "Lang may yer chimney rum."
                >
                > I would be really interested in anything others have to share on this
                > topic. I am fascinated by language and the fact that the NE of Scotland
                > (or really this little corner of it) has retained such a dialect in the
                > face of global media etc. (Not helped by a Peterhead, or really Cruden,
                > descendant in Rupert Murdoch!!)
                >
                > Regards to everyone,
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > Peterhead Genealogy at http://axs.com.au/~wsb/
                >
                >
              • Sam Daniel
                The local dialect or Buchan brogue is known as dorrick and is has a lot of roots with Dutch, Old English and I suppose a smattering of Scandanavian. Waal
                Message 7 of 11 , Nov 22, 2000
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                  The local dialect or Buchan brogue is known as dorrick and is has a lot
                  of roots with Dutch, Old English and I suppose a smattering of
                  Scandanavian.

                  "Waal Jeemes, a ya watchin' the whaals bhiavin'?" is more likely to be
                  Wul, Jeems, a ye watchin i whhaals blain? That is "Well Jamie, are you
                  watching the whales blowing.

                  "Lang may yer chimney rum" should be Lang may yer lum reek. This is
                  much more of a Glasgow use and means Long may your chimney smoke.

                  So now for your home exercise.

                  Let me know what the following means:

                  Mi bachles gie mi kweets jip.

                  >

                  --
                  Sam Daniel
                • Sam Daniel
                  I have no knowledge of gypsies and travellers sounds too modern for my liking. What did exits were tinkers. These were similar to gypsies and travelled the
                  Message 8 of 11 , Nov 22, 2000
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                    I have no knowledge of gypsies and travellers sounds too modern for my
                    liking. What did exits were tinkers. These were similar to gypsies and
                    travelled the horse fairs such as Aikey Brae and made utensils out of
                    metal. The metal was beaten into shape, hence the term tinky from the
                    tink-tink of the beating. They also begged around the area and sold
                    clothes pegs. However, they are distinct from the Romany Gypsies.

                    Sam

                    --
                    Sam Daniel
                  • Wilson Family
                    ... OK I give up. (Thanks for the rest.) Elisabeth Wilson South Hobart, Tasmania researching GORDON GIBB YOUNG SPENCE PAUL MURRISON CRAIG DAVIDSON
                    Message 9 of 11 , Nov 24, 2000
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                      At 08:12 23/11/2000, you wrote:
                      >So now for your home exercise.
                      >
                      >Let me know what the following means:
                      >
                      >Mi bachles gie mi kweets jip.

                      OK I give up. (Thanks for the rest.)


                      Elisabeth Wilson
                      South Hobart, Tasmania
                      researching GORDON GIBB YOUNG SPENCE PAUL MURRISON CRAIG DAVIDSON
                    • Wilson Family
                      Wade, ... When I finally got the time to look at this, it said Netscape is unable to locate the server www.rmple.co ... Is this the right name? Elisabeth
                      Message 10 of 11 , Mar 4, 2001
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                        Wade,

                        A while ago you wrote:
                        >You can visit DoricNet for more information:
                        >http://www.rmple.co.uk/eduweb/sites/grampit/doric.html

                        When I finally got the time to look at this, it said "Netscape is unable to
                        locate the server www.rmple.co ..." Is this the right name?


                        Elisabeth Wilson
                        South Hobart, Tasmania
                        researching GORDON GIBB YOUNG SPENCE PAUL MURRISON CRAIG DAVIDSON
                      • Braveheart
                        If you are interetsed in buchan dialect you might think about purchasing Mount Pleasant by Peter Buchan which contains translations of doric to english.
                        Message 11 of 11 , May 13 12:29 PM
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                          If you are interetsed in buchan dialect you might think
                          about purchasing Mount Pleasant by Peter Buchan which
                          contains translations of doric to english.

                          Regards dave

                          --- In Peterhead@y..., Wilson Family <wilsontrek@t...> wrote:
                          > At 08:12 23/11/2000, you wrote:
                          > >So now for your home exercise.
                          > >
                          > >Let me know what the following means:
                          > >
                          > >Mi bachles gie mi kweets jip.
                          >
                          > OK I give up. (Thanks for the rest.)
                          >
                          >
                          > Elisabeth Wilson
                          > South Hobart, Tasmania
                          > researching GORDON GIBB YOUNG SPENCE PAUL MURRISON CRAIG DAVIDSON
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