Re: [Pali] Re: Pali Word by Word 2003/13  dukkha.
- Dear Yong Peng,
op 31-03-2003 14:26 schreef Ong Yong Peng op ypong001@...:
Ayam belongs to the king, this king the PTS translates. Can you elaborate
on the suffix -aya.m, please.
N:Khataaya.m, bhikkhave, raajaa, upahataaya.m, bhikkhave, raajaa.
Ayam is this, masc. : thus twice the aaya.m is stuck together (sandhi)
with the previous particip: khata and upahata, and it belongs to raajaa.
>N: We read in the Visuddhimagga (Ch XVI, 13 ff) about the different meanings
>> N: I know it is difficult to translate dukkha, it is also
> translated as ill, and even as stress which I find too loaded. I
> myself opt for unsatisfactory, because I do not only think of
> sickness, etc. but I also think of the noble truth of dukkha: the
> five khandhas, all conditioned dhanmmas, are impermanent and thus, no
> refuge, they are unsatisfactory.
> Y: I agree on that too, however there is a tricky language
> problem. 'Unsatisfactory' is an adjective,
> and 'unsatisfactoriness', 'unsatisfaction' or 'non-satisfaction' is
> not a proper English word. There are still many words close to that,
> such as distress, unhappiness, sadness and agony. However, they do
> not convey the clear message of 'unsatisfactoriness'. What do you
of dukkha: 1. dukkha-dukkha, intrinsic dukkha, painful feeling and
unpleasant (mental) feeling, and this is the more obvious suffering.
2. Parinaama dukkha, the changeability of things; when what is pleasant
changes one suffers. 3. Finally, sa.nkhaara dukkha, the impermanence of all
conditioned realities (sa.nkhaara dhammas) which are therefore
I agree with Rene that in different contexts we could use different transl.
Nyantiloka in Buddhist dictionary still uses unsatisfactoriness. Renee says:
<Dissatisfaction is another possibility. It conveys subjective nuances>.
That is difficult because here as the noble Truth it is a characteristic
inherent in all conditioned dhammas. I am inclined to leave it untranslated
here. Or: to use the adjective: unsatisfactory, or: the unsatisfactory
nature of all conditioned dhammas.
- Dear Nina and friends,
thanks for that, Nina.
--- In Pali@yahoogroups.com, nina van gorkom wrote:
> would you tell us roughly what the comparison is about? Thanks
> what in comparison, lord, can these five hundred carts do... etc.
> Wheel 67-69: What, O lord, are five hundred carts- nay six, seven...
> etc...compared with this?
28: Now what think you Pukusa, which is the more difficult thing to
do or to meet with - that a man, being conscious and awake, should
neither see , nor hear the sound of five hundred cars passing by...or
that a man, being conscious and awake, should neither see, nor hear
the sound thereof when the falling rain goes on beating splashing,
and the lightnings are flashing forth, and the thunderbolts are
We read, <Then, Pukkusa, the thought occurred to that man:- "How
wonderful a thing it is, and marvellous, that those who have gone
forth out of the world should pass their time in a state of mind so
Thus, it is more difficult not to hear the sound of rain and thunder,
but this occurs when a high degree of calm is reached.