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Hyperfocal setting for Tokina/Pentax 10-17mm fisheye

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  • Roger D. Williams
    I would be grateful if someone who is using this zoom fisheye lens could tell me the hyperfocal setting at F/8 (which I think is the optimum aperture). I will
    Message 1 of 22 , Sep 21, 2010
      I would be grateful if someone who is using this zoom fisheye
      lens could tell me the hyperfocal setting at F/8 (which I think
      is the optimum aperture). I will then tape the focus setting to
      that value. I don't know about the Tokina version, but my
      Pentax version has a focus setting that is all too easily moved,
      and I've just had a blurry result probably due to carelessness
      in handling the lens and/or the wrong hyperfocal setting. I had
      it midway between the 1.5m and 0.7m marks.

      My poor eyesight makes it difficult to tell when things are in
      best focus, and it's difficult with a fisheye anyway. Help!

      Roger W.

      PS I also find it far too easy to move the focal length away
      from the 10mm I prefer to use. <sigh> More tape!

      --
      Business: www.adex-japan.com
      Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger
    • Scott Highton
      Roger, Hyperfocal distance is based on aperture AND focal length, so if you change your focal length (as is done with zoom lenses), so too will your hyperfocal
      Message 2 of 22 , Sep 21, 2010
        Roger,

        Hyperfocal distance is based on aperture AND focal length, so if you
        change your focal length (as is done with zoom lenses), so too will
        your hyperfocal distance change correspondingly.



        The basic formula for hyperfocal distance is:

        Hyperfocal distance = Focal length^2 / (aperture * circle of confusion
        diameter)
        For consistency, let's assume circle of confusion size to be
        1/1000 inch or 0.0254mm.

        So for 10mm:
        Hyperfocal dist. = 10^2 / (8 * .0254)
        = 100 / 0.203
        = 493mm, or 49.3 cm, or about 1.9 feet

        For 17mm:
        Hyperfocal dist. = 17^2 / (8 * .0254)
        = 289 / 0.203
        = 1,424mm, or 142.4 cm, or about 5.6 feet


        There are a number of online hyperfocal distance and depth of field
        calculators available, so you can check any combination you want
        against your own calculations. Just enter "hyperfocal distance
        calculator" in Google.

        Regards,




        Scott Highton
        Author, Virtual Reality Photography
        Web: http://www.vrphotography.com



        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Ricardo TVB
        Here s my suggestion: http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html ... [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        Message 3 of 22 , Sep 21, 2010
          Here's my suggestion: http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html



          Em 21/09/2010 13:49, Scott Highton escreveu:
          >
          > Roger,
          >
          > Hyperfocal distance is based on aperture AND focal length,
          > so if you
          > change your focal length (as is done with zoom lenses), so
          > too will
          > your hyperfocal distance change correspondingly.
          >
          > The basic formula for hyperfocal distance is:
          >
          > Hyperfocal distance = Focal length^2 / (aperture * circle
          > of confusion
          > diameter)
          > For consistency, let's assume circle of confusion size to be
          > 1/1000 inch or 0.0254mm.
          >
          > So for 10mm:
          > Hyperfocal dist. = 10^2 / (8 * .0254)
          > = 100 / 0.203
          > = 493mm, or 49.3 cm, or about 1.9 feet
          >
          > For 17mm:
          > Hyperfocal dist. = 17^2 / (8 * .0254)
          > = 289 / 0.203
          > = 1,424mm, or 142.4 cm, or about 5.6 feet
          >
          > There are a number of online hyperfocal distance and depth
          > of field
          > calculators available, so you can check any combination
          > you want
          > against your own calculations. Just enter "hyperfocal
          > distance
          > calculator" in Google.
          >
          > Regards,
          >
          > Scott Highton
          > Author, Virtual Reality Photography
          > Web: http://www.vrphotography.com
          >
          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          >
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Hans
          ... Most important it is NOT 1.5meters and 0.7Meters It is 1,5 and 0,7 feet. The blue are feet the yellow meter. So no wonder you get blurry images if you
          Message 4 of 22 , Sep 21, 2010
            --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Roger D. Williams" <roger@...> wrote:
            >
            > I would be grateful if someone who is using this zoom fisheye
            > lens could tell me the hyperfocal setting at F/8 (which I think
            > is the optimum aperture). I will then tape the focus setting to
            > that value. I don't know about the Tokina version, but my
            > Pentax version has a focus setting that is all too easily moved,
            > and I've just had a blurry result probably due to carelessness
            > in handling the lens and/or the wrong hyperfocal setting. I had
            > it midway between the 1.5m and 0.7m marks.


            Most important it is NOT 1.5meters and 0.7Meters

            It is 1,5 and 0,7 feet. The blue are feet the yellow meter.
            So no wonder you get blurry images if you used that.
            Forget about using these marks, they are not at all correct.

            You have to do some real live tests.
            Theoretically you should be able to focus at 1m and get focus from 0.5 to infinity at F8.

            But in practice this is very un secure.

            I usually use the autofocus (just use centre focus point) and focus at 2 meters.
            That gives me DOF from 0.6-infinity at F8 and 12mm.

            And with that I can also use F4 and still have from 0.95 to infinity.
            After I taped it at 2m I do some test shots to confirm it.

            Hans





            >
            > My poor eyesight makes it difficult to tell when things are in
            > best focus, and it's difficult with a fisheye anyway. Help!
            >
            > Roger W.
            >
            > PS I also find it far too easy to move the focal length away
            > from the 10mm I prefer to use. <sigh> More tape!
            >
            > --
            > Business: www.adex-japan.com
            > Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger
            >
          • Erik Krause
            ... While this formulas are true for conventional photography they might be not for panoramic work. The reason for the 0.025mm circle of confusion is the
            Message 5 of 22 , Sep 21, 2010
              Am 21.09.2010 18:49, schrieb Scott Highton:
              > Hyperfocal distance = Focal length2 / (aperture * circle of confusion
              > diameter)
              > For consistency, let's assume circle of confusion size to be
              > 1/1000 inch or 0.0254mm.
              >
              > So for 10mm:
              > Hyperfocal dist. = 102 / (8 * .0254)
              > = 100 / 0.203
              > = 493mm, or 49.3 cm, or about 1.9 feet
              >
              > For 17mm:
              > Hyperfocal dist. = 172 / (8 * .0254)
              > = 289 / 0.203
              > = 1,424mm, or 142.4 cm, or about 5.6 feet
              >

              While this formulas are true for conventional photography they might be
              not for panoramic work. The reason for the 0.025mm circle of confusion
              is the average resolution of human sight. Experience shows that bluring
              is perceived as such if the width of the blur exceeds 2 arc minutes.
              Assuming an image is viewed from approximately the image diagonal
              distance most of the time results in the a circle of confusion being
              1/1700 of the image diagonal. This is 0.025 for 35mm film and a full
              frame sensor. It is 0.0175mm for APS-C.

              However, situation for zoomable images like VR-panoramas is different.
              Here the pixel size needs to be the measure, at least if you want to
              zoom in until pixel limit. You need at least two pixels to show a blur,
              hence this needs to be the diameter of the circle of confusion (CoC).
              For more information and a brief list of CoC values (which can be used
              in any DOF calculator or in the above formulas) see
              http://wiki.panotools.org/Depth_of_Field


              --
              Erik Krause
              http://www.erik-krause.de
            • John Houghton
              ... Roger, I go along with the advice that Hans gives. I did my own tests, with 1m as the starting point and ended up with this setting, which works for me:
              Message 6 of 22 , Sep 21, 2010
                --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Hans" <hans@...> wrote:
                > You have to do some real live tests.
                > Theoretically you should be able to focus at 1m and get focus from
                > 0.5 to infinity at F8.

                Roger, I go along with the advice that Hans gives. I did my own tests, with 1m as the starting point and ended up with this setting, which works for me:

                http://www.johnhpanos.com/tok10focus.jpg

                John
              • Roger D. Williams
                ... Thank you, Hans. I realized that soon after I posted my question. It was a silly mistake, as I usually think in meters these days... ... Ah, now THAT is
                Message 7 of 22 , Sep 21, 2010
                  On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 02:52:13 +0900, Hans <hans@...> wrote:

                  >
                  >
                  > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Roger D. Williams" <roger@...>
                  > wrote:
                  >>
                  >> I would be grateful if someone who is using this zoom fisheye
                  >> lens could tell me the hyperfocal setting at F/8 (which I think
                  >> is the optimum aperture). I will then tape the focus setting to
                  >> that value. I don't know about the Tokina version, but my
                  >> Pentax version has a focus setting that is all too easily moved,
                  >> and I've just had a blurry result probably due to carelessness
                  >> in handling the lens and/or the wrong hyperfocal setting. I had
                  >> it midway between the 1.5m and 0.7m marks.
                  >
                  >
                  > Most important it is NOT 1.5meters and 0.7Meters

                  Thank you, Hans. I realized that soon after I posted my question.
                  It was a silly mistake, as I usually think in meters these days...

                  > It is 1,5 and 0,7 feet. The blue are feet the yellow meter.
                  > So no wonder you get blurry images if you used that.
                  > Forget about using these marks, they are not at all correct.

                  Ah, now THAT is news. I really thought I could rely on them.

                  > You have to do some real live tests.
                  > Theoretically you should be able to focus at 1m and get focus from 0.5
                  > to infinity at F8.
                  >
                  > But in practice this is very un secure.
                  >
                  > I usually use the autofocus (just use centre focus point) and focus at
                  > 2 meters.
                  > That gives me DOF from 0.6-infinity at F8 and 12mm.

                  Yes, I have autofocus set to centre point focus. It is pretty stable.

                  > And with that I can also use F4 and still have from 0.95 to infinity.
                  > After I taped it at 2m I do some test shots to confirm it.

                  Hmmm. F/4? Isn't that rather soft overall?


                  Roger W.

                  --
                  Business: www.adex-japan.com
                  Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger
                • Roger D. Williams
                  ... Thank you, Erik. That is a really valuable insight into the special factors affecting panoramas. Roger W. -- Business: www.adex-japan.com Pleasure:
                  Message 8 of 22 , Sep 21, 2010
                    On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 04:18:01 +0900, Erik Krause <erik.krause@...> wrote:

                    > Am 21.09.2010 18:49, schrieb Scott Highton:
                    >> Hyperfocal distance = Focal length2 / (aperture * circle of confusion
                    >> diameter)
                    >> For consistency, let's assume circle of confusion size to be
                    >> 1/1000 inch or 0.0254mm.

                    >
                    > While this formulas are true for conventional photography they might be
                    > not for panoramic work. The reason for the 0.025mm circle of confusion
                    > is the average resolution of human sight. Experience shows that bluring
                    > is perceived as such if the width of the blur exceeds 2 arc minutes.
                    > Assuming an image is viewed from approximately the image diagonal
                    > distance most of the time results in the a circle of confusion being
                    > 1/1700 of the image diagonal. This is 0.025 for 35mm film and a full
                    > frame sensor. It is 0.0175mm for APS-C.
                    >
                    > However, situation for zoomable images like VR-panoramas is different.
                    > Here the pixel size needs to be the measure, at least if you want to
                    > zoom in until pixel limit. You need at least two pixels to show a blur,
                    > hence this needs to be the diameter of the circle of confusion (CoC).
                    > For more information and a brief list of CoC values (which can be used
                    > in any DOF calculator or in the above formulas) see
                    > http://wiki.panotools.org/Depth_of_Field

                    Thank you, Erik. That is a really valuable insight into the special
                    factors affecting panoramas.

                    Roger W.

                    --
                    Business: www.adex-japan.com
                    Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger
                  • Roger D. Williams
                    On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 02:25:49 +0900, Ricardo TVB ... Thank you, Ricardo. That certainly seems to be a comprehensive and useful DOF calculator, although again I
                    Message 9 of 22 , Sep 21, 2010
                      On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 02:25:49 +0900, Ricardo TVB
                      <ricardo.araujo@...> wrote:

                      > Here's my suggestion: http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html

                      >> There are a number of online hyperfocal distance and depth
                      >> of field
                      >> calculators available, so you can check any combination
                      >> you want
                      >> against your own calculations. Just enter "hyperfocal
                      >> distance
                      >> calculator" in Google.

                      Thank you, Ricardo. That certainly seems to be a comprehensive
                      and useful DOF calculator, although again I am left wondering
                      about how to select the right circle of confusion. But Erik has
                      provided some useful information there. I think I have all I
                      need to go on...

                      Roger W.

                      --
                      Business: www.adex-japan.com
                      Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger
                    • Roger D. Williams
                      On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 04:32:59 +0900, John Houghton ... Thanks, John. An ounce of hands-on experience is worth a ton of theory. But I note that the focus scale
                      Message 10 of 22 , Sep 21, 2010
                        On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 04:32:59 +0900, John Houghton
                        <j.houghton@...> wrote:

                        > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Hans" <hans@...> wrote:
                        >> You have to do some real live tests.
                        >> Theoretically you should be able to focus at 1m and get focus from
                        >> 0.5 to infinity at F8.
                        >
                        > Roger, I go along with the advice that Hans gives. I did my own tests,
                        > with 1m as the starting point and ended up with this setting, which
                        > works for me:
                        >
                        > http://www.johnhpanos.com/tok10focus.jpg

                        Thanks, John. An ounce of hands-on experience is worth a ton of theory.
                        But I note that the focus scale is completely different on the Tokina
                        version of this lens, so it is hard for me to use the same setting. At
                        least I can follow the same procedure...

                        Roger W.

                        --
                        Business: www.adex-japan.com
                        Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger
                      • Hans
                        ... No not really. For example allmost all the panos from last Photokina you can see here are at F3.5-4.5 http://www.panoramas.dk/photokina/index.html The
                        Message 11 of 22 , Sep 22, 2010
                          --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Roger D. Williams" <roger@...> wrote:

                          >
                          >
                          > > And with that I can also use F4 and still have from 0.95 to infinity.
                          > > After I taped it at 2m I do some test shots to confirm it.
                          >
                          > Hmmm. F/4? Isn't that rather soft overall?

                          No not really.
                          For example allmost all the panos from last Photokina you can see here are at F3.5-4.5
                          http://www.panoramas.dk/photokina/index.html

                          The entrance and the Lomo pano are 5.6

                          Hans
                        • Roger D. Williams
                          ... Wow, Hans! As you say, not really rather soft. I think I will send my 10-17mm zoom back to Pentax for a checkup. I am not getting this degree of
                          Message 12 of 22 , Sep 22, 2010
                            On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 17:27:19 +0900, Hans <hans@...> wrote:

                            >
                            >
                            > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Roger D. Williams" <roger@...>
                            > wrote:
                            >
                            >>
                            >>
                            >> > And with that I can also use F4 and still have from 0.95 to infinity.
                            >> > After I taped it at 2m I do some test shots to confirm it.
                            >>
                            >> Hmmm. F/4? Isn't that rather soft overall?
                            >
                            > No not really.
                            > For example allmost all the panos from last Photokina you can see here
                            > are at F3.5-4.5
                            > http://www.panoramas.dk/photokina/index.html
                            >
                            > The entrance and the Lomo pano are 5.6

                            Wow, Hans! As you say, not really "rather soft." I think I will send my
                            10-17mm zoom back to Pentax for a checkup. I am not getting this degree
                            of sharpness with my lense despite very careful and (by my own standards)
                            expert sharpening.

                            I like its colour rendering and the overall image "quality" but I need
                            to use F/8 to get sharpness comparable to yours. And even then it tends
                            to vary noticeably at different zoom ratios. It is quite clearly inferior
                            at full aperture. I do hope they won't say "It's up to spec" and are able
                            to do something about it.

                            Roger W.

                            --
                            Business: www.adex-japan.com
                            Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger
                          • Hans
                            ... You should get much sharper than me. The Photokina panos are with the 5D 12mp at 10mm shaved which just gives me 6800x3400. You should get around 11500
                            Message 13 of 22 , Sep 22, 2010
                              --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Roger D. Williams" <roger@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 17:27:19 +0900, Hans <hans@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Roger D. Williams" <roger@>
                              > > wrote:
                              > >
                              > >>
                              > >>
                              > >> > And with that I can also use F4 and still have from 0.95 to infinity.
                              > >> > After I taped it at 2m I do some test shots to confirm it.
                              > >>
                              > >> Hmmm. F/4? Isn't that rather soft overall?
                              > >
                              > > No not really.
                              > > For example allmost all the panos from last Photokina you can see here
                              > > are at F3.5-4.5
                              > > http://www.panoramas.dk/photokina/index.html
                              > >
                              > > The entrance and the Lomo pano are 5.6
                              >
                              > Wow, Hans! As you say, not really "rather soft." I think I will send my
                              > 10-17mm zoom back to Pentax for a checkup. I am not getting this degree
                              > of sharpness with my lense despite very careful and (by my own standards)
                              > expert sharpening.
                              >
                              > I like its colour rendering and the overall image "quality" but I need
                              > to use F/8 to get sharpness comparable to yours. And even then it tends
                              > to vary noticeably at different zoom ratios. It is quite clearly inferior
                              > at full aperture. I do hope they won't say "It's up to spec" and are able
                              > to do something about it.


                              You should get much sharper than me. The Photokina panos are with the 5D 12mp at 10mm shaved which just gives me 6800x3400. You should get around 11500 pixels at 10mm.

                              Hans
                            • Roger D. Williams
                              ... Yes, the pixel dimensions I can get are exactly as you say. But the images are not sharp enough to take advantage of this. It does seem that I was shooting
                              Message 14 of 22 , Sep 22, 2010
                                On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 19:28:01 +0900, Hans <hans@...> wrote:

                                > You should get much sharper than me. The Photokina panos are with the 5D
                                > 12mp at 10mm shaved which just gives me 6800x3400. You should get around
                                > 11500 pixels at 10mm.

                                Yes, the pixel dimensions I can get are exactly as you say. But the images
                                are not sharp enough to take advantage of this. It does seem that I was
                                shooting nowhere near the hyperfocal setting, so I am taking further shots
                                and will see if quality improves. The dreadful summer-long heatwave here
                                in Japan (71 days of temperatures in the 30s) has continued after the
                                briefest of respites and I have not been getting out and about enough to
                                really thoroughly test this lens. It was 33C in Tokyo yesterday, with very
                                high humidity--unprecedented this far into September.

                                Roger W.

                                --
                                Business: www.adex-japan.com
                                Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger
                              • Ken Warner
                                Yesterday it was 113F in Los Angeles -- the highest temp ever. That s 45C for all you foreigners :-)
                                Message 15 of 22 , Sep 30, 2010
                                  Yesterday it was 113F in Los Angeles -- the highest temp ever.
                                  That's 45C for all you foreigners :-)

                                  Roger D. Williams wrote:
                                  > On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 19:28:01 +0900, Hans <hans@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  >> You should get much sharper than me. The Photokina panos are with the 5D
                                  >> 12mp at 10mm shaved which just gives me 6800x3400. You should get around
                                  >> 11500 pixels at 10mm.
                                  >
                                  > Yes, the pixel dimensions I can get are exactly as you say. But the images
                                  > are not sharp enough to take advantage of this. It does seem that I was
                                  > shooting nowhere near the hyperfocal setting, so I am taking further shots
                                  > and will see if quality improves. The dreadful summer-long heatwave here
                                  > in Japan (71 days of temperatures in the 30s) has continued after the
                                  > briefest of respites and I have not been getting out and about enough to
                                  > really thoroughly test this lens. It was 33C in Tokyo yesterday, with very
                                  > high humidity--unprecedented this far into September.
                                  >
                                  > Roger W.
                                  >
                                • Roger D. Williams
                                  On Fri, 01 Oct 2010 08:50:52 +0900, Ken Warner ... Yes, but in Tokyo it s not the heat, it s the humanity. Roger W. -- Business:
                                  Message 16 of 22 , Sep 30, 2010
                                    On Fri, 01 Oct 2010 08:50:52 +0900, Ken Warner <kwarner000@...>
                                    wrote:

                                    > Yesterday it was 113F in Los Angeles -- the highest temp ever.
                                    > That's 45C for all you foreigners :-)

                                    Yes, but in Tokyo it's not the heat, it's the humanity.

                                    Roger W.

                                    --
                                    Business: www.adex-japan.com
                                    Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger
                                  • Erik Krause
                                    ... Humanity or humidity? ;-) -- Erik Krause http://www.erik-krause.de
                                    Message 17 of 22 , Oct 1, 2010
                                      Am 01.10.2010 05:13, schrieb Roger D. Williams:

                                      > Yes, but in Tokyo it's not the heat, it's the humanity.

                                      Humanity or humidity? ;-)

                                      --
                                      Erik Krause
                                      http://www.erik-krause.de
                                    • ptgroup
                                      Roger, I find the ATX stupid to focus. Setting to 0.5m should be the best at F 16. See at: http://www.netzserver2.de/ptgroup/atx107dof.jpg But hard to find
                                      Message 18 of 22 , Oct 1, 2010
                                        Roger,
                                        I find the ATX stupid to focus.
                                        Setting to 0.5m should be the best at F 16.
                                        See at:
                                        http://www.netzserver2.de/ptgroup/atx107dof.jpg

                                        But hard to find 0.5m - I set at the first 0 of 00 and it works fine @12mm
                                        and F13-16.
                                        Although AF sets it just in the middle of 00.
                                        I really don´t know if the above posted table is correct or not.
                                        (Due to production varioation or whatever.)

                                        Ciao
                                        Mike

                                        ----------------------------
                                        ----------------------------
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                                        -----------------------------
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                                        -----Ursprungliche Nachricht-----
                                        Von: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]Im
                                        Auftrag von Erik Krause
                                        Gesendet: Freitag, 1. Oktober 2010 16:33
                                        An: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                                        Betreff: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Hyperfocal setting for Tokina/Pentax 10-17mm
                                        fisheye



                                        Am 01.10.2010 05:13, schrieb Roger D. Williams:

                                        > Yes, but in Tokyo it's not the heat, it's the humanity.

                                        Humanity or humidity? ;-)

                                        --
                                        Erik Krause
                                        http://www.erik-krause.de





                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      • Ken Warner
                                        I didn t get that the first time I read it. That s pretty funny Roger! Good one!
                                        Message 19 of 22 , Oct 1, 2010
                                          I didn't get that the first time I read it.

                                          That's pretty funny Roger! Good one!

                                          Erik Krause wrote:
                                          > Am 01.10.2010 05:13, schrieb Roger D. Williams:
                                          >
                                          >> Yes, but in Tokyo it's not the heat, it's the humanity.
                                          >
                                          > Humanity or humidity? ;-)
                                          >
                                        • Roger D. Williams
                                          Thanks for the link, Mike. The focusing scale on the Pentax version of this lens is long and easy to read. Contrasts favourably with the Tokina version, which
                                          Message 20 of 22 , Oct 1, 2010
                                            Thanks for the link, Mike.

                                            The focusing scale on the Pentax version of this lens is long
                                            and easy to read. Contrasts favourably with the Tokina version,
                                            which appears to have a silly little window rather than a long,
                                            fully calibrated (or at least fully marked) scale.

                                            But unfortunately the live view function on the K-x screen has no
                                            zoom function, so I can't use it to check focus. What a pain! I
                                            couldn't BELIEVE it at first, and hunted carefully through all
                                            the menus and submenus, but couldn't find anything.

                                            It's not a disaster, though, as there is a very good 16.8:1
                                            zoom function available on screen for reviewing shots in memory.

                                            I'm wondering whether my lens should go back for a check, as the
                                            images generally tend to be on the soft side... but perhaps
                                            that's because I am doing all my checking at F/3.5.

                                            Actually I wouldn't care to use F/16 at 10mm as that certainly
                                            would be soft due to diffraction...

                                            Roger W.

                                            On Fri, 01 Oct 2010 23:55:57 +0900, ptgroup <ptgroup@...> wrote:

                                            > Roger,
                                            > I find the ATX stupid to focus.
                                            > Setting to 0.5m should be the best at F 16.
                                            > See at:
                                            > http://www.netzserver2.de/ptgroup/atx107dof.jpg
                                            >
                                            > But hard to find 0.5m - I set at the first 0 of 00 and it works fine
                                            > @12mm
                                            > and F13-16.
                                            > Although AF sets it just in the middle of 00.
                                            > I really don´t know if the above posted table is correct or not.
                                            > (Due to production varioation or whatever.)
                                            >
                                            > Ciao
                                            > Mike
                                            >
                                            > ----------------------------
                                            > ----------------------------
                                            > 360° VR Fotografie:
                                            > http://www.360de.de
                                            >
                                            > NEU: Abstrakte Fotografie unter:
                                            > http://www.abstraktfoto.de
                                            > -----------------------------
                                            > Aktuelles vom Virtugrafen:
                                            > http://virtugraf.wordpress.com
                                            > -----Ursprungliche Nachricht-----
                                            > Von: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]Im
                                            > Auftrag von Erik Krause
                                            > Gesendet: Freitag, 1. Oktober 2010 16:33
                                            > An: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                                            > Betreff: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Hyperfocal setting for Tokina/Pentax 10-17mm
                                            > fisheye
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > Am 01.10.2010 05:13, schrieb Roger D. Williams:
                                            >
                                            > > Yes, but in Tokyo it's not the heat, it's the humanity.
                                            >
                                            > Humanity or humidity? ;-)
                                            >
                                            > --
                                            > Erik Krause
                                            > http://www.erik-krause.de
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > ------------------------------------
                                            >


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                                            Business: www.adex-japan.com
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                                          • ptgroup
                                            Roger, Flemming Larsen did some really meaningful test which you can find here: http://www.fvlmedia.dk/tokina107/dof.htm Yes, the focus scale of the atx is a
                                            Message 21 of 22 , Oct 3, 2010
                                              Roger,
                                              Flemming Larsen did some really meaningful test which you can find here:

                                              http://www.fvlmedia.dk/tokina107/dof.htm


                                              Yes, the focus scale of the atx is a joke, but I taped it as I said at the
                                              first 0 of 00 and
                                              all came out good @ F11-F16.
                                              At least as far as I could judge them, which could be insufficiant.

                                              Ciao
                                              Mike

                                              ----------------------------
                                              ----------------------------
                                              360° VR Fotografie:
                                              http://www.360de.de

                                              NEU: Abstrakte Fotografie unter:
                                              http://www.abstraktfoto.de
                                              -----------------------------
                                              Aktuelles vom Virtugrafen:
                                              http://virtugraf.wordpress.com
                                              -----Ursprungliche Nachricht-----
                                              Von: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]Im
                                              Auftrag von Roger D. Williams
                                              Gesendet: Samstag, 2. Oktober 2010 02:43
                                              An: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                                              Betreff: Re: AW: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Hyperfocal setting for Tokina/Pentax
                                              10-17mm fisheye



                                              Thanks for the link, Mike.

                                              The focusing scale on the Pentax version of this lens is long
                                              and easy to read. Contrasts favourably with the Tokina version,
                                              which appears to have a silly little window rather than a long,
                                              fully calibrated (or at least fully marked) scale.

                                              But unfortunately the live view function on the K-x screen has no
                                              zoom function, so I can't use it to check focus. What a pain! I
                                              couldn't BELIEVE it at first, and hunted carefully through all
                                              the menus and submenus, but couldn't find anything.

                                              It's not a disaster, though, as there is a very good 16.8:1
                                              zoom function available on screen for reviewing shots in memory.

                                              I'm wondering whether my lens should go back for a check, as the
                                              images generally tend to be on the soft side... but perhaps
                                              that's because I am doing all my checking at F/3.5.

                                              Actually I wouldn't care to use F/16 at 10mm as that certainly
                                              would be soft due to diffraction...

                                              Roger W.

                                              On Fri, 01 Oct 2010 23:55:57 +0900, ptgroup <ptgroup@...> wrote:

                                              > Roger,
                                              > I find the ATX stupid to focus.
                                              > Setting to 0.5m should be the best at F 16.
                                              > See at:
                                              > http://www.netzserver2.de/ptgroup/atx107dof.jpg
                                              >
                                              > But hard to find 0.5m - I set at the first 0 of 00 and it works fine
                                              > @12mm
                                              > and F13-16.
                                              > Although AF sets it just in the middle of 00.
                                              > I really don´t know if the above posted table is correct or not.
                                              > (Due to production varioation or whatever.)
                                              >
                                              > Ciao
                                              > Mike
                                              >
                                              > ----------------------------
                                              > ----------------------------
                                              > 360° VR Fotografie:
                                              > http://www.360de.de
                                              >
                                              > NEU: Abstrakte Fotografie unter:
                                              > http://www.abstraktfoto.de
                                              > -----------------------------
                                              > Aktuelles vom Virtugrafen:
                                              > http://virtugraf.wordpress.com
                                              > -----Ursprungliche Nachricht-----
                                              > Von: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]Im
                                              > Auftrag von Erik Krause
                                              > Gesendet: Freitag, 1. Oktober 2010 16:33
                                              > An: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                                              > Betreff: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Hyperfocal setting for Tokina/Pentax 10-17mm
                                              > fisheye
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > Am 01.10.2010 05:13, schrieb Roger D. Williams:
                                              >
                                              > > Yes, but in Tokyo it's not the heat, it's the humanity.
                                              >
                                              > Humanity or humidity? ;-)
                                              >
                                              > --
                                              > Erik Krause
                                              > http://www.erik-krause.de
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > ------------------------------------
                                              >

                                              --
                                              Business: www.adex-japan.com
                                              Pleasure: www.usefilm.com/member/roger





                                              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                            • Roger D. Williams
                                              Thanks again, Mike. ... Yes, these are the best kind of tests. Actual photographs in something like normal use. Very informative. ... Two comments on that.
                                              Message 22 of 22 , Oct 3, 2010
                                                Thanks again, Mike.

                                                On Mon, 04 Oct 2010 00:56:42 +0900, ptgroup <ptgroup@...> wrote:

                                                > Roger,
                                                > Flemming Larsen did some really meaningful test which you can find here:
                                                >
                                                > http://www.fvlmedia.dk/tokina107/dof.htm

                                                Yes, these are the best kind of tests. Actual photographs in something
                                                like normal use. Very informative.

                                                > Yes, the focus scale of the atx is a joke, but I taped it as I said at
                                                > the first 0 of 00 and all came out good @ F11-F16.

                                                Two comments on that. First, I was surprised to see how comparatively
                                                little softening of the image there was at F/16 and even F/22 (although
                                                it is obvious, it is not excessive). Second, the Pentax focus scale is
                                                so different that "the first 0 or 00" doesn't mean anything.

                                                My problem is that the optimum seems to be at 1.5m or 2.0m, both of
                                                which come between the infinity mark and the 0.5m mark, so my nice long
                                                Pentax focusing scale is no help at all! At the moment I cam getting
                                                satisfactory results at F/11 with the setting midway between the 0.5m
                                                mark and the infinity mark.

                                                > At least as far as I could judge them, which could be insufficiant.

                                                It is your judgment that matters. If it's too close to call, it's good
                                                enough!

                                                Roger W.

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                                                Business: www.adex-japan.com
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