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AW: [PanoToolsNG] Re: New samples made with the Sigma 4.5mm + Nikon D300.

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  • ptgroup
    Keith I would go for a Sunex or Sigma 8 @ 60° slanted (Lucas method). This I found out is a perfect way on monopods - gives you plenty of overlap and a very
    Message 1 of 15 , Mar 2, 2008
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      Keith
      I would go for a Sunex or Sigma 8 @ 60� slanted (Lucas method).
      This I found out is a perfect way on monopods - gives you plenty of overlap
      and
      a very good quality.
      The Sunex looks quite interesting too - but 3 to shoot is nearly the same as
      with a Sigma 8 slanted,
      so you don�t have such an advantage.
      Besides: I tried a Sigma 8 @ 60� --> it will go with 3 shots on a Nikon, not
      so on a Canon.
      Maybe it�s because my 120� where not precise enough- Canon does not fogive
      2-5 � error as Nikon does.
      But 4 shots - perfect.

      Ciao
      Mike
      http://www.360de.de

      -----Urspr�ngliche Nachricht-----
      Von: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]Im
      Auftrag von Keith Martin
      Gesendet: Sonntag, 2. M�rz 2008 13:02
      An: Roberto Gomez Torres; PanoTools NG Mailing List
      Betreff: [PanoToolsNG] Re: New samples made with the Sigma 4.5mm + Nikon
      D300.


      Sometime around 2/3/08 (at 11:08 +0100) Web-Connection GmbH said:

      >I think you have done a good selection to show hard light circumstances
      and
      >for my side the panoramas looks not to flat.

      They look fine to me as well. Impressive handling of difficult lighting.

      >What size do your panoramas measure at the end and could you show us one
      >original shot out the cam, I guess that would be very interesting for a
      few
      >of us?

      Absolutely! That would be *very* interesting for me. The workflow
      sounds nice and quick, and the results do look good - although it
      isn't possible from your pano to know how sharp and large things
      *could* be.
      I'm considering pitching for more access at more festivals to shoot
      panos, and a hand-held or monopod three or four-shot process sounds
      rather tempting for chaotic environments where my normal rig (tripod,
      360Precision & 10.5mm) is too crowd-unfriendly.
      It would be great to see a single original file and to know what your
      maximum pano size is with this lens and your D300.

      k



      No virus found in this outgoing message.
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      08:18


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Keith Martin
      ... Very useful feedback, thanks Mike. So the Sigma 8mm seems a possible front runner once more! Plenty of overlap is a vital point when dealing with festival
      Message 2 of 15 , Mar 2, 2008
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        Sometime around 2/3/08 (at 20:02 +0100) ptgroup said:

        >Keith
        >I would go for a Sunex or Sigma 8 @ 60° slanted (Lucas method).
        >This I found out is a perfect way on monopods - gives you plenty of overlap
        >and a very good quality.
        >The Sunex looks quite interesting too - but 3 to shoot is nearly the same as
        >with a Sigma 8 slanted

        Very useful feedback, thanks Mike. So the Sigma
        8mm seems a possible front runner once more!
        Plenty of overlap is a vital point when dealing
        with festival crowds. And shooting four around is
        easier to calculate than three.

        In practical terms, what does this process mean
        for the zenith and nadir? I'd be shooting with
        Nikon/Fuji S5Pro bodies. I prefer not to patch
        with 'graphic caps' if I can avoid it. And the
        Zenith would certainly be a particularly
        important part of shots taken in marquee tents or
        outdoors at night with lasers.

        k
      • ptgroup
        Keith, just as said before: just take a 60° roll and you CAN do with 6 shots without zenith & nadir problems (tripod not to count) . My tests came out bad on
        Message 3 of 15 , Mar 2, 2008
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          Keith,
          just as said before: just take a 60° roll and you CAN do with 6 shots
          without
          zenith & nadir problems (tripod not to count) .
          My tests came out bad on Canon and super on Nikon.
          (The reason is : I am out of NPP for ab . 6mm horizontal and ab. 4mm axial-
          this Canon does not forgive)
          Your play is little though and the overlap is not over the hole image sides
          as without 60° roll.
          If you do freehand or monopod -just take 4 - that gives you plenty of play.
          I had no need for a zenith- shot when pitched the system ab. 1 Nodal Ninja
          unit = 5 ° up.
          That worked fine even with Canon 1.6 crop.
          And with 4 shots you don´t use the "bad" areas of the lens.

          But honestly I must say that it was amazed of what came out with the Sunex -
          immediantely a perfect stitch
          with 3 shots. And plenty of overlap. The 2 shot test could be done- but
          that´s not what I was looking for.
          But I consider the 8mm to be a little better - has more information though.
          I would like to test the Sunex in practice - but where to do ???
          As far as I´ve seen there is no European distributor around - not to speak
          from the Hamburg area.
          You mentioned the easy setup - that speaks surely for the Sunex, the F 5.6
          is a little low- but your
          Fuji can easily raise a little ISO - did some yesterday with my 40D @ISO
          800 --> definately little noise
          and much more protected highlites. Should be close to the Fuji - NO Highlite
          Extension activated!!!
          This i do with my setup better I guess with lesser noise.
          May be we can convince someone to import Sunex :-) - then we´ll see.
          Ciao Mike
          http://www.360de.de

          BTW: Sigma is sold
          -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
          Von: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com]Im
          Auftrag von Keith Martin
          Gesendet: Sonntag, 2. März 2008 22:05
          An: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
          Betreff: Re: AW: [PanoToolsNG] Re: New samples made with the Sigma 4.5mm +
          Nikon D300.


          Sometime around 2/3/08 (at 20:02 +0100) ptgroup said:

          >Keith
          >I would go for a Sunex or Sigma 8 @ 60° slanted (Lucas method).
          >This I found out is a perfect way on monopods - gives you plenty of
          overlap
          >and a very good quality.
          >The Sunex looks quite interesting too - but 3 to shoot is nearly the same
          as
          >with a Sigma 8 slanted

          Very useful feedback, thanks Mike. So the Sigma
          8mm seems a possible front runner once more!
          Plenty of overlap is a vital point when dealing
          with festival crowds. And shooting four around is
          easier to calculate than three.

          In practical terms, what does this process mean
          for the zenith and nadir? I'd be shooting with
          Nikon/Fuji S5Pro bodies. I prefer not to patch
          with 'graphic caps' if I can avoid it. And the
          Zenith would certainly be a particularly
          important part of shots taken in marquee tents or
          outdoors at night with lasers.

          k





          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • ebig_foto
          A really nice set of images - a pleasure to see and good examples of handling difficult lighting. A couple questions: Were all images bracketed? How many
          Message 4 of 15 , Mar 2, 2008
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            A really nice set of images - a pleasure to see and good examples of
            handling difficult lighting.

            A couple questions:

            Were all images bracketed?

            How many bracketed shots did you use per image?

            Did you use a table tripod in the cafe?

            Isn't the cafe where the "real" decisions get made? ;-)

            Regards,
            Ed



            Roberto Gomez Torres wrote:
            >
            >
            > Here I have some new panorama samples made with the Sigma 4.5mm fisheye
            > and
            > the Nikon D300. This time I made some tests with bracketing and the new
            > Enfuse program.
            >
            > Mainly I tried with some difficult and hard lighting situations.
            >
            > ------------------
            >
            > The fourth panorama shows the room where the politicians of "El Oro" take
            > the most important decisions for the town.
            > And finally the fifth one shows the interior of an old train wagon
            > converted
            > to a nice Café (coffee shop), at there me and my friends who were on the
            > camping trip.
            >
            >
            >

            --
            View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/New-samples-made-with-the-Sigma-4.5mm-%2B-Nikon-D300.-tp15783989p15794281.html
            Sent from the PanoToolsNG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
          • Hans Nyberg
            ... http://www.360tacticalvr.co.uk/ But the price £562.50 ex Vat is higher than Nikkor 10.5 or Sigma 8mm not to talk about the Tokina 10-17mm which you can
            Message 5 of 15 , Mar 2, 2008
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              --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "ptgroup" <ptgroup@...> wrote:

              > As far as I´ve seen there is no European distributor around - not to speak
              > from the Hamburg area.

              http://www.360tacticalvr.co.uk/

              But the price £562.50 ex Vat is higher than Nikkor 10.5 or Sigma 8mm not to talk about the
              Tokina 10-17mm which you can buy in UK for around £299.95 including Vat

              Ok I have to say that the Nikkor 10.5mm is just £354.95 at Amazon
              360 Tactical VR wants £450.00 ex Vat

              Hans
            • Keith Martin
              ... I thought it would be. :-) Thanks for all the feedback, it is all very useful! Keith
              Message 6 of 15 , Mar 2, 2008
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                >BTW: Sigma is sold

                I thought it would be. :-)

                Thanks for all the feedback, it is all very useful!

                Keith
              • panokaemena@mac.com
                Here some prices in Germany Tokina from 477 Euros onwards Nikon 10.5
                Message 7 of 15 , Mar 3, 2008
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                  Here some prices in Germany

                  Tokina
                  <http://www.preistrend.de/suchen.php?q=Tokina+10-17&s=0&a=&z=&x=20&y=5>
                  from 477 Euros onwards

                  Nikon 10.5
                  <http://www.preistrend.de/suchen.php?q=Nikon+10.5&s=0&a=&z=&x=0&y=0>
                  from 655 Euro onwards


                  Sigma 8/3.5
                  <http://www.preistrend.de/suchen.php?q=Sigma+8mm&s=0&a=&z=&x=34&y=3>
                  from 641 Euros onwards

                  Sigma 4.5
                  <http://www.preistrend.de/Preisvergleich_Sigma_EX_-_Fischaugenobjektiv_-_4_5_mm_-_f_2_8_DC_HSM__x72497F0A017D77.html
                  >
                  from 697 Euros onward

                  Willy Kaemena

                  http://homepage.mac.com/wkaemena/FSPanos/Menu268.html
                  http://bremen.360cities.net/
                  http://syria.360cities.net/
                  http://lisbon.360cities.net/


                  On Mar 3, 2008, at 1:20, Hans Nyberg wrote:

                  > --- In PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com, "ptgroup" <ptgroup@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > As far as I´ve seen there is no European distributor around - not
                  > to speak
                  > > from the Hamburg area.
                  >
                  > http://www.360tacticalvr.co.uk/
                  >
                  > But the price £562.50 ex Vat is higher than Nikkor 10.5 or Sigma 8mm
                  > not to talk about the
                  > Tokina 10-17mm which you can buy in UK for around £299.95 including
                  > Vat
                  >
                  > Ok I have to say that the Nikkor 10.5mm is just £354.95 at Amazon
                  > 360 Tactical VR wants £450.00 ex Vat
                  >
                  > Hans
                  >
                  >
                  >











                  Willy Kaemena

                  http://homepage.mac.com/wkaemena/FSPanos/Menu268.html
                  http://bremen.360cities.net/
                  http://syria.360cities.net/
                  http://lisbon.360cities.net/









                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Roberto Gomez Torres
                  Hi Keith, Thanks a lot for taking the time to view my panoramas. I really appreciated that. ... Enfuse is working great. ... The final equirectangular file I
                  Message 8 of 15 , Mar 3, 2008
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                    Hi Keith,

                    Thanks a lot for taking the time to view my panoramas.
                    I really appreciated that.

                    >> They look fine to me as well. Impressive handling of difficult lighting.

                    Enfuse is working great.

                    >> Absolutely! That would be *very* interesting for me. The workflow
                    >> sounds nice and quick, and the results do look good - although it
                    >> isn't possible from your pano to know how sharp and large things
                    >> *could* be.

                    The final equirectangular file I got is on average 4,500 x 2,500 pixels.

                    The lens will be very useful for quick photographic in crowded places like
                    you point. Also on small areas were a table tripod can be practical since
                    the setup can be fast and small.
                    One area where I can see big benefits is using it for pole panoramas. On my
                    next camping trip I will try to buy a nice pole and make some tests again
                    with this Sigma 4.5mm.

                    But for quality, resolution and sharpness I will continue to use my Nikon
                    10.5mm.
                    Each lens have it's pros and cons.


                    >> It would be great to see a single original file

                    Sure, no problem.
                    At my web site I have uploaded a NEF file for you to play with (10.7 MB) :

                    http://www.tiempo-digital.com/galeria/sigma_4_5_mm_sample.nef

                    Hope that helps.
                    ======================
                    Roberto Gómez Torres
                    Tiempo Digital
                    Mexico City, Mexico
                    www.tiempo-digital.com
                    ======================

                    Re: New samples made with the Sigma 4.5mm + Nikon D300.
                    Posted by: "Keith Martin" keith@... the1keith
                    Sun Mar 2, 2008 4:07 am (PST)
                    Sometime around 2/3/08 (at 11:08 +0100) Web-Connection GmbH said:

                    >I think you have done a good selection to show hard light circumstances and
                    >for my side the panoramas looks not to flat.

                    They look fine to me as well. Impressive handling of difficult lighting.

                    >What size do your panoramas measure at the end and could you show us one
                    >original shot out the cam, I guess that would be very interesting for a few
                    >of us?

                    Absolutely! That would be *very* interesting for me. The workflow
                    sounds nice and quick, and the results do look good - although it
                    isn't possible from your pano to know how sharp and large things
                    *could* be.
                    I'm considering pitching for more access at more festivals to shoot
                    panos, and a hand-held or monopod three or four-shot process sounds
                    rather tempting for chaotic environments where my normal rig (tripod,
                    360Precision & 10.5mm) is too crowd-unfriendly.
                    It would be great to see a single original file and to know what your
                    maximum pano size is with this lens and your D300.

                    k
                  • Roberto Gomez Torres
                    Hi Tommy, At the footer of all my panoramas I put the ISO setting and also the lens aperture used. When not using Bracketing also the time of the exposure. For
                    Message 9 of 15 , Mar 3, 2008
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                      Hi Tommy,

                      At the footer of all my panoramas I put the ISO setting and also the lens
                      aperture used.
                      When not using Bracketing also the time of the exposure.

                      For those tests I only used ISO 200 on the Nikon D300.

                      ======================
                      Roberto Gómez Torres
                      Tiempo Digital
                      Mexico City, Mexico
                      www.tiempo-digital.com
                      ======================

                      Re: New samples made with the Sigma 4.5mm + Nikon D300.
                      Posted by: "qsecofr88888" fatchai@... qsecofr88888

                      Sun Mar 2, 2008 5:43 am (PST)

                      nice pano. i also hope i can upgrade to d300 soon.
                      what iso did you use for your indoor pano?
                      cheers
                      tommy
                    • Roberto Gomez Torres
                      Hello Ed, ... Gracias amigo. ... Yes, all images were bracketed. The Nikon D300 maximum EV step that it allows are increments of 1 EV. So for the first two
                      Message 10 of 15 , Mar 3, 2008
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                        Hello Ed,

                        >> A really nice set of images - a pleasure to see
                        >> and good examples of handling difficult lighting.

                        Gracias amigo.

                        >> Were all images bracketed?
                        >> How many bracketed shots did you use per image?

                        Yes, all images were bracketed.

                        The Nikon D300 maximum EV step that it allows are increments of 1 EV.

                        So for the first two panoramas I used -4EV, -3EV, -2EV, -1EV, 0EV, +1EV,
                        +2EV, +3EV, +4EV (9 auto bracket images).
                        For the third one (outdoor) I used -2EV, -1EV, 0EV, +1EV (4 auto bracket
                        images).
                        For the fourth one I used -3EV, -2EV, -1EV, 0EV, +1EV, +2EV, +3EV (7 auto
                        bracket images).
                        And for the fifth one I used -2EV, -1EV, 0EV, +1EV, +2EV (5 auto bracket
                        image and hard instructions to my friends to not move).

                        >> Did you use a table tripod in the cafe?

                        Sure, I have a little Bogen Manfrotto table tripod that i like to use a lot.
                        Here you can find it :

                        http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/171046-REG/Bogen_Manfrotto_3007KIT_3007_Tabletop_Tripod_Kit.html


                        >> Isn't the cafe where the "real" decisions get made? ;-)

                        You are right !

                        ======================
                        Roberto Gómez Torres
                        Tiempo Digital
                        Mexico City, Mexico
                        www.tiempo-digital.com
                        ======================

                        Re: New samples made with the Sigma 4.5mm + Nikon D300.
                        Posted by: "ebig_foto" ebig_foto@... ebig_foto
                        Sun Mar 2, 2008 2:26 pm (PST)


                        A really nice set of images - a pleasure to see and good examples of
                        handling difficult lighting.

                        A couple questions:

                        Were all images bracketed?

                        How many bracketed shots did you use per image?

                        Did you use a table tripod in the cafe?

                        Isn't the cafe where the "real" decisions get made? ;-)

                        Regards,
                        Ed
                      • panokaemena@mac.com
                        Roberto , is the sample file still there?? I get only an error message Willy ... Willy Kaemena http://homepage.mac.com/wkaemena/FSPanos/Menu268.html
                        Message 11 of 15 , Mar 3, 2008
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                          Roberto , is the sample file still there?? I get only an error message

                          Willy
                          On Mar 4, 2008, at 6:45, Roberto Gomez Torres wrote:
                          >
                          > >> It would be great to see a single original file
                          >
                          > Sure, no problem.
                          > At my web site I have uploaded a NEF file for you to play with (10.7
                          > MB) :
                          >
                          > http://www.tiempo-digital.com/galeria/sigma_4_5_mm_sample.nef
                          >
                          > Hope that helps.
                          > ======================
                          > Roberto Gómez Torres
                          > Tiempo Digital
                          > Mexico City, Mexico
                          > www.tiempo-digital.com
                          > ======================
                          >
                          >

                          Willy Kaemena

                          http://homepage.mac.com/wkaemena/FSPanos/Menu268.html
                          http://bremen.360cities.net/
                          http://syria.360cities.net/
                          http://lisbon.360cities.net/









                          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                        • Roberto Gomez Torres
                          Hi Willy, Maybe a ZIP file should be better. Please try the following link instead: http://www.tiempo-digital.com/galeria/sigma_4_5_mm_sample.zip Hope that
                          Message 12 of 15 , Mar 4, 2008
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                            Hi Willy,

                            Maybe a ZIP file should be better.
                            Please try the following link instead:

                            http://www.tiempo-digital.com/galeria/sigma_4_5_mm_sample.zip


                            Hope that works.
                            ======================
                            Roberto Gómez Torres
                            Tiempo Digital
                            Mexico City, Mexico
                            www.tiempo-digital.com
                            ======================

                            Re: New samples made with the Sigma 4.5mm + Nikon D300.
                            Posted by: "panokaemena@..." panokaemena@... panokaemena
                            Tue Mar 4, 2008 12:00 am (PST)

                            Roberto , is the sample file still there?? I get only an error message

                            Willy
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