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Re: AN Translations

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  • Phra Noah Yuttadhammo
    Dear Friends, I haven t looked to see what is on other people s websites, but I hope this is a part not yet translated. I have seen the Tipitaka.net
    Message 1 of 366 , May 29, 2004
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      Dear Friends,

      I haven't looked to see what is on other people's websites, but I hope this is a part not yet
      translated. I have seen the Tipitaka.net http://www.tipitaka.net/tipitaka/strans/ and this is what
      I thought would make sense. Hope that continues to be updated.

      I have chosen at random the Chapter of Sixes, 8th Vagga (arahattavagga) of the Anguttara Nikaya.
      Sorry, a correction to the last translation - it was also from this vagga, making its reference
      (according to the CSCD) correctly: AN 6.8.6, not AN 6.6.6.

      Also, where should I try to get the Pali from? I am using the CSCD of the Vipassana Research
      Institute because of its ease of use. Is that the generally accepted source? There is a project in
      Bangkok to make a new edition, more correct and more accurately reflecting the revisions of the
      Sixth Council - is that available yet? Any news?

      Also, about the word "veda", it is said in the PED to come from vid or ved, and I think it clearly
      does mean "feeling"... but of course not as in vedanaa, but rather like sa'mvega. If it is too
      ambiguous as "feeling", maybe add the word "religious" before it, but I think its meaning is clear
      enough as "feeling" alone - in this list it clearly refers to this kind of feeling: ex "do good
      deeds
      with feeling". Maybe "emotion" works too... Any comments?

      Anyway, here is A N 6.8.1 The Dukkha Sutta:

      --------------------------------------------------------------------

      A'nguttaranikaayo

      Chakkanipaatapaa.li

      8. Arahattavaggo

      1. Dukkhasutta'm

      "Chahi, bhikkhave, dhammehi samannaagato bhikkhu di.t.theva dhamme dukkha'm viharati savighaata'm
      sa-upaayaasa'm sapari.laaha'm, kaayassa bhedaa para'm mara.naa duggati paa.tika'nkhaa.

      With six, oh monks, dhammas endowed, a monk is seen, yea, in reality (dhamme) to dwell suffering -
      with vexation, with grief, with fever. After the breaking up and death of the body, to a bad
      destination he goes without doubt.

      "Katamehi chahi? kaamavitakkena, byaapaadavitakkena, vihi'msaavitakkena, kaamasaññaaya,
      byaapaadasaññaaya, vihi'msaasaññaaya- imehi, kho, bhikkhave, chahi dhammehi samannaagato bhikkhu
      di.t.theva dhamme dukkha'm viharati savighaata'm sa-upaayaasa'm sapari.laaha'm, kaayassa bhedaa para
      'm mara.naa duggati paa.tika'nkhaa.

      With which six? With the thought of lust, with the thought of ill-will, with the thought of
      harmfulness; with the perception of lust, with the perception of ill-will, with the perception of
      harmfulness. Indeed, with these, oh monks, six dhammas endowed, a monk is seen, yea, in reality
      (dhamme) to dwell suffering - with vexation, with grief, with fever. After the breaking up and
      death of the body, to a bad destination he goes without doubt.

      "Chahi, bhikkhave, dhammehi samannaagato bhikkhu di.t.theva dhamme sukha'm viharati avighaata'm
      anupaayaasa'm apari.laaha'm, kaayassa bhedaa para'm mara.naa sugati paa.tika'nkhaa.

      With six, oh monks, dhammas endowed, a monk is seen, yea, in reality (dhamme) to dwell happy -
      without vexation, without grief, without fever. After the breaking up and death of the body, to a
      good destination he goes without doubt.

      "Katamehi chahi? nekkhammavitakkena, abyaapaadavitakkena, avihi'msaavitakkena, nekkhammasaññaaya,
      abyaapaadasaññaaya, avihi'msaasaññaaya- imehi, kho, bhikkhave, chahi dhammehi samannaagato
      bhikkhu di.t.theva dhamme sukha'm viharati avighaata'm anupaayaasa'm apari.laaha'm, kaayassa bhedaa
      para'm mara.naa sugati paa.tika'nkhaa"ti.

      With which six? With the thought of renunciation, with the thought of non-ill-will, with the
      thought of harmlessness; with the perception of renunciation, with the perception of non-ill-will,
      with the perception of harmlessness. Indeed, with these, oh monks, six dhammas endowed, a monk is
      seen, yea, in reality (dhamme) to dwell happy - without vexation, without grief, without fever.
      After the breaking up and death of the body, to a good destination he goes without doubt.

      --------------------------------------------------------------------

      Best wishes,

      Yuttadhammo

      Chom Tong Insight Meditation Center
      Wat Phradhatu Sri Chom Tong Voravihara
      T. Ban Luang, A. Chom Tong
      Chiang Mai, Thailand, 50160
      Email: yuttadhammo@...
      Website: - www.sirimangalo.org
      Tel: (66 - int'l.) (0 - in Thailand) 53 342 184
      --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    • nina van gorkom
      Dear Yong Peng, I found this in my concepts file not sent. So, I send it now, though belated (29 July). I cannot remember whether I sent it, but I do not see
      Message 366 of 366 , Aug 17 11:20 AM
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        Dear Yong Peng,

        I found this in my concepts file not sent. So, I send it now, though
        belated (29 July). I cannot remember whether I sent it, but I do not
        see it in the messages.

        Nina.
        op 07-06-2006 08:45 schreef Ong Yong Peng op pali.smith@...:

        please advise on the word: aruupasa~n~nii

        21-25. Saddhindriya.m bhaaveti... viiriyindriya.m bhaaveti...
        satindriya.m bhaaveti... samaadhindriya.m bhaaveti...
        pa~n~nindriya.m bhaaveti....



        ----------------------------------------------------------

        21-25. Saddhindriya.m bhaaveti... viiriyindriya.m bhaaveti...
        satindriya.m bhaaveti... samaadhindriya.m bhaaveti...
        pa~n~nindriya.m bhaaveti....
        ["O monks, if a monk] developed the faculty of faith (faculty of
        energy, faculty of mindfulness, faculty of concentration, faculty of
        wisdom), [even for the duration of a finger-snap, monks, such is
        said...]
        ------
        N: such a one is said...
        --------
        ----------------------------------------------------------

        31-37. Satisambojjha`nga.m bhaaveti... dhammavicayasambojjha`nga.m
        bhaaveti... viiriyasambojjha`nga.m bhaaveti... piitisambojjha`nga.m
        bhaaveti... passaddhisambojjha`nga.m bhaaveti...
        samaadhisambojjha`nga.m bhaaveti... upekkhaasambojjha`nga.m
        bhaaveti....

        ["O monks, if a monk] developed the mindfulness (doctrinal
        investigation,
        ------
        N: Investigation of Dhamma.
        -------

        38-45. Sammaadi.t.thi.m bhaaveti... sammaasa`nkappa.m bhaaveti...
        sammaavaaca.m bhaaveti... sammaakammanta.m bhaaveti... sammaa-
        aajiiva.m bhaaveti... sammaavaayaama.m bhaaveti... sammaasati.m
        bhaaveti... sammaasamaadhi.m bhaaveti....
        ["O monks, if a monk] developed right view (right intention, right
        speech, right action, right livelihood, right effort, right
        mindfulness, right concentration), [even for the duration of a
        finger-snap, monks, such is said...]
        -------
        N: sammaasa`nkappa.m: instead of right intention: right thinking.

        Intention is usually reserved for the term cetanaa, volition or kamma
        which
        is not a factor of the eightfold Path.
        Sammaadi.t.thi and sammaasa`nkappa are together called the wisdom of the
        eightfold Path. Sammaasa`nkappa is vitakka cetasika and it assists
        paññaa in
        'touching' or striking the object of understanding so that paññaa can
        know
        it.

        ----------------------------------------------------------

        46-53. Ajjhatta.m ruupasa~n~nii bahiddhaa ruupaani passati
        parittaani suva.n.nadubba.n.naani. 'Taani abhibhuyya jaanaami
        passaamii'ti -- eva.msa~n~nii hoti...
        ["O monks, if a monk, even for the duration of a finger-snap,]
        conscious of material forms arising from within,
        -------
        N: ajjhatta: I would eliminate arising, thus: within himself.
        I think materiality of his own body.
        He can develop kasinas taking as subject parts of his own body or
        external
        objects and then attain ruupa-jhaana.
        --------

        * appamaa.na (adj) endless, immeasurable, boundless, unlimited.
        ------
        N: here is allusion to the immaterial jhaanas, and here is the
        connection
        with the term aruupasa~n~nin.
        I consulted Dhammasangani Pali, 225: this has aruupasa~n~na. This is
        translated by PTS as: unconscious of any part of his corporeal self..

        The *a* is a negation of ruupasa~n~nin, not of ruupa, thus, not
        perceiving
        ruupa, materiality, of his own body. (See below the Atthasaalinii).
        The word unconscious seems misleading.
        ---------
        Ajjhatta.m aruupasa~n~nii bahiddhaa ruupaani passati parittaani
        suva.n.nadubba.n.naani. 'Taani abhibhuyya jaanaami passaamii'ti --
        eva.msa~n~nii hoti...

        ["O monks, if a monk, even for the duration of a finger-snap,]
        conscious of immaterial forms arising from within,
        ------
        N: immaterial forms: this is a contradiction.
        It could be: not conscious of material forms of his own body...
        This could be applied of all the following paras. These paras seem to
        refer
        to the colour kasinas of ruupa-jhaana.

        The Atthasaalinii, Co. to the Dhammasangani, explains (188) these
        'positions
        of mastery'.
        <'Not perceiving material quality in himself' means devoid of the
        perception
        of the preamble in his own bodily frame, either from not getting it,
        or from
        not wishing it.
        'Sees material qualities external to himself' means, from having
        performed
        the preamble externally in the eight devices, he sees with jhaana-
        eyes the
        external objects of these eight devices by virtue of the preamble and
        the
        extasy.
        'Limited' means not growing....
        Beautiful or ugly means pure or impure colours...>

        It is asked why it is said, Not perceiving material quality in
        himself, this
        is because his own body is not to be mastered, only external objects...
        *****
        Nina.






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