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OT: SD & CF

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  • Yuval Levy
    Hi all, Does anybody have experience with something like ? Yuv --
    Message 1 of 11 , Feb 25, 2007
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      Hi all,

      Does anybody have experience with something like
      <http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=1098&A=details&Q=&sku=462559&is=REG>
      ?

      Yuv

      --
      Copyright © 2007 Yuval Levy
      Verbatim copying and distribution on other medium than YahooGroup
      strictly forbidden.
    • Kathy Wheeler
      ... Do you mean Compact Flash Adapters generally? Used them for years. I don t know that specific model or the Secure Digital/MultiMedia technology/buzz-word
      Message 2 of 11 , Feb 25, 2007
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        On 26/02/2007, at 12:13 PM, Yuval Levy wrote:
        > Does anybody have experience with something like
        > <http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?
        > O=1098&A=details&Q=&sku=462559&is=REG>
        > ?

        Do you mean Compact Flash Adapters generally? Used them for years. I
        don't know that specific model or the "Secure Digital/MultiMedia"
        technology/buzz-word they refer to thou.

        Cheers,
        KathyW.
      • Yuval Levy
        ... it seems that with this one it is possible to put an SD-card into a camera that takes CF cards? I d like to have it confirmed. If it is possible and there
        Message 3 of 11 , Feb 25, 2007
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          Kathy Wheeler wrote:
          > On 26/02/2007, at 12:13 PM, Yuval Levy wrote:
          >> Does anybody have experience with something like
          >> <http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?
          >> O=1098&A=details&Q=&sku=462559&is=REG>
          >> ?
          >
          > Do you mean Compact Flash Adapters generally? Used them for years. I
          > don't know that specific model or the "Secure Digital/MultiMedia"
          > technology/buzz-word they refer to thou.

          it seems that with this one it is possible to put an SD-card into a
          camera that takes CF cards? I'd like to have it confirmed. If it is
          possible and there is no significant draw back, I'd buy one of these and
          SD memory rather than CF memory because I believe SD memory with its
          smaller form factor and increasing support (e.g. some of the new Nikon
          dSLRs) has a chance to accomplish what most other formats have not,
          namely to replace CF.

          Yuv


          --
          Copyright © 2007 Yuval Levy
          Verbatim copying and distribution on other medium than YahooGroup
          strictly forbidden.
        • dmgalpha
          ... I haven t use them but I don t see why they would not work. It is probably the same technology used in the USB multi format readers. THe only drawback
          Message 4 of 11 , Feb 25, 2007
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            --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Yuval Levy <yahoo06@...> wrote:
            >
            > Kathy Wheeler wrote:
            > > On 26/02/2007, at 12:13 PM, Yuval Levy wrote:
            > >> Does anybody have experience with something like
            > >> <http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?
            > >> O=1098&A=details&Q=&sku=462559&is=REG>
            > >> ?
            > >
            > > Do you mean Compact Flash Adapters generally? Used them for years. I
            > > don't know that specific model or the "Secure Digital/MultiMedia"
            > > technology/buzz-word they refer to thou.
            >
            > it seems that with this one it is possible to put an SD-card into a
            > camera that takes CF cards? I'd like to have it confirmed. If it is
            > possible and there is no significant draw back, I'd buy one of these and
            > SD memory rather than CF memory because I believe SD memory with its
            > smaller form factor and increasing support (e.g. some of the new Nikon
            > dSLRs) has a chance to accomplish what most other formats have not,
            > namely to replace CF.
            >
            > Yuv
            >
            >

            I haven't use them but I don't see why they would not work. It is
            probably the same technology used in the USB multi format readers.

            THe only drawback might be that they might make your card slower than
            it actually is.

            I actually like CFs compared to SDs because they are larger and more
            difficult to lose. :)

            But SDs are cheaper these days.

            dmg
          • Robert C. Fisher
            My 2 issues with SD cards is they are really small and easy to loose and they are less robust. I have heard from several sources that they won t last anywhere
            Message 5 of 11 , Feb 25, 2007
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              My 2 issues with SD cards is they are really small and easy to loose
              and they are less robust. I have heard from several sources that they
              won't last anywhere near as long as CF cards. Mainly due to the
              exposed contacts. Finger oil and static can kill contacts and memory.

              I'll just keep using CF cards.

              On Feb 25, 2007, at 8:09 PM, Yuval Levy wrote:

              >
              > it seems that with this one it is possible to put an SD-card into a
              > camera that takes CF cards? I'd like to have it confirmed. If it is
              > possible and there is no significant draw back, I'd buy one of
              > these and
              > SD memory rather than CF memory because I believe SD memory with its
              > smaller form factor and increasing support (e.g. some of the new Nikon
              > dSLRs) has a chance to accomplish what most other formats have not,
              > namely to replace CF.
              >
              > Yuv
              >
              Cheers
              Robert C. Fisher
              VR Photography/Cinematography
            • Luca Vascon
              Yes, I agree..-. I ve used the adapter and it slows down the card. Then, I ve seen phisically broken SD, but NEVER broken CF. I had data loss with SD, not with
              Message 6 of 11 , Feb 26, 2007
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                Yes, I agree..-. I've used the adapter and it slows down the card.
                Then, I've seen phisically broken SD, but NEVER broken CF. I had data loss with SD, not with CF!
                I'll stay with CF as long as possible!!!

                My favorite brand is PEAK, then RIDATA, and finally Lexar.
                Just for price-speed-reliability....
                I own 4 Peak 2gb, 160x and a Lexar 1Gb, 60x

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Robert C. Fisher
                To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Monday, February 26, 2007 8:17 AM
                Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] OT: SD & CF


                My 2 issues with SD cards is they are really small and easy to loose
                and they are less robust. I have heard from several sources that they
                won't last anywhere near as long as CF cards. Mainly due to the
                exposed contacts. Finger oil and static can kill contacts and memory.

                I'll just keep using CF cards.

                On Feb 25, 2007, at 8:09 PM, Yuval Levy wrote:

                >
                > it seems that with this one it is possible to put an SD-card into a
                > camera that takes CF cards? I'd like to have it confirmed. If it is
                > possible and there is no significant draw back, I'd buy one of
                > these and
                > SD memory rather than CF memory because I believe SD memory with its
                > smaller form factor and increasing support (e.g. some of the new Nikon
                > dSLRs) has a chance to accomplish what most other formats have not,
                > namely to replace CF.
                >
                > Yuv
                >
                Cheers
                Robert C. Fisher
                VR Photography/Cinematography





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Yuval Levy
                ... I wonder if somebody has made the experience and can quantify the speed trade off of the SD- CF interface? ... I also like CFs better, for the reasons
                Message 7 of 11 , Feb 26, 2007
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                  dmgalpha wrote:
                  > THe only drawback might be that they might make your card slower than
                  > it actually is.

                  I wonder if somebody has made the experience and can quantify the speed
                  trade off of the SD->CF interface?


                  > I actually like CFs compared to SDs because they are larger and more
                  > difficult to lose. :)

                  I also like CFs better, for the reasons named by Robert and Luca in
                  previous posts and yourself here. Memory format has never been an
                  influencing factor in my choice of camera.

                  I can relate to Robert's comments about corrupted cards when the
                  contacts are exposed from a previous SmartMedia experience.

                  I am worried about Nikon's choice of SD cards for the D40/D80. Is this
                  market segmentation (professionals=CF prosumers=SD)? Or the beginning of
                  a market shift toward SD?

                  SD is already widely adopted in other market segments such as cell
                  phones, MP3 players, PDAs, camcorders where their small form factor is a
                  significant advantage.

                  Even though the prices for the memory cards are constantly falling and
                  capacities are constantly increasing, I would hate to make an investment
                  in CF capacity now that might turn incompatible with my next gen
                  gadgets. Also having one unified format for all of my gadets helps
                  reduce clutter.

                  Yuv

                  P.S.: thanks for the link to the NYT article about Jeff Wall's work -
                  very inspiring!

                  --
                  Copyright © 2007 Yuval Levy
                  Verbatim copying and distribution on other medium than YahooGroup
                  strictly forbidden.
                • Kathy Wheeler
                  ... They may well succeed in market segments where the user is not expected to keep removing them like we do. Most happy-snappers will download directly, not
                  Message 8 of 11 , Feb 26, 2007
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                    On 27/02/2007, at 3:44 AM, Yuval Levy wrote:
                    > SD is already widely adopted in other market segments such as cell
                    > phones, MP3 players, PDAs, camcorders where their small form factor
                    > is a
                    > significant advantage.

                    They may well succeed in market segments where the user is not
                    expected to keep removing them like we do. Most happy-snappers will
                    download directly, not change the SD unless they want a bigger,
                    better one. Same goes for other consumer gadgets. My daughter is
                    constantly re-recording tracks on her MP3 player, but is not really
                    interested in getting additional cards ...

                    I hope CF hangs around for a long time yet - it's tough.

                    Cheers,
                    KathyW.
                  • dmgalpha
                    ... I keep upgrading my CFs all the time. I have gone from a 128, to a 256, to a 512, to a 1024 to a 4096 (my current one). Panorama shooting has been one of
                    Message 9 of 11 , Feb 26, 2007
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                      --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Kathy Wheeler <kathyw@...> wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > On 27/02/2007, at 3:44 AM, Yuval Levy wrote:
                      > > SD is already widely adopted in other market segments such as cell
                      > > phones, MP3 players, PDAs, camcorders where their small form factor
                      > > is a
                      > > significant advantage.
                      >
                      > They may well succeed in market segments where the user is not
                      > expected to keep removing them like we do. Most happy-snappers will
                      > download directly, not change the SD unless they want a bigger,
                      > better one. Same goes for other consumer gadgets. My daughter is
                      > constantly re-recording tracks on her MP3 player, but is not really
                      > interested in getting additional cards ...
                      >
                      > I hope CF hangs around for a long time yet - it's tough.
                      >
                      > Cheers,
                      > KathyW.
                      >

                      I keep upgrading my CFs all the time. I have gone from a 128, to a
                      256, to a 512, to a 1024 to a 4096 (my current one). Panorama shooting
                      has been one of those few areas that makes me need extra memory (I
                      rarely shoot more than 100 photos in a single day).

                      Given the price of memory (June 2006) I decided to buy an Epson
                      Storage Viewer P2000 (it was 400 canadian in Japan). It is 40 gigs and
                      I find it far more convenient than carrying many CFs. This way I only
                      need two: the main one and a secondary one that is used while the main
                      one is copied.

                      I found that if I keep using many flash cards it is (for me) difficult
                      to keep track of which ones have been used and which ones have not.
                      One of the features I like of the SDs is the ability to make them
                      read-only.

                      dmg
                    • Yuval Levy
                      ... at the 128 stage I was still shooting with a Smartmedia driven Olympus. Those days memory was a limiting factor, one pano with that camera was about 30
                      Message 10 of 11 , Feb 27, 2007
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                        dmgalpha wrote:
                        > I keep upgrading my CFs all the time. I have gone from a 128, to a
                        > 256, to a 512, to a 1024 to a 4096 (my current one).

                        at the 128 stage I was still shooting with a Smartmedia driven Olympus.
                        Those days memory was a limiting factor, one pano with that camera was
                        about 30 stitched shots <http://www.photopla.net/pano.php?id=12>

                        I had a whole collection of expensive 64 and 128 SM and a few of them
                        failed after a while, despite being careful not to extract them from the
                        camera too often (i.e. download via cable to the laptop when full).

                        When I bought my first CF driven camera (350D, almost exactly two years
                        ago) I went to the limits of budget pain to buy a 1024 SanDisk Extreme
                        III and I did not regret it. Solid as a rock, brought back safely
                        pictures from winter shots at -20°C and below.


                        > Panorama shooting
                        > has been one of those few areas that makes me need extra memory (I
                        > rarely shoot more than 100 photos in a single day).

                        same here. For this I bought an additional 2048 SanDisk Ultra II. No
                        Extreme III in the shop. I am happy with it. I considered the 4096 but
                        was still wary of putting too many eggs in the same basket.


                        > Given the price of memory (June 2006) I decided to buy an Epson
                        > Storage Viewer P2000 (it was 400 canadian in Japan). It is 40 gigs and
                        > I find it far more convenient than carrying many CFs. This way I only
                        > need two: the main one and a secondary one that is used while the main
                        > one is copied.

                        I bought one of these USB-OTG HDD <http://www.look.com.cn/prod_A3.htm>
                        (sorry, Chinese only) manufactured by
                        <http://www.look.com.cn/index_english.htm> from eBay for 30CAD and put
                        into it a 40GB HDD a couple of months after buying the 350D. It served
                        me well on a few trips. <http://www.photopla.net/pano.php?id=53>

                        I used it as "day-memory". In the evening I took care to download the
                        images from the OTG-HDD to my notebook.

                        That "day-memory" usage has disadvantages. HDD are sensitive. I lost one
                        (with little data) after a year. Then last summer, during my Boston
                        shooting, the transfer failed. This is what got me thinking of buying
                        more solid state memory (CF or SD? still undecided).

                        I might consider upgrading the USB-OTG HDD capacity to 120GB so that I
                        don't need to lug around a notebook anymore on multi-days trips. The A3
                        has the advantage that it runs on four AA batteries which are available
                        even there where notebook power adapters are not functional.


                        > I found that if I keep using many flash cards it is (for me) difficult
                        > to keep track of which ones have been used and which ones have not.

                        Latest when the camera reports CF full I know :-) Yes, it is difficult
                        for me too.

                        I always keep my CFs empty, i.e. in the evening I download all shots and
                        empty them.

                        I try to keep them in a pocket on the right side of my jacket and store
                        the full one in another pocket on the left, but I am the guy who hears
                        his wife saying "turn right..." "the other, right, darling!" way too
                        often. <http://faculty.washington.edu/chudler/rightl.html#hands>

                        So this left - right confusion kills me.

                        Another trick I have tried: store the CF in individual cases with a
                        piece of paper. One side of the paper is white, the other colored.
                        White= empty, colored = full. Turn the paper appropriately when putting
                        the full CF back in the case.

                        Yuv

                        --
                        Copyright © 2007 Yuval Levy
                        Verbatim copying and distribution on other medium than YahooGroup
                        strictly forbidden.
                      • Robert C. Fisher
                        ... About 6 months ago I purchased a Flash-Trax unit with a 40GB HDD. I got a great deal at a shop that was going out of bussiness, 40% of the original cost I
                        Message 11 of 11 , Feb 27, 2007
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                          On Feb 27, 2007, at 8:31 AM, Yuval Levy wrote:

                          >
                          > I bought one of these USB-OTG HDD <http://www.look.com.cn/prod_A3.htm>
                          > (sorry, Chinese only) manufactured by
                          > <http://www.look.com.cn/index_english.htm> from eBay for 30CAD and put
                          > into it a 40GB HDD a couple of months after buying the 350D. It served
                          > me well on a few trips. <http://www.photopla.net/pano.php?id=53>
                          >
                          > I used it as "day-memory". In the evening I took care to download the
                          > images from the OTG-HDD to my notebook.

                          About 6 months ago I purchased a Flash-Trax unit with a 40GB HDD. I
                          got a great deal at a shop that was going out of bussiness, 40% of
                          the original cost I think.
                          >
                          > That "day-memory" usage has disadvantages. HDD are sensitive. I
                          > lost one
                          > (with little data) after a year. Then last summer, during my Boston
                          > shooting, the transfer failed. This is what got me thinking of buying
                          > more solid state memory (CF or SD? still undecided).
                          >
                          > I might consider upgrading the USB-OTG HDD capacity to 120GB so that I
                          > don't need to lug around a notebook anymore on multi-days trips.
                          > The A3
                          > has the advantage that it runs on four AA batteries which are
                          > available
                          > even there where notebook power adapters are not functional.

                          The laptop downloading didn't really work for me either, too
                          complicated unless I have an assistant to do it or the time.
                          >
                          > > I found that if I keep using many flash cards it is (for me)
                          > difficult
                          > > to keep track of which ones have been used and which ones have not.
                          >
                          > Latest when the camera reports CF full I know :-) Yes, it is difficult
                          > for me too.
                          >
                          > I always keep my CFs empty, i.e. in the evening I download all
                          > shots and
                          > empty them.
                          >
                          > I try to keep them in a pocket on the right side of my jacket and
                          > store
                          > the full one in another pocket on the left, but I am the guy who hears
                          > his wife saying "turn right..." "the other, right, darling!" way too
                          > often. <http://faculty.washington.edu/chudler/rightl.html#hands>
                          >
                          > So this left - right confusion kills me.
                          >
                          > Another trick I have tried: store the CF in individual cases with a
                          > piece of paper. One side of the paper is white, the other colored.
                          > White= empty, colored = full. Turn the paper appropriately when
                          > putting
                          > the full CF back in the case.

                          I solved this by the purchase of a little case that holds 4 CF cards.
                          It's water proof and dust resistant so it keeps them out of harms
                          way. When I replace the cards in the case I put them in brand label
                          out (these are empty, erased) when I use them I put them in the case
                          with rear label out (most CF cards have a white label on the back so
                          it's pretty easy) White out it's used, Brand label out ready to
                          shoot. Pretty simple and I haven't lost any images yet by using a un-
                          backed up card. I carry 5 2GB CF cards so most of the time I don't
                          need to backup to the Flash-Trax until the end of the day when I back
                          up to that and a portable HDD through the laptop so I now have 2
                          copies of the images. I got the 2GB CF cards about 5 months ago on a
                          job that I knew I wouldn't have the opportunity back up quickly so
                          have enough cards was the best idea. Shooting with a D200 I can put
                          about 200 images (with no loss compression) onto 2Gig cards.
                          > Yuv
                          >

                          Cheers
                          Robert C. Fisher
                          VR Photography/Cinematography
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