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Zenith and Nadir advice, please

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  • Steven Baker
    I m hoping some of you that are more experienced than I am, could help me out here. I can usually edit the zenith and nadir problems with PTeditor and
    Message 1 of 4 , Apr 26 7:41 PM
      I'm hoping some of you that are more experienced than I am, could
      help me out here. I can usually edit the zenith and nadir "problems"
      with PTeditor and Photoshop, but I find it really tough to do when
      there is a pattern on the ground or lighting/cloud issues with the
      sky. I have an example for you to look at, if you would.

      http://www.stevenandmelanie.com/panos/sample.html

      http://www.stevenandmelanie.com/panos/pano1.jpg


      I've tried to include a zenith shot into my stitching process in
      PTGui, but it doesn't work for me....I end up getting the sky in the
      middle of the pano. I took the sky image in the same position as my
      last shot. I included it when I stitched the other four images, but
      no luck. I tried rotating it with the others and it didn't work. I
      tried not rotating it and still it didn't work. Am I taking the
      zenith picture in the wrong sequence when shooting the pictures?

      Also, how do you take and incorporate a nadir shot? This is just as
      confusing to me, if not more, than the zenith. I've read almost all
      of the tutorials that are out there on the web on how to do these to
      processes and I still can't figure it out....I feel pretty stupid
      right now.

      If any of you have the time and would give me some explicit details
      on how to achieve these two things, I would be forever greatfull to
      you. :) I wish one of you lived near me so I could simply watch how
      it's done.

      Thanks,
      Steven
    • John Houghton
      ... It s quite clear what you mean by this. Is the zenith image properly aligned with the horizontal images but all the images are shifted such that the sky
      Message 2 of 4 , Apr 27 12:13 AM
        --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Steven Baker" <coolwater@...>
        wrote:
        >
        > I end up getting the sky in the middle of the pano.

        It's quite clear what you mean by this. Is the zenith image
        properly aligned with the horizontal images but all the images are
        shifted such that the sky is in the centre? I have seen PTGui do
        this when run in its automatic mode. All you need do then is select
        the Numerical Transform option on the Panorama Editor window and
        apply a -90 pitch adjustment.

        If the horizontal images are properly aligned and in their correct
        orientation but only the sky image is out of position, then you need
        to optimize y,p,r of the zenith image only, unchecking all other
        parameters. If there are control points assigned between the zenith
        image and some of the horizontal shots, then the optimizer should
        align it correctly.

        At the end of all this, you may find that the blender does not
        include the zenith in the final stitch. This is because the image
        might be considered surplus to requirements, i.e. the zenith area is
        already fully covered by the horizontal shots. You can overcome this
        difficulty by applying an alpha channel mask to each horizontal shot
        to mask out the top so that there will be a hole when the horizontal
        shots are stitched together. The blender will then be obliged to use
        the zenith shot to patch over the hole.

        If automatic blending of the zenith is not completely satisfactory
        for any reason, you can resort to manual blending. Use the Include
        Images option on the Create Panorama tab and output two separate
        360x180 equirectangular stitches. The first contains only the
        horizontal shots and the second contains only the zenith. You then
        use PTEditor to extract a zenith view from the zenith panorama image
        and then the horizontals panorama (just hold down the up arrow key to
        get an identical view from each). Merge these manually in Photoshop
        and insert the result back into the horizontals panorama.

        You can patch the nadir using a similar technique.

        John
      • ptgroup
        Steven, just as John said but if the automatic stitch fails - mostly in sky etc with no or moving CPS, I do it the manual Houghton way : - insert the zenith
        Message 3 of 4 , Apr 27 3:29 AM
          Steven,
          just as John said but if the automatic stitch fails - mostly in sky etc with no or moving CPS, I do
          it the "manual Houghton way":

          - insert the zenith (nadir) shot into the images
          - pitch it to +90 (if nadir: -90)
          - set some CP´s
          - optimize manually ONLY the zenith (nadir) using all CPS but
          deselect all othe images (optimizer : advanced)
          - create ONLY the zenith (nadir) by deselecting the already done horizontals (create pano)

          then you have the horizontals without a zenith (nadir) and a zenith (nadir) without the horizontals.
          these I put into pteditor end extract the appropriated view (90 or -90).
          when loaded the horizontal-extract it´s mostly easy to get some image parts from the zenith (nadir)- extract to correct.

          it´s surely mor work than an automatic stitch.
          you could also try ptlens to get an undistorted zenith (nadir) to use it, because that´s the result of the
          mentioned workflow above.

          Ciao
          Mike


          -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
          Von: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]Im Auftrag von Steven Baker
          Gesendet: Freitag, 27. April 2007 04:42
          An: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
          Betreff: [PanoToolsNG] Zenith and Nadir advice, please


          I'm hoping some of you that are more experienced than I am, could
          help me out here. I can usually edit the zenith and nadir "problems"
          with PTeditor and Photoshop, but I find it really tough to do when
          there is a pattern on the ground or lighting/cloud issues with the
          sky. I have an example for you to look at, if you would.

          http://www.stevenandmelanie.com/panos/sample.html

          http://www.stevenandmelanie.com/panos/pano1.jpg

          I've tried to include a zenith shot into my stitching process in
          PTGui, but it doesn't work for me....I end up getting the sky in the
          middle of the pano. I took the sky image in the same position as my
          last shot. I included it when I stitched the other four images, but
          no luck. I tried rotating it with the others and it didn't work. I
          tried not rotating it and still it didn't work. Am I taking the
          zenith picture in the wrong sequence when shooting the pictures?

          Also, how do you take and incorporate a nadir shot? This is just as
          confusing to me, if not more, than the zenith. I've read almost all
          of the tutorials that are out there on the web on how to do these to
          processes and I still can't figure it out....I feel pretty stupid
          right now.

          If any of you have the time and would give me some explicit details
          on how to achieve these two things, I would be forever greatfull to
          you. :) I wish one of you lived near me so I could simply watch how
          it's done.

          Thanks,
          Steven






          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • dalileis
          If you still can t manage to manually stitch the extracted rectilinear nadirs, from the horisontals and your nadir shot(s), by way of photoshoping them
          Message 4 of 4 , Apr 27 12:07 PM
            If you still can't manage to manually stitch the extracted rectilinear
            nadirs, from the horisontals and your nadir shot(s), by way of
            photoshoping them together, you man want to try to stitch THOSE two
            rectilinear views in PTGui, only optimizing your nadir shot. Output
            also them as layered psd, and blend by using quick-masking.

            If you'de like to "watch over someones shoulder" while they do the
            entire stitching process (including nadir etc...), this too is
            possible now, thanks to Eric Rougiers outstanding work with video
            tutorials on this.

            Link:

            http://www.fromparis.com/html/technical_us_quicktime_vr_360precision_adjuste_head_part1.php

            This is gonna save you a lot of trial-and-error learning time. Good
            luck to you!
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