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1st "horizontal" polepano attempt

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  • panobanano
    Hi, Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a horizontal pole pano. I was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel. There was a step ladder
    Message 1 of 20 , Nov 28, 2009
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      Hi,
      Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a "horizontal" pole pano. I was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel. There was a step ladder on the landing so I used it to help me keep the pole steady. I rested the pole on top of the railing and back to one of the steps on the ladder. I pushed the pole into the corner where the step meets the upright of the ladder and pulled the middle of the pole over against the wall where the railing attached. I marked the pole so that I could do 6 around evenly and had a piece of tape so I could keep it lined up with the ladder. This way I felt I could rotate the pole without any drift in the nodal point. I had an "assistant" fire the shutter 3 times for every position on auto bracket. When I got the 6 around I had to haul in the camera so I could point it to the zenith position then I had to put the camera back out in the same position (using a D300 and 10.5 lens). Thanks to all the precautions and marks I was able to get it back pretty close. This left me with a stitch with a hole where the end of the railing meets the wall there. We were hiding behind the corner and were pretty much out of sight.. Still I had to reconstruct some of the railing and floor in photoshop
      Also on the same project I tried a "day/night" comparison pano. I am using Pano2VR so there is no slick transition like FPP has :-( but it turned out OK too I guess. See them both here by scrolling down to the last 2 panos in the list.
      <http://rackphoto.com/pp/prayerplaces/our-lady-of-the-most-holy-trinity-chapel/>

      Ron Rack
    • jrgen_schrader
      Excellent shots, but I d redo the tonemapping. Despite the bright sunshine the scenery seems somehow greyish and dull. Cheers Jürgen
      Message 2 of 20 , Nov 29, 2009
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        Excellent shots, but I'd redo the tonemapping.
        Despite the bright sunshine the scenery seems somehow greyish and dull.

        Cheers
        Jürgen



        --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "panobanano" <ronrack@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi,
        > Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a "horizontal" pole pano. I was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel. There was a step ladder on the landing so I used it to help me keep the pole steady. I rested the pole on top of the railing and back to one of the steps on the ladder. I pushed the pole into the corner where the step meets the upright of the ladder and pulled the middle of the pole over against the wall where the railing attached. I marked the pole so that I could do 6 around evenly and had a piece of tape so I could keep it lined up with the ladder. This way I felt I could rotate the pole without any drift in the nodal point. I had an "assistant" fire the shutter 3 times for every position on auto bracket. When I got the 6 around I had to haul in the camera so I could point it to the zenith position then I had to put the camera back out in the same position (using a D300 and 10.5 lens). Thanks to all the precautions and marks I was able to get it back pretty close. This left me with a stitch with a hole where the end of the railing meets the wall there. We were hiding behind the corner and were pretty much out of sight.. Still I had to reconstruct some of the railing and floor in photoshop
        > Also on the same project I tried a "day/night" comparison pano. I am using Pano2VR so there is no slick transition like FPP has :-( but it turned out OK too I guess. See them both here by scrolling down to the last 2 panos in the list.
        > <http://rackphoto.com/pp/prayerplaces/our-lady-of-the-most-holy-trinity-chapel/>
        >
        > Ron Rack
        >
      • alarcon@blueyonder.co.uk
        Hi Ron Rack, Congratulations nice work. kind regards, Rodrigo
        Message 3 of 20 , Nov 29, 2009
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          Hi Ron Rack,

          Congratulations nice work.

          kind regards,

          Rodrigo
        • Hans
          ... ??? What tonemapping? I can not see any need for doing any HDR on the outdoor ones and I doubt it is. If the buildings were white like our churches in
          Message 4 of 20 , Nov 29, 2009
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            --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@...> wrote:
            >
            > Excellent shots, but I'd redo the tonemapping.
            > Despite the bright sunshine the scenery seems somehow greyish and dull.
            >
            > Cheers
            > Jürgen

            ???
            What tonemapping?
            I can not see any need for doing any HDR on the outdoor ones and I doubt it is.
            If the buildings were white like our churches in Denmark it would be a problem but not with these.
            The colours look perfect to me.

            Maybe if you use old Mac gamma but that should now be history.

            BTW I also checked them on my MacBook PRO which has very low saturation and found them still OK .
            I know the Colors on todays Macs with glossy screens can be very saturated and bright so I expect that they have much more power on them. My old G5 with the Cinema 23" is still perfect if you keep it calibrated with the standard built in Mac calibration.

            Hans


            >
            >
            > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "panobanano" <ronrack@> wrote:
            > >
            > > Hi,
            > > Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a "horizontal" pole pano. I was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel. There was a step ladder on the landing so I used it to help me keep the pole steady. I rested the pole on top of the railing and back to one of the steps on the ladder. I pushed the pole into the corner where the step meets the upright of the ladder and pulled the middle of the pole over against the wall where the railing attached. I marked the pole so that I could do 6 around evenly and had a piece of tape so I could keep it lined up with the ladder. This way I felt I could rotate the pole without any drift in the nodal point. I had an "assistant" fire the shutter 3 times for every position on auto bracket. When I got the 6 around I had to haul in the camera so I could point it to the zenith position then I had to put the camera back out in the same position (using a D300 and 10.5 lens). Thanks to all the precautions and marks I was able to get it back pretty close. This left me with a stitch with a hole where the end of the railing meets the wall there. We were hiding behind the corner and were pretty much out of sight.. Still I had to reconstruct some of the railing and floor in photoshop
            > > Also on the same project I tried a "day/night" comparison pano. I am using Pano2VR so there is no slick transition like FPP has :-( but it turned out OK too I guess. See them both here by scrolling down to the last 2 panos in the list.
            > > <http://rackphoto.com/pp/prayerplaces/our-lady-of-the-most-holy-trinity-chapel/>
            > >
            > > Ron Rack
            > >
            >
          • jrgen_schrader
            ... Look into the sun and you ll see what happened ;)
            Message 5 of 20 , Nov 29, 2009
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              >and I doubt it is.

              Look into the sun and you'll see what happened ;)

              --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Hans" <hans@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              >
              > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Excellent shots, but I'd redo the tonemapping.
              > > Despite the bright sunshine the scenery seems somehow greyish and dull.
              > >
              > > Cheers
              > > Jürgen
              >
              > ???
              > What tonemapping?
              > I can not see any need for doing any HDR on the outdoor ones and I doubt it is.
              > If the buildings were white like our churches in Denmark it would be a problem but not with these.
              > The colours look perfect to me.
              >
              > Maybe if you use old Mac gamma but that should now be history.
              >
              > BTW I also checked them on my MacBook PRO which has very low saturation and found them still OK .
              > I know the Colors on todays Macs with glossy screens can be very saturated and bright so I expect that they have much more power on them. My old G5 with the Cinema 23" is still perfect if you keep it calibrated with the standard built in Mac calibration.
              >
              > Hans
              >
              >
              > >
              > >
              > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "panobanano" <ronrack@> wrote:
              > > >
              > > > Hi,
              > > > Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a "horizontal" pole pano. I was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel. There was a step ladder on the landing so I used it to help me keep the pole steady. I rested the pole on top of the railing and back to one of the steps on the ladder. I pushed the pole into the corner where the step meets the upright of the ladder and pulled the middle of the pole over against the wall where the railing attached. I marked the pole so that I could do 6 around evenly and had a piece of tape so I could keep it lined up with the ladder. This way I felt I could rotate the pole without any drift in the nodal point. I had an "assistant" fire the shutter 3 times for every position on auto bracket. When I got the 6 around I had to haul in the camera so I could point it to the zenith position then I had to put the camera back out in the same position (using a D300 and 10.5 lens). Thanks to all the precautions and marks I was able to get it back pretty close. This left me with a stitch with a hole where the end of the railing meets the wall there. We were hiding behind the corner and were pretty much out of sight.. Still I had to reconstruct some of the railing and floor in photoshop
              > > > Also on the same project I tried a "day/night" comparison pano. I am using Pano2VR so there is no slick transition like FPP has :-( but it turned out OK too I guess. See them both here by scrolling down to the last 2 panos in the list.
              > > > <http://rackphoto.com/pp/prayerplaces/our-lady-of-the-most-holy-trinity-chapel/>
              > > >
              > > > Ron Rack
              > > >
              > >
              >
            • Hans
              ... Thats not tonemapping or enfuse. It is just using Shadowhighlight a little to much. Hans
              Message 6 of 20 , Nov 29, 2009
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                --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@...> wrote:
                >
                > >and I doubt it is.
                >
                > Look into the sun and you'll see what happened ;)

                Thats not tonemapping or enfuse. It is just using Shadowhighlight a little to much.

                Hans


                >
                > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Hans" <hans@> wrote:
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@> wrote:
                > > >
                > > > Excellent shots, but I'd redo the tonemapping.
                > > > Despite the bright sunshine the scenery seems somehow greyish and dull.
                > > >
                > > > Cheers
                > > > Jürgen
                > >
                > > ???
                > > What tonemapping?
                > > I can not see any need for doing any HDR on the outdoor ones and I doubt it is.
                > > If the buildings were white like our churches in Denmark it would be a problem but not with these.
                > > The colours look perfect to me.
                > >
                > > Maybe if you use old Mac gamma but that should now be history.
                > >
                > > BTW I also checked them on my MacBook PRO which has very low saturation and found them still OK .
                > > I know the Colors on todays Macs with glossy screens can be very saturated and bright so I expect that they have much more power on them. My old G5 with the Cinema 23" is still perfect if you keep it calibrated with the standard built in Mac calibration.
                > >
                > > Hans
                > >
                > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "panobanano" <ronrack@> wrote:
                > > > >
                > > > > Hi,
                > > > > Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a "horizontal" pole pano. I was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel. There was a step ladder on the landing so I used it to help me keep the pole steady. I rested the pole on top of the railing and back to one of the steps on the ladder. I pushed the pole into the corner where the step meets the upright of the ladder and pulled the middle of the pole over against the wall where the railing attached. I marked the pole so that I could do 6 around evenly and had a piece of tape so I could keep it lined up with the ladder. This way I felt I could rotate the pole without any drift in the nodal point. I had an "assistant" fire the shutter 3 times for every position on auto bracket. When I got the 6 around I had to haul in the camera so I could point it to the zenith position then I had to put the camera back out in the same position (using a D300 and 10.5 lens). Thanks to all the precautions and marks I was able to get it back pretty close. This left me with a stitch with a hole where the end of the railing meets the wall there. We were hiding behind the corner and were pretty much out of sight.. Still I had to reconstruct some of the railing and floor in photoshop
                > > > > Also on the same project I tried a "day/night" comparison pano. I am using Pano2VR so there is no slick transition like FPP has :-( but it turned out OK too I guess. See them both here by scrolling down to the last 2 panos in the list.
                > > > > <http://rackphoto.com/pp/prayerplaces/our-lady-of-the-most-holy-trinity-chapel/>
                > > > >
                > > > > Ron Rack
                > > > >
                > > >
                > >
                >
              • Hans
                ... Actually it looks like pasting a single underexposed one and combining them in Photoshop. Hazy suns are the worst to do. A sun on a clear blue sky is no
                Message 7 of 20 , Nov 29, 2009
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                  --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Hans" <hans@...> wrote:
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > >and I doubt it is.
                  > >
                  > > Look into the sun and you'll see what happened ;)
                  >
                  > Thats not tonemapping or enfuse. It is just using Shadowhighlight a little to much.

                  Actually it looks like pasting a single underexposed one and combining them in Photoshop.

                  Hazy suns are the worst to do. A sun on a clear blue sky is no problem but suns behind a slight hazy sky are really difficult to handle so that it looks natural.

                  Hans



                  >
                  >
                  > >
                  > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Hans" <hans@> wrote:
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@> wrote:
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Excellent shots, but I'd redo the tonemapping.
                  > > > > Despite the bright sunshine the scenery seems somehow greyish and dull.
                  > > > >
                  > > > > Cheers
                  > > > > Jürgen
                  > > >
                  > > > ???
                  > > > What tonemapping?
                  > > > I can not see any need for doing any HDR on the outdoor ones and I doubt it is.
                  > > > If the buildings were white like our churches in Denmark it would be a problem but not with these.
                  > > > The colours look perfect to me.
                  > > >
                  > > > Maybe if you use old Mac gamma but that should now be history.
                  > > >
                  > > > BTW I also checked them on my MacBook PRO which has very low saturation and found them still OK .
                  > > > I know the Colors on todays Macs with glossy screens can be very saturated and bright so I expect that they have much more power on them. My old G5 with the Cinema 23" is still perfect if you keep it calibrated with the standard built in Mac calibration.
                  > > >
                  > > > Hans
                  > > >
                  > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "panobanano" <ronrack@> wrote:
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Hi,
                  > > > > > Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a "horizontal" pole pano. I was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel. There was a step ladder on the landing so I used it to help me keep the pole steady. I rested the pole on top of the railing and back to one of the steps on the ladder. I pushed the pole into the corner where the step meets the upright of the ladder and pulled the middle of the pole over against the wall where the railing attached. I marked the pole so that I could do 6 around evenly and had a piece of tape so I could keep it lined up with the ladder. This way I felt I could rotate the pole without any drift in the nodal point. I had an "assistant" fire the shutter 3 times for every position on auto bracket. When I got the 6 around I had to haul in the camera so I could point it to the zenith position then I had to put the camera back out in the same position (using a D300 and 10.5 lens). Thanks to all the precautions and marks I was able to get it back pretty close. This left me with a stitch with a hole where the end of the railing meets the wall there. We were hiding behind the corner and were pretty much out of sight.. Still I had to reconstruct some of the railing and floor in photoshop
                  > > > > > Also on the same project I tried a "day/night" comparison pano. I am using Pano2VR so there is no slick transition like FPP has :-( but it turned out OK too I guess. See them both here by scrolling down to the last 2 panos in the list.
                  > > > > > <http://rackphoto.com/pp/prayerplaces/our-lady-of-the-most-holy-trinity-chapel/>
                  > > > > >
                  > > > > > Ron Rack
                  > > > > >
                  > > > >
                  > > >
                  > >
                  >
                • Wim Koornneef
                  Hello Ron, This is a well shot pano of an attractive scene. You said you shot bracketed, I don t know if you processed all images or only used a single
                  Message 8 of 20 , Nov 29, 2009
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                    Hello Ron,

                    This is a well shot pano of an attractive scene.
                    You said you shot bracketed, I don't know if you processed all images or
                    only used a single exposure but the tonemapping and/or a misuse of the
                    highlite correction in PhotoShop is making the part of the sky around the
                    sun greyish and not as it should be.
                    It is not a big issue and I guess it will be easy to correct.
                    Aside from this minor issue it really is a fine pano.

                    Wim
                    --
                    View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/1st-horizontal-polepano-attempt-tp930633p930728.html
                    Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
                  • onezebra1
                    Hi Ron, I use to ride my horses, hike, and even pack with my llamas past Thomas Aquinas Collage years ago, so I really enjoyed viewing your panos and must say
                    Message 9 of 20 , Nov 29, 2009
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                      Hi Ron,
                      I use to ride my horses, hike, and even pack with my llamas past Thomas Aquinas Collage years ago, so I really enjoyed viewing your panos and must say they are exceptionally done.
                      I also saw your pano of the Serra Cross at Grant Park .
                      Today it was very clear so I decided to go up to the cross a shot one with my Canon 5D mark-2 with Nikon 10.5mm lens mounted on a 17 foot pool. It was a little windy up there and hard to keep the camera steady.
                      Anyway here it is:
                      http://indiavrtours.com/vrphotos/cross.html

                      Roger Berry
                      IndiaVRtours.com



                      --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "panobanano" <ronrack@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Hi,
                      > Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a "horizontal" pole pano. I was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel. There was a step ladder on the landing so I used it to help me keep the pole steady. I rested the pole on top of the railing and back to one of the steps on the ladder. I pushed the pole into the corner where the step meets the upright of the ladder and pulled the middle of the pole over against the wall where the railing attached. I marked the pole so that I could do 6 around evenly and had a piece of tape so I could keep it lined up with the ladder. This way I felt I could rotate the pole without any drift in the nodal point. I had an "assistant" fire the shutter 3 times for every position on auto bracket. When I got the 6 around I had to haul in the camera so I could point it to the zenith position then I had to put the camera back out in the same position (using a D300 and 10.5 lens). Thanks to all the precautions and marks I was able to get it back pretty close. This left me with a stitch with a hole where the end of the railing meets the wall there. We were hiding behind the corner and were pretty much out of sight.. Still I had to reconstruct some of the railing and floor in photoshop
                      > Also on the same project I tried a "day/night" comparison pano. I am using Pano2VR so there is no slick transition like FPP has :-( but it turned out OK too I guess. See them both here by scrolling down to the last 2 panos in the list.
                      > <http://rackphoto.com/pp/prayerplaces/our-lady-of-the-most-holy-trinity-chapel/>
                      >
                      > Ron Rack
                      >
                    • Ron Rack
                      Roger, Thanks for the comments, glad to be able to bring back good memories, are you located in Ventura? Also, Wow, that was a clear day for you, I can even
                      Message 10 of 20 , Nov 30, 2009
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                        Roger,
                        Thanks for the comments, glad to be able to bring back good memories,
                        are you located in Ventura? Also, Wow, that was a clear day for you, I
                        can even see the Channel Islands peaking out of the horizon. Did you
                        see my Anacapa panos?

                        ron rack


                        On Nov 29, 2009, at 11:56 PM, onezebra1 wrote:

                        > Hi Ron,
                        > I use to ride my horses, hike, and even pack with my llamas past
                        > Thomas Aquinas Collage years ago, so I really enjoyed viewing your
                        > panos and must say they are exceptionally done.
                        > I also saw your pano of the Serra Cross at Grant Park .
                        > Today it was very clear so I decided to go up to the cross a shot
                        > one with my Canon 5D mark-2 with Nikon 10.5mm lens mounted on a 17
                        > foot pool. It was a little windy up there and hard to keep the
                        > camera steady.
                        > Anyway here it is:
                        > http://indiavrtours.com/vrphotos/cross.html
                        >
                        > Roger Berry
                        > IndiaVRtours.com
                        >
                        > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "panobanano" <ronrack@...> wrote:
                        > >
                        > > Hi,
                        > > Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a "horizontal" pole
                        > pano. I was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel.
                        > There was a step ladder on the landing so I used it to help me keep
                        > the pole steady. I rested the pole on top of the railing and back to
                        > one of the steps on the ladder. I pushed the pole into the corner
                        > where the step meets the upright of the ladder and pulled the middle
                        > of the pole over against the wall where the railing attached. I
                        > marked the pole so that I could do 6 around evenly and had a piece
                        > of tape so I could keep it lined up with the ladder. This way I felt
                        > I could rotate the pole without any drift in the nodal point. I had
                        > an "assistant" fire the shutter 3 times for every position on auto
                        > bracket. When I got the 6 around I had to haul in the camera so I
                        > could point it to the zenith position then I had to put the camera
                        > back out in the same position (using a D300 and 10.5 lens). Thanks
                        > to all the precautions and marks I was able to get it back pretty
                        > close. This left me with a stitch with a hole where the end of the
                        > railing meets the wall there. We were hiding behind the corner and
                        > were pretty much out of sight.. Still I had to reconstruct some of
                        > the railing and floor in photoshop
                        > > Also on the same project I tried a "day/night" comparison pano. I
                        > am using Pano2VR so there is no slick transition like FPP has :-
                        > ( but it turned out OK too I guess. See them both here by scrolling
                        > down to the last 2 panos in the list.
                        > > <http://rackphoto.com/pp/prayerplaces/our-lady-of-the-most-holy-trinity-chapel/
                        > >
                        > >
                        > > Ron Rack
                        > >
                        >
                        >
                        >



                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Ron Rack
                        Thanks for all the comments about this pano. I did use a 3 stop bracket, used Bracketeer, overlayed dark exposure, etc. Any trick I could think of. As Hans
                        Message 11 of 20 , Nov 30, 2009
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                          Thanks for all the comments about this pano. I did use a 3 stop
                          bracket, used Bracketeer, overlayed dark exposure, etc. Any trick I
                          could think of. As Hans says a hazy sun seems really tricky to deal
                          with. I was not entirely happy with the results I had with this pano
                          and your comments have inspired me to go back and tweak it some. For
                          the average viewer I think the "sun" thing is not an issue, but when
                          presenting to a panel of experts such as you all are, I must remember
                          to keep pushing until I think I have done the best that I could.
                          Thanks for keeping me on my toes. BTW do you think the best way to
                          handle the hazy sun is to let the area around it there go to pure
                          white? I do agree that the "grey" area in the sun looks a little weird.

                          sincerely

                          ron rack


                          On Nov 29, 2009, at 9:29 AM, Wim Koornneef wrote:

                          >
                          > Hello Ron,
                          >
                          > This is a well shot pano of an attractive scene.
                          > You said you shot bracketed, I don't know if you processed all
                          > images or
                          > only used a single exposure but the tonemapping and/or a misuse of the
                          > highlite correction in PhotoShop is making the part of the sky
                          > around the
                          > sun greyish and not as it should be.
                          > It is not a big issue and I guess it will be easy to correct.
                          > Aside from this minor issue it really is a fine pano.
                          >
                          > Wim
                          > --
                          > View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/1st-horizontal-polepano-attempt-tp930633p930728.html
                          > Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
                          >
                          >



                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • jrgen_schrader
                          Never mind, Ron, this is a known problem. But before I d push the bars too far I d leave the center of the sun white. But more then that I d make sure the
                          Message 12 of 20 , Nov 30, 2009
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                            Never mind, Ron, this is a known problem.
                            But before I'd push the bars too far I'd leave the center of the sun white. But more then that I'd make sure the tonality of the scenery looks somehow "natural". Yours is definitely too far on the dark side and I just showed the sun as an indicator that there was some overdone tweaking involved (there's also way too much gray in the clouds).

                            Usually I don't dare criticize anyones pictures, but this example was too obvious amongst the rest of your excellent work. If you shot in RAW I'm pretty sure you can get a perfect result from just one exposure. Just don't look into the sun as a starting point ;)

                            Cheers
                            Jürgen

                            --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Ron Rack <ronrack@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > Thanks for all the comments about this pano. I did use a 3 stop
                            > bracket, used Bracketeer, overlayed dark exposure, etc. Any trick I
                            > could think of. As Hans says a hazy sun seems really tricky to deal
                            > with. I was not entirely happy with the results I had with this pano
                            > and your comments have inspired me to go back and tweak it some. For
                            > the average viewer I think the "sun" thing is not an issue, but when
                            > presenting to a panel of experts such as you all are, I must remember
                            > to keep pushing until I think I have done the best that I could.
                            > Thanks for keeping me on my toes. BTW do you think the best way to
                            > handle the hazy sun is to let the area around it there go to pure
                            > white? I do agree that the "grey" area in the sun looks a little weird.
                            >
                            > sincerely
                            >
                            > ron rack
                            >
                            >
                            > On Nov 29, 2009, at 9:29 AM, Wim Koornneef wrote:
                            >
                            > >
                            > > Hello Ron,
                            > >
                            > > This is a well shot pano of an attractive scene.
                            > > You said you shot bracketed, I don't know if you processed all
                            > > images or
                            > > only used a single exposure but the tonemapping and/or a misuse of the
                            > > highlite correction in PhotoShop is making the part of the sky
                            > > around the
                            > > sun greyish and not as it should be.
                            > > It is not a big issue and I guess it will be easy to correct.
                            > > Aside from this minor issue it really is a fine pano.
                            > >
                            > > Wim
                            > > --
                            > > View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/1st-horizontal-polepano-attempt-tp930633p930728.html
                            > > Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
                            > >
                            > >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                            >
                          • Hans
                            ... I simply can not understand that you find them too dark. I just did a recalibration of my Cinema23 and revisited Ron s panoramas. I did not find them too
                            Message 13 of 20 , Nov 30, 2009
                            • 0 Attachment
                              --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Never mind, Ron, this is a known problem.
                              > But before I'd push the bars too far I'd leave the center of the sun white. But more then >that I'd make sure the tonality of the scenery looks somehow "natural". Yours is definitely >too far on the dark side and I just showed the sun as an indicator that there was some >overdone tweaking involved (there's also way too much gray in the clouds).

                              I simply can not understand that you find them too dark.

                              I just did a recalibration of my Cinema23 and revisited Ron' s panoramas. I did not find them too dark before and my new calibration actually made them brighter.

                              I had to check the dates on the files to see if Ron had updated them all as I could see that the tower had been adjusted for the sun.
                              But the 2 other panos are not updated,
                              So please Ron do not make them brighter, that will take the power of them.

                              Hans



                              >
                              > Usually I don't dare criticize anyones pictures, but this example was too obvious amongst the rest of your excellent work. If you shot in RAW I'm pretty sure you can get a perfect result from just one exposure. Just don't look into the sun as a starting point ;)
                              >
                              > Cheers
                              > Jürgen
                              >
                              > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Ron Rack <ronrack@> wrote:
                              > >
                              > > Thanks for all the comments about this pano. I did use a 3 stop
                              > > bracket, used Bracketeer, overlayed dark exposure, etc. Any trick I
                              > > could think of. As Hans says a hazy sun seems really tricky to deal
                              > > with. I was not entirely happy with the results I had with this pano
                              > > and your comments have inspired me to go back and tweak it some. For
                              > > the average viewer I think the "sun" thing is not an issue, but when
                              > > presenting to a panel of experts such as you all are, I must remember
                              > > to keep pushing until I think I have done the best that I could.
                              > > Thanks for keeping me on my toes. BTW do you think the best way to
                              > > handle the hazy sun is to let the area around it there go to pure
                              > > white? I do agree that the "grey" area in the sun looks a little weird.
                              > >
                              > > sincerely
                              > >
                              > > ron rack
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > On Nov 29, 2009, at 9:29 AM, Wim Koornneef wrote:
                              > >
                              > > >
                              > > > Hello Ron,
                              > > >
                              > > > This is a well shot pano of an attractive scene.
                              > > > You said you shot bracketed, I don't know if you processed all
                              > > > images or
                              > > > only used a single exposure but the tonemapping and/or a misuse of the
                              > > > highlite correction in PhotoShop is making the part of the sky
                              > > > around the
                              > > > sun greyish and not as it should be.
                              > > > It is not a big issue and I guess it will be easy to correct.
                              > > > Aside from this minor issue it really is a fine pano.
                              > > >
                              > > > Wim
                              > > > --
                              > > > View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/1st-horizontal-polepano-attempt-tp930633p930728.html
                              > > > Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
                              > > >
                              > > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              > >
                              >
                            • Ron Rack
                              Hans, Thanks for the comments, I did update the belltower shot. I wasn t quite happy with it to begin with and I think it is better now, the other ones will
                              Message 14 of 20 , Nov 30, 2009
                              • 0 Attachment
                                Hans,
                                Thanks for the comments, I did update the "belltower" shot. I wasn't
                                quite happy with it to begin with and I think it is better now, the
                                other ones will stay the same.

                                ron rack


                                On Nov 30, 2009, at 4:13 PM, Hans wrote:

                                >
                                >
                                > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@...>
                                > wrote:
                                > >
                                > > Never mind, Ron, this is a known problem.
                                > > But before I'd push the bars too far I'd leave the center of the
                                > sun white. But more then >that I'd make sure the tonality of the
                                > scenery looks somehow "natural". Yours is definitely >too far on the
                                > dark side and I just showed the sun as an indicator that there was
                                > some >overdone tweaking involved (there's also way too much gray in
                                > the clouds).
                                >
                                > I simply can not understand that you find them too dark.
                                >
                                > I just did a recalibration of my Cinema23 and revisited Ron' s
                                > panoramas. I did not find them too dark before and my new
                                > calibration actually made them brighter.
                                >
                                > I had to check the dates on the files to see if Ron had updated them
                                > all as I could see that the tower had been adjusted for the sun.
                                > But the 2 other panos are not updated,
                                > So please Ron do not make them brighter, that will take the power of
                                > them.
                                >
                                > Hans
                                >
                                > >
                                > > Usually I don't dare criticize anyones pictures, but this example
                                > was too obvious amongst the rest of your excellent work. If you shot
                                > in RAW I'm pretty sure you can get a perfect result from just one
                                > exposure. Just don't look into the sun as a starting point ;)
                                > >
                                > > Cheers
                                > > J�rgen
                                > >
                                > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Ron Rack <ronrack@> wrote:
                                > > >
                                > > > Thanks for all the comments about this pano. I did use a 3 stop
                                > > > bracket, used Bracketeer, overlayed dark exposure, etc. Any
                                > trick I
                                > > > could think of. As Hans says a hazy sun seems really tricky to
                                > deal
                                > > > with. I was not entirely happy with the results I had with this
                                > pano
                                > > > and your comments have inspired me to go back and tweak it some.
                                > For
                                > > > the average viewer I think the "sun" thing is not an issue, but
                                > when
                                > > > presenting to a panel of experts such as you all are, I must
                                > remember
                                > > > to keep pushing until I think I have done the best that I could.
                                > > > Thanks for keeping me on my toes. BTW do you think the best way to
                                > > > handle the hazy sun is to let the area around it there go to pure
                                > > > white? I do agree that the "grey" area in the sun looks a little
                                > weird.
                                > > >
                                > > > sincerely
                                > > >
                                > > > ron rack
                                > > >
                                > > >
                                > > > On Nov 29, 2009, at 9:29 AM, Wim Koornneef wrote:
                                > > >
                                > > > >
                                > > > > Hello Ron,
                                > > > >
                                > > > > This is a well shot pano of an attractive scene.
                                > > > > You said you shot bracketed, I don't know if you processed all
                                > > > > images or
                                > > > > only used a single exposure but the tonemapping and/or a
                                > misuse of the
                                > > > > highlite correction in PhotoShop is making the part of the sky
                                > > > > around the
                                > > > > sun greyish and not as it should be.
                                > > > > It is not a big issue and I guess it will be easy to correct.
                                > > > > Aside from this minor issue it really is a fine pano.
                                > > > >
                                > > > > Wim
                                > > > > --
                                > > > > View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/1st-horizontal-polepano-attempt-tp930633p930728.html
                                > > > > Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
                                > > > >
                                > > > >
                                > > >
                                > > >
                                > > >
                                > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                > > >
                                > >
                                >
                                >
                                >



                                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              • onezebra1
                                Hi Ron, Yes I live in Ventura near Ojai and I did view your Anacapa Island panos along with a number of others. I ve been there many years ago when I was doing
                                Message 15 of 20 , Nov 30, 2009
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Hi Ron,
                                  Yes I live in Ventura near Ojai and I did view your Anacapa Island panos along with a number of others.
                                  I've been there many years ago when I was doing volunteer work with the forest service.
                                  Use to do a lot of hiking, horse packing and llama packing into the Ojai and Santa Barbara backcountry.
                                  Now days I seem to be mostly exploring the opposite side of the world.

                                  Roger Berry
                                  IndiaVRtours.com


                                  --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Ron Rack <ronrack@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Roger,
                                  > Thanks for the comments, glad to be able to bring back good memories,
                                  > are you located in Ventura? Also, Wow, that was a clear day for you, I
                                  > can even see the Channel Islands peaking out of the horizon. Did you
                                  > see my Anacapa panos?
                                  >
                                  > ron rack
                                  >
                                  >
                                • jrgen_schrader
                                  ... So let s get to an end ;) I haven t been talking about them but just the one from the tower as this was the headline of this topic. And yes, I also have
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Dec 1, 2009
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    >I simply can not understand that you find them too dark.

                                    So let's get to an end ;)
                                    I haven't been talking about "them" but just the one from the tower as this was the headline of this topic.
                                    And yes, I also have a calibrated monitor on my desktop and also watched it on a MBPro.
                                    The revised version is a lot better now.

                                    Cheers
                                    Jürgen


                                    --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Hans" <hans@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "jrgen_schrader" <panorama@> wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > > Never mind, Ron, this is a known problem.
                                    > > But before I'd push the bars too far I'd leave the center of the sun white. But more then >that I'd make sure the tonality of the scenery looks somehow "natural". Yours is definitely >too far on the dark side and I just showed the sun as an indicator that there was some >overdone tweaking involved (there's also way too much gray in the clouds).
                                    >
                                    > I simply can not understand that you find them too dark.
                                    >
                                    > I just did a recalibration of my Cinema23 and revisited Ron' s panoramas. I did not find them too dark before and my new calibration actually made them brighter.
                                    >
                                    > I had to check the dates on the files to see if Ron had updated them all as I could see that the tower had been adjusted for the sun.
                                    > But the 2 other panos are not updated,
                                    > So please Ron do not make them brighter, that will take the power of them.
                                    >
                                    > Hans
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > >
                                    > > Usually I don't dare criticize anyones pictures, but this example was too obvious amongst the rest of your excellent work. If you shot in RAW I'm pretty sure you can get a perfect result from just one exposure. Just don't look into the sun as a starting point ;)
                                    > >
                                    > > Cheers
                                    > > Jürgen
                                    > >
                                    > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Ron Rack <ronrack@> wrote:
                                    > > >
                                    > > > Thanks for all the comments about this pano. I did use a 3 stop
                                    > > > bracket, used Bracketeer, overlayed dark exposure, etc. Any trick I
                                    > > > could think of. As Hans says a hazy sun seems really tricky to deal
                                    > > > with. I was not entirely happy with the results I had with this pano
                                    > > > and your comments have inspired me to go back and tweak it some. For
                                    > > > the average viewer I think the "sun" thing is not an issue, but when
                                    > > > presenting to a panel of experts such as you all are, I must remember
                                    > > > to keep pushing until I think I have done the best that I could.
                                    > > > Thanks for keeping me on my toes. BTW do you think the best way to
                                    > > > handle the hazy sun is to let the area around it there go to pure
                                    > > > white? I do agree that the "grey" area in the sun looks a little weird.
                                    > > >
                                    > > > sincerely
                                    > > >
                                    > > > ron rack
                                    > > >
                                    > > >
                                    > > > On Nov 29, 2009, at 9:29 AM, Wim Koornneef wrote:
                                    > > >
                                    > > > >
                                    > > > > Hello Ron,
                                    > > > >
                                    > > > > This is a well shot pano of an attractive scene.
                                    > > > > You said you shot bracketed, I don't know if you processed all
                                    > > > > images or
                                    > > > > only used a single exposure but the tonemapping and/or a misuse of the
                                    > > > > highlite correction in PhotoShop is making the part of the sky
                                    > > > > around the
                                    > > > > sun greyish and not as it should be.
                                    > > > > It is not a big issue and I guess it will be easy to correct.
                                    > > > > Aside from this minor issue it really is a fine pano.
                                    > > > >
                                    > > > > Wim
                                    > > > > --
                                    > > > > View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/1st-horizontal-polepano-attempt-tp930633p930728.html
                                    > > > > Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
                                    > > > >
                                    > > > >
                                    > > >
                                    > > >
                                    > > >
                                    > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    > > >
                                    > >
                                    >
                                  • ptgroup
                                    Ron: I realy like the colour and quality ! Consideruíng the small filesize - really great. Since I still temper with optimal Pano2VR-Settings: may I ask you
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Dec 1, 2009
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      Ron: I realy like the colour and quality !
                                      Consideruíng the small filesize - really great.
                                      Since I still temper with optimal Pano2VR-Settings:
                                      may I ask you for your settings ?

                                      I get a large filesize < 1.5 MB and still not your quality.
                                      My tif I supply has app. 8000 x 4000.
                                      The tif is ok - the Pano2VR output a little blurry.
                                      Maybe your settings would be better .

                                      Thanks
                                      Mike
                                      ----------------------------
                                      ----------------------------
                                      360° VR Fotografie:
                                      http://www.360de.de

                                      NEU: Abstrakte Fotografie unter:
                                      http://www.abstraktfoto.de
                                      -----------------------------
                                      Aktuelles vom Virtugrafen:
                                      http://virtugraf.wordpress.com
                                      -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
                                      Von: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]Im
                                      Auftrag von jrgen_schrader
                                      Gesendet: Sonntag, 29. November 2009 09:24
                                      An: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                                      Betreff: [PanoToolsNG] Re: 1st "horizontal" polepano attempt



                                      Excellent shots, but I'd redo the tonemapping.
                                      Despite the bright sunshine the scenery seems somehow greyish and dull.

                                      Cheers
                                      Jürgen

                                      --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "panobanano" <ronrack@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Hi,
                                      > Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a "horizontal" pole pano. I
                                      was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel. There was a step
                                      ladder on the landing so I used it to help me keep the pole steady. I rested
                                      the pole on top of the railing and back to one of the steps on the ladder. I
                                      pushed the pole into the corner where the step meets the upright of the
                                      ladder and pulled the middle of the pole over against the wall where the
                                      railing attached. I marked the pole so that I could do 6 around evenly and
                                      had a piece of tape so I could keep it lined up with the ladder. This way I
                                      felt I could rotate the pole without any drift in the nodal point. I had an
                                      "assistant" fire the shutter 3 times for every position on auto bracket.
                                      When I got the 6 around I had to haul in the camera so I could point it to
                                      the zenith position then I had to put the camera back out in the same
                                      position (using a D300 and 10.5 lens). Thanks to all the precautions and
                                      marks I was able to get it back pretty close. This left me with a stitch
                                      with a hole where the end of the railing meets the wall there. We were
                                      hiding behind the corner and were pretty much out of sight.. Still I had to
                                      reconstruct some of the railing and floor in photoshop
                                      > Also on the same project I tried a "day/night" comparison pano. I am
                                      using Pano2VR so there is no slick transition like FPP has :-( but it turned
                                      out OK too I guess. See them both here by scrolling down to the last 2 panos
                                      in the list.
                                      >
                                      <http://rackphoto.com/pp/prayerplaces/our-lady-of-the-most-holy-trinity-chap
                                      el/>
                                      >
                                      > Ron Rack
                                      >






                                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                    • ptgroup
                                      The greyish sun halo is a little too much PS- hilight recovery. I think it?s not that bad - a complete white sun would not be better though. It?s well
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Dec 1, 2009
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        The greyish sun halo is a little too much PS- hilight recovery.
                                        I think it?s not that bad - a complete white sun would not be better though.
                                        It?s well balanced for my opinion.
                                        The "High-Light Priority" of my old (and sold) Canon 40D could handle
                                        this issue much much better then my 5D - unfortunately.


                                        Ciao
                                        Mike

                                        ----------------------------
                                        ----------------------------
                                        360? VR Fotografie:
                                        http://www.360de.de

                                        NEU: Abstrakte Fotografie unter:
                                        http://www.abstraktfoto.de
                                        -----------------------------
                                        Aktuelles vom Virtugrafen:
                                        http://virtugraf.wordpress.com
                                        -----Ursprungliche Nachricht-----
                                        Von: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]Im
                                        Auftrag von Wim Koornneef
                                        Gesendet: Sonntag, 29. November 2009 15:30
                                        An: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                                        Betreff: Re: [PanoToolsNG] 1st "horizontal" polepano attempt




                                        Hello Ron,

                                        This is a well shot pano of an attractive scene.
                                        You said you shot bracketed, I don't know if you processed all images or
                                        only used a single exposure but the tonemapping and/or a misuse of the
                                        highlite correction in PhotoShop is making the part of the sky around the
                                        sun greyish and not as it should be.
                                        It is not a big issue and I guess it will be easy to correct.
                                        Aside from this minor issue it really is a fine pano.

                                        Wim
                                        --
                                        View this message in context:
                                        http://n4.nabble.com/1st-horizontal-polepano-attempt-tp930633p930728.html
                                        Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.





                                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                      • Hans
                                        ... You probably use the default interpolator Mitchell. In your preferences/ settings change to lanczos 3 or Blackman/sinc. Hans
                                        Message 19 of 20 , Dec 1, 2009
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "ptgroup" <ptgroup@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > Ron: I realy like the colour and quality !
                                          > Consideruíng the small filesize - really great.
                                          > Since I still temper with optimal Pano2VR-Settings:
                                          > may I ask you for your settings ?
                                          >
                                          > I get a large filesize < 1.5 MB and still not your quality.
                                          > My tif I supply has app. 8000 x 4000.
                                          > The tif is ok - the Pano2VR output a little blurry.
                                          > Maybe your settings would be better .
                                          >

                                          You probably use the default interpolator Mitchell.
                                          In your preferences/ settings change to lanczos 3 or Blackman/sinc.

                                          Hans








                                          > Thanks
                                          > Mike
                                          > ----------------------------
                                          > ----------------------------
                                          > 360° VR Fotografie:
                                          > http://www.360de.de
                                          >
                                          > NEU: Abstrakte Fotografie unter:
                                          > http://www.abstraktfoto.de
                                          > -----------------------------
                                          > Aktuelles vom Virtugrafen:
                                          > http://virtugraf.wordpress.com
                                          > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
                                          > Von: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]Im
                                          > Auftrag von jrgen_schrader
                                          > Gesendet: Sonntag, 29. November 2009 09:24
                                          > An: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                                          > Betreff: [PanoToolsNG] Re: 1st "horizontal" polepano attempt
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > Excellent shots, but I'd redo the tonemapping.
                                          > Despite the bright sunshine the scenery seems somehow greyish and dull.
                                          >
                                          > Cheers
                                          > Jürgen
                                          >
                                          > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "panobanano" <ronrack@> wrote:
                                          > >
                                          > > Hi,
                                          > > Here is a link to my first attempt at doing a "horizontal" pole pano. I
                                          > was on the second level of the bell tower of this chapel. There was a step
                                          > ladder on the landing so I used it to help me keep the pole steady. I rested
                                          > the pole on top of the railing and back to one of the steps on the ladder. I
                                          > pushed the pole into the corner where the step meets the upright of the
                                          > ladder and pulled the middle of the pole over against the wall where the
                                          > railing attached. I marked the pole so that I could do 6 around evenly and
                                          > had a piece of tape so I could keep it lined up with the ladder. This way I
                                          > felt I could rotate the pole without any drift in the nodal point. I had an
                                          > "assistant" fire the shutter 3 times for every position on auto bracket.
                                          > When I got the 6 around I had to haul in the camera so I could point it to
                                          > the zenith position then I had to put the camera back out in the same
                                          > position (using a D300 and 10.5 lens). Thanks to all the precautions and
                                          > marks I was able to get it back pretty close. This left me with a stitch
                                          > with a hole where the end of the railing meets the wall there. We were
                                          > hiding behind the corner and were pretty much out of sight.. Still I had to
                                          > reconstruct some of the railing and floor in photoshop
                                          > > Also on the same project I tried a "day/night" comparison pano. I am
                                          > using Pano2VR so there is no slick transition like FPP has :-( but it turned
                                          > out OK too I guess. See them both here by scrolling down to the last 2 panos
                                          > in the list.
                                          > >
                                          > <http://rackphoto.com/pp/prayerplaces/our-lady-of-the-most-holy-trinity-chap
                                          > el/>
                                          > >
                                          > > Ron Rack
                                          > >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                          >
                                        • Wim Koornneef
                                          ... The improvement is visible, nice work ! Wim -- View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/1st-horizontal-polepano-attempt-tp930633p936562.html Sent
                                          Message 20 of 20 , Dec 2, 2009
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            panobanano wrote:
                                            > ...I did update the "belltower" shot. I wasn't
                                            > quite happy with it to begin with and I think it is better now...
                                            The improvement is visible, nice work !

                                            Wim

                                            --
                                            View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/1st-horizontal-polepano-attempt-tp930633p936562.html
                                            Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
                                          Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.