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Re: [PanoToolsNG] Job advert appearing in NZ for Panorama photographer

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  • Kathy Wheeler
    ... And his grammar is suspect: would indicate your in a surely *should* have been would indicate you re in a ... looks like *you re* better off without
    Message 1 of 11 , Mar 6 2:13 AM
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      On 03/06/2011, at 6:43 PM, Murray C wrote:
      > "Thank you for your email. I don't think you are who we are looking for, the
      > role will not change and the response we've had would indicate your in a
      > minority. "
      >
      > Based on the fact that he doesn't know any thing about me, other than my
      > Christian name, it's a somewhat arrogant and misguided assumption!


      And his grammar is suspect:
      "would indicate your in a"
      surely *should* have been
      "would indicate you're in a"

      ... looks like *you're* better off without them. They're looking for cheap labor and someone who doesn't know his/her rights.

      Regards,
      KathyW.
    • Michael Bajko BFA - The Fine Art of Photo
      Good on you for enquiring Murray. Not surprised at the reply. Here s what I got; ... Doesn t answer our concerns at all. Michael -- Michael Bajko BFA The Fine
      Message 2 of 11 , Mar 6 1:11 PM
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        Good on you for enquiring Murray.
        Not surprised at the reply.
        Here's what I got;

        > Micheal,
        >
        > Thank you for your email raising your concerns.
        >
        > I can assure you offering a great source of income to photographers to
        > make this their profession is by no means unprofessional - I've been
        > paying our photographer here the same rate and he's shooting 30-40
        > images a week which has enabled the role to become 'professional' for
        > him. Please tell me where else he could find this volume of well paid
        > work and I'll ask him if he's interested?
        >
        > If you feel that what we are offering is inappropriate, please tell me
        > what you think a suitable rate for shooting 10 images in a local city
        > centre business is, especially if you can do another one the same day.
        > And you don't have to deal with the clients or be involved in the
        > sales process. And you get paid within a week of the images being
        > approved?
        >
        > I've looked through your site and I don't think the type of
        > photography we are looking for is really in the same category so
        > really, you have no need to worry and we won't be stepping on your
        > toes. We are more commercially focused than fine art photographers.
        >
        > At present there is a very limited growth of commercial VR
        > photography, we've managed to come up with a new way to access a large
        > market for our photographers and provide regular, high volume work so
        > I believe we are helping rather than hindering growth of the industry.
        >
        > I welcome your comments.
        >
        > Best regards,
        >
        >
        > Ben Knill
        >
        Doesn't answer our concerns at all.
        Michael

        --
        Michael Bajko BFA
        The Fine Art Of Photography
        Associate Member IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photography Association )
        Waitakere, Auckland
        Aotearoa/ New Zealand



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Murray C
        ... From: Michael Bajko BFA - The Fine Art of Photography Sent: Monday, March 07, 2011 10:11 AM To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com Subject: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Job
        Message 3 of 11 , Mar 6 1:33 PM
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          -----Original Message-----
          From: Michael Bajko BFA - The Fine Art of Photography
          Sent: Monday, March 07, 2011 10:11 AM
          To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Job advert appearing in NZ for Panorama
          photographer

          Good on you for enquiring Murray.
          Not surprised at the reply.
          Here's what I got;

          > Micheal,
          >
          > Thank you for your email raising your concerns.
          >
          > I can assure you offering a great source of income to photographers to
          > make this their profession is by no means unprofessional - I've been
          > paying our photographer here the same rate and he's shooting 30-40
          > images a week which has enabled the role to become 'professional' for
          > him. Please tell me where else he could find this volume of well paid
          > work and I'll ask him if he's interested?
          >
          > If you feel that what we are offering is inappropriate, please tell me
          > what you think a suitable rate for shooting 10 images in a local city
          > centre business is, especially if you can do another one the same day.
          > And you don't have to deal with the clients or be involved in the
          > sales process. And you get paid within a week of the images being
          > approved?
          >
          > I've looked through your site and I don't think the type of
          > photography we are looking for is really in the same category so
          > really, you have no need to worry and we won't be stepping on your
          > toes. We are more commercially focused than fine art photographers.
          >
          > At present there is a very limited growth of commercial VR
          > photography, we've managed to come up with a new way to access a large
          > market for our photographers and provide regular, high volume work so
          > I believe we are helping rather than hindering growth of the industry.
          >
          > I welcome your comments.
          >
          > Best regards,
          >
          >
          > Ben Knill
          >
          Doesn't answer our concerns at all.
          Michael

          --
          Michael Bajko BFA
          The Fine Art Of Photography
          Associate Member IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photography
          Association )
          Waitakere, Auckland
          Aotearoa/ New Zealand



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


          Michael

          Just a few seconds ago I received a copy of the the reply Beek forwarded to
          you! Not very professional in my view. I have many reservations in respect
          of the claims they make. Beeks will be the winner of this venture. It's a
          good example of how (professional) vr photographers can be exploited.

          Murray



          ------------------------------------

          --
        • jrgen_schrader
          Well, to be honest I am not sure what you are complaining about. I went to a huge museum last week to shoot some images for a tour. In the afternoon I took 30
          Message 4 of 11 , Mar 6 1:41 PM
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            Well, to be honest I am not sure what you are complaining about.
            I went to a huge museum last week to shoot some images for a tour.
            In the afternoon I took 30 panoramas with bracketed shots in a couple of hours and processed most of them in the evening. The outcome was close to perfect and exceeded customers expectations. And I can assure you I will not get 150 each.
            I don't know about general income in NZ but with the prospect of doing 30 or 40 images per week at this rate I would be rather happy for a while.

            Cheers
            Jürgen





            --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "michaelbajko" <michael@...> wrote:
            >
            > Kia Ora everyone'
            >
            > Below is a job advert appearing on
            > http://www.thebigidea.co.nz/work/jobs-opportunities/multimedia/82170-pan\
            > oramic-photographer
            > <http://www.thebigidea.co.nz/work/jobs-opportunities/multimedia/82170-pa\
            > noramic-photographer>
            > an arts community site in New Zealand,
            > and my response to the advertiser, copied to the arts site and the
            > IVRPA.
            >
            > Cheers Michael
            >
            > --------------------------------
            >
            > Panoramic photographer
            > 02 March 2011
            > beek.co
            > Organisation/person name: Beek
            > Work type: Freelance
            > Work classification: Photography
            > Job description:
            >
            > Beek is an interactive destination guide that is getting ready to embark
            > on a national rollout of our interactive guide product. If you can
            > provide spherical panoramic images or virtual tours we want to hear from
            > you.
            >
            > We would like to find photographers out there who can supply
            > equirectangular panoramic images. Generally they will need to be high
            > dynamic range, full spherical images that usually have people in them,
            > showing rooms and spaces in hotels, restaurants, attractions and public
            > spaces.
            >
            > You will need your own quality DSLR, Fisheye lens and tripod with a
            > rotator. You will be able to stitch your images in stitching software
            > such as ptgui or autopano, and be able to provide processed images at
            > 6000x3000 pixels.
            >
            > You will usually be paid $150 per image, and will be responsible for all
            > of your own costs and expenses. You may be asked to provide some images
            > without charge to support sales activity.
            >
            > Please send examples of images to ben@... with your contact details
            > and location.
            > Opportunity location: New Zealand
            > Key skills sought:
            > Photography
            > image stitching
            > photoshop
            > This opportunity is: Paid
            > Salary low $: 0
            > Salary high $: 0
            > Closing date: Saturday, 2 April 2011
            > Contact details:
            > Email ben@... with examples of images.
            > Submitted by beek on Wed, 02/03/2011 - 11:33am.
            >
            > -------------------------------------------
            >
            > Kia Ora Ben,
            >
            > I write concerning your job advertisement in 'The Big Idea, Te Aria
            > Nui' for a 'Panoramic Photographer'
            > I am a vr panoramic photographer of four years standing and an associate
            > member of the IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photographers
            > Association).
            >
            > Neither myself or the association consider a flat fee per image,
            > incorporating responsibility for all costs and expenses, as professional
            > conduct.
            > Providing images without charge especialy so.
            > The association recomends charging per assignmet, specifically taking
            > into account costs and expenses.
            > Agreement is made through written contract, and rights of the image are
            > most always held by the photographer and liscensed to the client by
            > writen agreement.
            >
            > Commercial VR photography is rare in Aotearoa/New Zealand and it is my
            > concern that it's growth is undertaken in as professional manner as
            > possible.
            >
            > No reira,
            > Regards Michael
            >
            > Michael Bajko BFA
            > The Fine Art Of Photography
            > Associate Member IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photography
            > Association )
            > Waitakere, Auckland
            > Aotearoa/ New Zealand
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
          • Hans
            ... Beek http://beek.co/index.html And an example. http://a.beek.co/g.htm?s=boltonhotel_reception&t=1 I guess this is the worst mistreatment of KRPano I ever
            Message 5 of 11 , Mar 6 2:47 PM
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              --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "michaelbajko" <michael@...> wrote:
              >
              > Kia Ora everyone'
              >
              > Below is a job advert appearing on
              > http://www.thebigidea.co.nz/work/jobs-opportunities/multimedia/82170-pan\
              > oramic-photographer
              > <http://www.thebigidea.co.nz/work/jobs-opportunities/multimedia/82170-pa\
              > noramic-photographer>
              > an arts community site in New Zealand,
              > and my response to the advertiser, copied to the arts site and the
              > IVRPA.
              >
              > Cheers Michael



              Beek
              http://beek.co/index.html
              And an example.

              http://a.beek.co/g.htm?s=boltonhotel_reception&t=1

              I guess this is the worst mistreatment of KRPano I ever seen.

              I guess that if I try to load it on my last computer I will not be able to move it.
              Not sure what they done with it.

              Hans

              >
              > --------------------------------
              >
              > Panoramic photographer
              > 02 March 2011
              > beek.co
              > Organisation/person name: Beek
              > Work type: Freelance
              > Work classification: Photography
              > Job description:
              >
              > Beek is an interactive destination guide that is getting ready to embark
              > on a national rollout of our interactive guide product. If you can
              > provide spherical panoramic images or virtual tours we want to hear from
              > you.
              >
              > We would like to find photographers out there who can supply
              > equirectangular panoramic images. Generally they will need to be high
              > dynamic range, full spherical images that usually have people in them,
              > showing rooms and spaces in hotels, restaurants, attractions and public
              > spaces.
              >
              > You will need your own quality DSLR, Fisheye lens and tripod with a
              > rotator. You will be able to stitch your images in stitching software
              > such as ptgui or autopano, and be able to provide processed images at
              > 6000x3000 pixels.
              >
              > You will usually be paid $150 per image, and will be responsible for all
              > of your own costs and expenses. You may be asked to provide some images
              > without charge to support sales activity.
              >
              > Please send examples of images to ben@... with your contact details
              > and location.
              > Opportunity location: New Zealand
              > Key skills sought:
              > Photography
              > image stitching
              > photoshop
              > This opportunity is: Paid
              > Salary low $: 0
              > Salary high $: 0
              > Closing date: Saturday, 2 April 2011
              > Contact details:
              > Email ben@... with examples of images.
              > Submitted by beek on Wed, 02/03/2011 - 11:33am.
              >
              > -------------------------------------------
              >
              > Kia Ora Ben,
              >
              > I write concerning your job advertisement in 'The Big Idea, Te Aria
              > Nui' for a 'Panoramic Photographer'
              > I am a vr panoramic photographer of four years standing and an associate
              > member of the IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photographers
              > Association).
              >
              > Neither myself or the association consider a flat fee per image,
              > incorporating responsibility for all costs and expenses, as professional
              > conduct.
              > Providing images without charge especialy so.
              > The association recomends charging per assignmet, specifically taking
              > into account costs and expenses.
              > Agreement is made through written contract, and rights of the image are
              > most always held by the photographer and liscensed to the client by
              > writen agreement.
              >
              > Commercial VR photography is rare in Aotearoa/New Zealand and it is my
              > concern that it's growth is undertaken in as professional manner as
              > possible.
              >
              > No reira,
              > Regards Michael
              >
              > Michael Bajko BFA
              > The Fine Art Of Photography
              > Associate Member IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photography
              > Association )
              > Waitakere, Auckland
              > Aotearoa/ New Zealand
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
            • Stephani Hill
              I believe that is what is referred to as a drive by shoot or quick and dirty. As a consumer, I would be very unhappy with the finished product if it
              Message 6 of 11 , Mar 6 2:54 PM
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                I believe that is what is referred to as a "drive by shoot" or "quick and dirty."

                As a consumer, I would be very unhappy with the finished product if it included stitching errors.

                Stephani
              • michaelbajko
                Hi Jurgen, In reality it would be more like 10-20 images full stop, not per week,and then it d be off out of town for a couple of images here, a couple of
                Message 7 of 11 , Mar 6 3:52 PM
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                  Hi Jurgen,
                  In reality it would be more like 10-20 images full stop, not per week,and then it'd be off out of town for a couple of images here, a couple of images there, full stop.
                  We just don't have the population/economic scale to do what you just have, so basically it's a one off for a couple of grand and that's it.
                  On the other side of the coin, as Hans has pointed out experience and quality is crap which doesn't do any of us here in NZ that are endeavouring to raise our standards any good either.
                  Cheers Michael

                  OT: PS. Enjoyed seeing your cat on your knee on the last IVRPA video cast. I'm a catman too, why I love Roger's swimming tiger series.


                  --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Well, to be honest I am not sure what you are complaining about.
                  > I went to a huge museum last week to shoot some images for a tour.
                  > In the afternoon I took 30 panoramas with bracketed shots in a couple of hours and processed most of them in the evening. The outcome was close to perfect and exceeded customers expectations. And I can assure you I will not get 150 each.
                  > I don't know about general income in NZ but with the prospect of doing 30 or 40 images per week at this rate I would be rather happy for a while.
                  >
                  > Cheers
                  > Jürgen
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "michaelbajko" <michael@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Kia Ora everyone'
                  > >
                  > > Below is a job advert appearing on
                  > > http://www.thebigidea.co.nz/work/jobs-opportunities/multimedia/82170-pan\
                  > > oramic-photographer
                  > > <http://www.thebigidea.co.nz/work/jobs-opportunities/multimedia/82170-pa\
                  > > noramic-photographer>
                  > > an arts community site in New Zealand,
                  > > and my response to the advertiser, copied to the arts site and the
                  > > IVRPA.
                  > >
                  > > Cheers Michael
                  > >
                  > > --------------------------------
                  > >
                  > > Panoramic photographer
                  > > 02 March 2011
                  > > beek.co
                  > > Organisation/person name: Beek
                  > > Work type: Freelance
                  > > Work classification: Photography
                  > > Job description:
                  > >
                  > > Beek is an interactive destination guide that is getting ready to embark
                  > > on a national rollout of our interactive guide product. If you can
                  > > provide spherical panoramic images or virtual tours we want to hear from
                  > > you.
                  > >
                  > > We would like to find photographers out there who can supply
                  > > equirectangular panoramic images. Generally they will need to be high
                  > > dynamic range, full spherical images that usually have people in them,
                  > > showing rooms and spaces in hotels, restaurants, attractions and public
                  > > spaces.
                  > >
                  > > You will need your own quality DSLR, Fisheye lens and tripod with a
                  > > rotator. You will be able to stitch your images in stitching software
                  > > such as ptgui or autopano, and be able to provide processed images at
                  > > 6000x3000 pixels.
                  > >
                  > > You will usually be paid $150 per image, and will be responsible for all
                  > > of your own costs and expenses. You may be asked to provide some images
                  > > without charge to support sales activity.
                  > >
                  > > Please send examples of images to ben@ with your contact details
                  > > and location.
                  > > Opportunity location: New Zealand
                  > > Key skills sought:
                  > > Photography
                  > > image stitching
                  > > photoshop
                  > > This opportunity is: Paid
                  > > Salary low $: 0
                  > > Salary high $: 0
                  > > Closing date: Saturday, 2 April 2011
                  > > Contact details:
                  > > Email ben@ with examples of images.
                  > > Submitted by beek on Wed, 02/03/2011 - 11:33am.
                  > >
                  > > -------------------------------------------
                  > >
                  > > Kia Ora Ben,
                  > >
                  > > I write concerning your job advertisement in 'The Big Idea, Te Aria
                  > > Nui' for a 'Panoramic Photographer'
                  > > I am a vr panoramic photographer of four years standing and an associate
                  > > member of the IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photographers
                  > > Association).
                  > >
                  > > Neither myself or the association consider a flat fee per image,
                  > > incorporating responsibility for all costs and expenses, as professional
                  > > conduct.
                  > > Providing images without charge especialy so.
                  > > The association recomends charging per assignmet, specifically taking
                  > > into account costs and expenses.
                  > > Agreement is made through written contract, and rights of the image are
                  > > most always held by the photographer and liscensed to the client by
                  > > writen agreement.
                  > >
                  > > Commercial VR photography is rare in Aotearoa/New Zealand and it is my
                  > > concern that it's growth is undertaken in as professional manner as
                  > > possible.
                  > >
                  > > No reira,
                  > > Regards Michael
                  > >
                  > > Michael Bajko BFA
                  > > The Fine Art Of Photography
                  > > Associate Member IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photography
                  > > Association )
                  > > Waitakere, Auckland
                  > > Aotearoa/ New Zealand
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  > >
                  >
                • benknill
                  Hans, Thank you for your comments. I m not sure what Klaus would say I m sure he s seen worse! We are trying to build a product people will buy. People are
                  Message 8 of 11 , Mar 7 4:54 PM
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                    Hans,

                    Thank you for your comments. I'm not sure what Klaus would say I'm sure he's seen worse!

                    We are trying to build a product people will buy. People are buying it, lots of them and while we know we have not built the perfect user interface as I'm not a developer and have been learning as I go - I have now managed to raise some capital based on what I have achieved and have engaged some pretty serious developers who are building a new interface based on what are customers are asking for.

                    As we generate more custom using our new interface and business model, we will invite other photographers to use it and we will pay them to supply images.

                    Unfortunately, most of the interfaces out there are built by photographers for other photographers and our user testing has shown some glaring weaknesses in a standard pano user interface. We are trying to work towards something that is usable and useful, and while we are not there yet it is something we think we can get to.





                    --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Hans" <hans@...> wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "michaelbajko" <michael@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > Kia Ora everyone'
                    > >
                    > > Below is a job advert appearing on
                    > > http://www.thebigidea.co.nz/work/jobs-opportunities/multimedia/82170-pan\
                    > > oramic-photographer
                    > > <http://www.thebigidea.co.nz/work/jobs-opportunities/multimedia/82170-pa\
                    > > noramic-photographer>
                    > > an arts community site in New Zealand,
                    > > and my response to the advertiser, copied to the arts site and the
                    > > IVRPA.
                    > >
                    > > Cheers Michael
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Beek
                    > http://beek.co/index.html
                    > And an example.
                    >
                    > http://a.beek.co/g.htm?s=boltonhotel_reception&t=1
                    >
                    > I guess this is the worst mistreatment of KRPano I ever seen.
                    >
                    > I guess that if I try to load it on my last computer I will not be able to move it.
                    > Not sure what they done with it.
                    >
                    > Hans
                    >
                    > >
                    > > --------------------------------
                    > >
                    > > Panoramic photographer
                    > > 02 March 2011
                    > > beek.co
                    > > Organisation/person name: Beek
                    > > Work type: Freelance
                    > > Work classification: Photography
                    > > Job description:
                    > >
                    > > Beek is an interactive destination guide that is getting ready to embark
                    > > on a national rollout of our interactive guide product. If you can
                    > > provide spherical panoramic images or virtual tours we want to hear from
                    > > you.
                    > >
                    > > We would like to find photographers out there who can supply
                    > > equirectangular panoramic images. Generally they will need to be high
                    > > dynamic range, full spherical images that usually have people in them,
                    > > showing rooms and spaces in hotels, restaurants, attractions and public
                    > > spaces.
                    > >
                    > > You will need your own quality DSLR, Fisheye lens and tripod with a
                    > > rotator. You will be able to stitch your images in stitching software
                    > > such as ptgui or autopano, and be able to provide processed images at
                    > > 6000x3000 pixels.
                    > >
                    > > You will usually be paid $150 per image, and will be responsible for all
                    > > of your own costs and expenses. You may be asked to provide some images
                    > > without charge to support sales activity.
                    > >
                    > > Please send examples of images to ben@ with your contact details
                    > > and location.
                    > > Opportunity location: New Zealand
                    > > Key skills sought:
                    > > Photography
                    > > image stitching
                    > > photoshop
                    > > This opportunity is: Paid
                    > > Salary low $: 0
                    > > Salary high $: 0
                    > > Closing date: Saturday, 2 April 2011
                    > > Contact details:
                    > > Email ben@ with examples of images.
                    > > Submitted by beek on Wed, 02/03/2011 - 11:33am.
                    > >
                    > > -------------------------------------------
                    > >
                    > > Kia Ora Ben,
                    > >
                    > > I write concerning your job advertisement in 'The Big Idea, Te Aria
                    > > Nui' for a 'Panoramic Photographer'
                    > > I am a vr panoramic photographer of four years standing and an associate
                    > > member of the IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photographers
                    > > Association).
                    > >
                    > > Neither myself or the association consider a flat fee per image,
                    > > incorporating responsibility for all costs and expenses, as professional
                    > > conduct.
                    > > Providing images without charge especialy so.
                    > > The association recomends charging per assignmet, specifically taking
                    > > into account costs and expenses.
                    > > Agreement is made through written contract, and rights of the image are
                    > > most always held by the photographer and liscensed to the client by
                    > > writen agreement.
                    > >
                    > > Commercial VR photography is rare in Aotearoa/New Zealand and it is my
                    > > concern that it's growth is undertaken in as professional manner as
                    > > possible.
                    > >
                    > > No reira,
                    > > Regards Michael
                    > >
                    > > Michael Bajko BFA
                    > > The Fine Art Of Photography
                    > > Associate Member IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photography
                    > > Association )
                    > > Waitakere, Auckland
                    > > Aotearoa/ New Zealand
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    > >
                    >
                  • Michael Bajko BFA - The Fine Art of Photo
                    Kia Ora Ben, I unreservedly apologise for the injudicious use of language and assumptions in my last post. My benchmark for quality is members work from the
                    Message 9 of 11 , Mar 8 9:00 AM
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Kia Ora Ben,
                      I unreservedly apologise for the injudicious use of language and
                      assumptions in my last post.
                      My benchmark for quality is members work from the IVRPA.
                      My intention has been the promotion of, the quality of, VR photography.
                      I concede that my post was unamicable to this, and the work you are doing.
                      I wish you, and your endeavour, well.
                      No reira.
                      Regards Michael

                      Michael Bajko BFA
                      The Fine Art Of Photography
                      Associate Member IVRPA ( International Virtual Reality Photography Association )
                      Waitakere, Auckland
                      Aotearoa/ New Zealand
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