Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Struggling with Nadir Shot

Expand Messages
  • Drew Fulton
    Hey Everybody, I am fairly new to this and am hoping for some help. I am currently shooting some spherical panos in the cloud forests of Costa Rica and I am
    Message 1 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
    • 0 Attachment
      Hey Everybody,

      I am fairly new to this and am hoping for some help. I am currently
      shooting some spherical panos in the cloud forests of Costa Rica and I
      am failing when it comes to covering the tripod with a handheld nadir
      shot. I am hoping some folks can offer some suggestions.

      I am shooting with a 360Precision Adjuste, Nikon D3, and Nikon 24-70mm
      f2.8 lens at 24mm. I am stitching with PtGui Pro and finishing up
      with Photoshop CS3. So now you know what I have at my disposal.

      I shoot 8 shots at 0°, 8 at 60° and 8 at -60°. Shoot Raw, convert to
      Tiff, stitch with PtGui and a great template. The results look great
      except I still have the tripod.

      I am trying to shoot a handheld shot afterwards but I am having
      several issues. First, I am working in a very dark forest which makes
      handholding difficult. Second, the plants on the ground tend to move
      a bit when I remove the tripod so trying to stitch in PtGui doesn't
      really work with manually set control points. I have tried to do
      remap in PtGui (90 yaw, 90 pitch) and then touch up in Photoshop but
      with no success.

      I am really struggling here and would love any suggestions anyone
      might have to simplify this process. If I can get the Nadir working
      then I am good to go do a whole bunch of shooting in the forest over
      the next few weeks.

      Thanks!

      Best,
      Drew

      Canopy in the Clouds: Science Education that Starts at the Top
      http://www.canopyintheclouds.com


      Drew Fulton Photography
      1511 S. Texas Ave, PMB 149
      College Station, TX 77840
      http://www.drewfulton.com
      ph: 979.764.4164
      c: 321.230.6212
      drew@...



      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Sacha Griffin
      Your best bet is to use an thin aluminum spike or another person’s finger. Use it to mark the point of the lens in space, and re setup the tripod offset. You
      Message 2 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
      • 0 Attachment
        Your best bet is to use an thin aluminum spike or another person’s finger.
        Use it to mark the point of the lens in space, and re setup the tripod
        offset.

        You will of course need a tripod with a movable center column to swing your
        camera back over this point. Its good to have a 5-10lb counter weight so
        everything doesn’t fall over.

        Handheld in a dark forest, isn’t going to cut it, unless you’ve amped up
        your iso, which of course will hurt the amazing quality you are trying to
        achieve.

        It’s very difficult in costa rican forest terrain, unless your spot is very
        level. I’d say also you’ve chosen the wrong lens for the job.

        24 is WAAY to long. Unless you want to print an 10 foot wide image at
        300dpi. Its much better to drop down to 10mm fisheye on a crop camera or 15
        fisheye on a full frame.

        This will make the nadir process much easier, and cover more ground. In the
        rainforest shots, there is probably a lot of moving vegetation close to the
        camera, so you’re going to end up with a mountain of retouching work,
        getting leaves and branches back where they should be.



        If you can position the camera semi well back over the npp spot, you can use
        a viewpoint correction to do the rest of the work.

        Using the finger trick, you can achieve good enough precision for a shot
        like this.

        http://southern-digital.com/noblemanor/360/index.php?id=2



        Also it maybe possible to flip the vertical arm on your head, (depending on
        the head) and moving the tripod only. Eliminating the need for using the
        center column as a camera boom. Then you won’t need to get the vertical
        precision.



        The rest of the problems should be retouchable.

        Good luck. If you need further help, I’m more than willing to fly right in
        to help you out!



        Pura vida!





        Sacha Griffin

        Southern Digital Solutions LLC

        http://www.southern-digital.com

        http://www.seeit360.net

        404-551-4275







        From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com] On
        Behalf Of Drew Fulton
        Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 8:57 AM
        To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [PanoToolsNG] Struggling with Nadir Shot



        Hey Everybody,

        I am fairly new to this and am hoping for some help. I am currently
        shooting some spherical panos in the cloud forests of Costa Rica and I
        am failing when it comes to covering the tripod with a handheld nadir
        shot. I am hoping some folks can offer some suggestions.

        I am shooting with a 360Precision Adjuste, Nikon D3, and Nikon 24-70mm
        f2.8 lens at 24mm. I am stitching with PtGui Pro and finishing up
        with Photoshop CS3. So now you know what I have at my disposal.

        I shoot 8 shots at 0°, 8 at 60° and 8 at -60°. Shoot Raw, convert to
        Tiff, stitch with PtGui and a great template. The results look great
        except I still have the tripod.

        I am trying to shoot a handheld shot afterwards but I am having
        several issues. First, I am working in a very dark forest which makes
        handholding difficult. Second, the plants on the ground tend to move
        a bit when I remove the tripod so trying to stitch in PtGui doesn't
        really work with manually set control points. I have tried to do
        remap in PtGui (90 yaw, 90 pitch) and then touch up in Photoshop but
        with no success.

        I am really struggling here and would love any suggestions anyone
        might have to simplify this process. If I can get the Nadir working
        then I am good to go do a whole bunch of shooting in the forest over
        the next few weeks.

        Thanks!

        Best,
        Drew

        Canopy in the Clouds: Science Education that Starts at the Top
        http://www.canopyintheclouds.com

        Drew Fulton Photography
        1511 S. Texas Ave, PMB 149
        College Station, TX 77840
        http://www.drewfulton.com
        ph: 979.764.4164
        c: 321.230.6212
        drew@... <mailto:drew%40drewfulton.com>

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Hans Nyberg
        ... Here is a tutorial I just set up on how to take a perfect nadir. http://www.panoramas.dk/panorama/nadir/ Unfortunatelly the 360 precision Adjuste is
        Message 3 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
        • 0 Attachment
          --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Drew Fulton <drew@...> wrote:

          > I am trying to shoot a handheld shot afterwards but I am having
          > several issues. First, I am working in a very dark forest which makes
          > handholding difficult. Second, the plants on the ground tend to move
          > a bit when I remove the tripod so trying to stitch in PtGui doesn't
          > really work with manually set control points. I have tried to do
          > remap in PtGui (90 yaw, 90 pitch) and then touch up in Photoshop but
          > with no success.
          >
          > I am really struggling here and would love any suggestions anyone
          > might have to simplify this process. If I can get the Nadir working
          > then I am good to go do a whole bunch of shooting in the forest over
          > the next few weeks.

          Here is a tutorial I just set up on how to take a perfect nadir.
          http://www.panoramas.dk/panorama/nadir/

          Unfortunatelly the 360 precision Adjuste is missing an important feature for this, It does
          not have a locking knob for the rotator.

          I just tried one a week ago and was surprised that this was not possible.
          This is in my opinion a large miss as I also find it important for transporting the tripod
          with the head on.
          Even if the click stops are very firm the panohead can easy rotate when you lean the
          tripod.

          Hans
        • Drew Fulton
          Sacha, Thanks for the suggestions. I agree with the lens statement. I started using a 14mm lens but was getting a whole lot of lens flare that I wasn t real
          Message 4 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
          • 0 Attachment
            Sacha,

            Thanks for the suggestions. I agree with the lens statement. I
            started using a 14mm lens but was getting a whole lot of lens flare
            that I wasn't real happy with. The lens took a bit of a drop a couple
            weeks ago and I think it is ok, but am not totally positive so
            switched to the 24mm. I unfortunately, don't own a fisheye though I
            see one in my future when I get home. However, that being said, I am
            trying to create some very high resolution for educational purposes.
            As of right now, we don't know exactly what our final product is going
            to look like but it looks like we will need high resolution files down
            the line. Since I only get one chance to shoot in the forest, I am
            working under the theory of shoot the highest quality and then
            downsize later if we don't need it but I can't come back and reshoot,
            at least not in the wet season.

            So, working with what I've got now. I don't have a tripod with a
            column that can go horizontally unfortunately so I am trying to
            fashion something this morning and run some tests. Any other
            suggestions or help working with the gear I have would be greatly
            appreciated.

            Thanks!

            Best,
            Drew


            On Aug 4, 2008, at 8:01 AM, Sacha Griffin wrote:

            > Your best bet is to use an thin aluminum spike or another person’s
            > finger.
            > Use it to mark the point of the lens in space, and re setup the tripod
            > offset.
            >
            > You will of course need a tripod with a movable center column to
            > swing your
            > camera back over this point. Its good to have a 5-10lb counter
            > weight so
            > everything doesn’t fall over.
            >
            > Handheld in a dark forest, isn’t going to cut it, unless you’ve
            > amped up
            > your iso, which of course will hurt the amazing quality you are
            > trying to
            > achieve.
            >
            > It’s very difficult in costa rican forest terrain, unless your spot
            > is very
            > level. I’d say also you’ve chosen the wrong lens for the job.
            >
            > 24 is WAAY to long. Unless you want to print an 10 foot wide image at
            > 300dpi. Its much better to drop down to 10mm fisheye on a crop
            > camera or 15
            > fisheye on a full frame.
            >
            > This will make the nadir process much easier, and cover more ground.
            > In the
            > rainforest shots, there is probably a lot of moving vegetation close
            > to the
            > camera, so you’re going to end up with a mountain of retouching work,
            > getting leaves and branches back where they should be.
            >
            >
            >
            > If you can position the camera semi well back over the npp spot, you
            > can use
            > a viewpoint correction to do the rest of the work.
            >
            > Using the finger trick, you can achieve good enough precision for a
            > shot
            > like this.
            >
            > http://southern-digital.com/noblemanor/360/index.php?id=2
            >
            >
            >
            > Also it maybe possible to flip the vertical arm on your head,
            > (depending on
            > the head) and moving the tripod only. Eliminating the need for using
            > the
            > center column as a camera boom. Then you won’t need to get the
            > vertical
            > precision.
            >
            >
            >
            > The rest of the problems should be retouchable.
            >
            > Good luck. If you need further help, I’m more than willing to fly
            > right in
            > to help you out!
            >
            >
            >
            > Pura vida!
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > Sacha Griffin
            >
            > Southern Digital Solutions LLC
            >
            > http://www.southern-digital.com
            >
            > http://www.seeit360.net
            >
            > 404-551-4275
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
            > [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com] On
            > Behalf Of Drew Fulton
            > Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 8:57 AM
            > To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
            > Subject: [PanoToolsNG] Struggling with Nadir Shot
            >
            >
            >
            > Hey Everybody,
            >
            > I am fairly new to this and am hoping for some help. I am currently
            > shooting some spherical panos in the cloud forests of Costa Rica and I
            > am failing when it comes to covering the tripod with a handheld nadir
            > shot. I am hoping some folks can offer some suggestions.
            >
            > I am shooting with a 360Precision Adjuste, Nikon D3, and Nikon 24-70mm
            > f2.8 lens at 24mm. I am stitching with PtGui Pro and finishing up
            > with Photoshop CS3. So now you know what I have at my disposal.
            >
            > I shoot 8 shots at 0°, 8 at 60° and 8 at -60°. Shoot Raw, convert to
            > Tiff, stitch with PtGui and a great template. The results look great
            > except I still have the tripod.
            >
            > I am trying to shoot a handheld shot afterwards but I am having
            > several issues. First, I am working in a very dark forest which makes
            > handholding difficult. Second, the plants on the ground tend to move
            > a bit when I remove the tripod so trying to stitch in PtGui doesn't
            > really work with manually set control points. I have tried to do
            > remap in PtGui (90 yaw, 90 pitch) and then touch up in Photoshop but
            > with no success.
            >
            > I am really struggling here and would love any suggestions anyone
            > might have to simplify this process. If I can get the Nadir working
            > then I am good to go do a whole bunch of shooting in the forest over
            > the next few weeks.
            >
            > Thanks!
            >
            > Best,
            > Drew
            >
            > Canopy in the Clouds: Science Education that Starts at the Top
            > http://www.canopyintheclouds.com
            >
            > Drew Fulton Photography
            > 1511 S. Texas Ave, PMB 149
            > College Station, TX 77840
            > http://www.drewfulton.com
            > ph: 979.764.4164
            > c: 321.230.6212
            > drew@... <mailto:drew%40drewfulton.com>
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            >
            >
            > ------------------------------------
            >
            > --
            >
            >
            >
          • Drew Fulton
            Hans, This looks like exactly what I am looking for. I ll give it a try here in a couple minutes. Thanks! Drew
            Message 5 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
            • 0 Attachment
              Hans,

              This looks like exactly what I am looking for. I'll give it a try
              here in a couple minutes. Thanks!

              Drew

              On Aug 4, 2008, at 9:04 AM, Hans Nyberg wrote:

              > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Drew Fulton <drew@...> wrote:
              >
              >> I am trying to shoot a handheld shot afterwards but I am having
              >> several issues. First, I am working in a very dark forest which
              >> makes
              >> handholding difficult. Second, the plants on the ground tend to move
              >> a bit when I remove the tripod so trying to stitch in PtGui doesn't
              >> really work with manually set control points. I have tried to do
              >> remap in PtGui (90 yaw, 90 pitch) and then touch up in Photoshop but
              >> with no success.
              >>
              >> I am really struggling here and would love any suggestions anyone
              >> might have to simplify this process. If I can get the Nadir working
              >> then I am good to go do a whole bunch of shooting in the forest over
              >> the next few weeks.
              >
              > Here is a tutorial I just set up on how to take a perfect nadir.
              > http://www.panoramas.dk/panorama/nadir/
              >
              > Unfortunatelly the 360 precision Adjuste is missing an important
              > feature for this, It does
              > not have a locking knob for the rotator.
              >
              > I just tried one a week ago and was surprised that this was not
              > possible.
              > This is in my opinion a large miss as I also find it important for
              > transporting the tripod
              > with the head on.
              > Even if the click stops are very firm the panohead can easy rotate
              > when you lean the
              > tripod.
              >
              > Hans
              >
              >
              > ------------------------------------
              >
              > --
              >
              >
              >
            • Hans Nyberg
              ... Be careful, as I said the Adjuste can easy turn around. Hans
              Message 6 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
              • 0 Attachment
                --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Drew Fulton <drew@...> wrote:
                >
                > Hans,
                >
                > This looks like exactly what I am looking for. I'll give it a try
                > here in a couple minutes. Thanks!


                Be careful, as I said the Adjuste can easy turn around.

                Hans
              • John Riley
                ... Maybe a little duct tape can keep it from rotating? And Hans, what do you mean in your tutorial when you say you can use a spigot on the monopod? At
                Message 7 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                • 0 Attachment
                  On Aug 4, 2008, at 11:24 AM, Hans Nyberg wrote:

                  > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Drew Fulton <drew@...> wrote:
                  > >
                  > > Hans,
                  > >
                  > > This looks like exactly what I am looking for. I'll give it a try
                  > > here in a couple minutes. Thanks!
                  >
                  > Be careful, as I said the Adjuste can easy turn around.
                  >
                  > Hans

                  Maybe a little duct tape can keep it from rotating? And Hans, what
                  do you mean in your tutorial when you say you can use a spigot on the
                  monopod? At least in american english, a spigot is the thing water
                  comes out of in a sink. Do you mean a clamp of some sort? Very good
                  ideas in your tutorial. I will have to try that with my Absolute
                  head (and have some duct tape to lock the head too.)

                  Drew, I wish I were in Costa Rica so I could come see your work.
                  This is only the second time in 10 years I haven't been there for the
                  summer 8-( My wife is a Tica and, in fact, her mother just returned
                  from CR three days ago. You picked a really wet time of the year to
                  be shooting! Which area are you in? Monteverde?

                  John


                  John Riley
                  johnriley@...
                  jriley@...



                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Hans Nyberg
                  ... Sorry I meant a spike. Thanks for the correction. Hans
                  Message 8 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                  • 0 Attachment
                    --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, John Riley <johnriley@...> wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > On Aug 4, 2008, at 11:24 AM, Hans Nyberg wrote:
                    >
                    > > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Drew Fulton <drew@> wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > Hans,
                    > > >
                    > > > This looks like exactly what I am looking for. I'll give it a try
                    > > > here in a couple minutes. Thanks!
                    > >
                    > > Be careful, as I said the Adjuste can easy turn around.
                    > >
                    > > Hans
                    >
                    > Maybe a little duct tape can keep it from rotating? And Hans, what
                    > do you mean in your tutorial when you say you can use a spigot on the
                    > monopod? At least in american english, a spigot is the thing water
                    > comes out of in a sink. Do you mean a clamp of some sort? Very good
                    > ideas in your tutorial. I will have to try that with my Absolute
                    > head (and have some duct tape to lock the head too.)

                    Sorry I meant a spike. Thanks for the correction.
                    Hans
                  • Mark D. Fink
                    Hans, Great tutorial, especially if people don t have the Pro version of PTGui that allows viewpoint correction. If you do have PTGui Pro, AND
                    Message 9 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Hans,

                      Great tutorial, especially if people don't have the Pro version of PTGui
                      that allows viewpoint correction.

                      <shameless plug>
                      If you do have PTGui Pro, AND you're not already in Costa Rica in the midst
                      of a shoot, :o) the Pinnacle VR has an option that makes shooting the nadir
                      very easy. I've been using it extensively these last few months, and cringe
                      when I look at my old work where I used a clone tool to fake my nadirs. You
                      can see the relevant details at position 4:40 in the video I have on my site
                      - http://www.pinnacle-vr.com
                      </shameless plug>

                      However, if you are working with uneven terrain, this approach doesn't work
                      nearly as well as yours, Hans. PTGui Pro can handle some variation in
                      topography, but not a lot of it.

                      Mark
                      www.pinnacle-vr.com
                      www.nyc.360cities.net
                      www.northernlight.net

                      >Here is a tutorial I just set up on how to take a perfect nadir.
                      >http://www.panoramas.dk/panorama/nadir/
                      >
                      >Unfortunatelly the 360 precision Adjuste is missing an important feature
                      >for this, It does
                      >not have a locking knob for the rotator.
                      >
                      >I just tried one a week ago and was surprised that this was not possible.
                      >This is in my opinion a large miss as I also find it important for
                      >transporting the tripod
                      >with the head on.
                      >Even if the click stops are very firm the panohead can easy rotate when you
                      >lean the
                      >tripod.
                      >
                      >Hans
                      >
                    • Drew Fulton
                      John, I am currently working on a project here in Monteverde. We have been here about 4 weeks and have 3 to go. It is quite a wet time but when you are
                      Message 10 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                      • 0 Attachment
                        John,

                        I am currently working on a project here in Monteverde. We have been
                        here about 4 weeks and have 3 to go. It is quite a wet time but when
                        you are working with someone researching clouds, its a good time to be
                        here. We will be returning again in February/March so will have a
                        comparison of the dry season as well. Check out our site, http://www.canopyintheclouds.com
                        to see some photos, video and learn a lot more about the project.

                        Its a mighty tough place to work as everything is so dark and wet.
                        Add the fact that I am often working dangling by rope in the top of
                        the tree and things get really tough. Did get about 5 hours in a
                        giant fig with a troop of Howler Monkeys last week. Quite an
                        experience.

                        Once I get this nadir thing sorted, which I am nearly there thanks to
                        Hans, the next step is taking the whole rig into the tree. Hae some
                        ideas on how to make it work but keeping myself out of the pano isn't
                        as easy on the ground. Can't just walk around but have to move all of
                        my ropes as well. Should be quite a challenge and will post here once
                        I get one up, hopefully later this week.

                        I just want to say thanks to all those who have supported this
                        project. Matt at 360Precision provided the heads and Joost provided a
                        copy of PtGui for my use. I couldn't be doing it without there
                        support. Thanks again.

                        Best,
                        Drew


                        On Aug 4, 2008, at 10:55 AM, John Riley wrote:

                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > On Aug 4, 2008, at 11:24 AM, Hans Nyberg wrote:
                        >
                        >> --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Drew Fulton <drew@...> wrote:
                        >>>
                        >>> Hans,
                        >>>
                        >>> This looks like exactly what I am looking for. I'll give it a try
                        >>> here in a couple minutes. Thanks!
                        >>
                        >> Be careful, as I said the Adjuste can easy turn around.
                        >>
                        >> Hans
                        >
                        > Maybe a little duct tape can keep it from rotating? And Hans, what
                        > do you mean in your tutorial when you say you can use a spigot on the
                        > monopod? At least in american english, a spigot is the thing water
                        > comes out of in a sink. Do you mean a clamp of some sort? Very good
                        > ideas in your tutorial. I will have to try that with my Absolute
                        > head (and have some duct tape to lock the head too.)
                        >
                        > Drew, I wish I were in Costa Rica so I could come see your work.
                        > This is only the second time in 10 years I haven't been there for the
                        > summer 8-( My wife is a Tica and, in fact, her mother just returned
                        > from CR three days ago. You picked a really wet time of the year to
                        > be shooting! Which area are you in? Monteverde?
                        >
                        > John
                        >
                        >
                        > John Riley
                        > johnriley@...
                        > jriley@...
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        >
                        >
                        > ------------------------------------
                        >
                        > --
                        >
                        >
                        >
                      • Sacha Griffin
                        Fantastic setup. I d say it d require an assistant or an extra level of care reserved for certain types of people. I guarantee if I shot like that alone, I d
                        Message 11 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                        • 0 Attachment
                          Fantastic setup. I'd say it'd require an assistant or an extra level of care
                          reserved for certain types of people.

                          I guarantee if I shot like that alone, I'd knock into it one day and topple
                          it over.

                          The good part about yours, is that you reserve the max shooting height
                          mostly.

                          Whereas using the center column, (for tripods with a rotatable/angelable
                          center column) you sacrifice the max height of the system. So you can't
                          shoot your normal shots with the center column fully extended.

                          An example tripod would be the gitzo 2220.

                          However, I am not a tall person, so I rarely shoot at max height anyway.



                          The good part about some fisheyes, is the lack of flare visible. Combined
                          with a rotated image with overlap, you can eliminate any visible flare in
                          the previous image.



                          Drew//

                          I started using a 14mm lens but was getting a whole lot of lens flare
                          that I wasn't real happy with.



                          The nodal ninja5 is lockable in all positions, however, the horizontal arm
                          is just not long enough to flip the vertical assembly using a 5d 10.5 combo.
                          This flip allows the head to face on the other side of the center of the
                          tripod. You may not able point straight down and clear the entire tripod
                          hole, but you maybe able to compensate using viewpoint correction.





                          Sacha Griffin

                          Southern Digital Solutions LLC

                          http://www.southern-digital.com

                          http://www.seeit360.net

                          404-551-4275











                          From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com] On
                          Behalf Of Hans Nyberg
                          Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 11:05 AM
                          To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                          Subject: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Struggling with Nadir Shot



                          --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com <mailto:PanoToolsNG%40yahoogroups.com> ,
                          Drew Fulton <drew@...> wrote:

                          > I am trying to shoot a handheld shot afterwards but I am having
                          > several issues. First, I am working in a very dark forest which makes
                          > handholding difficult. Second, the plants on the ground tend to move
                          > a bit when I remove the tripod so trying to stitch in PtGui doesn't
                          > really work with manually set control points. I have tried to do
                          > remap in PtGui (90 yaw, 90 pitch) and then touch up in Photoshop but
                          > with no success.
                          >
                          > I am really struggling here and would love any suggestions anyone
                          > might have to simplify this process. If I can get the Nadir working
                          > then I am good to go do a whole bunch of shooting in the forest over
                          > the next few weeks.

                          Here is a tutorial I just set up on how to take a perfect nadir.
                          http://www.panoramas.dk/panorama/nadir/

                          Unfortunatelly the 360 precision Adjuste is missing an important feature for
                          this, It does
                          not have a locking knob for the rotator.

                          I just tried one a week ago and was surprised that this was not possible.
                          This is in my opinion a large miss as I also find it important for
                          transporting the tripod
                          with the head on.
                          Even if the click stops are very firm the panohead can easy rotate when you
                          lean the
                          tripod.

                          Hans





                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • John Riley
                          ... Now, for that you need Ignacio Ferrando! Have you seen his unbelieveable how the heck did you do that?? panos made while mountain climbing, ice
                          Message 12 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                          • 0 Attachment
                            On Aug 4, 2008, at 1:18 PM, Drew Fulton wrote:

                            > Once I get this nadir thing sorted, which I am nearly there thanks to
                            > Hans, the next step is taking the whole rig into the tree. Hae some
                            > ideas on how to make it work but keeping myself out of the pano isn't
                            > as easy on the ground. Can't just walk around but have to move all of
                            > my ropes as well. Should be quite a challenge and will post here once
                            > I get one up, hopefully later this week.

                            Now, for that you need Ignacio Ferrando! Have you seen his
                            unbelieveable "how the heck did you do that??" panos made while
                            mountain climbing, ice climbing, outside a helicopter, etc, etc? He
                            would be the go-to guy for something like that!

                            Good luck and enjoy the adventure. Pura Vida!

                            John

                            John Riley
                            johnriley@...
                            jriley@...




                            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                          • Mark D. Fink
                            Drew, This sounds like a FANTASTIC trip! Being somewhat literal minded, I got a kick out of your comment that you got about 5 hours in a giant fig with a
                            Message 13 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Drew,

                              This sounds like a FANTASTIC trip! Being somewhat literal minded, I got a
                              kick out of your comment that you got "about 5 hours in a giant fig with a
                              troop of Howler Monkeys..." OK, so you meant a fig TREE, but I like my
                              version of it better. (Had no idea figs grew that big - is Nabisco aware of
                              this...)

                              Regarding shooting from the trees, do you mean setting up a tripod on a
                              large branch, or suspended? If you are suspended, could you shoot free-hand
                              while hanging upside down? Then, you'd have a zenith patch to do, but as
                              long as you aren't too close to any of the detail, freehand might work. I'd
                              probably pass out before finishing the sequence, what with all the blood
                              rushing to my head, but it would be interesting to try.

                              Mark
                              www.pinnacle-vr.com
                              www.nyc.360cities.net
                              www.northernlight.net


                              >-----Original Message-----
                              >From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com] On
                              >Behalf Of Drew Fulton
                              >Sent: Monday, August 04, 2008 1:18 PM
                              >To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
                              >Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] Re: Struggling with Nadir Shot
                              >
                              >John,
                              >
                              >I am currently working on a project here in Monteverde. We have been
                              >here about 4 weeks and have 3 to go. It is quite a wet time but when
                              >you are working with someone researching clouds, its a good time to be
                              >here. We will be returning again in February/March so will have a
                              >comparison of the dry season as well. Check out our site,
                              >http://www.canopyintheclouds.com
                              > to see some photos, video and learn a lot more about the project.
                              >
                              >Its a mighty tough place to work as everything is so dark and wet.
                              >Add the fact that I am often working dangling by rope in the top of
                              >the tree and things get really tough. Did get about 5 hours in a
                              >giant fig with a troop of Howler Monkeys last week. Quite an
                              >experience.
                              >
                              >Once I get this nadir thing sorted, which I am nearly there thanks to
                              >Hans, the next step is taking the whole rig into the tree. Hae some
                              >ideas on how to make it work but keeping myself out of the pano isn't
                              >as easy on the ground. Can't just walk around but have to move all of
                              >my ropes as well. Should be quite a challenge and will post here once
                              >I get one up, hopefully later this week.
                              >
                              >I just want to say thanks to all those who have supported this
                              >project. Matt at 360Precision provided the heads and Joost provided a
                              >copy of PtGui for my use. I couldn't be doing it without there
                              >support. Thanks again.
                              >
                              >Best,
                              >Drew
                              >
                              >
                              >On Aug 4, 2008, at 10:55 AM, John Riley wrote:
                              >
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> On Aug 4, 2008, at 11:24 AM, Hans Nyberg wrote:
                              >>
                              >>> --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, Drew Fulton <drew@...> wrote:
                              >>>>
                              >>>> Hans,
                              >>>>
                              >>>> This looks like exactly what I am looking for. I'll give it a try
                              >>>> here in a couple minutes. Thanks!
                              >>>
                              >>> Be careful, as I said the Adjuste can easy turn around.
                              >>>
                              >>> Hans
                              >>
                              >> Maybe a little duct tape can keep it from rotating? And Hans, what
                              >> do you mean in your tutorial when you say you can use a spigot on the
                              >> monopod? At least in american english, a spigot is the thing water
                              >> comes out of in a sink. Do you mean a clamp of some sort? Very good
                              >> ideas in your tutorial. I will have to try that with my Absolute
                              >> head (and have some duct tape to lock the head too.)
                              >>
                              >> Drew, I wish I were in Costa Rica so I could come see your work.
                              >> This is only the second time in 10 years I haven't been there for the
                              >> summer 8-( My wife is a Tica and, in fact, her mother just returned
                              >> from CR three days ago. You picked a really wet time of the year to
                              >> be shooting! Which area are you in? Monteverde?
                              >>
                              >> John
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> John Riley
                              >> johnriley@...
                              >> jriley@...
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                              >>
                              >>
                              >> ------------------------------------
                              >>
                              >> --
                              >>
                              >>
                              >>
                              >
                              >
                              >------------------------------------
                              >
                              >--
                              >
                              >
                              >
                            • Erik Krause
                              ... Like that: http://pano.erik-krause.de/gardens/index.htm ? best regards Erik Krause http://www.erik-krause.de
                              Message 14 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                              • 0 Attachment
                                On Monday, August 04, 2008 at 11:18, Drew Fulton wrote:

                                > Once I get this nadir thing sorted, which I am nearly there thanks to
                                > Hans, the next step is taking the whole rig into the tree.

                                Like that: http://pano.erik-krause.de/gardens/index.htm ?

                                best regards
                                Erik Krause
                                http://www.erik-krause.de
                              • Drew Fulton
                                Something like that, except 20-30m/60-100 feet off the ground... Drew
                                Message 15 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Something like that, except 20-30m/60-100 feet off the ground...

                                  Drew

                                  On Aug 4, 2008, at 11:55 AM, Erik Krause wrote:

                                  > On Monday, August 04, 2008 at 11:18, Drew Fulton wrote:
                                  >
                                  >> Once I get this nadir thing sorted, which I am nearly there thanks to
                                  >> Hans, the next step is taking the whole rig into the tree.
                                  >
                                  > Like that: http://pano.erik-krause.de/gardens/index.htm ?
                                  >
                                  > best regards
                                  > Erik Krause
                                  > http://www.erik-krause.de
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > ------------------------------------
                                  >
                                  > --
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                • Erik Krause
                                  ... Shootin in a tree is very tricky, because there usually is near foreground which causes heavy parallax errors. You could fix a monopod to some branches
                                  Message 16 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    On Monday, August 04, 2008 at 11:18, Drew Fulton wrote:

                                    > Hae some
                                    > ideas on how to make it work but keeping myself out of the pano isn't
                                    > as easy on the ground. Can't just walk around but have to move all of
                                    > my ropes as well. Should be quite a challenge and will post here once
                                    > I get one up, hopefully later this week.

                                    Shootin in a tree is very tricky, because there usually is near
                                    foreground which causes heavy parallax errors. You could fix a
                                    monopod to some branches like I did for the cherries shot. For the
                                    nadir shot I fixed it to some other branches. Befor I did that I
                                    carefully measured the distance of the NPP from some marked points
                                    and tried to put it in the same place after. Perhaps some laser
                                    pointers would do an even better job.

                                    Another idea would be you hang the camera on a monopod below you. If
                                    you add some extra weights you might balance the whole thing such,
                                    that the NPP hangs exactly below the end of the monopod, which would
                                    allow for simply rotating it around the center of gravity. If you use
                                    a fisheye lens and point it slightly down, you probably won't need a
                                    nadir shot, but then you'll have the Problems with the zenith shot.

                                    You need a cable release of course. I used a quite long one which
                                    reached to any positions I'm visible. Camera was set to self timer
                                    mode of course, allowing me to drop the cable and do something...

                                    In any case it's a good idea to shoot with very large overlap. This
                                    increases the chance to find some details you need for retouche.

                                    best regards
                                    Erik Krause
                                    http://www.erik-krause.de
                                  • Erik Krause
                                    ... 400m: http://pano.erik-krause.de/verdon/index.htm ;-) Erik Krause http://www.erik-krause.de
                                    Message 17 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      On Monday, August 04, 2008 at 12:01, Drew Fulton wrote:

                                      > Something like that, except 20-30m/60-100 feet off the ground...

                                      400m: http://pano.erik-krause.de/verdon/index.htm ;-)
                                      Erik Krause
                                      http://www.erik-krause.de
                                    • crane@ukonline.co.uk
                                      ... I m planning making a panorama from inside the basket of a hot air balloon next week. I thought to use 2 monopods. one with the mrotatorCP which is at 30
                                      Message 18 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        Quoting Drew Fulton <drew@...>:

                                        > Something like that, except 20-30m/60-100 feet off the ground...

                                        I'm planning making a panorama from inside the basket of a hot air balloon
                                        next week.

                                        I thought to use 2 monopods.
                                        one with the mrotatorCP which is at 30 degree slant and the other with an arm
                                        on the end so the camera is looking back with nothing in the way.

                                        I will stick the pole out of the basket horizontally maybe using a boat
                                        rollock for support and turn the monopod to take 4-6 photos then put the
                                        camera on the other monopod and try to get the camera in the same place to
                                        shoot what will be the nadir.
                                        Everything needs to be clipped to a harness of course.

                                        I guess you could do a similar thing using a branch for support.
                                        and maybe have your ropes on the other side of the trunk of the tree.

                                        regards


                                        mick


                                        ----------------------------------------------
                                        This mail sent through http://www.ukonline.net
                                      • John Riley
                                        ... Mark, these fig trees aren t any thing like you are used to in the U.S.! They are way cool and HUGE. They start out as an epiphyte growing on the tree,
                                        Message 19 of 21 , Aug 4, 2008
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          On Aug 4, 2008, at 1:53 PM, Mark D. Fink wrote:

                                          > Drew,
                                          >
                                          > This sounds like a FANTASTIC trip! Being somewhat literal minded, I
                                          > got a
                                          > kick out of your comment that you got "about 5 hours in a giant fig
                                          > with a
                                          > troop of Howler Monkeys..." OK, so you meant a fig TREE, but I like my
                                          > version of it better. (Had no idea figs grew that big - is Nabisco
                                          > aware of
                                          > this...)
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > Mark
                                          > www.pinnacle-vr.com
                                          > www.nyc.360cities.net
                                          > www.northernlight.net

                                          Mark, these fig trees aren't any thing like you are used to in the
                                          U.S.! They are way cool and HUGE. They start out as an epiphyte
                                          growing on the tree, which drops vines that grow way down to the
                                          ground. Near the ground, they encircle the tree and take root. Then
                                          the vines meld together and eventually totally envelop the tree. It
                                          grows limbs and leaves and becomes a tree itself, killing the host
                                          tree inside. It is wild to see these huge vine-tree things, which
                                          you usually can see through the gaps to the hollow interior.

                                          There is a pretty amazing one in the area where drew is: <http://
                                          www.costaricatravelscout.com/the-strangler-fig-tree.html>. The cloud
                                          forest is so cool and spooky looking. I am jealous of his adventure!

                                          John


                                          John Riley
                                          johnriley@...
                                          jriley@...




                                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                                        • Mark D. Fink
                                          ... Simply amazing! I liked the reference to the Lord of the Rings. I can just imagine a hobbit climbing up inside one of those. Reminiscent of Mirkwood...
                                          Message 20 of 21 , Aug 6, 2008
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            >
                                            > Mark, these fig trees aren't any thing like you are used to in the
                                            > U.S.! They are way cool and HUGE. They start out as an epiphyte
                                            > growing on the tree, which drops vines that grow way down to the
                                            > ground. Near the ground, they encircle the tree and take root. Then
                                            > the vines meld together and eventually totally envelop the tree. It
                                            > grows limbs and leaves and becomes a tree itself, killing the host
                                            > tree inside. It is wild to see these huge vine-tree things, which
                                            > you usually can see through the gaps to the hollow interior.
                                            >
                                            > There is a pretty amazing one in the area where drew is: <http://
                                            > www.costaricatravelscout.com/the-strangler-fig-tree.html>. The cloud
                                            > forest is so cool and spooky looking. I am jealous of his adventure!
                                            >
                                            > John
                                            >
                                            Simply amazing! I liked the reference to the Lord of the Rings. I can just
                                            imagine a hobbit climbing up inside one of those. Reminiscent of Mirkwood...

                                            Mark
                                            www.pinnacle-vr.com
                                            www.nyc.360cities.net
                                            www.northernlight.net
                                          Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.