Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Patent '400 issue

Expand Messages
  • Mark D. Fink
    I just got this and am passing it along to get comment/education on this matter. It s the first I have heard of it. Are any of you aware of this? Have any of
    Message 1 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
    • 0 Attachment
      I just got this and am passing it along to get comment/education on this
      matter. It's the first I have heard of it. Are any of you aware of this?
      Have any of you had any direct issues with clients as is stated below?



      Mark



      www.northernlight.net

      www.virtual-travels.com

      <http://www.pinnacle-vr.com/> www.pinnacle-vr.com



      Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2011 00:07:13 -0500
      From: scottw@...
      To: vr-patents@...
      Subject: [vr-patents] Join with IVRPA to Save 360 VR Photography!



      <http://ivrpa.org/patent> <http://ivrpa.org/patent>
      <http://ivrpa.org/patent> Join with the IVRPA to Save 360 VR Photography!



      Your ability to make a living with 360 VR photography, possibly even to
      create such images for personal use, is in jeopardy. This is real. We need
      to act. We need to stop this. You can help. More on how below, but first
      some background: (Or Donate Now <http://ivrpa.org/patent> )




      What is this all about?


      You may have heard of the infamous '400 patent. ( US Patent 6,754,400 ).
      Anyone with knowledge considers it junk. It's almost as if they just copied
      Quicktime, iPix and various common virtual tour practices, wrote them down
      and claimed they invented it all -- in 2001. They sent it off to the US
      Patent office never acknowledging the existing "prior art." The patent
      examiners never noticed it so they gave them the patent.

      An outfit called Tour Technology Systems, LLC (TTS) now owns the patent and
      is using it to demand money from our clients including hotels, builders,
      realtors, media companies, anybody who uses 360 images and tours. TTS's
      lawyer sends them a letter saying their use of 360 virtual tours infringes
      TTS's patent and demands significant money for their continued use or they
      will take legal action.

      Clients freak out. It is, after all, a real patent. Even when clients learn
      that they are protected, for instance IPix customers are protected by the
      IPix patents, it doesn't matter. The cost of defending against the '400
      patent is too great. Sometimes they get mad at us (the photographers and
      tour producers) for putting them in this situation. Usually they take down
      the tours rather than pay the ransom and swear never to use 360 VR again.
      And they often warn others in their industry to do the same. One
      photographer I know recently lost a client worth $50,000 because of this.

      The more you read the more outraged you will be. Just Google "Patent
      <http://www.google.com/search?q=Patent+6,754,400&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&a
      mp;aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official> 6,754,400".

      If you haven't lost a client over this prepare yourself. By our estimation
      there are easily dozens of photographers who have been hit financially and
      many times more seeing the threat to their clients. Anthony Handal, lawyer
      for TTS, tells us he is just getting started.

      What if you don't sell your 360 images? There is nothing to stop TTS from
      going after PTGui, KRPano, Pano2VR, FPP, EasyPano... any software that
      produces 360 images since the technology they all use is ostensibly covered
      by the '400 patent. It is just a matter of time.


      What can you do?


      The effort needs funds and help researching and preparing documentation.

      IVRPA (International Virtual Reality Photography Association) is sponsoring
      the move to stop the '400 patent. Work done so far by our lawyers makes us
      confident that we can succeed. But it will take money, some $20,000. Therein
      lies the problem. TTS knows that the cost and time of challenging their
      patent is too great for most companies. It is easier and cheaper to just
      fold.

      If we all band together to finance this we can all reap the benefits. If we
      don't... expect a hit -- maybe a huge hit -- to your pocketbook and passion
      one way or another. It's just a matter of time. Your choice: Together we
      win. Separately doing nothing we all lose.

      IVRPA is contributing what it can to this effort but there is no way the
      organization can do it all. We just aren't that big. We need your help to
      make this happen, IVRPA member or not.

      <http://ivrpa.org/patent> Donate Now

      Put this into perspective, if you lose just one client, one 360 virtual tour
      job, how much will that cost you? How much would you pay to prevent this?

      Documentation: We need proof that methods and technology covered by the '400
      patent were in use before the patent was submitted (Feb. 6th, 2001). We
      already know the pre-existing patents. Software manuals, magazine articles,
      books etc that describe all this would be great if they were clearly
      published before the '400 patent application . Please contact Scott Witte
      <mailto:patent@...> if you have these.

      Your Stories: Have you or your clients been affected by the '400 patent? We
      need as much intelligence as possible about what Handal is doing, who is he
      approaching and what have been the result, especially any settlements made.
      Please contact Scott <mailto:patent@...> Witte directly with this
      information.

      Please. Let's all do our part! If you can, a significant part.

      (Note: If you prefer, and especially for large contributions, you may wire
      money directly into the IVRPA Patent Fund account. Contact Scott
      <mailto:patent@...> Witte for more information.)



      Scott Witte

      IVRPA board member

      Coordinator, patent committee.

      On Behalf of the IVRPA Board of Directors





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Ken Warner
      Sounds like a bunch of B.S. to me. Do you know anybody in this group? If you haven t lost a client over this prepare yourself. By our estimation ... If you
      Message 2 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
      • 0 Attachment
        Sounds like a bunch of B.S. to me. Do you know anybody in this group?

        "> If you haven't lost a client over this prepare yourself. By our estimation
        > there are easily dozens of photographers who have been hit financially and
        > many times more seeing the threat to their clients. Anthony Handal, lawyer
        > for TTS, tells us he is just getting started.
        > "

        If you google "Tour Technology Systems, LLC" all you find is a bunch of people
        asking about this. You don't find the actual company.

        Did this come from Nigeria?


        Mark D. Fink wrote:
        > I just got this and am passing it along to get comment/education on this
        > matter. It's the first I have heard of it. Are any of you aware of this?
        > Have any of you had any direct issues with clients as is stated below?
        >
        >
        >
        > Mark
      • Mark D. Fink
        ... www.ivrpa.org? A few. I don t think they are from Nigeria... :o) You can see this topic on their home page.
        Message 3 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
        • 0 Attachment
          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com] On
          > Behalf Of Ken Warner
          > Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2011 12:18 PM
          > To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] Patent '400 issue
          >
          > Sounds like a bunch of B.S. to me. Do you know anybody in this group?

          www.ivrpa.org? A few. I don't think they are from Nigeria... :o)
          You can see this topic on their home page.

          >
          > "> If you haven't lost a client over this prepare yourself. By our
          > estimation
          > > there are easily dozens of photographers who have been hit financially
          > and
          > > many times more seeing the threat to their clients. Anthony Handal,
          > lawyer
          > > for TTS, tells us he is just getting started.
          > > "
          >
          > If you google "Tour Technology Systems, LLC" all you find is a bunch of
          > people
          > asking about this. You don't find the actual company.
          >
          > Did this come from Nigeria?
          >
          >
          > Mark D. Fink wrote:
          > > I just got this and am passing it along to get comment/education on this
          > > matter. It's the first I have heard of it. Are any of you aware of this?
          > > Have any of you had any direct issues with clients as is stated below?
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Mark
          >
          >
          > ------------------------------------
          >
          > --
          >
          >
          >
        • Ken Warner
          DOOMED I say! DOOMED... Run for your underground shelters!!!!!
          Message 4 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
          • 0 Attachment
            DOOMED I say! DOOMED... Run for your underground shelters!!!!!

            Mark D. Fink wrote:
            >> -----Original Message-----
            >> From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com] On
            >> Behalf Of Ken Warner
            >> Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2011 12:18 PM
            >> To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
            >> Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] Patent '400 issue
            >>
            >> Sounds like a bunch of B.S. to me. Do you know anybody in this group?
            >
            > www.ivrpa.org? A few. I don't think they are from Nigeria... :o)
            > You can see this topic on their home page.
            >
            >> "> If you haven't lost a client over this prepare yourself. By our
            >> estimation
            >> > there are easily dozens of photographers who have been hit financially
            >> and
            >> > many times more seeing the threat to their clients. Anthony Handal,
            >> lawyer
            >> > for TTS, tells us he is just getting started.
            >> > "
            >>
            >> If you google "Tour Technology Systems, LLC" all you find is a bunch of
            >> people
            >> asking about this. You don't find the actual company.
            >>
            >> Did this come from Nigeria?
            >>
            >>
            >> Mark D. Fink wrote:
            >>> I just got this and am passing it along to get comment/education on this
            >>> matter. It's the first I have heard of it. Are any of you aware of this?
            >>> Have any of you had any direct issues with clients as is stated below?
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>> Mark
            >>
            >> ------------------------------------
            >>
            >> --
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >
            >
          • AYRTON
            ... Sorry I could not find a translation in portuguese for this .. What exactly does it means ? best AYRTON ... -- + 55 21 9982 6313 - RIO + 55 11 3717 5131 -
            Message 5 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
            • 0 Attachment
              On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 2:08 PM, Ken Warner <kwarner000@...> wrote:

              > DOOMED I say! DOOMED... Run for your underground shelters!!!!!
              >

              Sorry
              I could not find a translation in portuguese for this ..
              What exactly does it means ?

              best
              AYRTON



              >
              > Mark D. Fink wrote:
              > >> -----Original Message-----
              > >> From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]
              > On
              > >> Behalf Of Ken Warner
              > >> Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2011 12:18 PM
              > >> To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
              > >> Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] Patent '400 issue
              > >>
              > >> Sounds like a bunch of B.S. to me. Do you know anybody in this group?
              > >
              > > www.ivrpa.org? A few. I don't think they are from Nigeria... :o)
              > > You can see this topic on their home page.
              > >
              > >> "> If you haven't lost a client over this prepare yourself. By our
              > >> estimation
              > >> > there are easily dozens of photographers who have been hit
              > financially
              > >> and
              > >> > many times more seeing the threat to their clients. Anthony Handal,
              > >> lawyer
              > >> > for TTS, tells us he is just getting started.
              > >> > "
              > >>
              > >> If you google "Tour Technology Systems, LLC" all you find is a bunch of
              > >> people
              > >> asking about this. You don't find the actual company.
              > >>
              > >> Did this come from Nigeria?
              > >>
              > >>
              > >> Mark D. Fink wrote:
              > >>> I just got this and am passing it along to get comment/education on
              > this
              > >>> matter. It's the first I have heard of it. Are any of you aware of
              > this?
              > >>> Have any of you had any direct issues with clients as is stated below?
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>> Mark
              > >>
              > >> ------------------------------------
              > >>
              > >> --
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
              > ------------------------------------
              >
              > --
              >
              >
              >
              >


              --

              + 55 21 9982 6313 - RIO
              + 55 11 3717 5131 - SP
              http://ayrton360.com
              twitter.com/ayrton360


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Ken Warner
              Then your translation is correct. It means nothing....
              Message 6 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
              • 0 Attachment
                Then your translation is correct. It means nothing....

                AYRTON wrote:
                > On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 2:08 PM, Ken Warner <kwarner000@...> wrote:
                >
                >> DOOMED I say! DOOMED... Run for your underground shelters!!!!!
                >>
                >
                > Sorry
                > I could not find a translation in portuguese for this ..
                > What exactly does it means ?
                >
                > best
                > AYRTON
                >
                >
                >
                >> Mark D. Fink wrote:
                >>>> -----Original Message-----
                >>>> From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]
                >> On
                >>>> Behalf Of Ken Warner
                >>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2011 12:18 PM
                >>>> To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                >>>> Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] Patent '400 issue
                >>>>
                >>>> Sounds like a bunch of B.S. to me. Do you know anybody in this group?
                >>> www.ivrpa.org? A few. I don't think they are from Nigeria... :o)
                >>> You can see this topic on their home page.
                >>>
                >>>> "> If you haven't lost a client over this prepare yourself. By our
                >>>> estimation
                >>>> > there are easily dozens of photographers who have been hit
                >> financially
                >>>> and
                >>>> > many times more seeing the threat to their clients. Anthony Handal,
                >>>> lawyer
                >>>> > for TTS, tells us he is just getting started.
                >>>> > "
                >>>>
                >>>> If you google "Tour Technology Systems, LLC" all you find is a bunch of
                >>>> people
                >>>> asking about this. You don't find the actual company.
                >>>>
                >>>> Did this come from Nigeria?
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>> Mark D. Fink wrote:
                >>>>> I just got this and am passing it along to get comment/education on
                >> this
                >>>>> matter. It's the first I have heard of it. Are any of you aware of
                >> this?
                >>>>> Have any of you had any direct issues with clients as is stated below?
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>> Mark
                >>>> ------------------------------------
                >>>>
                >>>> --
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>
                >>
                >> ------------------------------------
                >>
                >> --
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >
                >
              • AYRTON
                ... ??? the word doomed in portuguese would mean GUILTY !?!?! A ... -- + 55 21 9982 6313 - RIO + 55 11 3717 5131 - SP http://ayrton360.com
                Message 7 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
                • 0 Attachment
                  On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 2:30 PM, Ken Warner <kwarner000@...> wrote:

                  > Then your translation is correct. It means nothing....
                  >

                  ???
                  the word doomed in portuguese would mean GUILTY !?!?!

                  A




                  >
                  > AYRTON wrote:
                  > > On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 2:08 PM, Ken Warner <kwarner000@...>
                  > wrote:
                  > >
                  > >> DOOMED I say! DOOMED... Run for your underground shelters!!!!!
                  > >>
                  > >
                  > > Sorry
                  > > I could not find a translation in portuguese for this ..
                  > > What exactly does it means ?
                  > >
                  > > best
                  > > AYRTON
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >> Mark D. Fink wrote:
                  > >>>> -----Original Message-----
                  > >>>> From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                  > ]
                  > >> On
                  > >>>> Behalf Of Ken Warner
                  > >>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2011 12:18 PM
                  > >>>> To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                  > >>>> Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] Patent '400 issue
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>> Sounds like a bunch of B.S. to me. Do you know anybody in this group?
                  > >>> www.ivrpa.org? A few. I don't think they are from Nigeria... :o)
                  > >>> You can see this topic on their home page.
                  > >>>
                  > >>>> "> If you haven't lost a client over this prepare yourself. By our
                  > >>>> estimation
                  > >>>> > there are easily dozens of photographers who have been hit
                  > >> financially
                  > >>>> and
                  > >>>> > many times more seeing the threat to their clients. Anthony Handal,
                  > >>>> lawyer
                  > >>>> > for TTS, tells us he is just getting started.
                  > >>>> > "
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>> If you google "Tour Technology Systems, LLC" all you find is a bunch
                  > of
                  > >>>> people
                  > >>>> asking about this. You don't find the actual company.
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>> Did this come from Nigeria?
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>> Mark D. Fink wrote:
                  > >>>>> I just got this and am passing it along to get comment/education on
                  > >> this
                  > >>>>> matter. It's the first I have heard of it. Are any of you aware of
                  > >> this?
                  > >>>>> Have any of you had any direct issues with clients as is stated
                  > below?
                  > >>>>>
                  > >>>>>
                  > >>>>>
                  > >>>>> Mark
                  > >>>> ------------------------------------
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>> --
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>
                  > >>
                  > >> ------------------------------------
                  > >>
                  > >> --
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >
                  > >
                  >
                  >
                  > ------------------------------------
                  >
                  > --
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >


                  --

                  + 55 21 9982 6313 - RIO
                  + 55 11 3717 5131 - SP
                  http://ayrton360.com
                  twitter.com/ayrton360


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Zack Weinberg
                  ... It used to mean something like that in English, too. The oldest meaning of the verb to doom is to judge and sentence , like a court does. So someone
                  Message 8 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
                  • 0 Attachment
                    On 2011-04-27 10:52 AM, AYRTON wrote:
                    > On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 2:30 PM, Ken Warner<kwarner000@...> wrote:
                    >
                    >> Then your translation is correct. It means nothing....
                    >>
                    >
                    > ???
                    > the word doomed in portuguese would mean GUILTY !?!?!

                    It used to mean something like that in English, too. The oldest meaning
                    of the verb "to doom" is "to judge and sentence", like a court does. So
                    someone who is doomed is someone who is under some sort of sentence of
                    punishment. Therefore, that person was found guilty of something.

                    But in modern English, the _judgement_ part has been forgotten. If you
                    say "<someone> is doomed" you just mean "something bad is going to
                    happen to <someone> in the near future". Usually something very bad,
                    like death. So "DOOMED! DOOMED, I say!" is roughly the same as "We're
                    all going to die!!!!1!" only with extra portentousness.

                    zw
                  • Serge Maandag
                    ... If you re doomed, a bad thing will happen and there is no way to escape it. The first dictionary I googled translates it to condenado . Serge.
                    Message 9 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
                    • 0 Attachment
                      > ???
                      > the word doomed in portuguese would mean GUILTY !?!?!
                      >

                      If you're doomed, a bad thing will happen and there is no way to escape it.
                      The first dictionary I googled translates it to "condenado".

                      Serge.
                      http://360photo.org/
                    • pedro_silva58
                      hi! especially for seu ayrton ;-) i agree, the best simple translation of doomed in the modern sense, which was certainly, if sarcastically, implied by ken,
                      Message 10 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
                      • 0 Attachment
                        hi!
                        especially for seu ayrton ;-)

                        i agree, the best simple translation of "doomed" in the modern sense, which was certainly, if sarcastically, implied by ken, would be "condenado", but even then...
                        "condenado", not as "sentenciado como criminoso", which would be closer to "convicted",
                        but as "condenado de antemão", or "destinado a derrota", in the sense of having an unfortunate but inescapable outcome.

                        hope this helps!

                        cheers,
                        pedro

                        (ps. this reminds me something about (not) relying on humor, sarcasm, etc, on an international list such as ours, but what is it?)

                        --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Serge Maandag" <panotools@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > > ???
                        > > the word doomed in portuguese would mean GUILTY !?!?!
                        > >
                        >
                        > If you're doomed, a bad thing will happen and there is no way to escape it.
                        > The first dictionary I googled translates it to "condenado".
                        >
                        > Serge.
                        > http://360photo.org/
                        >
                      • Rodolpho Pajuaba
                        Amaldiçoado (almost like cursed ) translates better. ... Regards, -- Rodolpho Pajuaba www.pajuaba.com.br/heterose www.pajuaba.com.br/panoblog
                        Message 11 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
                        • 0 Attachment
                          "Amaldiçoado" (almost like "cursed") translates better.

                          2011/4/27 pedro_silva58 <pedro_silva58@...>:
                          > hi!
                          >
                          > i agree, the best simple translation of "doomed" in the modern sense, which was certainly, if sarcastically, implied by ken, would be "condenado", but even then...
                          > "condenado", not as "sentenciado como criminoso", which would be closer to "convicted",
                          > but as "condenado de antemão", or "destinado a derrota", in the sense of having an unfortunate but inescapable outcome.
                          >
                          > hope this helps!
                          >
                          > cheers,
                          > pedro
                          >
                          > (ps. this reminds me something about (not) relying on humor, sarcasm, etc, on an international list such as ours, but what is it?)
                          >
                          > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Serge Maandag" <panotools@...> wrote:
                          >>
                          >> > ???
                          >> > the word doomed in portuguese would mean GUILTY !?!?!
                          >> >
                          >>
                          >> If you're doomed, a bad thing will happen and there is no way to escape it.
                          >> The first dictionary I googled translates it to "condenado".
                          >>
                          >> Serge.
                          >> http://360photo.org/


                          Regards,
                          --
                          Rodolpho Pajuaba
                          www.pajuaba.com.br/heterose
                          www.pajuaba.com.br/panoblog
                          www.pajuaba.com.br/traduzindophotoshop
                          Follow me on Twitter - @rpajuaba
                        • AYRTON
                          ... Opps is getting more complicated :-) best A ... -- + 55 21 9982 6313 - RIO + 55 11 3717 5131 - SP http://ayrton360.com twitter.com/ayrton360 [Non-text
                          Message 12 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
                          • 0 Attachment
                            On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 4:30 PM, Serge Maandag <panotools@...>wrote:

                            > > ???
                            > > the word doomed in portuguese would mean GUILTY !?!?!
                            > If you're doomed, a bad thing will happen and there is no way to escape it.
                            > The first dictionary I googled translates it to "condenado".
                            >

                            Opps is getting more complicated :-)

                            best
                            A


                            >
                            > Serge.
                            > http://360photo.org/
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > ------------------------------------
                            >
                            > --
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >


                            --

                            + 55 21 9982 6313 - RIO
                            + 55 11 3717 5131 - SP
                            http://ayrton360.com
                            twitter.com/ayrton360


                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • AYRTON
                            ... Makes sense .... ... yes ... yes !!! it is complicated sometimes to complete understand slangs .... best AYRTON ... -- + 55 21 9982 6313 - RIO + 55 11 3717
                            Message 13 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
                            • 0 Attachment
                              On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 5:19 PM, pedro_silva58 <pedro_silva58@...>wrote:

                              > hi!
                              > especially for seu ayrton ;-)
                              >

                              :-)



                              > i agree, the best simple translation of "doomed" in the modern sense, which
                              > was certainly, if sarcastically, implied by ken, would be "condenado", but
                              > even then...
                              > "condenado", not as "sentenciado como criminoso", which would be closer to
                              > "convicted",
                              > but as "condenado de antemão", or "destinado a derrota", in the sense of
                              > having an unfortunate but inescapable outcome.
                              >

                              Makes sense ....



                              >
                              > hope this helps!
                              >

                              yes



                              >
                              > cheers,
                              > pedro
                              >
                              > (ps. this reminds me something about (not) relying on humor, sarcasm, etc,
                              > on an international list such as ours, but what is it?)
                              >

                              yes !!!
                              it is complicated sometimes to complete understand slangs ....

                              best
                              AYRTON



                              >
                              > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Serge Maandag" <panotools@...> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > > ???
                              > > > the word doomed in portuguese would mean GUILTY !?!?!
                              > > >
                              > >
                              > > If you're doomed, a bad thing will happen and there is no way to escape
                              > it.
                              > > The first dictionary I googled translates it to "condenado".
                              > >
                              > > Serge.
                              > > http://360photo.org/
                              > >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > ------------------------------------
                              >
                              > --
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >


                              --

                              + 55 21 9982 6313 - RIO
                              + 55 11 3717 5131 - SP
                              http://ayrton360.com
                              twitter.com/ayrton360


                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            • AYRTON
                              ... Wowwww, Rodolpho, then it gets more non sense to me ... you re brazilian, but I know your english is wayyyyyy better than mine. But how amaldiçoado on
                              Message 14 of 14 , Apr 27, 2011
                              • 0 Attachment
                                On Wed, Apr 27, 2011 at 5:25 PM, Rodolpho Pajuaba <rpajuaba@...>wrote:

                                > "Amaldiçoado" (almost like "cursed") translates better.
                                >

                                Wowwww,
                                Rodolpho,
                                then it gets more non sense to me ...
                                you're brazilian, but I know your english is wayyyyyy better than mine.

                                But how "amaldiçoado" on his phrase would make sense ???
                                Doesn't Pedro Silva's "destinado a derrota" make it better to his sentence ?

                                best
                                AYRTON


                                >
                                > 2011/4/27 pedro_silva58 <pedro_silva58@...>:
                                > > hi!
                                > >
                                > > i agree, the best simple translation of "doomed" in the modern sense,
                                > which was certainly, if sarcastically, implied by ken, would be "condenado",
                                > but even then...
                                > > "condenado", not as "sentenciado como criminoso", which would be closer
                                > to "convicted",
                                > > but as "condenado de antemão", or "destinado a derrota", in the sense of
                                > having an unfortunate but inescapable outcome.
                                > >
                                > > hope this helps!
                                > >
                                > > cheers,
                                > > pedro
                                > >
                                > > (ps. this reminds me something about (not) relying on humor, sarcasm,
                                > etc, on an international list such as ours, but what is it?)
                                > >
                                > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Serge Maandag" <panotools@...>
                                > wrote:
                                > >>
                                > >> > ???
                                > >> > the word doomed in portuguese would mean GUILTY !?!?!
                                > >> >
                                > >>
                                > >> If you're doomed, a bad thing will happen and there is no way to escape
                                > it.
                                > >> The first dictionary I googled translates it to "condenado".
                                > >>
                                > >> Serge.
                                > >> http://360photo.org/
                                >
                                >
                                > Regards,
                                > --
                                > Rodolpho Pajuaba
                                > www.pajuaba.com.br/heterose
                                > www.pajuaba.com.br/panoblog
                                > www.pajuaba.com.br/traduzindophotoshop
                                > Follow me on Twitter - @rpajuaba
                                >
                                >
                                > ------------------------------------
                                >
                                > --
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >


                                --

                                + 55 21 9982 6313 - RIO
                                + 55 11 3717 5131 - SP
                                http://ayrton360.com
                                twitter.com/ayrton360


                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.