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Re: [PanoToolsNG] flash on ipad

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  • Matthew Rogers
    I don t know a single function my iPad can t perform because it lacks Flash. Can I watch videos ? YES, can I view VRs ? YES. If you re too lazy to convert or
    Message 1 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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      I don't know a single function my iPad can't perform because it lacks Flash. Can I watch videos ? YES, can I view VRs ? YES. If you're too lazy to convert or create content for the iPad that's your problem, not mine and certainly not Apples.

      The only website I've visited on the ipad that I've not been able to view is Nike.com and I simply went to Adidas and bought my shoes there. No biggy really. Also means I'm switching from Nike+ to Suunto Movescount. So by using Flash, Nike has lost a customer and I know I'm not the only one.

      Matt

      On 8 Jul 2010, at 11:15, Trausti Hraunfjord wrote:

      > I would rather say that the iPad is a useless device because it "can not"
      > use Flash, while technically - it can... as long as Jobs doesn't get in the
      > way.
      >
      > Buying iPad, is like buying a DSLR camera that can only take jpg images...
      > because the CEO of the camera company doesn't like the fact that RAW images
      > drain the batteries too fast... and as an added bonus, the live view is also
      > disabled, because ... yups, it uses too much battery power as well.
      >
      > Unless it was Apple making such cameras, I don't really think any pro
      > photographer would buy one.
      >
      > :)
      >
      > Trausti
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 4:35 AM, Jeffrey Martin | 360Cities.net <
      > 360cities@...> wrote:
      >
      >>
      >>
      >> here trausti,
      >>
      >> you can play with flash on the ipad and see how useless it really is on
      >> such
      >> a device ;-)
      >>
      >>
      >> http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/07/how-to-install-flash-on-your-jailbroken-ipad-for-real/
      >>
      >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >
      > ------------------------------------
      >
      > --
      >
      >
      >
    • Tom Sparks
      ... its only a matter of time before somebody breaks the system (be it a iDevice), my feeling is that some of these CEO/marketing don t get what the user
      Message 2 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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        --- On Thu, 8/7/10, Trausti Hraunfjord <trausti.hraunfjord@...> wrote:

        > From: Trausti Hraunfjord <trausti.hraunfjord@...>
        > Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] flash on ipad
        > To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
        > Received: Thursday, 8 July, 2010, 8:15 PM
        > I would rather say that the iPad is a
        > useless device because it "can not"
        > use Flash, while technically - it can... as long as Jobs
        > doesn't get in the
        > way.
        >
        > Buying iPad, is like buying a DSLR camera that can only
        > take jpg images...
        > because the CEO of the camera company doesn't like the fact
        > that RAW images
        > drain the batteries too fast... and as an added bonus, the
        > live view is also
        > disabled, because ... yups, it uses too much battery power
        > as well.
        >
        > Unless it was Apple making such cameras, I don't really
        > think any pro
        > photographer would buy one.
        >
        > :)
        its only a matter of time before somebody breaks the system (be it a iDevice), my feeling is that some of these CEO/marketing don't get what the user wants.
        for example the iPad should be looked at like a computer not a device like an oven

        tom
      • Trausti Hraunfjord
        Matthew. You can not watch MILLIONS of websites that use Flash only, and which do not provide support for the iSnob devices. So don t try to brush this off
        Message 3 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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          Matthew. You can not watch MILLIONS of websites that use Flash only, and
          which do not provide support for the iSnob devices. So don't try to brush
          this off as if it's only a minor issue bound to a couple or so sites.

          I could direct you to thousands of sites if I had the time to waste on such
          things. It is your choice to have a device that is handicapped by the
          DECISION of one man, and that was not your decision. There is no doubt at
          all, that if your Steve hadn't woke up in an anti-flash mood one morning,
          you would be overly happy to have flash support on your iPad. But since you
          are a loyal Apple user, you follow their line without flinching, pretending
          that all is good.

          You would probably be the proud first owner of a Apple made DSLR camera that
          can't shoot in RAW because of battery consumption issues.... and your
          argument would be: There is nothing you can take a picture of, that I can't
          too!

          :)

          What the heck... one day Apple will have to wake up to reality and stop
          putting up road blocks. In a way it is GOOD that they excluded Flash... it
          is bound to result in a very much needed focus on streamlining the Flash
          code and make it better for both computers and telephones. I should
          actually thank Steve for that... when the improvements have happened.

          Trausti



          On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:38 AM, Matthew Rogers <matthew@...>wrote:

          >
          >
          > I don't know a single function my iPad can't perform because it lacks
          > Flash. Can I watch videos ? YES, can I view VRs ? YES. If you're too lazy to
          > convert or create content for the iPad that's your problem, not mine and
          > certainly not Apples.
          >
          > The only website I've visited on the ipad that I've not been able to view
          > is Nike.com and I simply went to Adidas and bought my shoes there. No biggy
          > really. Also means I'm switching from Nike+ to Suunto Movescount. So by
          > using Flash, Nike has lost a customer and I know I'm not the only one.
          >
          > Matt
          >
          >
          > On 8 Jul 2010, at 11:15, Trausti Hraunfjord wrote:
          >
          > > I would rather say that the iPad is a useless device because it "can not"
          > > use Flash, while technically - it can... as long as Jobs doesn't get in
          > the
          > > way.
          > >
          > > Buying iPad, is like buying a DSLR camera that can only take jpg
          > images...
          > > because the CEO of the camera company doesn't like the fact that RAW
          > images
          > > drain the batteries too fast... and as an added bonus, the live view is
          > also
          > > disabled, because ... yups, it uses too much battery power as well.
          > >
          > > Unless it was Apple making such cameras, I don't really think any pro
          > > photographer would buy one.
          > >
          > > :)
          > >
          > > Trausti
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 4:35 AM, Jeffrey Martin | 360Cities.net <
          > > 360cities@... <360cities%40gmail.com>> wrote:
          > >
          > >>
          > >>
          > >> here trausti,
          > >>
          > >> you can play with flash on the ipad and see how useless it really is on
          > >> such
          > >> a device ;-)
          > >>
          > >>
          > >>
          > http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/07/how-to-install-flash-on-your-jailbroken-ipad-for-real/
          > >>
          > >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          > >>
          > >>
          > >>
          > >
          > >
          > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > ------------------------------------
          > >
          > > --
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >
          >
          >


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Matthew Rogers
          ... That s not what I m saying. In the time I ve had my iPad I ve not been restricted from viewing any content that I d normally view. Even on my MacPro I very
          Message 4 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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            On 8 Jul 2010, at 12:03, Trausti Hraunfjord wrote:

            > Matthew. You can not watch MILLIONS of websites that use Flash only, and
            > which do not provide support for the iSnob devices. So don't try to brush
            > this off as if it's only a minor issue bound to a couple or so sites.

            That's not what I'm saying. In the time I've had my iPad I've not been restricted from viewing any content that I'd normally view. Even on my MacPro I very rarely come across sites that are purely flash based or don't offer other better options.

            Strange that I rarely come across any of these Flash only sites. The Flash only sites that I do visit very rarely do anything that you can't do just as easily without Flash.

            >
            > I could direct you to thousands of sites if I had the time to waste on such
            > things. It is your choice to have a device that is handicapped by the
            > DECISION of one man, and that was not your decision. There is no doubt at
            > all, that if your Steve hadn't woke up in an anti-flash mood one morning,
            > you would be overly happy to have flash support on your iPad. But since you
            > are a loyal Apple user, you follow their line without flinching, pretending
            > that all is good.
            >
            >
            > On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:38 AM, Matthew Rogers <matthew@...>wrote:
            >
            >>
            >>
            >> I don't know a single function my iPad can't perform because it lacks
            >> Flash. Can I watch videos ? YES, can I view VRs ? YES. If you're too lazy to
            >> convert or create content for the iPad that's your problem, not mine and
            >> certainly not Apples.
            >>
            >> The only website I've visited on the ipad that I've not been able to view
            >> is Nike.com and I simply went to Adidas and bought my shoes there. No biggy
            >> really. Also means I'm switching from Nike+ to Suunto Movescount. So by
            >> using Flash, Nike has lost a customer and I know I'm not the only one.
            >>
            >> Matt
            >>
            >>
            >> On 8 Jul 2010, at 11:15, Trausti Hraunfjord wrote:
            >>
            >>> I would rather say that the iPad is a useless device because it "can not"
            >>> use Flash, while technically - it can... as long as Jobs doesn't get in
            >> the
            >>> way.
            >>>
            >>> Buying iPad, is like buying a DSLR camera that can only take jpg
            >> images...
            >>> because the CEO of the camera company doesn't like the fact that RAW
            >> images
            >>> drain the batteries too fast... and as an added bonus, the live view is
            >> also
            >>> disabled, because ... yups, it uses too much battery power as well.
            >>>
            >>> Unless it was Apple making such cameras, I don't really think any pro
            >>> photographer would buy one.
            >>>
            >>> :)
            >>>
            >>> Trausti
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>> On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 4:35 AM, Jeffrey Martin | 360Cities.net <
            >>> 360cities@... <360cities%40gmail.com>> wrote:
            >>>
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>>> here trausti,
            >>>>
            >>>> you can play with flash on the ipad and see how useless it really is on
            >>>> such
            >>>> a device ;-)
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >> http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/07/how-to-install-flash-on-your-jailbroken-ipad-for-real/
            >>>>
            >>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>> ------------------------------------
            >>>
            >>> --
            >>>
            >>>
            >>>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > --
            >
            >
            >
          • Trausti Hraunfjord
            As always, it comes down to the needs of the individual. If you don t need to watch anything Flashy, then iPad is going to be a great device for you. But if
            Message 5 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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              As always, it comes down to the needs of the individual. If you don't need
              to watch anything Flashy, then iPad is going to be a great device for you.
              But if it was me having such a device, I would consider it to be a waste of
              money, since I use and view flash based content a lot.... and there are
              hundreds of millions of other people who use Flash every day, and for those
              people, anything BUT iPad will be considered useful.

              As long as it does what you need it to do, then it's fine.

              As long as it doesn't do what I would like it to, it's not going to be mine.

              Trausti

              On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 6:45 AM, Matthew Rogers <matthew@...>wrote:

              >
              >
              >
              > On 8 Jul 2010, at 12:03, Trausti Hraunfjord wrote:
              >
              > > Matthew. You can not watch MILLIONS of websites that use Flash only, and
              > > which do not provide support for the iSnob devices. So don't try to brush
              > > this off as if it's only a minor issue bound to a couple or so sites.
              >
              > That's not what I'm saying. In the time I've had my iPad I've not been
              > restricted from viewing any content that I'd normally view. Even on my
              > MacPro I very rarely come across sites that are purely flash based or don't
              > offer other better options.
              >
              > Strange that I rarely come across any of these Flash only sites. The Flash
              > only sites that I do visit very rarely do anything that you can't do just as
              > easily without Flash.
              >
              >
              > >
              > > I could direct you to thousands of sites if I had the time to waste on
              > such
              > > things. It is your choice to have a device that is handicapped by the
              > > DECISION of one man, and that was not your decision. There is no doubt at
              > > all, that if your Steve hadn't woke up in an anti-flash mood one morning,
              > > you would be overly happy to have flash support on your iPad. But since
              > you
              > > are a loyal Apple user, you follow their line without flinching,
              > pretending
              > > that all is good.
              > >
              > >
              > > On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:38 AM, Matthew Rogers <matthew@...<matthew%40360precision.com>
              > >wrote:
              > >
              > >>
              > >>
              > >> I don't know a single function my iPad can't perform because it lacks
              > >> Flash. Can I watch videos ? YES, can I view VRs ? YES. If you're too
              > lazy to
              > >> convert or create content for the iPad that's your problem, not mine and
              > >> certainly not Apples.
              > >>
              > >> The only website I've visited on the ipad that I've not been able to
              > view
              > >> is Nike.com and I simply went to Adidas and bought my shoes there. No
              > biggy
              > >> really. Also means I'm switching from Nike+ to Suunto Movescount. So by
              > >> using Flash, Nike has lost a customer and I know I'm not the only one.
              > >>
              > >> Matt
              > >>
              > >>
              > >> On 8 Jul 2010, at 11:15, Trausti Hraunfjord wrote:
              > >>
              > >>> I would rather say that the iPad is a useless device because it "can
              > not"
              > >>> use Flash, while technically - it can... as long as Jobs doesn't get in
              > >> the
              > >>> way.
              > >>>
              > >>> Buying iPad, is like buying a DSLR camera that can only take jpg
              > >> images...
              > >>> because the CEO of the camera company doesn't like the fact that RAW
              > >> images
              > >>> drain the batteries too fast... and as an added bonus, the live view is
              > >> also
              > >>> disabled, because ... yups, it uses too much battery power as well.
              > >>>
              > >>> Unless it was Apple making such cameras, I don't really think any pro
              > >>> photographer would buy one.
              > >>>
              > >>> :)
              > >>>
              > >>> Trausti
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>> On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 4:35 AM, Jeffrey Martin | 360Cities.net <
              > >>> 360cities@... <360cities%40gmail.com> <360cities%40gmail.com>>
              > wrote:
              > >>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>> here trausti,
              > >>>>
              > >>>> you can play with flash on the ipad and see how useless it really is
              > on
              > >>>> such
              > >>>> a device ;-)
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>
              > http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/07/how-to-install-flash-on-your-jailbroken-ipad-for-real/
              > >>>>
              > >>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>>
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>> ------------------------------------
              > >>>
              > >>> --
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >>
              > >
              > >
              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > ------------------------------------
              > >
              > > --
              > >
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
              >


              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Matthew Rogers
              OK, apart from your own product, give me five examples of sites that you use that require Flash. Matt
              Message 6 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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                OK, apart from your own product, give me five examples of sites that you use that require Flash.

                Matt

                On 8 Jul 2010, at 13:21, Trausti Hraunfjord wrote:

                > As always, it comes down to the needs of the individual. If you don't need
                > to watch anything Flashy, then iPad is going to be a great device for you.
                > But if it was me having such a device, I would consider it to be a waste of
                > money, since I use and view flash based content a lot.... and there are
                > hundreds of millions of other people who use Flash every day, and for those
                > people, anything BUT iPad will be considered useful.
                >
                > As long as it does what you need it to do, then it's fine.
                >
                > As long as it doesn't do what I would like it to, it's not going to be mine.
                >
                > Trausti
                >
                > On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 6:45 AM, Matthew Rogers <matthew@...>wrote:
                >
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >> On 8 Jul 2010, at 12:03, Trausti Hraunfjord wrote:
                >>
                >>> Matthew. You can not watch MILLIONS of websites that use Flash only, and
                >>> which do not provide support for the iSnob devices. So don't try to brush
                >>> this off as if it's only a minor issue bound to a couple or so sites.
                >>
                >> That's not what I'm saying. In the time I've had my iPad I've not been
                >> restricted from viewing any content that I'd normally view. Even on my
                >> MacPro I very rarely come across sites that are purely flash based or don't
                >> offer other better options.
                >>
                >> Strange that I rarely come across any of these Flash only sites. The Flash
                >> only sites that I do visit very rarely do anything that you can't do just as
                >> easily without Flash.
                >>
                >>
                >>>
                >>> I could direct you to thousands of sites if I had the time to waste on
                >> such
                >>> things. It is your choice to have a device that is handicapped by the
                >>> DECISION of one man, and that was not your decision. There is no doubt at
                >>> all, that if your Steve hadn't woke up in an anti-flash mood one morning,
                >>> you would be overly happy to have flash support on your iPad. But since
                >> you
                >>> are a loyal Apple user, you follow their line without flinching,
                >> pretending
                >>> that all is good.
                >>>
                >>>
                >>> On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 5:38 AM, Matthew Rogers <matthew@...<matthew%40360precision.com>
                >>> wrote:
                >>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>> I don't know a single function my iPad can't perform because it lacks
                >>>> Flash. Can I watch videos ? YES, can I view VRs ? YES. If you're too
                >> lazy to
                >>>> convert or create content for the iPad that's your problem, not mine and
                >>>> certainly not Apples.
                >>>>
                >>>> The only website I've visited on the ipad that I've not been able to
                >> view
                >>>> is Nike.com and I simply went to Adidas and bought my shoes there. No
                >> biggy
                >>>> really. Also means I'm switching from Nike+ to Suunto Movescount. So by
                >>>> using Flash, Nike has lost a customer and I know I'm not the only one.
                >>>>
                >>>> Matt
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>> On 8 Jul 2010, at 11:15, Trausti Hraunfjord wrote:
                >>>>
                >>>>> I would rather say that the iPad is a useless device because it "can
                >> not"
                >>>>> use Flash, while technically - it can... as long as Jobs doesn't get in
                >>>> the
                >>>>> way.
                >>>>>
                >>>>> Buying iPad, is like buying a DSLR camera that can only take jpg
                >>>> images...
                >>>>> because the CEO of the camera company doesn't like the fact that RAW
                >>>> images
                >>>>> drain the batteries too fast... and as an added bonus, the live view is
                >>>> also
                >>>>> disabled, because ... yups, it uses too much battery power as well.
                >>>>>
                >>>>> Unless it was Apple making such cameras, I don't really think any pro
                >>>>> photographer would buy one.
                >>>>>
                >>>>> :)
                >>>>>
                >>>>> Trausti
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>> On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 4:35 AM, Jeffrey Martin | 360Cities.net <
                >>>>> 360cities@... <360cities%40gmail.com> <360cities%40gmail.com>>
                >> wrote:
                >>>>>
                >>>>>>
                >>>>>>
                >>>>>> here trausti,
                >>>>>>
                >>>>>> you can play with flash on the ipad and see how useless it really is
                >> on
                >>>>>> such
                >>>>>> a device ;-)
                >>>>>>
                >>>>>>
                >>>>>>
                >>>>
                >> http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/07/how-to-install-flash-on-your-jailbroken-ipad-for-real/
                >>>>>>
                >>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >>>>>>
                >>>>>>
                >>>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>> ------------------------------------
                >>>>>
                >>>>> --
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>> ------------------------------------
                >>>
                >>> --
                >>>
                >>>
                >>>
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                >
                >
                >
                > ------------------------------------
                >
                > --
                >
                >
                >
              • Trausti Hraunfjord
                http://www.youtube.com/ http://loombo.com/ http://megavideo.com/ http://freakmov.com/ http://wisevid.com/ Youtube, the world s biggest in online videos has
                Message 7 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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                  http://www.youtube.com/
                  http://loombo.com/
                  http://megavideo.com/
                  http://freakmov.com/
                  http://wisevid.com/

                  Youtube, the world's biggest in online videos has decided to drop HTML5
                  videos as the "future"... contrary to what Steve was claiming... so even if
                  it is possible to see videos there on iDevices, it may end soon.... or it
                  may continue on limited basis.

                  Trausti

                  On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 7:47 AM, Matthew Rogers <matthew@...>wrote:

                  >
                  >
                  > OK, apart from your own product, give me five examples of sites that you
                  > use that require Flash.
                  >
                  > Matt
                  >


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • prague
                  I love watching this argument. It s like those cock-fights that some people like to watch, but without the blood.
                  Message 8 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
                  • 0 Attachment
                    I love watching this argument.

                    It's like those cock-fights that some people like to watch, but without the blood.

                    http://home.alphalink.com.au/~grum/oldbalipics/internetimage/fight.jpg

                    I guess everyone has their guilty pleasures

                    :-)

                    --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Trausti Hraunfjord <trausti.hraunfjord@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > http://www.youtube.com/
                    > http://loombo.com/
                    > http://megavideo.com/
                    > http://freakmov.com/
                    > http://wisevid.com/
                    >
                    > Youtube, the world's biggest in online videos has decided to drop HTML5
                    > videos as the "future"... contrary to what Steve was claiming... so even if
                    > it is possible to see videos there on iDevices, it may end soon.... or it
                    > may continue on limited basis.
                    >
                    > Trausti
                    >
                    > On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 7:47 AM, Matthew Rogers <matthew@...>wrote:
                    >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > OK, apart from your own product, give me five examples of sites that you
                    > > use that require Flash.
                    > >
                    > > Matt
                    > >
                    >
                    >
                    > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    >
                  • Matthew Rogers
                    I know, but I still don t get his point. So he visits Youtube and 3 crappier versions of Youtube :( Since Apple basically created digital video with the
                    Message 9 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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                      I know, but I still don't get his point. So he visits Youtube and 3 crappier versions of Youtube :(

                      Since Apple basically created digital video with the introduction of Quicktime there won't be a time when I can't view videos on my devices. So even if Youtube drop HTML5 (which isn't used in the native youtube app) I can still view all the video content in the native Youtube app.

                      As for file sharing, there are already dozens of file sharing utilities on the iPad and I can't see any use of Flash on Loombo anyway.

                      So your post basically proves to me that even you don't need Flash.

                      Matt

                      On 8 Jul 2010, at 14:15, prague wrote:

                      >
                      >
                      > I love watching this argument.
                      >
                      > It's like those cock-fights that some people like to watch, but without the blood.
                      >
                      > http://home.alphalink.com.au/~grum/oldbalipics/internetimage/fight.jpg
                      >
                      > I guess everyone has their guilty pleasures
                      >
                      > :-)
                      >
                      > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Trausti Hraunfjord <trausti.hraunfjord@...> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > http://www.youtube.com/
                      > > http://loombo.com/
                      > > http://megavideo.com/
                      > > http://freakmov.com/
                      > > http://wisevid.com/
                      > >
                      > > Youtube, the world's biggest in online videos has decided to drop HTML5
                      > > videos as the "future"... contrary to what Steve was claiming... so even if
                      > > it is possible to see videos there on iDevices, it may end soon.... or it
                      > > may continue on limited basis.
                      > >
                      > > Trausti
                      > >
                      > > On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 7:47 AM, Matthew Rogers <matthew@...>wrote:
                      > >
                      > > >
                      > > >
                      > > > OK, apart from your own product, give me five examples of sites that you
                      > > > use that require Flash.
                      > > >
                      > > > Matt
                      > > >
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      > >
                      >
                      >



                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Trausti Hraunfjord
                      I don t know if this even qualifies as a fight... the tone is way too friendly. Personally I don t give a hoot about iPad or iPhones.... or any other phones
                      Message 10 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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                        I don't know if this even qualifies as a fight... the tone is way too
                        friendly.

                        Personally I don't give a hoot about iPad or iPhones.... or any other phones
                        for that matter.... but my thought is that the owners of such devices have
                        been cheated from making their own choices. Just as it would be with my
                        previously mentioned (imaginary) camera example...

                        If Adobe excluded Apple platforms from using it's products, it would
                        probably make every Apple fan go nuts.... but if Steve would exclude all
                        Adobe products from having access to Macs... the fans would probably have a
                        big party and say that it didn't matter at all, because there are other
                        image editors available than PS, and After Effects are not that important,
                        because there is something else that can take it's place... of course none
                        of the replacements would be able to do EVERYTHING the Adobe products can,
                        but the fans would not worry about that, because there would be something
                        really fantastic just around the corner behind their iGod Steve.

                        In my personal opinion, Mac's are great machinery, and absolutely superior
                        in every way and form when compared to PC's. And I am sure that iPhones and
                        iPads and whatever else there is in the iProduct line, is just as great
                        mechanically and on the software side. But that does not mean that I will
                        bow in the dust and praise everything that comes from Steve or Apple. He
                        has made some really bad judgement decisions, and that is a fact... at least
                        from where I view it.

                        Flash exists, and has existed for a long time. It works and can do things
                        that no other software can do. That is a fact.

                        To exclude such a platform, rather than support it, is stupid. The "new
                        standard" as it was touted by Apple a short while back, consisted of
                        completely outdated examples, which were intended to show that HTML5 could
                        do the same as Flash... but completely failed to make the point... unless
                        the point was to be made for people who have no inkling about anything.

                        Quicktime as a format to use?? Come on... that's so last century! It is a
                        terrible format... the installer is what... 30 mb today? Compare that to
                        the 2 mb Flash installer... and now Flash is getting integrated in browsers,
                        so it is not going to be a "plugin" any more. I have QT installed, but
                        truly despise it due to all the crashes it has caused on my end. Freezing
                        up the computer because it decided it had to check for an update. No thank
                        you. That kind of faulty-ware I can't vouch for.

                        I can watch movies in a much better quailty using Flash, and have much fewer
                        crashes.

                        So you couldn't watch anything on the sites in question... therefore you
                        feel that you have to call them crappy?

                        Isn't it just your iPad that is crappy for not being able to visit any site
                        on the internet?

                        :)

                        That IS the issue at hand. You pay good money for a device that prevents
                        you from accessing sites that might have material you would like to see...
                        but rather than admitting that it is a crappy device, you feel the need to
                        bad mouth sites that your iCan't device is unable to visit :)

                        Well... I have no problem watching things I want to see. You probably feel
                        the same.

                        ... but... again... why on earth would you use Quicktime for anything at
                        all, unless you are FORCED to use it?

                        Trausti







                        On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 8:15 AM, prague <360cities@...> wrote:

                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > I love watching this argument.
                        >
                        > It's like those cock-fights that some people like to watch, but without the
                        > blood.
                        >
                        > http://home.alphalink.com.au/~grum/oldbalipics/internetimage/fight.jpg<http://home.alphalink.com.au/%7Egrum/oldbalipics/internetimage/fight.jpg>
                        >
                        > I guess everyone has their guilty pleasures
                        >
                        > :-)
                        >
                        >
                        > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com <PanoToolsNG%40yahoogroups.com>,
                        > Trausti Hraunfjord <trausti.hraunfjord@...> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > http://www.youtube.com/
                        > > http://loombo.com/
                        > > http://megavideo.com/
                        > > http://freakmov.com/
                        > > http://wisevid.com/
                        > >
                        > > Youtube, the world's biggest in online videos has decided to drop HTML5
                        > > videos as the "future"... contrary to what Steve was claiming... so even
                        > if
                        > > it is possible to see videos there on iDevices, it may end soon.... or it
                        > > may continue on limited basis.
                        > >
                        > > Trausti
                        > >
                        > > On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 7:47 AM, Matthew Rogers <matthew@...>wrote:
                        >
                        > >
                        > > >
                        > > >
                        > > > OK, apart from your own product, give me five examples of sites that
                        > you
                        > > > use that require Flash.
                        > > >
                        > > > Matt
                        > > >
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        > >
                        >
                        >
                        >


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Christian Bloch
                        Actually, I m glad there s less Flash-ONLY sites around these days. From a webdesigner standpoint they have always been horrible, non-indexed, with lengthy
                        Message 11 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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                          Actually, I'm glad there's less Flash-ONLY sites around these days. From a webdesigner standpoint they have always been horrible, non-indexed, with lengthy intro movies, fixed screen size. It's been a really bad habit to make the full site navigation in Flash, and always a bit lazy on the webdesigner's side.

                          Not saying Flash isn't useful - it's great for runtime-optimized interactive content. But a site that is ONLY Flash has always been considered a failure.

                          Blochi

                          On Jul 8, 2010, at 4:03 AM, Trausti Hraunfjord wrote:

                          > You can not watch MILLIONS of websites that use Flash only, and
                          > which do not provide support for the iSnob devices.
                        • mick crane
                          ... I like this one http://hanamushi.jp/
                          Message 12 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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                            On Thu, July 8, 2010 3:49 pm, Christian Bloch wrote:
                            > Actually, I'm glad there's less Flash-ONLY sites around these days. From
                            > a webdesigner standpoint they have always been horrible, non-indexed,
                            > with lengthy intro movies, fixed screen size. It's been a really bad
                            > habit to make the full site navigation in Flash, and always a bit lazy on
                            > the webdesigner's side.
                            >
                            > Not saying Flash isn't useful - it's great for runtime-optimized
                            > interactive content. But a site that is ONLY Flash has always been
                            > considered a failure.

                            I like this one
                            http://hanamushi.jp/
                          • Henri Smeets
                            I agree that Flash on iPad/Phone would be great but I cannot say that I really, REALLY need it to be on there, Having had three iPhones by now and awaiting the
                            Message 13 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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                              I agree that Flash on iPad/Phone would be great but I cannot say that I
                              really, REALLY need it to be on there, Having had three iPhones by now and
                              awaiting the iPad I truly love many things that these devices have made
                              possible.

                              The iPhone was able to display my panorama's (CubeWorld/PangeaVR and now VR5
                              an KRPano) even before Android was available and the Windows Mobile devices
                              were horrible beyond comprehension. Android is still not able to show
                              panorama's.

                              The biggest crime I my humble opinion is having to work with things that are
                              hard to use or function slowly, have been poorly developed, etc. The
                              iDevices do not fall into that class, Windows does, so do the
                              parkingticketpoles here in Amsterdam, many Philips devices, Realviz Stitcher
                              and many more things!

                              Thankfully we can almost always choose an alternative, so let's not be
                              bitter about it!
                              --
                              View this message in context: http://panotoolsng.586017.n4.nabble.com/flash-on-ipad-tp2282047p2282814.html
                              Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
                            • Bjørn K Nilssen
                              ... Who can choose? iPad/iPod users can t choose, but have to depend on developers making their pages available as apps or viewable in a browser in iPosh
                              Message 14 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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                                On 8 Jul 2010 at 13:20, Henri Smeets wrote:

                                >
                                > I agree that Flash on iPad/Phone would be great but I cannot say that I
                                > really, REALLY need it to be on there, Having had three iPhones by now and
                                > awaiting the iPad I truly love many things that these devices have made
                                > possible.
                                >
                                > The iPhone was able to display my panorama's (CubeWorld/PangeaVR and now VR5
                                > an KRPano) even before Android was available and the Windows Mobile devices
                                > were horrible beyond comprehension. Android is still not able to show
                                > panorama's.
                                >
                                > The biggest crime I my humble opinion is having to work with things that are
                                > hard to use or function slowly, have been poorly developed, etc. The
                                > iDevices do not fall into that class, Windows does, so do the
                                > parkingticketpoles here in Amsterdam, many Philips devices, Realviz Stitcher
                                > and many more things!
                                >
                                > Thankfully we can almost always choose an alternative, so let's not be
                                > bitter about it!

                                Who can choose? iPad/iPod users can't choose, but have to depend on developers making
                                their pages available as apps or viewable in a browser in iPosh format. Of the millions
                                of web pages using Flash I don't think a very high percentage will be rewritten. At least
                                I hope they won't, and that St Steve will be forced to remove his roadblock. Not very
                                likely though, as most iUsers seems to be perfectly happy with their limited web options,
                                thus there most likely will be no riot from unhappy users.

                                --
                                Bjørn K Nilssen - http://bknilssen.no - panoramas and 3D
                              • Henri Smeets
                                Bjørn wrote: Who can choose? iPad/iPod users can t choose They DID choose, to buy a device that didn t support Flash Every new hard- or software-technology
                                Message 15 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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                                  Bjørn wrote: "Who can choose? iPad/iPod users can't choose"

                                  They DID choose, to buy a device that didn't support Flash

                                  Every new hard- or software-technology requires adjustments, tune-ups etc.
                                  We have Unix, Windows, MacOS and many more platforms on dozens of devices, I
                                  hear no one complaining the Kindle doesn't support PS3 games (or color for
                                  that matter)

                                  The most important issue is here that we have to adopt the new developments,
                                  I'd be crazy not to support iDevices, I even think it's an opportunity to
                                  enter new markets and develop new ideas!

                                  Flash on touchscreen devices has issues anyway, click-dragging is a pain,
                                  embedded flash in a html page would make that page not draggable on the
                                  flash surface so what if it fills the screen area, not to mention those
                                  obnoxious Flash add's that cover entire pages!
                                  --
                                  View this message in context: http://panotoolsng.586017.n4.nabble.com/flash-on-ipad-tp2282047p2282928.html
                                  Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
                                • Paulo Fernandes
                                  First I have an iPhone and I do miss flash. With that said one thing people tend to forget is that flash player wasn t available for ARM processors until last
                                  Message 16 of 25 , Jul 8, 2010
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                                    First I have an iPhone and I do miss flash.
                                    With that said one thing people tend to forget
                                    is that flash player wasn't available for ARM
                                    processors until last month. I'm sorry but that
                                    lame Flash Lite player was completely useless.
                                    iPhones exist for several years and adobe
                                    complained before they had a viable product!
                                    Even now flash is only available on the fastest
                                    Smartphones (with 1Ghz Arm processor like
                                    iPad or the latest Android mobiles).

                                    BUT, as soon as flash is available for my iPhone
                                    I'll be installing it :)

                                    Sent from my iPhone

                                    On 8 de Jul de 2010, at 23:25, Henri Smeets <henri@...> wrote:

                                    >
                                    > Bjørn wrote: "Who can choose? iPad/iPod users can't choose"
                                    >
                                    > They DID choose, to buy a device that didn't support Flash
                                    >
                                    > Every new hard- or software-technology requires adjustments, tune-ups etc.
                                    > We have Unix, Windows, MacOS and many more platforms on dozens of devices, I
                                    > hear no one complaining the Kindle doesn't support PS3 games (or color for
                                    > that matter)
                                    >
                                    > The most important issue is here that we have to adopt the new developments,
                                    > I'd be crazy not to support iDevices, I even think it's an opportunity to
                                    > enter new markets and develop new ideas!
                                    >
                                    > Flash on touchscreen devices has issues anyway, click-dragging is a pain,
                                    > embedded flash in a html page would make that page not draggable on the
                                    > flash surface so what if it fills the screen area, not to mention those
                                    > obnoxious Flash add's that cover entire pages!
                                    > --
                                    > View this message in context: http://panotoolsng.586017.n4.nabble.com/flash-on-ipad-tp2282047p2282928.html
                                    > Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
                                    >


                                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                  • tom_a_sparks
                                    the iDevices, have made us developer rethink our needs to use flash yes, I know that flash can do something that HTML5 cant do (eg: web cam access, but flash
                                    Message 17 of 25 , Jul 9, 2010
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                                      the iDevices, have made us developer rethink our needs to use flash

                                      yes, I know that flash can do something that HTML5 cant do (eg: web cam access, but flash cant do local video transcoding like you can in java)

                                      this is the best example of where flash fails: http://www.spacesounds.com/

                                      tom
                                    • Trausti Hraunfjord
                                      I m sure there s a lot of areas where Flash will never be useful in any way or form. Personally I find most Flash based websites to be nothing short of public
                                      Message 18 of 25 , Jul 9, 2010
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                                        I'm sure there's a lot of areas where Flash will never be useful in any way
                                        or form. Personally I find most Flash based websites to be nothing short of
                                        public torture chambers. Come there flashy ads sailing over the monitors...
                                        and I get this urge to smash the monitor.

                                        This space sounds site you linked... what is it that flash failed at doing
                                        there? Isn't the site doing what it was designed to do? Maybe the
                                        designers failed in their work ?

                                        I don't know... I don't find it interesting enough to spend too much time
                                        there, but if you point out where Flash has failed, I might agree... I don't
                                        consider Flash to be some holy cow that can't be poked at with pointy
                                        sticks.

                                        Local video transcoding... what exactly is that? Do you have some examples
                                        to share on that... I have absolutely no idea what that is.

                                        Trausti



                                        On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 2:38 AM, tom_a_sparks <tom_a_sparks@...>wrote:

                                        >
                                        >
                                        > the iDevices, have made us developer rethink our needs to use flash
                                        >
                                        > yes, I know that flash can do something that HTML5 cant do (eg: web cam
                                        > access, but flash cant do local video transcoding like you can in java)
                                        >
                                        > this is the best example of where flash fails: http://www.spacesounds.com/
                                        >
                                        > tom
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >


                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      • Tom Sparks
                                        ... you upload the video to youtube youtube transcodes the video for you while firefogg (http://firefogg.org/) dose all the work local and just uploads the
                                        Message 19 of 25 , Jul 9, 2010
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                                          --- On Fri, 9/7/10, Trausti Hraunfjord <trausti.hraunfjord@...> wrote:

                                          > From: Trausti Hraunfjord <trausti.hraunfjord@...>
                                          > Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] Re: flash on ipad
                                          > To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                                          > Received: Friday, 9 July, 2010, 6:08 PM
                                          > I'm sure there's a lot of areas where
                                          > Flash will never be useful in any way
                                          > or form.  Personally I find most Flash based websites
                                          > to be nothing short of
                                          > public torture chambers.  Come there flashy ads
                                          > sailing over the monitors...
                                          > and I get this urge to smash the monitor.
                                          >
                                          > This space sounds site you linked... what is it that flash
                                          > failed at doing
                                          > there?
                                          >  Isn't the site doing what it was designed to
                                          > do?
                                          >  Maybe the
                                          > designers failed in their work ?


                                          >
                                          > Local video transcoding... what exactly is that?  Do
                                          > you have some examples
                                          > to share on that... I have absolutely no idea what that
                                          > is.
                                          >
                                          you upload the video to youtube
                                          youtube transcodes the video for you

                                          while firefogg (http://firefogg.org/) dose all the work local and just uploads the video afterward

                                          recording a webcam in flash
                                          the video is streamed to a server
                                          but if you want to encode/transcode the video to webm or theora, forget it
                                          http://www.red5-recorder.com/demo.php

                                          > Trausti
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 2:38 AM, tom_a_sparks <tom_a_sparks@...>wrote:
                                          >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > the iDevices, have made us developer rethink our needs
                                          > to use flash
                                          > >
                                          > > yes, I know that flash can do something that HTML5
                                          > cant do (eg: web cam
                                          > > access, but flash cant do local video transcoding like
                                          > you can in java)
                                          > >
                                          > > this is the best example of where flash fails: http://www.spacesounds.com/
                                          > >
                                          > > tom
                                          > >
                                          > > 
                                          > >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > ------------------------------------
                                          >
                                          > --
                                          > Yahoo! Groups Links
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >     PanoToolsNG-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                        • Trausti Hraunfjord
                                          Ah... that was interesting! Thank you for the info... and yes, clearly Flash lags behind on that front. Trausti ... [Non-text portions of this message have
                                          Message 20 of 25 , Jul 9, 2010
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                                            Ah... that was interesting! Thank you for the info... and yes, clearly
                                            Flash lags behind on that front.

                                            Trausti



                                            On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 4:41 AM, Tom Sparks <tom_a_sparks@...>wrote:

                                            > you upload the video to youtube
                                            > youtube transcodes the video for you
                                            >
                                            > while firefogg (http://firefogg.org/) dose all the work local and just
                                            > uploads the video afterward
                                            >
                                            > recording a webcam in flash
                                            > the video is streamed to a server
                                            > but if you want to encode/transcode the video to webm or theora, forget it
                                            > http://www.red5-recorder.com/demo.php
                                            >
                                            >


                                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          • Keith Martin
                                            ... Trausti, smileys are good and proper, but they don t make a daft statement any less daft! Any site? Let s not fish for arguments, please. Me, I m an
                                            Message 21 of 25 , Jul 9, 2010
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                                              Sometime around 8/7/10 (at 09:02 -0500) Trausti Hraunfjord said:

                                              >Isn't it just your iPad that is crappy for not being able to visit any site
                                              >on the internet?
                                              >
                                              >:)

                                              Trausti, smileys are good and proper, but they don't make a daft
                                              statement any less daft! "Any" site? Let's not fish for arguments,
                                              please.

                                              Me, I'm an eyes-wide-open Mac user. I've been using Macs since the
                                              mid-1980s and I've been MacUser's Technical Editor since the mid/late
                                              1990s. I totally agree that there's no such thing as a perfect
                                              platform. But I do like using the Mac, and I do find Windows, not
                                              always but often, to be a source of personal and tech-aesthetic
                                              annoyance. I say this in the hopes that others may regard me as an
                                              intelligent Mac user, not a Mac fanboi. (Well, I can hope, eh?)

                                              I have recently become an iPad owner. NO, it isn't the future of
                                              everything and it doesn't do everything I want. But DAMN, it is a
                                              lovely bit of kit; it is a supremely well-designed and
                                              well-integrated marraige of hardware and software.

                                              It is a very nice bit of tech, but don't get hung up on things like
                                              "but tablet-X and tablet-Y does this or that
                                              more/better/differently". It should definitely not be judged by spec
                                              sheets or features lists; it is far, far more than the sum of it's
                                              parts.

                                              It is a truly good personal device with astounding abilities. It
                                              doesn't do everything. But here's what I'm doing about that: I'm
                                              learning Objective C. This device is seriously EXCITING, and I want
                                              to take it as far as I can.

                                              The iPad is not a crappy device, it just doesn't do everything. If
                                              you want what it can't do, don't get it. Just please don't imply that
                                              those who choose it are fools.

                                              k
                                            • Trausti Hraunfjord
                                              Daft it was. Truly. It was supposed to read any FLASH site on the internet ... don t know where that flash disappeared to ... was Steve in here? :)
                                              Message 22 of 25 , Jul 9, 2010
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                                                Daft it was. Truly. It was supposed to read "any FLASH site on the
                                                internet" ... don't know where that "flash" disappeared to ... was Steve in
                                                here? :) Sorry for that.

                                                And as to the quality of build. I don't think there is any other company in
                                                the marketplace of computing and hand-held devices, that comes anywhere
                                                close to Apple's products. It is engineering at it's best. No darn doubt
                                                about that.

                                                Last night I had an iPod nano to play with, and I was truly amazed by it's
                                                capabilities... the camera, the video quality... the storage space, the
                                                battery life... absolutely mind blowing!

                                                I can absolutely see huge possibilities with it, and looking a couple of
                                                years down the road of the future, it is clear to me that I will probably
                                                start eating many of my previous statements right back... and I actually
                                                don't see that as a bad thing.

                                                Heck, right now I am even feeling that it's a good thing that Flash met this
                                                fierce resistance by Steve, since it will result in better Flash for all of
                                                us sooner rather than later.

                                                Inconvenient yes... but that does actually depend on where one is viewing it
                                                from.

                                                More innovation is good. If there is no Flash for the iDevices, then there
                                                will be more innovation needed in that field, so that Flash will not be
                                                missed by anyone that has the iDevices, and that could actually result in
                                                something that might spread into the normal computing world... and Flash
                                                will have to get a lot better to wipe off the stains Steve smeared on it's
                                                image, and that will be a good thing too.

                                                Have I become a convert? No, but it has clearly helped me to gain better
                                                understanding to meet different views, read online accounts of pros and
                                                cons, and air my views to people of a different opinion.

                                                So if my last writing against iDevices has been written, I would like to
                                                thank all those who helped me to come to the point I am at now... and sorry
                                                to those who got their knickers in a twist because I word things as I do ...
                                                sometimes.

                                                Trausti




                                                On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 6:47 AM, Keith Martin <keith@...> wrote:

                                                >
                                                >
                                                > Sometime around 8/7/10 (at 09:02 -0500) Trausti Hraunfjord said:
                                                >
                                                > >Isn't it just your iPad that is crappy for not being able to visit any
                                                > site
                                                > >on the internet?
                                                > >
                                                > >:)
                                                >
                                                > Trausti, smileys are good and proper, but they don't make a daft
                                                > statement any less daft! "Any" site? Let's not fish for arguments,
                                                > please.
                                                >
                                                > Me, I'm an eyes-wide-open Mac user. I've been using Macs since the
                                                > mid-1980s and I've been MacUser's Technical Editor since the mid/late
                                                > 1990s. I totally agree that there's no such thing as a perfect
                                                > platform. But I do like using the Mac, and I do find Windows, not
                                                > always but often, to be a source of personal and tech-aesthetic
                                                > annoyance. I say this in the hopes that others may regard me as an
                                                > intelligent Mac user, not a Mac fanboi. (Well, I can hope, eh?)
                                                >
                                                > I have recently become an iPad owner. NO, it isn't the future of
                                                > everything and it doesn't do everything I want. But DAMN, it is a
                                                > lovely bit of kit; it is a supremely well-designed and
                                                > well-integrated marraige of hardware and software.
                                                >
                                                > It is a very nice bit of tech, but don't get hung up on things like
                                                > "but tablet-X and tablet-Y does this or that
                                                > more/better/differently". It should definitely not be judged by spec
                                                > sheets or features lists; it is far, far more than the sum of it's
                                                > parts.
                                                >
                                                > It is a truly good personal device with astounding abilities. It
                                                > doesn't do everything. But here's what I'm doing about that: I'm
                                                > learning Objective C. This device is seriously EXCITING, and I want
                                                > to take it as far as I can.
                                                >
                                                > The iPad is not a crappy device, it just doesn't do everything. If
                                                > you want what it can't do, don't get it. Just please don't imply that
                                                > those who choose it are fools.
                                                >
                                                > k
                                                >
                                                >


                                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                              • mrjimbo
                                                Trausti, Your scaring me.. :-)... To sum on on my end.. I to think that these apple devices are actually pretty neat.. I also however am not convinced that Mr
                                                Message 23 of 25 , Jul 9, 2010
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                                                  Trausti,
                                                  Your scaring me.. :-)... To sum on on my end.. I to think that these apple devices are actually pretty neat.. I also however am not convinced that Mr iJobs .. is on top of his game sometimes.. Anyway he's got a better track record at this stuff then I do so I guess I have to trust for a while. What's weird is that it seems that everyone tries to kill the guy on top (flash) ...wouldn't a more humane way simply be to develop an alternate then over time then make a switch.. rather then all this bashing ..

                                                  jimbo
                                                  ----- Original Message -----
                                                  From: Trausti Hraunfjord
                                                  To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                                                  Sent: Friday, July 09, 2010 6:19 AM
                                                  Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] Re: flash on ipad



                                                  Daft it was. Truly. It was supposed to read "any FLASH site on the
                                                  internet" ... don't know where that "flash" disappeared to ... was Steve in
                                                  here? :) Sorry for that.

                                                  And as to the quality of build. I don't think there is any other company in
                                                  the marketplace of computing and hand-held devices, that comes anywhere
                                                  close to Apple's products. It is engineering at it's best. No darn doubt
                                                  about that.

                                                  Last night I had an iPod nano to play with, and I was truly amazed by it's
                                                  capabilities... the camera, the video quality... the storage space, the
                                                  battery life... absolutely mind blowing!

                                                  I can absolutely see huge possibilities with it, and looking a couple of
                                                  years down the road of the future, it is clear to me that I will probably
                                                  start eating many of my previous statements right back... and I actually
                                                  don't see that as a bad thing.

                                                  Heck, right now I am even feeling that it's a good thing that Flash met this
                                                  fierce resistance by Steve, since it will result in better Flash for all of
                                                  us sooner rather than later.

                                                  Inconvenient yes... but that does actually depend on where one is viewing it
                                                  from.

                                                  More innovation is good. If there is no Flash for the iDevices, then there
                                                  will be more innovation needed in that field, so that Flash will not be
                                                  missed by anyone that has the iDevices, and that could actually result in
                                                  something that might spread into the normal computing world... and Flash
                                                  will have to get a lot better to wipe off the stains Steve smeared on it's
                                                  image, and that will be a good thing too.

                                                  Have I become a convert? No, but it has clearly helped me to gain better
                                                  understanding to meet different views, read online accounts of pros and
                                                  cons, and air my views to people of a different opinion.

                                                  So if my last writing against iDevices has been written, I would like to
                                                  thank all those who helped me to come to the point I am at now... and sorry
                                                  to those who got their knickers in a twist because I word things as I do ...
                                                  sometimes.

                                                  Trausti

                                                  On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 6:47 AM, Keith Martin <keith@...> wrote:

                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > Sometime around 8/7/10 (at 09:02 -0500) Trausti Hraunfjord said:
                                                  >
                                                  > >Isn't it just your iPad that is crappy for not being able to visit any
                                                  > site
                                                  > >on the internet?
                                                  > >
                                                  > >:)
                                                  >
                                                  > Trausti, smileys are good and proper, but they don't make a daft
                                                  > statement any less daft! "Any" site? Let's not fish for arguments,
                                                  > please.
                                                  >
                                                  > Me, I'm an eyes-wide-open Mac user. I've been using Macs since the
                                                  > mid-1980s and I've been MacUser's Technical Editor since the mid/late
                                                  > 1990s. I totally agree that there's no such thing as a perfect
                                                  > platform. But I do like using the Mac, and I do find Windows, not
                                                  > always but often, to be a source of personal and tech-aesthetic
                                                  > annoyance. I say this in the hopes that others may regard me as an
                                                  > intelligent Mac user, not a Mac fanboi. (Well, I can hope, eh?)
                                                  >
                                                  > I have recently become an iPad owner. NO, it isn't the future of
                                                  > everything and it doesn't do everything I want. But DAMN, it is a
                                                  > lovely bit of kit; it is a supremely well-designed and
                                                  > well-integrated marraige of hardware and software.
                                                  >
                                                  > It is a very nice bit of tech, but don't get hung up on things like
                                                  > "but tablet-X and tablet-Y does this or that
                                                  > more/better/differently". It should definitely not be judged by spec
                                                  > sheets or features lists; it is far, far more than the sum of it's
                                                  > parts.
                                                  >
                                                  > It is a truly good personal device with astounding abilities. It
                                                  > doesn't do everything. But here's what I'm doing about that: I'm
                                                  > learning Objective C. This device is seriously EXCITING, and I want
                                                  > to take it as far as I can.
                                                  >
                                                  > The iPad is not a crappy device, it just doesn't do everything. If
                                                  > you want what it can't do, don't get it. Just please don't imply that
                                                  > those who choose it are fools.
                                                  >
                                                  > k
                                                  >
                                                  >

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