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Re: [PanoToolsNG] Re: File Format-

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  • Ken Warner
    BTW: Java has codecs (coder/decoders) for JPEG2000 and JPEG-LS which may be an even better way to compress in some situations. The problem is that is an extra
    Message 1 of 97 , Jun 25, 2008
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      BTW: Java has codecs (coder/decoders) for JPEG2000 and JPEG-LS which may
      be an even better way to compress in some situations. The problem is that
      is an extra client side install to install the JPEG2000 codecs.

      I've been proding the Java development team to include the decoder in the
      standard JRE (plugin) for about 3 years now. But there is a lot of resistance
      to the idea.

      If camera makers start supporting in camera JPEG2000 compression, that would
      be a big help in promoting JPEG2000 as a compression standard.

      JPEG2000 is good stuff...

      bohonus wrote:
      > Erik (and others as well),
      >
      > Download and have a look at this file-
      >
      > "save link to disk" will work best.
      >
      > http:www.bohonus.com/temp/File_687.pano_95.jp2
      >
      >
      > The above is a JPEG2000 file made from a single 6,000 x 28,809 500MB panoramic Tiff
      > image (8bits per channel). It has been compressed down to about 30MB using a quality
      > level setting of 95 out of 100. A quality setting of 50 brings the size down to 8MB (yes 8).
      > The image artifacts aren't too bad at such a high compression ration, but you would be
      > better served with higher quality settings to retain detail. A lossless option (also available
      > as part of JPEG2000 spec) will create a file of about 200MB.
      >
      > This is a multi-resolution, variable access streaming file. The format also supports higher
      > bit depths, color profiles, vector layers (think scalable hot spots!), XML "boxes" for
      > including complete XML metadata structures (like what is currently being done with GML
      > etc). There is a great number of other possibilities that I couldn't possible iterate here.
      > Does it sound like Quicktime a bit? That is because it is a direct (and evolutionary) descendant of Quicktime.
      >
      > Why is this of interest to me now?
      >
      > The above file was created in a single pass with my Panoscan camera. I have had this
      > capability for over four years now to create such large and detailed files for panoramic vr.
      > The problem was that there was no technology to view such images in their correct form.
      > This has started to change recently with the development of vr panorama viewers that are
      > presently using directories of tiled images (which is understandable because it is a simpler
      > approach for just starting out). There have been other high-resolution image viewers for
      > nearly 10 years, but they did not take into consideration the additional data and display
      > requirements for interactive panoramas. There are entire industry segments that are
      > currently utilizing or adopting this format (or one's like it). Single file, embedded data such
      > as XML and other media types, multi-resolution etc.
      >
      > Because what we do with creating interactive panoramas is rather small compared to what
      > is being generated by other industries driving these formats, I wouldn't want us and what
      > we produce to get "overlooked" by those who are developing this format or others like it.
      >
      > I am not even saying it should necessarily be JPEG2000 for panoramas, as there could be
      > other formats that will crop up that could be a nice option. But there is much activity and
      > work being pursued in this area and it might be worth looking into what could be possible
      > for us. The current resources and people dedicated to working this stuff out are very high
      > caliber. They have considered and worked out issues that are way way beyond anything
      > being discussed on this list. It would be negligible of us not to have a look at what they
      > are doing and consider how this all might benefit the interactive panoramas we create.
      >
      > By the way- to open this file?
      >
      > You may have trouble with photoshop and not enough memory. Try a dedicated JPEG200
      > viewer like this free one for example (Windows & Mac):
      >
      > http://www.lizardtech.com/download/dl_options.php?page=viewers
      >
      > Download the "ExpressView Browser Plug-in (MrSID)" file.
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "Erik Krause" <erik.krause@...> wrote:
      >
      >>On Wednesday, June 25, 2008 at 10:27, aiwetir wrote:
      >>
      >>
      >>>>different resolutions for QT, SWF and Immervision
      >>>>strips each in one go, a second go creates immervision preview.
      >>>>Alternatively equirects for PTViewer are resized using ImageMagick
      >>>>optionally as PTViewer slices (with only one convert call).
      >>>
      >>>thank you for restating the problem erik ;)
      >>
      >>Ok, I probably misunderstood you. Could you specify what exactly you
      >>want inside the file?
      >>
      >>best regards
      >>Erik Krause
      >>http://www.erik-krause.de
      >>
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
    • Fulvio Senore
      Many thanks to all those who took the time to test the pano. I suppose than now I have some useful info. Loading in Windows computers is usually very fast, so
      Message 97 of 97 , Jul 2, 2008
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        Many thanks to all those who took the time to test the pano.
        I suppose than now I have some useful info.

        Loading in Windows computers is usually very fast, so I suppose that the
        slow loading is caused by the internet connection. Unless java on Mac is
        hopeless, of course.

        At the moment there is no point in having a larger pano, since the
        current implementation of java has not enough memory available to store
        a larger image.

        I hope that I will be able to prepare something in the next months.

        Fulvio Senore


        Uri Cogan ha scritto:
        > Fulvio Senore wrote:
        >
        >
        >
        >> So I am curious. Here is an old sample of a rather large java pano:
        >> http://www.fsoft.it/panorama/PTViewer/PTVTest/Prova5000.html
        >> <http://www.fsoft.it/panorama/PTViewer/PTVTest/Prova5000.html>
        >> May anybody test it with a Mac, just to report if it is fast enough?
        >> I am confident that, on modern computers, the speed could be easily
        >> doubled.
        >>
        >>
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > It would be interesting to see a full-screen Java pano. Your sample Took
        > 25 seconds to load fully - this probably depends on the connection speed
        > rather than on Java itself. panning and zooming were quite smooth.
        >
        > Mac Pro Intel dual processor 2 Ghz, Mac OS 10.5.3, Safari browser.
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        > ------------------------------------
        >
        >
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