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Reasons NOT to post content on Google!

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  • Chris Thomas
    I d like to start a discussion, I think we should all be having. As creative people, we all too often rush to have our work displayed, printed and reproduced.
    Message 1 of 20 , Sep 2, 2007
      I'd like to start a discussion, I think we should all be having.

      As creative people, we all too often rush to have our work displayed,
      printed and reproduced.

      Sometimes, it's better to say NO! to people and organizations that "want to
      give you exposure" in return for little or nothing.

      Below is Article 11.. of Google's standard agreement.

      This is carte blanche for Google!

      Google escapes any legal responsibility for model & property releases, while
      getting the content provider

      to take full legal responsibility for everything... and paying nothing for
      content contribution!

      They repeatedly state throughout their "Standard Agreement" that they don't
      take copyright from their contributors (except as provided

      in Article 11)... below

      Bold emphasis is mine..

      "11. Content licence from you

      11.1 You retain copyright and any other rights you already hold in Content
      which you submit, post or display on or through, the Services. By
      submitting, posting or displaying the content you give Google a perpetual,
      irrevocable, worldwide, royalty-free, and non-exclusive licence to
      reproduce, adapt, modify, translate, publish, publicly perform, publicly
      display and distribute any Content which you submit, post or display on or
      through, the Services. This licence is for the sole purpose of enabling
      Google to display, distribute and promote the Services and may be revoked
      for certain Services as defined in the Additional Terms of those Services.

      11.2 You agree that this licence includes a right for Google to make such
      Content available to other companies, organizations or individuals with whom
      Google has relationships for the provision of syndicated services, and to
      use such Content in connection with the provision of those services.

      11.3 You understand that Google, in performing the required technical steps
      to provide the Services to our users, may (a) transmit or distribute your
      Content over various public networks and in various media; and (b) make such
      changes to your Content as are necessary to conform and adapt that Content
      to the technical requirements of connecting networks, devices, services or
      media. You agree that this licence shall permit Google to take these
      actions.

      11.4 You confirm and warrant to Google that you have all the rights, power
      and authority necessary to grant the above licence."

      They take everything... but leave the image owner with their copyright. now
      much used and tattered

      In short, without property and model releases, the contributor is at great
      risk, especially as it appears that Google can design any kind of

      service at anytime in the future and use our content as they please.

      This is crazy for content providers!



      Thoughts on this.



      Chris Thomas

      Photographer

      cell... 403-615-1212

      In North America

      call... 1-800-870-5110

      <http://www.christhomas.com/> http://www.christhomas.com





      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Yuval Levy
      Hi Chris, what Services does this Standard Agreement refer to? ... yes, I agree that such issues should be discussed and that content producers should be
      Message 2 of 20 , Sep 2, 2007
        Hi Chris,

        what "Services" does this "Standard Agreement" refer to?

        Chris Thomas wrote:
        > I'd like to start a discussion, I think we should all be having.

        yes, I agree that such issues should be discussed and that content
        producers should be aware of them.

        > Sometimes, it's better to say NO!

        indeed, better say an informed NO than an uninformed YES. Or an
        uniformed NO. So what "Services" are we talking of exactly?

        Maybe I am missing the point, but so far people on this list are using
        GoogleMap on their site, not the other way around. They are not
        submitting or posting their content to Google.

        Yuv
      • Chris Thomas
        Hi Yuv.. Google uses Services as a catch-all phrase. They ve defined it as any business activity they now, or in the future will undertake. In the instance
        Message 3 of 20 , Sep 2, 2007
          Hi Yuv..



          Google uses "Services" as a catch-all phrase. They've defined it as any
          business activity they now,

          or in the future will undertake.

          In the instance I'm referring to; their "Service" is to the person or
          organization that wants to. for example. post a picture

          to .., Google Earth via "Panoramio"



          In return for the "Service" of allowing the content provider to "upload".
          They take perpetual rights and can even make changes

          to content and use it in " yet to be dreamed of " ways in the future.



          If you were to post an equirectangular image for regular pano-type viewing,
          for example. There's nothing to stop them, from

          chopping it up into conventional print format and selling prints or making
          "Tiny Worlds" or spherical icons, or making

          any other use of it.. in some future "Service".



          Consider this:

          You post a Pano at some point in the future. There's a guy with his mistress
          arm in arm on a street in Paris.

          His wife sees it and a divorce ensues. Google gets sued.

          Google sues you. because you didn't have a model release.

          Under Article 11. you've agreed to be responsible.



          Providers of creative content. beware!

          I'm not a lawyer, but as a professional photographer.

          I'm more sensitive to copyright and release issues than the average "google
          content provider".



          Cheers

          chris



          Chris Thomas

          Photographer

          cell... 403-615-1212

          In North America

          call... 1-800-870-5110

          <http://www.christhomas.com/> http://www.christhomas.com



          -----Original Message-----
          From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com] On
          Behalf Of Yuval Levy
          Sent: Sunday, September 02, 2007 12:43 PM
          To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] Reasons NOT to post content on Google!



          Hi Chris,

          what "Services" does this "Standard Agreement" refer to?

          Chris Thomas wrote:
          > I'd like to start a discussion, I think we should all be having.

          yes, I agree that such issues should be discussed and that content
          producers should be aware of them.

          > Sometimes, it's better to say NO!

          indeed, better say an informed NO than an uninformed YES. Or an
          uniformed NO. So what "Services" are we talking of exactly?

          Maybe I am missing the point, but so far people on this list are using
          GoogleMap on their site, not the other way around. They are not
          submitting or posting their content to Google.

          Yuv



          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Erik Krause
          ... Why don t you simply tell us the URL? Ok, searching (with google ;-) reveals: http://www.google.com/accounts/TOS?loc=US best regards --
          Message 4 of 20 , Sep 2, 2007
            On Sunday, September 02, 2007 at 13:57, Chris Thomas wrote:

            > Google uses "Services" as a catch-all phrase. They've defined it as any
            > business activity they now,

            Why don't you simply tell us the URL? Ok, searching (with google ;-)
            reveals: http://www.google.com/accounts/TOS?loc=US

            best regards
            --
            http://www.erik-krause.de
          • Yuval Levy
            Thanks for clarifying, Chris. I did not know Google bought Panoramio. Last time I saw Panoramio the pictures in the service where such crap cluttering
            Message 5 of 20 , Sep 2, 2007
              Thanks for clarifying, Chris.

              I did not know Google bought Panoramio. Last time I saw Panoramio the
              pictures in the service where such crap cluttering GoogleEarth that I
              decided to turn it off and have not missed it ever since.

              I don't know if Google's take over will do something to improve quality,
              but I 100% agree with your points about the (IMO unacceptable) terms and
              under such terms and conditions I am not inclined to post there.

              They could learn from Flickr (Yahoo) who has a more content producer
              friendly licensing which:
              1. reasonably restricts usage to the purpose for which the content was
              submitted or made available.
              2. gives content owners the right to terminate the license.

              I don't see much to discuss in Google's licensing terms posted earlier.
              As they stand they should be deal-killer for every serious content producer.

              Thank you, Google, for sponsoring hugin and freepv development, but NO
              THANKS, I won't post my content with you.

              Yuv



              Chris Thomas wrote:
              > Hi Yuv..
              >
              >
              >
              > Google uses "Services" as a catch-all phrase. They've defined it as any
              > business activity they now,
              >
              > or in the future will undertake.
              >
              > In the instance I'm referring to; their "Service" is to the person or
              > organization that wants to. for example. post a picture
              >
              > to .., Google Earth via "Panoramio"
              >
              >
              >
              > In return for the "Service" of allowing the content provider to "upload".
              > They take perpetual rights and can even make changes
              >
              > to content and use it in " yet to be dreamed of " ways in the future.
              >
              >
              >
              > If you were to post an equirectangular image for regular pano-type viewing,
              > for example. There's nothing to stop them, from
              >
              > chopping it up into conventional print format and selling prints or making
              > "Tiny Worlds" or spherical icons, or making
              >
              > any other use of it.. in some future "Service".
              >
              >
              >
              > Consider this:
              >
              > You post a Pano at some point in the future. There's a guy with his mistress
              > arm in arm on a street in Paris.
              >
              > His wife sees it and a divorce ensues. Google gets sued.
              >
              > Google sues you. because you didn't have a model release.
              >
              > Under Article 11. you've agreed to be responsible.
              >
              >
              >
              > Providers of creative content. beware!
              >
              > I'm not a lawyer, but as a professional photographer.
              >
              > I'm more sensitive to copyright and release issues than the average "google
              > content provider".
              >
              >
              >
              > Cheers
              >
              > chris
              >
              >
              >
              > Chris Thomas
              >
              > Photographer
              >
              > cell... 403-615-1212
              >
              > In North America
              >
              > call... 1-800-870-5110
              >
              > <http://www.christhomas.com/> http://www.christhomas.com
              >
              >
              >
              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com] On
              > Behalf Of Yuval Levy
              > Sent: Sunday, September 02, 2007 12:43 PM
              > To: PanoToolsNG@yahoogroups.com
              > Subject: Re: [PanoToolsNG] Reasons NOT to post content on Google!
              >
              >
              >
              > Hi Chris,
              >
              > what "Services" does this "Standard Agreement" refer to?
              >
              > Chris Thomas wrote:
              >> I'd like to start a discussion, I think we should all be having.
              >
              > yes, I agree that such issues should be discussed and that content
              > producers should be aware of them.
              >
              >> Sometimes, it's better to say NO!
              >
              > indeed, better say an informed NO than an uninformed YES. Or an
              > uniformed NO. So what "Services" are we talking of exactly?
              >
              > Maybe I am missing the point, but so far people on this list are using
              > GoogleMap on their site, not the other way around. They are not
              > submitting or posting their content to Google.
              >
              > Yuv
              >
              >
              >
              > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              >
              >
              >
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