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Re: [Pali] food purity/pollution

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  • Ngawang Dorje
    Hi, Are you probably having in mind Matthew 15:17-19? Regards, Rahula ________________________________ From: Jacques Huynen To:
    Message 1 of 8 , Oct 10, 2011
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      Hi,

      Are you probably having in mind Matthew 15:17-19?

      Regards,

      Rahula


      ________________________________
      From: Jacques Huynen <jhuynen@...>
      To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 6:58 PM
      Subject: [Pali] food purity/pollution


       
      Hello Friends,
      Would anyone know the ref. in the Pali Tipitaka of a passage where the Buddha states that pollution come from within (mind defilements, greed, anger etc.) not from without (food) ? 
      Thanks 

      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Bryan Levman
      Dear Jacques, I do not know if there is an exact statement to this effect (reminds me of Matthew 15:11: What goes into the mouth does not make a man unclean;
      Message 2 of 8 , Oct 11, 2011
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        Dear Jacques,

        I do not know if there is an exact statement to this effect (reminds me of Matthew 15:11: "What goes into the mouth does not make a man unclean; it is what comes out of the mouth that makes him unclean"), but it is certainly implicit in several parts of the writings, e. g. the Mahāsīhanāda Sutta MN12 (Nanamoli and Bodhi, page 175) where the Buddha refutes the brahmanical doctrine that "Purification comes about through food". The Buddha does however recognize that eating itself can be a source of affliction, either eating too much or when one becomes dependent on almsfood, either a certain type (e. g. meat) or on a certain householder as alms-supplier (MN 55 Jīvaka sutta, page 474 and following). Hope that helps,

        Metta, Bryan




        ________________________________
        From: Jacques Huynen <jhuynen@...>
        To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 6:58:36 AM
        Subject: [Pali] food purity/pollution


         
        Hello Friends,
        Would anyone know the ref. in the Pali Tipitaka of a passage where the Buddha states that pollution come from within (mind defilements, greed, anger etc.) not from without (food) ? 
        Thanks 

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Jacques Huynen
        Dear Bryan,   It helps a lot. Thanks.   I knew about Matthew 15:11 and wanted to compare both doctrines about food interdictions, which can also be cause of
        Message 3 of 8 , Oct 11, 2011
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          Dear Bryan,
           
          It helps a lot. Thanks.
           
          I knew about Matthew 15:11 and wanted to compare both doctrines about food interdictions, which can also be cause of social non-integration and even conflict as can be seen in India, where I am now.
           
          Still the Buddha also seems to emphasize the need to be mindful about what and how you eat, which seems quite reasonable. 
           
          Metta
           
          Jacques  

          --- On Tue, 10/11/11, Bryan Levman <bryan.levman@...> wrote:


          From: Bryan Levman <bryan.levman@...>
          Subject: Re: [Pali] food purity/pollution
          To: "Pali@yahoogroups.com" <Pali@yahoogroups.com>
          Date: Tuesday, October 11, 2011, 3:48 PM



           



          Dear Jacques,

          I do not know if there is an exact statement to this effect (reminds me of Matthew 15:11: "What goes into the mouth does not make a man unclean; it is what comes out of the mouth that makes him unclean"), but it is certainly implicit in several parts of the writings, e. g. the Mahāsīhanāda Sutta MN12 (Nanamoli and Bodhi, page 175) where the Buddha refutes the brahmanical doctrine that "Purification comes about through food". The Buddha does however recognize that eating itself can be a source of affliction, either eating too much or when one becomes dependent on almsfood, either a certain type (e. g. meat) or on a certain householder as alms-supplier (MN 55 Jīvaka sutta, page 474 and following). Hope that helps,

          Metta, Bryan

          ________________________________
          From: Jacques Huynen <jhuynen@...>
          To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 6:58:36 AM
          Subject: [Pali] food purity/pollution

           
          Hello Friends,
          Would anyone know the ref. in the Pali Tipitaka of a passage where the Buddha states that pollution come from within (mind defilements, greed, anger etc.) not from without (food) ? 
          Thanks 

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]








          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Rajendra Jadhao
          The Amagandha Sutta of Sutta Nipata addresses this issue and in this sutta the previous Buddha (I dont remember if its Kassapa Buddha or Konagamana) clearly
          Message 4 of 8 , Nov 10, 2011
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            The Amagandha Sutta of Sutta Nipata addresses this issue and in this sutta the previous Buddha (I dont remember if its Kassapa Buddha or Konagamana) clearly says that food does not cause polluton.

            R.O. Jadhao

            ----- Original Message -----
            From: Bryan Levman
            Sent: 10/11/11 07:18 PM
            To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
            Subject: Re: [Pali] food purity/pollution

            Dear Jacques,

            I do not know if there is an exact statement to this effect (reminds me of Matthew 15:11: "What goes into the mouth does not make a man unclean; it is what comes out of the mouth that makes him unclean"), but it is certainly implicit in several parts of the writings, e. g. the Mahāsīhanāda Sutta MN12 (Nanamoli and Bodhi, page 175) where the Buddha refutes the brahmanical doctrine that "Purification comes about through food". The Buddha does however recognize that eating itself can be a source of affliction, either eating too much or when one becomes dependent on almsfood, either a certain type (e. g. meat) or on a certain householder as alms-supplier (MN 55 Jīvaka sutta, page 474 and following). Hope that helps,

            Metta, Bryan

            ________________________________
            From: Jacques Huynen < jhuynen%2540yahoo.com >
            To: Pali%2540yahoogroups.com
            Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 6:58:36 AM
            Subject: [Pali] food purity/pollution


            Hello Friends,
            Would anyone know the ref. in the Pali Tipitaka of a passage where the Buddha states that pollution come from within (mind defilements, greed, anger etc.) not from without (food) ?
            Thanks

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Bryan Levman
            Dear Rajendra, Thanks for bringing this to the group s attention.Yes here the Buddha (Kassapa) repeatedly states esāmagandho na hi maṃsabhojanam... ( this
            Message 5 of 8 , Nov 12, 2011
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              Dear Rajendra,

              Thanks for bringing this to the group's attention.Yes here the Buddha (Kassapa) repeatedly states
              esāmagandho na hi maṃsabhojanam... ("this is tainted fare, not the eating of flesh" per Norman's translation), in reference to hurting others, breaking the precepts, anger, arrogance, etc.).


              Metta, Bryan





              ________________________________
              From: Rajendra Jadhao <jadhao@...>
              To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Friday, November 11, 2011 2:05:24 AM
              Subject: Re: [Pali] food purity/pollution


               
              The Amagandha Sutta of Sutta Nipata addresses this issue and in this sutta the previous Buddha (I dont remember if its Kassapa Buddha or Konagamana) clearly says that food does not cause polluton.

              R.O. Jadhao

              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Bryan Levman
              Sent: 10/11/11 07:18 PM
              To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [Pali] food purity/pollution

              Dear Jacques,

              I do not know if there is an exact statement to this effect (reminds me of Matthew 15:11: "What goes into the mouth does not make a man unclean; it is what comes out of the mouth that makes him unclean"), but it is certainly implicit in several parts of the writings, e. g. the Mahāsīhanāda Sutta MN12 (Nanamoli and Bodhi, page 175) where the Buddha refutes the brahmanical doctrine that "Purification comes about through food". The Buddha does however recognize that eating itself can be a source of affliction, either eating too much or when one becomes dependent on almsfood, either a certain type (e. g. meat) or on a certain householder as alms-supplier (MN 55 Jīvaka sutta, page 474 and following). Hope that helps,

              Metta, Bryan

              ________________________________
              From: Jacques Huynen < jhuynen%2540yahoo.com >
              To: Pali%2540yahoogroups.com
              Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 6:58:36 AM
              Subject: [Pali] food purity/pollution

              Hello Friends,
              Would anyone know the ref. in the Pali Tipitaka of a passage where the Buddha states that pollution come from within (mind defilements, greed, anger etc.) not from without (food) ?
              Thanks

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • Nicki Karu
              Dear friends,   ....  bhikkhave, sāhāraṃ vadāmi, no anāhāraṃ. .... can be found at   http://tipitaka.org/romn/cscd/s0404m3.mul6.xml
              Message 6 of 8 , Nov 12, 2011
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                Dear friends,
                 
                ....  bhikkhave, sāhāraṃ vadāmi, no anāhāraṃ. .... can be found at
                 
                http://tipitaka.org/romn/cscd/s0404m3.mul6.xml
                http://metta.lk/tipitaka/2Sutta-Pitaka/4Anguttara-Nikaya/Anguttara6/10-dasakanipata/007-yamakavaggo-e.html
                 
                 
                Regards,
                Nicki

                 

                ________________________________
                De : Bryan Levman <bryan.levman@...>
                À : "Pali@yahoogroups.com" <Pali@yahoogroups.com>
                Envoyé le : Samedi 12 Novembre 2011 12h21
                Objet : Re: [Pali] food purity/pollution



                 

                Dear Rajendra,

                Thanks for bringing this to the group's attention.Yes here the Buddha (Kassapa) repeatedly states
                esāmagandho na hi maṃsabhojanam... ("this is tainted fare, not the eating of flesh" per Norman's translation), in reference to hurting others, breaking the precepts, anger, arrogance, etc.).

                Metta, Bryan

                ________________________________
                From: Rajendra Jadhao <jadhao@...>
                To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Friday, November 11, 2011 2:05:24 AM
                Subject: Re: [Pali] food purity/pollution

                 
                The Amagandha Sutta of Sutta Nipata addresses this issue and in this sutta the previous Buddha (I dont remember if its Kassapa Buddha or Konagamana) clearly says that food does not cause polluton.

                R.O. Jadhao

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Bryan Levman
                Sent: 10/11/11 07:18 PM
                To: Pali@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: Re: [Pali] food purity/pollution

                Dear Jacques,

                I do not know if there is an exact statement to this effect (reminds me of Matthew 15:11: "What goes into the mouth does not make a man unclean; it is what comes out of the mouth that makes him unclean"), but it is certainly implicit in several parts of the writings, e. g. the Mahāsīhanāda Sutta MN12 (Nanamoli and Bodhi, page 175) where the Buddha refutes the brahmanical doctrine that "Purification comes about through food". The Buddha does however recognize that eating itself can be a source of affliction, either eating too much or when one becomes dependent on almsfood, either a certain type (e. g. meat) or on a certain householder as alms-supplier (MN 55 Jīvaka sutta, page 474 and following). Hope that helps,

                Metta, Bryan

                ________________________________
                From: Jacques Huynen < jhuynen%2540yahoo.com >
                To: Pali%2540yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 6:58:36 AM
                Subject: [Pali] food purity/pollution

                Hello Friends,
                Would anyone know the ref. in the Pali Tipitaka of a passage where the Buddha states that pollution come from within (mind defilements, greed, anger etc.) not from without (food) ?
                Thanks

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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