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Re: [PanoToolsNG] Beautiful Panoramas: Turkey Cinemascope: Another opinion

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  • Fulvio Senore
    I visited Turkey in 1988, and I did not only visit the usual places: I traveled from Italy to the Turkey-Iran border in an old car, with my wife and my 8 month
    Message 1 of 6 , Feb 28, 2007
      I visited Turkey in 1988, and I did not only visit the usual places: I
      traveled from Italy to the Turkey-Iran border in an old car, with my
      wife and my 8 month old daughter. The car got broken at the feet of
      Mount Ararat and a local mechanic fixed it with an old-style solution,
      but I was able to come back home without problems. That man asked us
      very little money, even if he could have asked us much more, since we
      had no other choice. He only spoke Turkish, I did not speak Turkish at
      all, but we understood each other.

      I liked the country very much, but I liked the people even more. They
      were kind, they always did everything they could to help us. It was like
      using a time-machine to move to my country in a past time: most people
      were poorer, but money is not the only way to measure people and the
      quality of their life.

      I do not recognize the Turkey that I visited in those photographs.

      Yes, I have been there 20 years ago, but I do not believe that the
      country can have changed so much. When I visited the country I also saw
      poor people (but not only), but I had a different feeling: I saw a
      growing country with opportunities. What I see in those photos is a
      desperate country.

      I think that we should remember that we are looking at images created by
      a photographer in order to sell them, and it seems that he wants to sell
      them to western customers. It would be difficult to sell images that
      look like they have been taken in any western country, it is surely
      easier to sell images with a dramatic look that seem taken in a
      desperate land. So buyers can think: "how am I lucky to live in my
      country!".

      Who knows, maybe 50 meters away from one of those desperate houses there
      is a tall steel-and-glass building :-) .
      In the end, when you are looking at those photographs you are not
      looking at a country, but you are looking at what the photographer has
      decided that you must see, and the two things are not necessarily the same.

      Last but not least, how can you measure the ignorance of people from
      some photographs?

      Fulvio Senore


      Margaret & Dean Graetz ha scritto:
      > Folks,
      > Here is another opinion about the panoramas from Turkey.
      >
      > All of you seem impressed by, and have focused on the
      > technology/technique.
      >
      > There has been almost no comment on the content - the point
      > of generating the images.
      >
      > The photographer is repeatedly and powerfully telling a
      > simple but sad story.
      >
      > His images convey the ignorance and squalor of rural and urban Turkey.
      >
      > For example, in one image the Roman infrastructure is
      > outstanding for its elegance compared with the near-decrepit urban
      > junk in another.
      >
      > Even under a snow cover you can see (and imagine) how
      > degraded and tired is the land.
      >
      > And almost every image is captured under brooding,
      > suffocating grey clouds.
      >
      > Turkey's future, perhaps?
      >
      > My choice of most telling image is that of donkey foreground
      > with the two women background dressed in black and lugging heavy
      > loads.
      >
      > The root cause of the poverty and squalor, perhaps?
      >
      > If I was a European, I would go somewhere else for my summer holidays.
      >
      > Cheers, Dean Graetz
      >
      >
    • David Sykes
      ... I do not think so, this is very dangerous ground that can quickly get out-of-hand. Consider my message 1690 :- Yuval Levy wrote:
      Message 2 of 6 , Mar 1, 2007
        Yuval Levy wrote:

        > thank you for sharing this opinion. i think we need more of these
        > comments.


        I do not think so, this is very dangerous ground that can quickly get
        out-of-hand.

        Consider my message 1690 :-

        "Yuval Levy wrote:

        <http://vrm.vrway.com/issue26/PEACEFUL_SCENES_OF_HAIFA_AND_THE_NORTHERN_ISRAELI_COAST.html>

        Very nice caves.

        Try a Google search for 'Lebanon bbc oil'.

        It may provide more up-to-date information about that attractive
        coastline"


        You did not respond and I could have said 'that once-attractive
        coastline before the actions by the "state" of Israel'.


        I would love to say a lot, lot more but it would not be appropriate,
        see what I mean :-)

        Best to stick with technicalities in this forum.



        David Sykes
      • yuval_levy
        ... There is a fine difference between artistic judgment and political statements and while I agree with you that it is dangerous ground and everyone is at
        Message 3 of 6 , Mar 2, 2007
          --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "David Sykes" <killspammers2@...>
          wrote:
          >
          > Yuval Levy wrote:
          >
          > > thank you for sharing this opinion. i think we need more of these
          > > comments.
          >
          >
          > I do not think so, this is very dangerous ground that can quickly
          > get out-of-hand.

          There is a fine difference between artistic judgment and political
          statements and while I agree with you that it is dangerous ground and
          everyone is at risk of feeling provoked and react at some point or
          another, it's no good reason to cover our eyes and refrain from
          expressing subjective judgment about composition, color, collection
          and, to a limited extent, interpretation.


          > Consider my message 1690 :-
          ...
          > You did not respond and I could have said 'that once-attractive
          > coastline before the actions by the "state" of Israel'.

          I did not ignore you. I decided to ignore my reaction that would have
          lead the thread way off-topic.


          > I would love to say a lot, lot more but it would not be appropriate,
          > see what I mean :-)

          Feel free to do so in *private*. And get ready for heated debate :-)


          > Best to stick with technicalities in this forum.

          Stick with panoramas. Technicalities are an important part. Artistic
          and aesthetic judgment too. Moderation (self or by the mods) ensures
          that debate does not get sidetracked by polarizing issues.

          Yuv


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          Copyright © 2007 Yuval Levy
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