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Re: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Is there anything Ptgui can do that panotools cant?

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  • Bruno Postle
    ... Can you send me a .pto project that shows this problem? Internally hugin does the usual panotools thing of working entirely with the horizontal angle of
    Message 1 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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      On Mon 03-Nov-2008 at 06:30 -0000, Garrett Unglaub wrote:
      >The only thing i seem to have a problem with in hugin is, it does not
      >seem to want to save my focal mm or multiplier, so instead of 24 @ 1.6
      >i get 0@1.6 and i end up with a dough nut shaped picture instead of a
      >pano :-/

      Can you send me a .pto project that shows this problem?

      Internally hugin does the usual panotools thing of working entirely
      with the horizontal angle of view, it also keeps a record of the
      sensor size multiplier and calculates to and from focal length when
      required.

      --
      Bruno
    • yuval_levy
      ... - do you get a dialog asking to enter them? - what camera make/model do you have? - do you feed processed images, or directly out of camera? - what is the
      Message 2 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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        --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Garrett Unglaub" <cruc10@...> wrote:
        > The only thing i seem to have a problem with in hugin is, it does
        > not seem to want to save my focal mm or multiplier

        - do you get a dialog asking to enter them?
        - what camera make/model do you have?
        - do you feed processed images, or directly out of camera?
        - what is the locale set on your computer (regional language setting)?
        is the decimal point a comma or a dot?
        - what system is it? Win/Lin/Mac? and what flavor of it?

        there are known issues with image files where the exif metadata is not
        complete, either because one of the pre-processing tool has omitted to
        copy them (e.g. using "save for web" in Adobe Photoshop will strip all
        the unnecessary weight); or because the camera manufacturer uses some
        esoteric own exif tag. This second case is what happens with many
        Olympus cameras. I have found a potential solution and will implement
        it in the near future.

        If you can put up two of your input images for download somewhere, I
        can have a look and try to identify what causes the unexpected
        behavior you are experiencing.

        It may take a while though, my free time use has radically changed,
        and I've gone from short to long focal distance, and from stills to
        movies:
        <http://panospace.wordpress.com/2008/10/31/the-most-beautiful-smile-in-the-world/>

        :-)
        Yuv
      • Ken Warner
        Maybe there should be an option for hugin to not use exif data and to only use the values specified by the user.
        Message 3 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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          Maybe there should be an option for hugin
          to not use exif data and to only use the
          values specified by the user.


          >>The only thing i seem to have a problem with in hugin is, it does
          >>not seem to want to save my focal mm or multiplier
          >
        • Garrett Unglaub
          ... ah i see, so if there is no exif data available, you cant enter it in yourself? in ptgui i hadnt had that problem. it gives me the option to enter it, but
          Message 4 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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            --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Ken Warner <kwarner000@...> wrote:
            >
            > Maybe there should be an option for hugin
            > to not use exif data and to only use the
            > values specified by the user.
            >
            >
            > >>The only thing i seem to have a problem with in hugin is, it does
            > >>not seem to want to save my focal mm or multiplier
            > >
            >



            ah i see, so if there is no exif data available, you cant enter it in
            yourself? in ptgui i hadnt had that problem.

            it gives me the option to enter it, but then does not keep my data.

            it says i can open a lens file but i dont know how to create one.

            the images are converted from raw so there is no exif
          • Erik Krause
            ... Which raw converter does not write the EXIF data in the result files? Even dcraw (8.88) does! However, use exiftool to copy EXIF data from raw file to
            Message 5 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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              Am Monday, November 03, 2008 um 19:11 schrieb Garrett Unglaub:

              > the images are converted from raw so there is no exif

              Which raw converter does not write the EXIF data in the result files?
              Even dcraw (8.88) does!

              However, use exiftool to copy EXIF data from raw file to result file.

              best regards
              --
              Erik Krause
              Offenburger Str. 33
              79108 Freiburg
            • Bruno Postle
              ... I shoot with a manual lens and hugin has no problem with missing EXIF data, I just enter the angle of view manually. ... I d really like to see a .pto
              Message 6 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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                On Mon 03-Nov-2008 at 19:11 -0000, Garrett Unglaub wrote:

                >ah i see, so if there is no exif data available, you cant enter it in
                >yourself? in ptgui i hadnt had that problem.

                I shoot with a manual lens and hugin has no problem with missing
                EXIF data, I just enter the angle of view manually.

                >it gives me the option to enter it, but then does not keep my data.

                I'd really like to see a .pto project that behaves like this.

                >it says i can open a lens file but i dont know how to create one.

                You can 'Save lens...' on the 'Camera and Lens' tab.

                --
                Bruno
              • Erik Krause
                ... I think he refers to the slightly annoying behaviour of hugin to aks the lens information for any single image again. Most panoramas are shot with all
                Message 7 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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                  Am Monday, November 03, 2008 um 22:00 schrieb Bruno Postle:

                  > >ah i see, so if there is no exif data available, you cant enter it in
                  > >yourself? in ptgui i hadnt had that problem.
                  >
                  > I shoot with a manual lens and hugin has no problem with missing
                  > EXIF data, I just enter the angle of view manually.
                  >
                  > >it gives me the option to enter it, but then does not keep my data.

                  I think he refers to the slightly annoying behaviour of hugin to aks
                  the lens information for any single image again. Most panoramas are
                  shot with all images the same lens so this should be optional...

                  best regards
                  --
                  Erik Krause
                  Offenburger Str. 33
                  79108 Freiburg
                • Garrett Unglaub
                  So there just isnt a way to use your own exif data then? I m going to try a set of images with exif and let you know how it goes. Otherwise I ll upload some
                  Message 8 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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                    So there just isnt a way to use your own exif data
                    then? I'm going to try a set of images with exif and
                    let you know how it goes. Otherwise I'll upload some
                    pictures tomorrow


                    --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Erik
                    Krause" <erik.krause@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Am Monday, November 03, 2008 um 19:11
                    schrieb Garrett Unglaub:
                    >
                    > > the images are converted from raw so there is
                    no exif
                    >
                    > Which raw converter does not write the EXIF data
                    in the result files?
                    > Even dcraw (8.88) does!
                    >
                    > However, use exiftool to copy EXIF data from raw
                    file to result file.
                    >
                    > best regards
                    > --
                    > Erik Krause
                    > Offenburger Str. 33
                    > 79108 Freiburg
                    >
                  • PanoToolsNG.10.m8@spamgourmet.com
                    If you have your own EXIF information, you can likewise use exiftool to add them to any image you like. Though I am not sure why you wouldn t want the EXIF
                    Message 9 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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                      If you have your own EXIF information, you can likewise use exiftool to add
                      them to any image you like.

                      Though I am not sure why you wouldn't want the EXIF info from your original
                      raw to be copied to your converted image.(or why your raw converter is not
                      doing that anyway. Most do.)
                      Unless you are cropping your image, then you may want to change some of the
                      EXIF information.

                      Cheers,
                      Darren.

                      )-----Original Message-----
                      )From: Garrett Unglaub
                      )
                      )So there just isnt a way to use your own exif data
                      )then? I'm going to try a set of images with exif and
                      )let you know how it goes. Otherwise I'll upload some
                      )pictures tomorrow
                      )
                      )
                      )--- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Erik
                      )Krause" <erik.krause@...> wrote:
                      )>
                      )> Am Monday, November 03, 2008 um 19:11
                      )schrieb Garrett Unglaub:
                      )>
                      )> > the images are converted from raw so there is
                      )no exif
                      )>
                      )> Which raw converter does not write the EXIF data
                      )in the result files?
                      )> Even dcraw (8.88) does!
                      )>
                      )> However, use exiftool to copy EXIF data from raw
                      )file to result file.
                      )>
                      )> best regards
                      )> --
                      )> Erik Krause
                      )> Offenburger Str. 33
                      )> 79108 Freiburg
                      )>
                      )
                    • Garrett Unglaub
                      Well, the actual problem is the fact that i keep getting a donut shaped pano in hugin with the same settings as ptgui. I changed my lens data to 24mm 1.6x
                      Message 10 of 19 , Nov 3, 2008
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                        Well, the actual problem is the fact that i keep getting a donut
                        shaped pano in hugin with the same settings as ptgui.

                        I changed my lens data to 24mm 1.6x multiplier rectilinear and i end
                        up with this http://home.comcast.net/~calculatrix/t1.jpg or
                        http://home.comcast.net/~calculatrix/t2.jpg



                        I am trying to get it to look like this
                        http://home.comcast.net/~calculatrix/backyard.html


                        i get that problem in ptgui if i have a focal length that is higher
                        than it should be


                        --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Erik Krause" <erik.krause@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Am Monday, November 03, 2008 um 22:00 schrieb Bruno Postle:
                        >
                        > > >ah i see, so if there is no exif data available, you cant enter it in
                        > > >yourself? in ptgui i hadnt had that problem.
                        > >
                        > > I shoot with a manual lens and hugin has no problem with missing
                        > > EXIF data, I just enter the angle of view manually.
                        > >
                        > > >it gives me the option to enter it, but then does not keep my data.
                        >
                        > I think he refers to the slightly annoying behaviour of hugin to aks
                        > the lens information for any single image again. Most panoramas are
                        > shot with all images the same lens so this should be optional...
                        >
                        > best regards
                        > --
                        > Erik Krause
                        > Offenburger Str. 33
                        > 79108 Freiburg
                        >
                      • John Houghton
                        ... Maybe you are relying too much on automatic features. These don t always work perfectly - neither in Hugin nor in PTGui. Have you checked the control
                        Message 11 of 19 , Nov 4, 2008
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                          --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Garrett Unglaub" <cruc10@...>
                          wrote:
                          >
                          > Well, the actual problem is the fact that i keep getting a donut
                          > shaped pano in hugin with the same settings as ptgui.

                          Maybe you are relying too much on automatic features. These don't
                          always work perfectly - neither in Hugin nor in PTGui. Have you
                          checked the control point assignments, particularly those between
                          images in the neighborhood of the obvious discontinuities of the
                          output image? With some intelligent manual intervention, you can
                          easily get more-or-less identical results from both PTGui and Hugin.

                          As it's a 360 degree panorama, the hfov of the lens will be evaluated
                          accurately by the optimizer, provided you have a good spread of
                          control points. The optimizer gives a lot of control over what does
                          and doesn't get changed in the optimization if you choose to use it.
                          It can often help if you initialize the yaw values of the images to
                          their approximate known values. (In PTGui, use the Fill Yaw button on
                          the Image Parameters tab to automatically calculate the values).

                          While your PTGui result is quite good, it could do with levelling to
                          get the vertical features properly upright. (Don't overlook the
                          cloud reflections in the lake, which should also be vertically
                          aligned). If you aren't familiar with using t1 (vertical line)
                          control points, I suggest you take a look at this tutorial:

                          http://www.johnhpanos.com/levtut.htm

                          John
                        • Garrett Unglaub
                          Thank you I will check it out
                          Message 12 of 19 , Nov 4, 2008
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                            Thank you I will check it out



                            --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "John Houghton" <j.houghton@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Garrett Unglaub" <cruc10@>
                            > wrote:
                            > >
                            > > Well, the actual problem is the fact that i keep getting a donut
                            > > shaped pano in hugin with the same settings as ptgui.
                            >
                            > Maybe you are relying too much on automatic features. These don't
                            > always work perfectly - neither in Hugin nor in PTGui. Have you
                            > checked the control point assignments, particularly those between
                            > images in the neighborhood of the obvious discontinuities of the
                            > output image? With some intelligent manual intervention, you can
                            > easily get more-or-less identical results from both PTGui and Hugin.
                            >
                            > As it's a 360 degree panorama, the hfov of the lens will be evaluated
                            > accurately by the optimizer, provided you have a good spread of
                            > control points. The optimizer gives a lot of control over what does
                            > and doesn't get changed in the optimization if you choose to use it.
                            > It can often help if you initialize the yaw values of the images to
                            > their approximate known values. (In PTGui, use the Fill Yaw button on
                            > the Image Parameters tab to automatically calculate the values).
                            >
                            > While your PTGui result is quite good, it could do with levelling to
                            > get the vertical features properly upright. (Don't overlook the
                            > cloud reflections in the lake, which should also be vertically
                            > aligned). If you aren't familiar with using t1 (vertical line)
                            > control points, I suggest you take a look at this tutorial:
                            >
                            > http://www.johnhpanos.com/levtut.htm
                            >
                            > John
                            >
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